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Slipperiest Lube

teagueo

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Besides KY or Astroglide, what's the slickest low friction oil you guys know of?

This would be for a small sliding mechanism (low pressure) to reduce sliding friction to the minimum. Grease would likely be too viscous.

I have Super Lube oil ISO 100-150 but have been researching a bit and saw graphene lube is supposed to be next level...
 
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rlitman

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If grease is too viscous, maybe you need to construct it out of something that's inherently slippery. Teflon or Vespel?
 
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teagueo

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If grease is too viscous, maybe you need to construct it out of something that's inherently slippery. Teflon or Vespel?

Nice materials there!

It's all metal, but has been DLC coated (diamond like carbon) so that's already super low coefficient of friction. It might be diminishing returns from here
 

Boogerman

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I'd try Molybdenum Disulfide powder. Adsorbs onto the surface of metal and makes it slicker than graphite does. You work it into the metal surface using a hard piece of wood or plastic. I usually use popsicle stick. Don't know what it will do with the dlc coating though. Silicon oil can be applied onto the surface after the moly is worked in, and can make it even slicker.
 

wssix99

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Besides KY or Astroglide, what's the slickest low friction oil you guys know if?
A 50/50 mix is usually the best...


This would be for a small sliding mechanism to reduce sliding friction to the minimum.
Picking an optimal lube depends on the materials and loads involved involved. What are they and what are you sliding?
 

rlitman

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I'd try Molybdenum Disulfide powder. Adsorbs onto the surface of metal and makes it slicker than graphite does. You work it into the metal surface using a hard piece of wood or plastic. I usually use popsicle stick. Don't know what it will do with the dlc coating though. Silicon oil can be applied onto the surface after the moly is worked in, and can make it even slicker.
Moly will plate directly onto steel (I rub it into metal with a wood stick exactly like you said), but I too don't know about what it does with DLC. I'd suggest hexagonal boron nitride. It's at least as slippery as moly, but white, so it doesn't turn your hands black. Truly a miracle in locks.

As for a film lubricant, we'd need to know more. An EP gear oil might give you the best wear resistance, but will attract dirt and might still have too much drag for you.
 

nadogail

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Many times I have heard the expression “Slicker than snot” describing some unobtainable compound, so I guess Snot is probably the slickest readily obtainable lube. Some silicone compounds are considered very slick, but not having NASA’s budget I will have to continue to use what I can get.
 

tool_scrounge

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Besides KY or Astroglide, what's the slickest low friction oil you guys know if?

This would be for a small sliding mechanism to reduce sliding friction to the minimum. Grease would likely be too viscous.

I have Super Lube oil ISO 100-150 but have been researching a bit and saw graphene lube is supposed to be next level...
Depending on how deep your pockets are for this project, you might talk the Application Engineers at Nye Lubricants. They have been doing this since the mid 1800s.

 
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teagueo

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I'd try Molybdenum Disulfide powder. Adsorbs onto the surface of metal and makes it slicker than graphite does. You work it into the metal surface using a hard piece of wood or plastic. I usually use popsicle stick. Don't know what it will do with the dlc coating though. Silicon oil can be applied onto the surface after the moly is worked in, and can make it even slicker.

That sounds pretty interesting - if it's better than graphite, it must be crazy slick stuff. I've used moly assembly lube but the powdered version might be perfect for this.

Moly will plate directly onto steel (I rub it into metal with a wood stick exactly like you said), but I too don't know about what it does with DLC. I'd suggest hexagonal boron nitride. It's at least as slippery as moly, but white, so it doesn't turn your hands black. Truly a miracle in locks.

As for a film lubricant, we'd need to know more. An EP gear oil might give you the best wear resistance, but will attract dirt and might still have too much drag for you.

I've never heard of hexagonal boron nitride but I'm looking into that now. I'm thinking lightweight oil is better than gear oil for this application.


I'm taking a barrel of this stuff to the next **** :LOL:
 
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teagueo

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Some of you guys may have seen me post about this on here already, but it's for a titanium 3/8" ratchet I've been working on.

It has lower backdrag than my Koken's as it is already. I had it WPC shot peened (Japanese Micro Peening) which reduces friction even further. It leaves a micro dimpled surface that works as a sort of air bearing. High horsepower GTR's get their gears and crank journals done to increase fatigue strength and reduce friction.


ezgif.com-gif-maker (2).gif

Now I'm going to test it with a DLC coating to see if it makes a difference in smoothness, if any. DLC has a much lower coefficient of friction than even chrome plating. Either way it's going to look badass...

This is all without altering the spring that actuates the pawl.

DSC_2013.JPG

Testing it with this, it's right around 0.5 oz-in of torque to rotate the gear. Just seeing what's the lowest I can get to with a geared ratchet.
 
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rlitman

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Ok, backdrag, understood. So you're not concerned with wear under high pressures, and you just want the absolute minimum sliding friction under low pressures. I don't think you'll find anything that beats out dry lubes, since any liquid has viscosity to hold you back.
 

imagineer

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I'd try Molybdenum Disulfide powder.

Funny story about Molybdenum Disulfide.

Most of a lifetime ago, I was in Cub Scouts and the annual Pinewood Derby was coming up. I’d already done the ‘raise one wheel’ and 'center the weight' tricks, but felt I needed something more.

My father was an engineer and was at that time, designing a stabilization device for a centrifuge in the event the main shaft broke. The device was essentially an external drum brake, but to ensure limited negative inertial damping and heat on the rotor, the shoes of the brake had Molybdenum Disulfide baked into the contact surface.

My solution for the pinewood derby car was to, after polishing the nails used for axles, heat them, and try to impregnate the MoS into the surface.

Long story short, it worked and I won the event, by a wide margin. I also competed and won the regional and state gatherings. Each time, my car was inspected before the event and was certified for use. Being a young egomaniac, I didn’t keep my secrets to myself and blabbed (bragged) about the improvements.

One of the dads at the regional event, a lawyer, sent a formal complaint to the BSA governing group, accusing me of violating the rule (at the time) that the car must be made 100% by the scout without adult help. He argued an 8 year-old was incapable of conceiving the technical aspects of the improvements, and that my father must have helped.

3 months later, the B.S.A. head legal counsel decided I had broken the rules and vacated the wins. Needless to say, I was pissed and the incident effectively ended my involvement with the scouts.

Fast forward 24 years…standing in a church in Boston, as a groomsman in my kid sister’s wedding. Being the tallest of the groomsmen, I was situated next to the best man, the groom’s father . . . who was in fact, the (retired) head legal counsel for the Boy Scouts of America who made the decision against me.
 
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rlitman

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As a note to Boron Nitride, it is not hydroscopic, in nano form it is hydrophobic and is an excellent lubricant for high heat applications. In micron form can be used on bullets, gun barrels and internal weapon parts.
Yes. Just be sure you get HEXAGONAL boron nitride, because cubic boron nitride is an abrasive. You don't want to mix those two up.
 
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teagueo

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Yes. Just be sure you get HEXAGONAL boron nitride, because cubic boron nitride is an abrasive. You don't want to mix those two up.
Thanks for that distinction - makes a helluva difference!

Boron Nitride.

Kind of a ridiculous aside, but it reminded me of this chick my buddy met while traveling. We were on XR250 dirt bikes in Cambodia and got super sick for a week in Phnom Penh.

We were basically bed ridden for a while, watching this bootlegged Discovery channel on the hotel TV, venturing out for more street food once a day.

Once we got better, we went out to the backpackers area and I met these 2 girls at the bar. One was named BORON, no joke. My buddy ended up hanging out with her a few nights, and I with her friend.

But now all I can think is Boron Nightride lol.
 

flippin

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You may want to consider a product called TS1 301. The debate about the best ultralight lubricants has been argued to death in the fishing community. Distance casting with super tuned reels using hybrid ceramic bearings is acutally a thing :giggle:. Tungsten, graphite, MD, Boron etc have all been tested head to head and TSI 301 seems to always win. As mentioned any liquid will create some drag but the liquid in TSI301 only serves as a carrier before it evaporates. If you have any plastic parts in your ratchet TSI 321 uses a plastic friendly carrier. Much like anything else at the extreme end of the spectrum, hair splitting undoubtedly becomes the pursuit. As a scientist and despite any factual evidence, I suspect improvements between products are unlikely to acheive statistical significant differences. Most of the comparisons never conduct enough trials to achive a meaningful sample size.

TSI 301 Link
 

dave*99

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Reach out to these guys. Likely have a solution. They love a good challenge.

I know a guy that solved some electric motor lubrication issues with Krytox. He blabbed about it all the time. His most often stated comment was this was theeeee most expensive lubricant on the planet. I have no idea which formulation he used or the cost, I just remember the yapping.
It did work though.
 

imagineer

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Yes. Just be sure you get HEXAGONAL boron nitride, because cubic boron nitride is an abrasive. You don't want to mix those two up.
Ironically, we use both those products here.

Boron Nitride (or BN as the shop guys call it) is the lubricant that's spread on the dummy block of the extrusion press ram that keeps the aluminum from sticking.

We have Cubic Boron Nitride (CBN) impregnated tips on our friction stir weld tools.

We also use Boron Carbide (B4C) as an alloying element in the metal composite material we make...
 

theoldwizard1

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The problem with ANY light duty lube is that it will attract dirt/debris which will drastically change the coefficient of drag. In some cases, where the contacting surfaces have very tight tolerance no lube maybe best.

Back in physics lab in college, certain labs were done using air sleds. A small sled, held jus above a rail by air pressure. Just like an air hockey table.
 
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teagueo

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You may want to consider a product called TS1 301. The debate about the best ultralight lubricants has been argued to death in the fishing community. Distance casting with super tuned reels using hybrid ceramic bearings is acutally a thing :giggle:. Tungsten, graphite, MD, Boron etc have all been tested head to head and TSI 301 seems to always win. As mentioned any liquid will create some drag but the liquid in TSI301 only serves as a carrier before it evaporates. If you have any plastic parts in your ratchet TSI 321 uses a plastic friendly carrier. Much like anything else at the extreme end of the spectrum, hair splitting undoubtedly becomes the pursuit. As a scientist and despite any factual evidence, I suspect improvements between products are unlikely to acheive statistical significant differences. Most of the comparisons never conduct enough trials to achive a meaningful sample size.

TSI 301 Link
I dig it - those tuned reels actually sound pretty cool. Anything where the limits are being pushed will bring forth the best performing options. TSI 301 looks interesting especially in high temps.
 
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teagueo

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We used a certain type of Krytox at an aerospace company I worked at. So I already know that's likely out of my price range for this project haha. Unless I can get my hands on the smallest size tube.

Hexagonal Boron Nitride powder can be had for $22:

This may all make no difference but it's worth a shot. I just have no idea how much friction is caused by the gear/pawl rubbing against the housing & cover plate, vs just the spring forcing the pawl against the gear.

I'll post results once I test this out.
 
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toolmiser

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I have interest in this also. I have a bird feeder perched on an aluminum square tube. It's about 7' tall, but a squirrel has been able to climb this year. Other years no success after a little white grease (in Wisconsin). But this one is too dumb to know it can't climb a greased pole. I also did a 2' section with "super lube". Got any other ideas? I'm in town so I can't kill it, and I have a new backyard neighbor who I have no idea what their feelings about them are.
 

rlitman

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We used a certain type of Krytox at an aerospace company I worked at. So I already know that's likely out of my price range for this project haha. Unless I can get my hands on the smallest size tube...
The smallest tubes are 1/2 oz, and can be frequently found for around $25. I've bought several 8oz tubes and even one 14oz grease gun cartridge on eBay, never paying more than $70 each, but at that price, you may be looking for years before you find something. Krytox is NOT the only PFPE lubricant on the market. There's also Christolube and Solvay Fomblin, but the Krytox tends to have better wear properties. I've got a jug of Fomblin vacuum pump oil that makes a great lube that never thickens or evaporates, so I'll use it on sensitive mechanisms I don't want to keep oiling.

Here's what I can tell you about Krytox. The GPL (general purpose lubricant) 10x is the base oil, with the 102 being extremely light, and the 107 being gear oil thick. 20x is the grease with the base oil of the matching viscosity, and 22x has a nitrate corrosion inhibitor added. Krytox is found in all sorts of places you wouldn't expect, from high end keyboards to commercial coffee makers.

All that said, I've tried it on ratchets and unsurprisingly, the GPL205 grease has more back drag than ATF. The GPL103 oil might work for you:

I have interest in this also. I have a bird feeder perched on an aluminum square tube. It's about 7' tall, but a squirrel has been able to climb this year. Other years no success after a little white grease (in Wisconsin). But this one is too dumb to know it can't climb a greased pole. I also did a 2' section with "super lube". Got any other ideas? I'm in town so I can't kill it, and I have a new backyard neighbor who I have no idea what their feelings about them are.
Aluminum is soft enough for their claws to grab the metal well. A steel tube would be better. And you want a THICK application of a heavy grease that doesn't wash off. Like an NLGI 3.
 

Meursault74

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Many times I have heard the expression “Slicker than snot” describing some unobtainable compound, so I guess Snot is probably the slickest readily obtainable lube. Some silicone compounds are considered very slick, but not having NASA’s budget I will have to continue to use what I can get.
here you go




snot lube.jpeg
 

DGersic

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I have interest in this also. I have a bird feeder perched on an aluminum square tube. It's about 7' tall, but a squirrel has been able to climb this year. Other years no success after a little white grease (in Wisconsin). But this one is too dumb to know it can't climb a greased pole. I also did a 2' section with "super lube". Got any other ideas? I'm in town so I can't kill it, and I have a new backyard neighbor who I have no idea what their feelings about them are.

Slinky around the post.
 

Toolfool

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Many times I have heard the expression “Slicker than snot” describing some unobtainable compound, so I guess Snot is probably the slickest readily obtainable lube. Some silicone compounds are considered very slick, but not having NASA’s budget I will have to continue to use what I can get.
" Slicker than snake snot on a doorknob " is how I have heard it.
 

Mr.zippy

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A friend uses this on his gun bolts. He said of all lubricants he’s tried, this is the real deal. I figured I’d give it a try.872BA972-018A-4358-9202-48269A18988D.png
 
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teagueo

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A friend uses this on his gun bolts. He said of all lubricants he’s tried, this is the real deal. I figured I’d give it a try.

They mention ceramics (likely to be Boron Nitride) and PTFE (slippery as fook) - must be a good combination because the coefficient of friction is <0.1...This might be worth a shot.

The other one I was thinking of was Dupont MolyKote.

1669875273922.png
 

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