Spindle spacing on porch deck and steps

[HoosierBuddy]

Hey guys,

I posted about this project a while back....and it's coming on. Nutshell...replaced an old treated entry stair with a footer/welded steel tubular frame/precast concrete structure. It's all in and looking good. I finished up the steel posts and rails yesterday. The final step will be installing spindles to make it to code and keep anyone (me for example) from falling off the porch and crashing 24 inches to my death.

In the immortal words of Sgt. Columbo, "there's only one thing bothering me"...the spacing.

So...I understand that there can't be a gap of more than 4" anywhere. I figured out the minimum number of spindles to accomplish that between the posts on the "deck" portion to the right below. Drew that in. Then I kept that same spacing and drew in all the ones on the "stair" part.

Is that how you do it?

Because the spindle to the right and the left of the center post below are quite different distances away from the post edges. Is there a better way?

Thanks for any advice!

Phil

 

[csp]

IMO, the spacing between spindles takes precedence of the spindles on either side of the center post. It's a change in planes, so the difference isn't something that your eye is drawn to.

 

[joe49]

In the drawing, even the spaces on the stairs, then adjust spacing on the porch rail as close as you can. Think add or subtract spindles, but remain under the 4'' rule.

 

[MoonRise]

Generally, a 4" diameter sphere can not pass through any 'space' in the guardrail/handrail.

If you kept the same pitch spacing of all the balusters without accounting for the posts, then the baluster spacing might look 'off'. Reset the baluster spacing after every post.

Also, remember that the handrail/guardrail has to be able to withstand a load of 50 lbs/ linear foot AND a 200 lb concentrated load in any direction (not simultaneously). A couple nails doesn't do it. The vertical posts can also not surface mount to the deck if the deck/landing is wood. The posts must be BOLTED (or welded if you have all steel structure) to the actual structure of the stair/deck/landing.

Remember that the 4" sphere test also applies to the open risers (personally not a fan of open risers, have had multiple incidents of adults and kids and pets slipping a foot or other body part through that gap and getting hurt or 'trapped' to various degrees).

Although the space on the stairs under the baluster bottom rail to the tread/riser 'corner' is required to not pass a 6" diameter sphere.

Also remember that the handrail top height must be within 34" to 38" of the stair nosing and the guardrail must be a minimum of 36" above the deck height. Commercial locale (basically includes anything OTHER than a single-family residential situation) guardrail minimum height is 42".

Although technically, most building codes don't require a handrail or guardrail for steps less than 30" off the ground. Personally I think it's still good to have them. And if you do put handrail or guardrail in place even when not required to do so, they would still have to meet all the requirements for a required handrail/guardrail.

Not always the easiest site to read or navigate through, but there is a ton of info there:

https://inspectapedia.com/Stairs/Stair_Baluster_Codes.php

 

[HoosierBuddy]

Thanks for the help guys, and Moonrise great job summing up code requirements. I actually love the floating look of the open treads and it was one of the essential parts of my design here. I was not aware that the 4-inch rule applied there too..but happily due to the thickness of the precast treads I had made and the way the math worked out, I’m in spec. Not that anyone around my rural area is likely to notice....but I want to do it right.

Next up, now that I know how many spindles to make, is cutting and welding all those up.

Winter descended here starting today...so fortunately that part of the job is indoors!

Pic below is before I got the posts mounted and welded the rails in.

 

[jbfab]

I'm probably a little late to the party here, but here is how to get the spacing even. Take the distance from the inside of one post, to the inside of the next post and add one picket thickness. Divide by (4+thickness of picket) round up to the nearest whole number, and that is your number of pickets. Now take the first distance you measured plus the thickness of one picket and divide by the number of pickets for your center to center spacing.

For example, let's say you have 48" between posts and you are using 1/2" pickets. 48.5 divided by 4.5 = 10.7777, so 11 pickets. Now, 48.5 divided by 11 = 4.409" that is your HORIZONTAL center to center spacing of tickets.

 

[BD1]

You may consider adding diamond shapes or scrolls on the end spacing where it's larger than the 4''. Even flat bar in a ''Z'' type pattern or continuous rings "O''. Any design you can think of will work.
Check out the WELDINGWEB site. There are posts on railings which may help.
https://www.weldingweb.com/vbb/
https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthre...ngs-(and-other-cool-stuff)&highlight=railings


https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthre...ngs-(and-other-cool-stuff)&highlight=railings

https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthre...iling-Layout-and-Measuring&highlight=railings