Speaker wire

[tinbender 66]

Not really an electrical question maybe. Is there a problem with running regular wire (not CL) inside a wall? I plan on using good, heavy wire like Monster wire. I'm about to close up the walls on the "office" in my garage and need to get the wire in. Also will be running two to the outside (into the garage not outdoors) for future garage speakers. A little over a hundred feet total. I just can't see it generating enough heat to be a hazard. Thanks.

 

[ishiboo]

Not really an electrical question maybe. Is there a problem with running regular wire (not CL) inside a wall? I plan on using good, heavy wire like Monster wire. I'm about to close up the walls on the "office" in my garage and need to get the wire in. Also will be running two to the outside (into the garage not outdoors) for future garage speakers. A little over a hundred feet total. I just can't see it generating enough heat to be a hazard. Thanks.

It's fine.

Don't bother buying expensive speaker wire like Monster, anything is fine. I use extension cords - cheap when picked up on sale.

Do realize subwoofers can quite easily pick up interference from 60hz electric service, which they'll reproduce

 

[tfi racing]

Several manufacturers offer in wall speaker wiring,most of the big box stores carry it as well,in these parts it must be FT4 rated.Save your money,no need to pay big bucks for a big name from the electronics store,I have never bought into the marketing hype around speaker wire.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Regular old lamp cord is as good as anything for speaker wire. Since it's low voltage you shouldn't have any issues running it inside the walls as long as you don't pass it through any furnace ducts.

 

[tinbender 66]

Regular old lamp cord is as good as anything for speaker wire. Since it's low voltage you shouldn't have any issues running it inside the walls as long as you don't pass it through any furnace ducts.

Thanks guys

 

[Jeff]

Monster wire or cables are a complete rip off.

Lamp cord will work. You can usually find it pretty cheap on the bulk rolls at Homey Depot or Lowes.

 

[Perry H]

I'm not sure running lamp wire behind drywall meets code. It's probably not a problem, but I think this is the stuff you are supposed to use...

http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10239&cs_id=1023902&p_id=2819&seq=1&format=2

(There are other gauges available. I just linked to that one for an example.)

 

[Stuart in MN]

Speaker wiring is low voltage, and per the NEC about the only restriction for that is to do a "neat and workmanlike" installation. There may be local codes that supersede the NEC, but that will depend on where you live.

Edit: I stand corrected. The NEC does cover audio cables, and it does say to use class 2 cable in walls, like the stuff in the monoprice link above.

Here's a link that discusses the issue in more depth: http://www.audioholics.com/educatio...in-wall-speaker-video-and-audio-cable-ratings

 

[Norcal]

Run speaker wire in the walls on a inspected job & if the inpector is sharp, the wire will be getting ripped out, the cable being run has to be properly rated for the purpose.

 

[tinbender 66]

I'm not sure running lamp wire behind drywall meets code. It's probably not a problem, but I think this is the stuff you are supposed to use...

http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10239&cs_id=1023902&p_id=2819&seq=1&format=2

(There are other gauges available. I just linked to that one for an example.)

Speaker wiring is low voltage, and per the NEC about the only restriction for that is to do a "neat and workmanlike" installation. There may be local codes that supersede the NEC, but that will depend on where you live.

Edit: I stand corrected. The NEC does cover audio cables, and it does say to use class 2 cable in walls, like the stuff in the monoprice link above.

Here's a link that discusses the issue in more depth: http://www.audioholics.com/educatio...in-wall-speaker-video-and-audio-cable-ratings

Thanks Stuart and Perry H

I just used Perry H's link to order 100' of CL2 14 Ga wire for twenty bucks. For the length of my runs I could get by with 16 ga but I tend to overbuild things.

 

[tinbender 66]

Check this stuff out:

This was an example in an 'net article I read debunking the high end speaker wire myth. Pretty funny.

 

[ishiboo]

Check this stuff out:

This was an example in an 'net article I read debunking the high end speaker wire myth. Pretty funny.

Yup Mcintosh did research comparing high-priced speaker wire vs common el cheapo lamp cord - no discernible difference between the two even in audiophile-grade usage.

There ARE areas where a quality cable matters - longer HDMI runs at higher bandwidths for example - but you can still pick up a high-quality cable on the cheap.

 

[mrb]

Do not run lamp cord or non-rated speaker wire in walls. It needs to be CL2 rated or better. The issue is flame spread on the insulation.

 

[89GLH]

How does a higher quality HDMI make a difference? With a digital signal, it either works or doesn't. Theres no difference between the $35 walmart cable or the $90 monster cable.

Are you referring to if the components are at the couch, going to a TV 60 feet (through walls, around corners, etc)?

 

[sammm]

Friends don't let friends buy Monster Cable.

Go to www.monoprice.com (no affiliation) for your audio/video wiring.

 

[BrianAltenhofel]

How does a higher quality HDMI make a difference? With a digital signal, it either works or doesn't.

Impedance has a significant effect on high frequencies, especially in longer cable runs. It's not as simple as "it either works or doesn't". If the impedance of the cable itself is significant enough, you will have problems with a digital signal. That's why on longer runs, you use higher quality cable.

Monster is not higher quality cable. Monster is higher quality marketing.

There are only two factors that are really important about cables in audio: impedance per foot and capacitance per foot. What's tolerable depends on the length of the run.

 

[btoner69]

I myself am an audiophile. I've owned some serious audio gear for the home and cars. Typical 16 gauge speaker wire is all that I use anymore. I only used high end **** in the car where the wires could be seen for the looks of the system. The higher end patch cords I would use for noise suppression but not speaker cables.

 

[ishiboo]

Impedance has a significant effect on high frequencies, especially in longer cable runs. It's not as simple as "it either works or doesn't". If the impedance of the cable itself is significant enough, you will have problems with a digital signal. That's why on longer runs, you use higher quality cable.

Monster is not higher quality cable. Monster is higher quality marketing.

There are only two factors that are really important about cables in audio: impedance per foot and capacitance per foot. What's tolerable depends on the length of the run.

+1.

Speaker wire is just two big conductors of a higher-power, low-bandwidth signal. HDMI is very high bandwidth and it subjects itself to cable quality due to attenuation. It's more noticeable on long runs, of course.

That's not to say a Monster cable is every required - there is ZERO reason to purchase expensive cables like that. But a quality inexpensive cable may be required, a prime example is longer runs.

Connectors and wall plates are also an area where cheap product can subject high-bandwidth signals to sufficient problems, as well as shielding.

How does a higher quality HDMI make a difference? With a digital signal, it either works or doesn't. Theres no difference between the $35 walmart cable or the $90 monster cable.

Wrong. Ever own a satellite when it's raining? With sufficient interference, you get signal breakup and the picture gets lossy. Same with HDMI - they call it "snow".

The higher the bandwidth, the more cable quality/construction matters.

 

[Stuart in MN]

I just bought a 25' long generic HDMI cable yesterday, it works great.

I saw this exchange on a television forum, I thought it was funny.
Q: What is the difference between a $17 and a $150 HDMI cable?
A: $133. That was easy.

Cnet has a good article on cables here: http://reviews.cnet.com/hdmi-guide/ They say, "And if you get nothing else from reading this guide, you should remember one simple fact: There's no reason to pay extra for HDMI cables."

 

[nehog]

Best deal on speaker wires is to use outdoor walkway wire (you can get it in 16, 14 and 12 AWG) which looks like lamp (zip) cord. Works very well.

 

[mrb]

Best deal on speaker wires is to use outdoor walkway wire (you can get it in 16, 14 and 12 AWG) which looks like lamp (zip) cord. Works very well.

you cannot run that stuff inside the walls of a structure. Just buy the CL2 rated in wall speaker wire from monoprice and be done with it.

 

[tinbender 66]

Okay, here's what I did. I got 100 ft. of 14 AWG CL2 rated wire from monoprice. With shipping it was almost 30 bucks. Not too bad.

I used regular plastic elec. boxes at the walls. I bought some painted blank metal plates, drilled a 7/16" hole and used one of those grommets with the groove around the middle (they must have a name, but I've never heard it).
The one in the pic is high on the wall for speakers out in the garage.

Where the wires come out of the wall behind the tuner, I did the same thing except with two holes in each one. I painted the plates satin black before putting the grommets in. Make for a pretty neat looking installation methinks.

 

[Scott P]

Nice job on the speaker plates. I like the look. Good choice on cable too.

 

[tinbender 66]

Thanks Scott, I originally put regular spkr wire in the walls but mrb convinced me to do it right. This forum certainly makes one stop and sweat the details a lot more.