Snap On tap & die set?

[AJHD]

When did Snap On 86 their tap and die sets? Literally the only set I can find on their website is just taps and they don't even list what's included in the set...

Snap-on Store

shop.snapon.com

I assume this has something to do with the fact Irwin was actually making their tap and die sets, in the USA, and just rebranding them as Snap On.
It seems most Irwin tap and die sets these days are not available. Amazon only shows a few, mostly their larger sets.

I will have to ask my dealer. Just curious if I missed the memo or if this is just more "supply shortage" issues.

Speaking of which, there are lot of tools I can't buy right now from Snap On, they simply are not available and their out of stock notices keep pushing the back in stock dates seemingly infinitely forward. My dealer is having a hard time getting some tools.

 

[AmericanMechanic]

McMaster-carr?

Were the snap-on (irwin) sets carbon steel or HSS? You can order exactly the size and style you need in HSS from McMaster (or other sources... zoro, msc, etc).

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

Why pay $400 from Snap On when you can literally get it any where else for literally half the price?

 

[JSGAuto]

If its made by Irwin you are wasting your money. They are the worst taps I have ever used.

 

[WhataTool]

If i remember right, they had two separate near identical kit options, one was made by RIDGID US.
Matco's the only truck with something new/different

 

[TheToolEnthusiast]

I heard that Apex bought out the SO supplier and told them they were no longer going to provide Tap and Dies so SO is going back to the drawing board.

 

[Xcursion88]

I have a newer SO set...I'll have to look later byt but it's definitely different than the set listed above

 

[WhataTool]

I heard that Apex bought out the SO supplier and told them they were no longer going to provide Tap and Dies so SO is going back to the drawing board.

Irwin is owned by Stanley which owns Mac Tools. Def not Apex tool group

 

[CGarage]

If its made by Irwin you are wasting your money. They are the worst taps I have ever used.

What do you prefer?

 

[Ditchdigger]

Why pay $400 from Snap On when you can literally get it any where else for literally half the price?

Because when you have a "shop" tap and die set that all the employees use the Snap-on guy would replace dull and broken taps for free without question. The initial purchase price I paid for that set was an absolute bargain if you consider the fact that every piece of the kit was replaced at least 5-6 times (likely 10-12 in more commonly used sizes) for free in the 10 years before Snap-on discontinued it.

 

[jayemm]

Years ago I had a job where we were supplied by Fastenal. Their Fastenal branded US made HSS polished taps cut steel like butter. Wish I would have had more of them in my toolbox when the job ended. I don't know what they offer these days.

 

[Under_Pressure]

It has been said on here that Irwin and Snap-On had a falling out and Irwin refuses to supply Snap-On with anything anymore (which would probably only be taps and dies anyway). Some said that it had to do with Irwin being salty about Malco reopening the Nebraska Vise Grip plant and Snap-On using them for their locking pliers. I'd say that since Irwin has come under the SBD umbrella, which as a corporation competes more directly with Snap-On in the tool truck and industrial markets, it was probably just a matter of time before they divorced. If that's the case, though, it's funny that Snap-On hasn't teamed up with someone like Greenfield or Norseman to supply US made taps and dies. Those options would be more befitting Snap-On's reputation and price point than Irwin/Hanson anyway.

 

[Tiny Jackson]

What do you prefer?

Not to **** in, I buy Taps and Dies individual. Usually Greenfield brand.

 

[slowtwitch73]

Yeah, why overpay for the Snapon name when you can pick choose from a dizzying array of US made taps?

I only use Irwin if in a pinch.

 

[Firebrick43]

A people sure they are irwin? I have a snap on tap and die set that I picked up 20 years ago as government surplus cheap. They are not the highest quality taps, I only use them for cleaning holes. But they have very nice and deep roll stamping on them, I have not seen that on any irwin tap?

 

[Gcf11]

Because when you have a "shop" tap and die set that all the employees use the Snap-on guy would replace dull and broken taps for free without question. The initial purchase price I paid for that set was an absolute bargain if you consider the fact that every piece of the kit was replaced at least 5-6 times (likely 10-12 in more commonly used sizes) for free in the 10 years before Snap-on discontinued it.

This. We have a shop supplied snap on set and we’ve likely gone through the majority of the common taps 5 times and every time it gets replaced with no questions. Easily paid for itself a few times over at this point.

 

[sweet victory]

When Irwin moved their plant from Maine to Tennessee during covid, they were unable to get a lot of their equipment back into operation. It sounded like they would need to replace a lot of the equipment that had been in production for decades at the previous plant. Noone (SO, Mac, Matco, etc) was able to get orders filled from Irwin.

It was during this time SO decided they would manufacture their own extractors and taps. The set in the link looks like one of the new SO made tap and die sets.

 

[Professional Tool User]

It has been said on here that Irwin and Snap-On had a falling out and Irwin refuses to supply Snap-On with anything anymore (which would probably only be taps and dies anyway). Some said that it had to do with Irwin being salty about Malco reopening the Nebraska Vise Grip plant and Snap-On using them for their locking pliers. I'd say that since Irwin has come under the SBD umbrella, which as a corporation competes more directly with Snap-On in the tool truck and industrial markets, it was probably just a matter of time before they divorced. If that's the case, though, it's funny that Snap-On hasn't teamed up with someone like Greenfield or Norseman to supply US made taps and dies. Those options would be more befitting Snap-On's reputation and price point than Irwin/Hanson anyway.

I highly doubt it has anything to do with Malco. Previously, Snap on rebranded the Grip on locking pliers. You'll have to know that Irwin Vice Grips are available in the Snap on supplemental catalog to be able to buy it off the truck. Irwin as a tool brand is a joke. Almost every Irwin tool I can think of is garbage. I take Harbor Freight more seriously than Irwin. As for sourcing other options, machinist grade taps and dies are already extremely expensive. Once it arrives on the Snap on truck, it has to be marked up even more. Mechanics don't use their taps and dies day in and out.

 

[AJHD]

I like how just about every post/reply in this thread has absolutely nothing to do with the original question/post.

By all means continue the Snap On vs. whatever else argument.

 

[slowtwitch73]

Being pointed in the right direction to better tools for less money has nothing to do with original post?

 

[CGarage]

I like how just about every post/reply in this thread has absolutely nothing to do with the original question/post.

By all means continue the Snap On vs. whatever else argument.

All of the chatter is helpful.
There were things I never considered (I.e. that Snap-On would warranty taps and dies).
But, if there is something better from the original manufacturer, I want to know about it.

 

[garfunkle24]

Why pay $400 from Snap On when you can literally get it any where else for literally half the price?

I literally think you don't know what "literally" means.

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

I literally think you don't know what "literally" means.

Literally? Read the post I was quoting and maybe you'll understand the quip.

 

[F-22]

My recommendation would always be to get dies and taps from real cutting tool manufacturers. Big brands either rebrand those or do their own but they have next to no R&D into making such products.

For example, top notch manufacturers are Sandvik, Emuge Franken, Dormer, Walter, Garant...


Though for a mechanic workshop, if Snap On really replaces worn out taps it makes way more sense. Where I work, we use some special carbide taps made by Emuge and they charge ~100€ per resharpening (and a new tap is close to 200€).

 

[CGarage]

My recommendation would always be to get dies and taps from real cutting tool manufacturers. Big brands either rebrand those or do their own but they have next to no R&D into making such products.

For example, top notch manufacturers are Sandvik, Emuge Franken, Dormer, Walter, Garant...


Though for a mechanic workshop, if Snap On really replaces worn out taps it makes way more sense. Where I work, we use some special carbide taps made by Emuge and they charge ~100€ per resharpening (and a new tap is close to 200€).

This is the right thinking on this subject.

 

[garfunkle24]

Literally? Read the post I was quoting and maybe you'll understand the quip.

Now I am literally not sure you know what quoting a post means. Your post (the one I quoted) literally does not contain a quote.

 

[Woods_Wanderer]

You can get some of those good machinist taps from sources like mcmaster-carr and Amazon. For example, check out Regal or OSG.

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

Now I am literally not sure you know what quoting a post means. Your post (the one I quoted) literally does not contain a quote.

You could literally go back and read the post that I quoted. Pretty simple, literally scroll up, not down.

 

[KnurledNut]

Regarding dies, none of the premium machinist brands mentioned above have a dog in this fight, because...

...Snap-on used a proprietary double hex (12 point) for many of their dies, die stocks, specialty tools like the DDS1 and tap adaptors.
This is a feature for mechanics, using sockets and wrenches to drive them in cramped quarters.
(And no doubt helped control warranty claims.)

This has been the case for decades, originally as Bluepoint.
With the number of techs invested in these, myself included, it would be a difficult decision to discontinue them. (In fact, i hope they dont.)

 

[garfunkle24]

You could literally go back and read the post that I quoted. Pretty simple, literally scroll up, not down.

Your post, the one I quoted initially, is number 3 in the thread and neither quotes nor even paraphrases a previous post. What am I missing?

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

Your post, the one I quoted initially, is number 3 in the thread and neither quotes nor even paraphrases a previous post. What am I missing?

Apparently nothing.

 

[Lt CHEG]

Does anyone have a list of the contents of the old SnapOn tap and die set? I’m contemplating putting together a tap and die set, but with taper taps as well as either plug or bottom taps from a US manufacturer of HSS taps and dies. I would use the contents of a typical tap and die set as a template for where to start so as to have a general variety.

 

[BarrelRoll]

Does anyone have a list of the contents of the old SnapOn tap and die set? I’m contemplating putting together a tap and die set, but with taper taps as well as either plug or bottom taps from a US manufacturer of HSS taps and dies. I would use the contents of a typical tap and die set as a template for where to start so as to have a general variety.

https://www.bluetoad.com/publication/?m=12149&i=659699&p=442&pre=1&ver=html5

That should get you close to the right page in the snapon catalog

 

[Lt CHEG]

https://www.bluetoad.com/publication/?m=12149&i=659699&p=442&pre=1&ver=html5

That should get you close to the right page in the snapon catalog

Awesome, thank you very much!

 

[oldschoolcraft]

I heard Snap On recently started in-housing their tap and die but couldn't find any specific info on it. I wonder if they are using HSS now with their in-house versions?

 

[Hakeem]

Regarding dies, none of the premium machinist brands mentioned above have a dog in this fight, because...

...Snap-on used a proprietary double hex (12 point) for many of their dies, die stocks, specialty tools like the DDS1 and tap adaptors.
This is a feature for mechanics, using sockets and wrenches to drive them in cramped quarters.
(And no doubt helped control warranty claims.)

This has been the case for decades, originally as Bluepoint.
With the number of techs invested in these, myself included, it would be a difficult decision to discontinue them. (In fact, i hope they dont.)

What’s the advantage? All a double hex design means is that you can’t use your 6pt sockets or other conventional die handles to drive the die. A six pointed die would offer the end user more flexibility and increase compatibility with other non-Snapon hardware.

 

[john.k]

I d think the OD of a 12 pt die could be made smaller than 6 pt ,thereby saving expensive tool steel............my recent experience of OSG is the taps are soft ,maybe OK for soft steel ,no good at all when retapping a flywheel ,which was maybe a hard cast iron..........I rummanged in my bits and pieces ,found a WW2 tap ,and it cut easily and cleanly.

 

[toolenthusiast]

When Irwin moved their plant from Maine to Tennessee during covid, they were unable to get a lot of their equipment back into operation

Wait what? That’s a crazy level of brain drain / loss of institutional knowledge. I mean that really sounds like an epic unforced error. They failed to plan that badly? Did they not anticipate how fragile stuff was? Did they just have to disassemeble things to a point where no one alive had ever seen them that far apart? Did they not document every step of the teardown? Whoa.

 

[BrandonV]

Wait what? That’s a crazy level of brain drain / loss of institutional knowledge. I mean that really sounds like an epic unforced error. They failed to plan that badly? Did they not anticipate how fragile stuff was? Did they just have to disassemeble things to a point where no one alive had ever seen them that far apart? Did they not document every step of the teardown? Whoa.

Companies don't care. During COVID, I saw various large companies that do a significant amount of manufacturing relocate as part of projects I was involved in. Bean counters often see calculated savings in a geographical move, but they fail to account for other variables like labor that don't remain static with such a move.

Regardless. How much does Irwin still make in the United States? The last tap I bought from them had a COO of China on the packaging.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I d think the OD of a 12 pt die could be made smaller than 6 pt ,thereby saving expensive tool steel............my recent experience of OSG is the taps are soft ,maybe OK for soft steel ,no good at all when retapping a flywheel ,which was maybe a hard cast iron..........I rummanged in my bits and pieces ,found a WW2 tap ,and it cut easily and cleanly.

That's the reason. Smaller dies mean tighter areas are now workable.