Someone is going to be MAD!!!

[Bo Heck]

Here it is on my iTouch...

Also, note how he used spaces between the socket listings, but not between the description of the case and ratchet on upper portion of the description. This also points to an attempt to mislead.

If your definition of misleading is putting an honest description in BOLD CAPITAL letters. Then something is wrong here. This is not a crossword puzzle where you have to dig to find out what he is trying to say here. Its right there! In black and white! If you cant read, dont bid, period.

 

[Richard Givan]

My take:

Seller is guilty not of false representation according to the letter of the law, but bending the it's spirit to the breaking point. We all know he was banking on ensnaring a ******* just like the one he did.

Buyer, who grossly overpaid for the goods, is guilty of inattention and/or poor reading skills (poor education, ESL, etc). Folks like these are ill equipped to deal with the proliferation of people like this seller, who, sadly, are multiplying like viruses.

Ebay and the internet in general are providing sharpsters with the means to dupe with relative immunity the dull-witted.

 

[Stephenw]

If your definition of misleading is putting an honest description in BOLD CAPITAL letters. Then something is wrong here. This is not a crossword puzzle where you have to dig to find out what he is trying to say here. Its right there! In black and white! If you cant read, dont bid, period.

It's misleading. The text suffers from poor punctuation and blends together. He didn't put any spaces between the lines of the upper portion of the description like he did the lower portion (I think on purpose).

Here is a more honest description...

 

[Junkman]

It's misleading. The text suffers from poor punctuation and blends together. He didn't put any spaces between the lines of the upper portion of the description like he did the lower portion (I think on purpose).

Here is a more honest description...

Is it possible that the seller is as poorly educated and doesn't know how to post ???

 

[Stephenw]

Is it possible that the seller is as poorly educated and doesn't know how to post ???

Quite possible.

Taking everything in context, I don't think so. He states the case wont close with the ratchet inside. My conclusion is the only reason the items are in the case is an attempt to mislead.

 

[nissan_crawler]

It's misleading. The text suffers from poor punctuation and blends together. He didn't put any spaces between the lines of the upper portion of the description like he did the lower portion (I think on purpose).

Here is a more honest description...

Oh good god, the freaking letters are an inch high. Any inbred that can't read that shouldn't be using a computer.

Let's burn him at the stake for missing an enter key.

 

[Junkman]

Quite possible.

Taking everything in context, I don't think so. He states the case wont close with the ratchet inside. My conclusion is the only reason the items are in the case is an attempt to mislead.

How can this be misleading, when he clearly states that the case will not close with the Craftsman ratchet inside of it??? Misleading.... I don't see it..

 

[nissan_crawler]

Quite possible.

Taking everything in context, I don't think so. He states the case wont close with the ratchet inside. My conclusion is the only reason the items are in the case is an attempt to mislead.

My conclusion would be he had the damn case laying around, and put the sockets in it, since they all fit...call me crazy.

Would you rather buy Craftsman sockets in a ziplock baggy, or a blow molded case?

 

[Bo Heck]

So he will "ensnare" some fool. What's it to us? Make a new regulation to protect fools? Or let the fool learn a life lesson?

 

[Merkava_4]

d e c e p t i v e

 

[Stephenw]

Why is Snap-On the first word in the title and the description?

Why doesn't it say "Craftsman tools in a Snap-On case"?

I'm through with this thread.

I feel (as do many others) that it is clearly an attempt to mislead. Others think it is a well described and honest listing.

Should we scrap to see who is right?

 

[nissan_crawler]

I fail to see how the Craftsman tools are "new" They are in no form of packaging.
Once removed from the distribution packaging they are used.

They may be in "like new" or "as new" condition.

I consider this auction to be a perfect example of why people need to read.

oh good grief. In that case, NOBODY had bought a new car. As soon as it leaves the factory door, it's used.

In that case, you would NEVER be able to return anything you looked at to a store. Open the box, don't like that drill? Hey, it's used! No returns!

Back to reality...If the socket wasn't used, it's new. Taking a socket out of a package doesn't mean it's used.


used Listen to the pronunciation of used
Pronunciation:
\ˈyüzd, in the phrase “used to” usually ˈyüs(t)\
Function:
adjective
Date:
14th century

1: employed in accomplishing something Hmm, nope.
2: that has endured use ; specifically : secondhand <a used car> Hmm, nope.
3: accustomed , habituated Hmm, nope.

Gee, guess they aren't used!

 

[Merkava_4]

I find it no surprise that the guys in this thread defending the seller's deceptive practices are exactly the guys I'd expect to be defending the seller's deceptive practices.

 

[nissan_crawler]

The ones that know the definition of used?

 

[kwhitelaw]

The fact that he listed Snap On first in the description is what annoys me.

 

[walrus]

d e c e p t i v e

I agree, you read the ad though and its clear what he's selling. The Snap on is to get you in the door. Its not right if you ask me but I wouldn't fall for it either

 

[nissan_crawler]

The fact that he listed Snap On first in the description is what annoys me.

I'll give you that, but I wouldn't call it deceptive.

That's like putting ""THIS CAR HAS BEEN WRECKED!" all across the trunk of a car you're selling, the buyer looking at the car and buying it, then saying you were deceptive because he didn't ask if it had been, and his dumb @#$ didn't walk to the back of the car...

 

[walrus]

Buying anything on Ebay should be done with a whole lot of buyer beware.
Thats just the way it is.

 

[paramudduck]

Actually no, no one really ever buys a "New" car.

I agree the seller was upfront on some things. But the over all presentation to me is shady. Kind of ike a new car sales man.

UP FOR AUCTION IS A NEW SNAP-ON 1/4" DRIVE CASE WITH NEW CRAFTSMAN 1/4" TOOLS &1 STANLEY 2" EXTENION(USED)1 USED 6" CRAFTSMAN EXTENION

10 NEW SAE STANDARD

10 NEW DEEPWELL

9/16,1/2,7/16,3/8,11/32,5/16,9/32,1/4,7/32,

&3/16

10 NEW METRIC STANDARD 10 NEW DEEPWELL

14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6&5!! 1 NEW CRAFTSMAN POLISHED RATCHET!!RATCHET DOES NOT FIT IN CASE WHEN CASE IS CLOSED!!!

1 CRAFTSMAN SWIVEL!!STARTING BID $159.99

The failure to mention who made the sockets, after being so specific about the Craftsman ratchet, Stanley extension is interesting. Combined with a starting price of $159.99?

My objection to the word new comes from ebayers who have wide interpretations of the meaning.

All in all fraudulent, I can't really say. One I would personally not bid on?

Yes!

Also my interpretation of the word new seems to be prevalent today. Consider all the companies who will not take returns once they are out of the packaging.

 

[Merkava_4]

Why not have the case in a separate auction by itself? I'll tell you why, the case is in the auction with the Craftsman tools in an attempt to deceive the buyer.

 

[wrenchr]

I find it no surprise that the guys in this thread defending the seller's deceptive practices are exactly the guys I'd expect to be defending the seller's deceptive practices.

So what are you saying??? I'm deceptive???

 

[nissan_crawler]

Actually no, no one really ever buys a "New" car.

I agree the seller was upfront on some things. But the over all presentation to me is shady. Kind of ike a new car sales man.

UP FOR AUCTION IS A NEW SNAP-ON 1/4" DRIVE CASE WITH NEW CRAFTSMAN 1/4" TOOLS &1 STANLEY 2" EXTENION(USED)1 USED 6" CRAFTSMAN EXTENION

10 NEW SAE STANDARD

10 NEW DEEPWELL

9/16,1/2,7/16,3/8,11/32,5/16,9/32,1/4,7/32,

&3/16

10 NEW METRIC STANDARD 10 NEW DEEPWELL

14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6&5!! 1 NEW CRAFTSMAN POLISHED RATCHET!!RATCHET DOES NOT FIT IN CASE WHEN CASE IS CLOSED!!!

1 CRAFTSMAN SWIVEL!!STARTING BID $159.99

The failure to mention who made the sockets, after being so specific about the Craftsman ratchet, Stanley extension is interesting. Combined with a starting price of $159.99?

My objection to the word new comes from ebayers who have wide interpretations of the meaning.

All in all fraudulent, I can't really say. One I would personally not bid on?

Yes!

Also my interpretation of the word new seems to be prevalent today. Consider all the companies who will not take returns once they are out of the packaging.

Why not have the case in a separate auction by itself? I'll tell you why, the case is in the auction with the Craftsman tools in an attempt to deceive the buyer.

I'm not saying it isn't possible, because it is. It could also be just as possible that it was because he had the case.

I've seen several items in the classifieds on this board that were in a case that was NOT the same brand as the tools in them. Big deal, it was a case for them.

I would rather have my craftsman sockets in a blowmolded case than a ziploc bag. I also personally wouldn't sell a blowmolded or metal case on it's own, I've thrown several out.

 

[Merkava_4]

So what are you saying??? I'm deceptive???

I'll be sending you a PM shortly.

 

[wrenchr]

Why not have the case in a separate auction by itself? I'll tell you why, the case is in the auction with the Craftsman tools in an attempt to deceive the buyer.

So you are the type that does not read listings thru then??

 

[nissan_crawler]

Here's some more "deceptive" ones:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Automotive-Tools__Snap-on-Craftsman-and-other-brand-hand-tool-lot-impact_W0QQitemZ300296911277QQadiZ2871QQadnZAutomotiveQ20ToolsQQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Automotive_Tools?hash=item300296911277&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Automotive-Tools__Snap-on-Craftsman-8-point-double-square-3-8-drive-6_W0QQitemZ180272716723QQadiZ2871QQadnZAutomotiveQ20ToolsQQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Automotive_Tools?_trksid=p4506.m20.l1116

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Automotive-Tools__Snap-On-Craftsman-Matco-Mac-assorted-3-8-drive-sockets_W0QQitemZ120383053415QQadiZ2871QQadnZAutomotiveQ20ToolsQQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Automotive_Tools?hash=item120383053415&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318

 

[Merkava_4]

So you are the type that does not read listings thru then??

I read the listings through and through, but I'm speaking for the buyers who are not as well informed as I am.

 

[paramudduck]

Nissan what I am saying is, Yes he says Craftsman and Stanley 1/4 inch tools. Then he, very carefully, names the ratchets and the extensions.

Did you notice how the sockets are not named in the same way? Actually the way it is worded the sockets could be any brand.

I'm not saying it's fraud. I'm just saying that personally I do not trust the wording used.

Question can, any one who has a better monitor and eyes then I do tell what brand the sockets are?

Also if you look at his other auctions he uses that font on all of them.
I like this one best. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SNAP...Z150329925737QQptZMotorsQ5fAutomotiveQ5fTools

He also uses the word wratcheting in the description within the ad. By the way it starts at 19.99 if any one is interested.

 

[nissan_crawler]

Nissan what I am saying is, Yes he says Craftsman and Stanley 1/4 inch tools. Then he, very carefully, names the ratchets and the extensions.

Did you notice how the sockets are not named in the same way? Actually the way it is worded the sockets could be any brand.

I'm not saying it's fraud. I'm just saying that personally I do not trust the wording used.

Question can, any one who has a better monitor and eyes then I do tell what brand the sockets are?

Also if you look at his other auctions he uses that font on all of them.
I like this one best. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SNAP...Z150329925737QQptZMotorsQ5fAutomotiveQ5fTools

He also uses the word wratcheting in the description within the ad. By the way it starts at 19.99 if any one is interested.

"NEW CRAFTSMAN 1/4" TOOLS &1 STANLEY 2" EXTENION(USED)1 USED 6" CRAFTSMAN EXTENION"

The 2" extension is a used Stanley. The 6" extension is a used Craftsman, all other tools are new Craftsman. It seems very clear to me, what's the issue? It does say what the sockets are, and no, they could NOT be any brand. Are the sockets a used 2" Stanley extension? NO. Are the sockets a used 6" Craftsman extension? NO. Therefore, they are new Craftsman.

Good lord, the guy probably had a snap-on case here, some new sockets that probably came in a set and he already had them, a few used extensions there, threw a set together and put it on ebay.

I find it amusing our board members can do this in classifieds with no issues, but it's a problem when somebody on ebay does it.

 

[PowderKeg]

I guess that wrenchr is also a sleaze bag for not telling the seller that this ratchet is worth more than he was selling it for? After all, the seller had no idea as to what he was selling.......... Isn't it the responsibility of the buyer to make sure that the seller isn't selling himself short?

WHACK!! As the ball sails wayyy out into left field.....

Apples 'n oranges there Junk. It's the seller's responsibility to accurately describe the item for sale and know what he's willing to sell it for, it's the buyer's responsibility to know the value (to him) of what he's looking to buy. If wrenchr wanted to point out the ratchet was worth more than the seller was asking, that's up to him, but it's not his responsibility. Wrenchr gave the seller an amount the seller was satisfied with for the ratchet - if the seller wasn't satisfied, wrenchr wouldn't have the ratchet. Folks are bragging all the time (myself included) about the great deals they find, but nobody brags about how they've shafted a buyer (or a seller for that matter) by misleading/confusing them, because they'd get stomped on for being a real SOB.

Wanna pick it apart?

SNAP-ON/CRAFTSMAN 1/4" 44 PC RATCHET&SOCKET SET!!!

It's only the case that's a Snap-On and none of the tools, but the title insinuates a mixed brand set of tools. So why not "STANLEY/CRAFTSMAN" since there's a Stanley extension in there? Because "Snap-On" is the attention-getter, even though none of the actual hand tools are Snap-On, just the big red case.

The description? Yeah, the auction had an accurate description, but if you're going to copy/paste it, at least do it in the same font size as it was presented:

PLEASE READ BEFORE YOU BID!!
UP FOR AUCTION IS A NEW SNAP-ON 1/4" DRIVE CASE WITH NEW CRAFTSMAN 1/4" TOOLS &1 STANLEY 2" EXTENION(USED)1 USED 6" CRAFTSMAN EXTENION
10 NEW SAE STANDARD
10 NEW DEEPWELL
9/16,1/2,7/16,3/8,11/32,5/16,9/32,1/4,7/32,
&3/16
10 NEW METRIC STANDARD 10 NEW DEEPWELL
14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6&5!! 1 NEW CRAFTSMAN POLISHED RATCHET!!RATCHET DOES NOT FIT IN CASE WHEN CASE IS CLOSED!!!
1 CRAFTSMAN SWIVEL!!STARTING BID $159.99

Wow, that's real clear and easy to read.

ALL CAPS ALL SAME LARGE FONTSIZE LOUSY PUNCTUATION SPELING
&LINE SEPARATION
HARD TO READ EVERY BIT AS BAD AS the fine print folks complain about being used in warranties, country-of-origin, and such

The 2 pics? Well, one is a good pic of the whole set showing nice shiny new-looking tools, the other of the closed lid. Why the closed lid (when he said in the ad that the lid wouldn't close with the ratchet inside)? Because it focuses more attention on the only "Snap-On" part of the sale.

The starting bid of $159.99? Hey, I have no problem at all with someone asking a high starting price - they might not be interested in selling unless they can get a really big price for it, think it's worth far more to them to keep, whatever, but throw that starting bid (that's @ double what those tools would sell new for in a set from Sears) in with the misleading title and the difficult-to-read description, and it compounds the deceptive nature of the ad.

And that's the point - the auction, taken in it's entirety, is somewhat confusing, misleading, and ultimately deceptive.

And yes, ultimately it's the buyer that's an idiot for not carefully reading, researching, and asking before bidding, but buyer incompetence is no excuse for any seller to be misleading and deceptive. Deceptive a little or deceptive a lot, it's still deception.

We'll just have to disagree...

 

[fourfeathers]

I have had big problems with the descriptions not loading in auctions lately. The title is fine, the pics load, but I can't read any print in the descr. It gives me an error. Anyone else? This webpage is not available.

The webpage at http://vi.ebaydesc.com/ebaymotors/w...rum/showthread.php?t=31264&showall=1&caz.html might be temporarily down or it may have moved permanently to a new web address.

 

[Elwood77]

This reminds me of ebay listings that say "new Snap on sockets" in the title with a nice blurry far away photo, but if you read the fine print there not Snap On sockets but sockets that 'snap on to a ratchet'..

 

[nissan_crawler]

The description? Yeah, the auction had an accurate description, but if you're going to copy/paste it, at least do it in the same font size as it was presented:



Wow, that's real clear and easy to read.

ALL CAPS ALL SAME LARGE FONTSIZE LOUSY PUNCTUATION SPELING
&LINE SEPARATION
HARD TO READ EVERY BIT AS BAD AS the fine print folks complain about being used in warranties, country-of-origin, and such

It's quite clear to me. *shrug* one inch font isn't nearly as bad to read as micro font.

I have had big problems with the descriptions not loading in auctions lately. The title is fine, the pics load, but I can't read any print in the descr. It gives me an error. Anyone else? This webpage is not available.

The webpage at http://vi.ebaydesc.com/ebaymotors/w...rum/showthread.php?t=31264&showall=1&caz.html might be temporarily down or it may have moved permanently to a new web address.

It pulls up the description for me, works fine.

 

[PowderKeg]

I have had big problems with the descriptions not loading in auctions lately. The title is fine, the pics load, but I can't read any print in the descr. It gives me an error. Anyone else? This webpage is not available.

Nope, works fine for me as well, but I'm using Mozilla Firefox. Got fed up with Microsoft Exploder constantly detonating so I switched.

 

[speed bump]

Seems clear enough to me. The people I don't like are the people that try to sell sell Stanley or Blackhawk tools as Mac or Proto tools and put nothing about it in the title and leave that as small print in the description.

 

[charlie_nj]

Here is the ad............ please tell me what is misleading??? The seller in big letters says........PLEASE READ BEFORE YOU BID!! He mentions that "1 NEW CRAFTSMAN POLISHED RATCHET!!RATCHET DOES NOT FIT IN CASE WHEN CASE IS CLOSED!!!" Where is the deception? If you can speak, read, and understand the English language, then it is all there in easy to understand words. No double meaning, nothing deceptive the way that I see it. I bought this same set at a pawn brokers last month. I checked each socket prior to buying it to make sure that they were all Snap-On. There was one Craftsman in the box, and the pawn shop replaced it with a Snap-On from there tray of loose sockets. Were they being deceitful? No, it is my job as a buyer to know what I am buying.

Give me a break. You have to look at this sellers intent here. This is a savvy Ebayer who knows exactly what he is doing. He is carefully avoiding any blatant lies in his ad. This guy knows that there's a Snap On frenzy on Ebay and that there are lots of buyers who read titles but not entire ads, so he is taking advantage. However, you would have to be quite naive to think that his intent isn't to deceive a buyer into thinking he's getting a bunch of Snap-On sockets. Why the hell else would he put the sockets in a Snap On case? I don't see how anyone can defend this dude. And it obviously worked, somebody's paying nearly $200 for $50 worth of tools.

 

[Elroy]

That kind of reminds Elroy about his first house. It actually came with it's own lawn mower and gas can.

Hell I got the house for only a buck. But boy oh boy was that lawn mower ever expensive !!

That case was expensive !

 

[kwhitelaw]

Give me a break. You have to look at this sellers intent here. This is a savvy Ebayer who knows exactly what he is doing. He is carefully avoiding any blatant lies in his ad. This guy knows that there's a Snap On frenzy on Ebay and that there are lots of buyers who read titles but not entire ads, so he is taking advantage. However, you would have to be quite naive to think that his intent isn't to deceive a buyer into thinking he's getting a bunch of Snap-On sockets. Why the hell else would he put the sockets in a Snap On case? I don't see how anyone can defend this dude. And it obviously worked, somebody's paying nearly $200 for $50 worth of tools.

I agree. Although the end result lies on the buyer to read thoroughly the description.. This buyer knew what he was doing.

 

[3/8"indestro]

corporate America does it! they know what they are doing.lets see,re-badge wrenches,sockets,ratchets.Over inflated horsepower claims on compressors.Cordless drill that says "Assembled in America".claimed "12volt cordless drills",that are really 10.8volts.

not condoning the seller,as it is very misleading.but in the long run,buyer beware.if you don't do your research,you are on you're own.

 

[fourfeathers]

Nope, works fine for me as well, but I'm using Mozilla Firefox. Got fed up with Microsoft Exploder constantly detonating so I switched.

It does work fine on IE, I guess it hates the CHROME. Stay away from the Chrome, lol.

 

[LoneGunman]

I find it no surprise that the guys in this thread defending the seller's deceptive practices are exactly the guys I'd expect to be defending the seller's deceptive practices.

You mean the ones who believe in personal responsibility?