Stanley/Craftsman update - N. B. Herald

[B.S.A. (ret.)]

Here is an article from this morning's New Britain Herald regarding the Craftsman acquisition:

http://www.centralctcommunications....cle_c53e0494-0539-11e7-9f23-576629f6668a.html

 

[DTuck]

Here is an article from this morning's New Britain Herald regarding the Craftsman acquisition:

http://www.centralctcommunications....cle_c53e0494-0539-11e7-9f23-576629f6668a.html

Appears they want to manufacture in the U.S.

 

[gdocktor3]

Wow Stanley employs 52,000 people in 50 countries. I had no idea they were that large.

 

[Scout3918]

interesting. and hopefully they do go back making Craftsman back here in USA and good quality.

 

[Scout3918]

I knew Stanley big company, but didn't realize that many employees. Looks like CEO's doing alright lol.

 

[SuzukiGS750EZ]

Hmm... I wonder if Stanley quarter park relates to the Stanley company...

 

[flkeysdude]

This should answer some questions regarding COA of the "new" Craftsman Brand...you go SWK...!!!


http://www.investopedia.com/news/stanley-black-decker-build-us-swk/


http://www.usatoday.com/story/money...ars-holdings-craftsman-donald-trump/96192526/

http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...-opening-new-u-s-plant-trump-white-house-win/

 

[Fordman7795]

Wow Stanley employs 52,000 people in 50 countries. I had no idea they were that large.

Stanley owns many other brands so all of the employees for those brands are included as well. Mac, Dewalt, Porter Cable, Bostitch, etc

 

[flkeysdude]

in addition to Black and Decker, most recently Irwin and a host of others...

 

[Scout3918]

I was aware Stanley had Black & Decker but not DeWalt till the other day. Someone told me DeWalt basically a "souped" up B&D. Didn't know how accurate that is. I've had good luck with B&D but I just use them occasionally not weekly.

 

[bimmer630]

They have FACOM now too (france).
I wonder how much "cross breeding" between Mac, proto, Facom, and Now Craftsman, will occur

 

[Scout3918]

when should we expect see the Craftsman USA tools in stores?

 

[gdocktor3]

Stanley owns many other brands so all of the employees for those brands are included as well. Mac, Dewalt, Porter Cable, Bostitch, etc

I know but 50 countries

 

[four.cycle]

"We will invest in the brand with a focus on quality, innovation and U.S. manufacturing, with the goal of rapidly increasing sales through new channels and will provide more information on our distribution plans as they are developed."

So?

They've been saying that for three months. What part of this is "news"?

Sounds like just more jibber-jabber to keep their name in the headlines. (Gee, where have I seen that before?)
All talk, no substance.

 

[Super Sport]

They keep saying that they will make some Craftsman tools in the USA but "with global materials." See the Craftsman Facebook page for example. I'd almost be willing to bet that what this means is you will see Craftsman power tools built, alongside Dewalt, here in the USA using a bunch of imported parts.

Until Stanley comes out and says otherwise, I wouldn't get your hopes high for American made hand tools. They do have the capability since they already make most Proto tools stateside, but I still have my doubts, especially with the whole situation with Sears and the warranty issues.

 

[four.cycle]

Besides, you have to ask the question "Do they have a choice?"
If they choose to outsource their hand tools offshore from Asia, they have absolutely no advantage over any of the other Asian-produced product lines that already have established market share in this country.
They can't shell out $900 million dollars for the Craftsman name and continute to honor the Craftsman warranty and retain a price-point advantage over Kobalt, Husky, Pittsburgh, or any of the other Asian-made tool brands that have currently established market shares and distribution channels.
If they choose to continue to outsource the product line from Asia, they relegate it to the scrap-heap of irrelvency.

Where is this fabulous new manufacturing facility and when will production begin? Anything else is just more horn-blowing for the sake of horn-blowing.

 

[four.cycle]

They keep saying that they will make some Craftsman tools in the USA but "with global materials."

^ Weasel-words for "We're going to crank out the same kind of **** everybody else does and says it's "Assembled in USA" even though it's all made up of slave-labor-produced Chinese components."

Kind of like Black and Decker or (insert product name here).

Like I said: just more horn-blowing. No substance.

 

[Super Sport]

Besides, you have to ask the question "Do they have a choice?"
If they choose to outsource their hand tools offshore from Asia, they have absolutely no advantage over any of the other Asian-produced product lines that already have established market share in this country.
They can't shell out $900 million dollars for the Craftsman name and continute to honor the Craftsman warranty and retain a price-point advantage over Kobalt, Husky, Pittsburgh, or any of the other Asian-made tool brands that have currently established market shares and distribution channels.
If they choose to continue to outsource the product line from Asia, they relegate it to the scrap-heap of irrelvency.

Where is this fabulous new manufacturing facility and when will production begin? Anything else is just more horn-blowing for the sake of horn-blowing.

The Craftsman name itself hold enough of an advantage over the other Asian brands. While us GJ folk know tools, most of America does not. The Kobalt, Husky, and Pittsburg names mean nothing to most people. In fact, I'd even bet that most of the buyers that buy those brands only do it out of convenience since that is what their store of choice sells. If they swapped brand names tomorrow sales would not likely decrease. Meanwhile, the Craftsman name is very well known, and known by most to be "the best", no matter what the facts are.

 

[nahudson]

The Craftsman name itself hold enough of an advantage over the other Asian brands. While us GJ folk know tools, most of America does not. The Kobalt, Husky, and Pittsburg names mean nothing to most people. In fact, I'd even bet that most of the buyers that buy those brands only do it out of convenience since that is what their store of choice sells. If they swapped brand names tomorrow sales would not likely decrease. Meanwhile, the Craftsman name is very well known, and known by most to be "the best", no matter what the facts are.

I agree, the Craftsman name carries tremendous value. Everybody knows Craftsman, they have been around for 90 years. It is not going to matter where the tools are produced, if it says Craftsman people are going to choose it. I would be willing to bet that if you put every tool made overseas in a row and the average person had to pick which brand, they would pick up a Craftsman tool.

 

[four.cycle]

^ There were marketing people at General Motors who believed the same thing when they introduced the Cadillac Catera and Cimarron models too.

I have to assume you didn't actually read that post very carefully. Here it is again:

If they choose to outsource their hand tools offshore from Asia, they have absolutely no advantage over any of the other Asian-produced product lines that already have established market share in this country.
They can't shell out $900 million dollars for the Craftsman name and continue to honor the Craftsman warranty and retain a price-point advantage over Kobalt, Husky, Pittsburgh, or any of the other Asian-made tool brands that have currently established market shares and distribution channels.

 

[nahudson]

I read the whole post.
I believe that with the resources that Stanley/Black and Decker have, they can increase their market share in the US with the Asia tools, because they can offer Craftsman tools at more stores and locations. Right now, most people associate Craftsman with Sears and Sears stores are closing all the time, so there are fewer and fewer of them. Whereas, SBD will most likely have the tools in several stores including Sears. $900 million is a lot of money, but they only had to pay $525 million now and rest later and then just pay a percentage for 15 years. I would think SBD will see a good return on their investment in future years.

 

[Scout3918]

I agree, the Craftsman name carries tremendous value. Everybody knows Craftsman, they have been around for 90 years. It is not going to matter where the tools are produced, if it says Craftsman people are going to choose it. I would be willing to bet that if you put every tool made overseas in a row and the average person had to pick which brand, they would pick up a Craftsman tool.

True Statement

 

[kctyphoon]

I agree, the Craftsman name carries tremendous value. Everybody knows Craftsman, they have been around for 90 years. It is not going to matter where the tools are produced, if it says Craftsman people are going to choose it. I would be willing to bet that if you put every tool made overseas in a row and the average person had to pick which brand, they would pick up a Craftsman tool.

This is self evidently true. If ANYONE needed proof, look no further than the sale price of the brand.

As far as made in America and some "with global components" - where's the problem people?? Or did you guys think that plastic and steel raw material were only American made too.. seriously, are you really gonna start complaining ALREADY??.. if they did EVERYTHING your way then a single 3/8 drive 1/2" socket would sell for $15 - and you same people would then complain about the price, still call it junk, and then call them stupid for pricing themselves out of their own market..

Just saying, the same company that just agreed to a 900 million dollar brand acquisition, ALSO just said they are willing to spend ANOTHER 35 million to help revitalize the USA manufacturing of a historically American made brand.. this is what you guys are asking for, they are taking steps to do that... relax for a minute..

 

[cheechi]

I know but 50 countries

Yeah but Europe makes up probably 40 of those and realistically should count as 5.

They have one accountant in Monaco, one phone support person in Vatican City, a guy makes triggers for air nailers in Lichtenstein, and so on and so on.

 

[American Locomotive]

This is self evidently true. If ANYONE needed proof, look no further than the sale price of the brand.

As far as made in America and some "with global components" - where's the problem people?? Or did you guys think that plastic and steel raw material were only American made too.. seriously, stop complaining, stop crying.. if they did EVERYTHING your way then a single 3/8 drive 1/2" socket would sell for $15 - and you same people would then complain about the price, still call it junk, and then call them stupid for pricing themselves out of their own market..

There's a big distinction between "Made in the USA", "Assembled in the USA" and "Assembled in the USA with global components" Here's what happens in these "Assembled Global Components" assembly plants: A worker takes a plastic imported case half, puts the imported pre-assembled electronics package in it (including the motor, trigger and battery connector), screws the imported pre-built gearbox module into the case half, puts the other imported case half on, and then attaches the imported chuck.

You then put the whole deal on an assembly line where 1 worker does a single task, and now have 5 workers churning a drill out every minute or less. A plant with 20 line workers could probably churn out close to 2,000 drills a day.

Congrats, you gave 20 people a job putting a drill together, while hundreds of workers overseas did all the heavy lifting and got the majority of the money.

Look, I like "Made in the USA" just as much as the next guy, but to me the "Assembled in the US with Global Components" sticker is hilariously misleading and meaningless. Either actually manufacture some components here, or don't even bother putting a sticker proudly proclaiming its "origin". There's a reason why the DeWalt uses terms like "Built" or "Assembled", because the FTC has restrictions as to how "Made in the USA" can be used. The "With Global Components" modifier basically allows them to manufacture the entire product overseas, just screw it together here and still call it U.S. Assembled.

 

[kctyphoon]

There's a big distinction between "Made in the USA with global components" and "Assembled in the USA with global components" Here's what happens in these "Assembled Global Components" assembly plants: A worker takes a plastic imported case half, puts the imported pre-assembled electronics package in it (including the motor, trigger and battery connector), screws the imported pre-built gearbox module into the case half, puts the other imported case half on, and then attaches the imported chuck.

You then put the whole deal on an assembly line where 1 worker does a single task, and now have 5 workers churning a drill out every minute or less. A plant with 20 line workers could probably churn out close to 2,000 drills a day.

Congrats, you gave 20 people a job putting a drill together, while hundreds of workers overseas did all the heavy lifting and got the majority of the money.

Look, I like "Made in the USA" just as much as the next guy, but to me the "Assembled in the US with Global Components" sticker is hilariously misleading and meaningless. Either actually manufacture some components here, or don't even bother putting a sticker proudly proclaiming its "origin".

I would assume most people are referring to sockets and wrenches on this thread.. not much assembly going on there... don't think anyone is really expecting craftsman to start selling American made snowblowers again..

 

[American Locomotive]

The point is, the "Assembled in the U.S. with Global Components" tag is meaningless and misleading. It's not a "good start", it's not a "half way point" between making it fully in the US, or making half of it here. It's a marketing gimmick that allows them to sell a tool that's 90% constructed overseas as U.S. made.

I have no problem with SB&D taking Chinese steel, doing the actual forging of the sockets in the U.S., and then calling them "Made in the U.S.A". That's totally fine.

What I would have a problem with is SB&D taking fully forged sockets from overseas, sticking them on a socket-rail, and calling those "Assembled in the USA with global components"

 

[four.cycle]

I believe that with the resources that Stanley/Black and Decker have, they can increase their market share in the US with the Asia tools, because they can offer Craftsman tools at more stores and locations.

(* emphasis added *)

Really? Where are these "more stores and locations" at, exactly?
Ace Hardware? They don't do enough volume to justify the $900 million dollar purchase price.
Menards? They're a Midwest chain only, with no distribution on the east or west coast. Again, not enough distribution outlets.
Home Depot and Lowes already have their Husky and Kobalt "house brands" and are doing a fairly good job with them.
What would be the incentive for a Home Depot or Lowes buyer to pull the plug on a brand name they've been nurturing for well over a decade and replace it with another offshore sourced product line? Do you honestly believe that Home Depot or Lowes buyers would drop their current "house brands" to pay more for Craftsman simply because of brand name recognition?

Seriously?

Have you ever done any volume purchasing for a chain of stores?

Right now, most people associate Craftsman with Sears and Sears stores are closing all the time, so there are fewer and fewer of them. Whereas, SBD will most likely have the tools in several stores including Sears.

Really? That's curious, because every article that was published when the deal was done said that Sears would be selling its own line of Craftsman tools (presumably sourced from the same suppliers they've been buying it from all along.) There was (and has been) no mention of Sears sourcing the Craftsman brand from SBD.

 

[four.cycle]

^ .... and if your answer was "Wal-Mart":

The only way SBD will get Craftsman into Wal-Mart is on price point.
Wal-Mart is so big they will set the warranty policy on the product, not the manufacturer.
Meaning: the only Craftsman that SBD is going to get into Wal-Mart is going to be outsourced from China, and it's going to have to be competitive with Husky, Kobalt, and Harbor Freight's "Pittsburgh". Like I said above: relegating it to the scrap heap of irrelevance; it will be just another made-in-China cheapo tool line like all the others.

 

[B.S.A. (ret.)]

I apologize to the readers of this forum for starting this thread this morning. I thought that I was providing a service where a statement from the Stanley Management to the local newspaper would allay some fears that I have heard on this subject over the past few months. Instead, it has devolved into a paranoia-laced, opinionated sack of drivel that I want nothing to do with and I regret being the origin of these ceaseless attacks on a company trying to do their best at keeping a great American tool brand alive and living in the U.S.A. You "Debbie Downers" all should be ashamed of yourselves and give these people a chance to prove themselves before the mass condemnations start. Get a life and let's give American Business a chance to respond to the election of Donald Trump and give him a chance to bring back jobs to this country. I for one am damn sick of the whining I'm hearing here - ban we if you think I'm wrong!

 

[American Locomotive]

I apologize to the readers of this forum for starting this thread this morning. I thought that I was providing a service where a statement from the Stanley Management to the local newspaper would allay some fears that I have heard on this subject over the past few months. Instead, it has devolved into a paranoia-laced, opinionated sack of drivel that I want nothing to do with and I regret being the origin of these ceaseless attacks on a company trying to do their best at keeping a great American tool brand alive and living in the U.S.A. You "Debbie Downers" all should be ashamed of yourselves and give these people a chance to prove themselves before the mass condemnations start. Get a life and let's give American Business a chance to respond to the election of Donald Trump and give him a chance to bring back jobs to this country. I for one am damn sick of the whining I'm hearing here - ban we if you think I'm wrong!

Eventually you'll understand that these statements from SB&D are just deceitful patriotic-marketing-drivel designed to tug at the heartstrings of patriotic Americans. They spout nonsense about how important American manufacturing is to them, and how important American jobs are.

Then they have the gall to import 90% of the product components, assemble them with a plant staffed by about 25 people and then go on and on about how they're "supporting American workers" while barely paying their factory workers over minimum wage (https://www.glassdoor.com/Hourly-Pay/DeWalt-Hourly-Pay-E331506.htm)

Call me when SB&D fires up a Craftsman forging plant with a DeWalt motor-winding plant right next to it, and a gear-cutting shop across the street staffed by actual people doing actual work. Until they do that - it's all talk. As far as things changing with the current president - there's a reason every single one of his namesake's products, as well as his daughter's products are made overseas.

In my opinion, if consumer goods manufacturing comes back in a big way to the U.S., it's going to be with assembly line workers named "RBT_A15" and "RBT_B03" - not Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.

Call me a debbie-downer all you want, but I'm tired of being lied to and mislead by large companies and politicians.

 

[B.S.A. (ret.)]

Eventually you'll understand that these "statements" from SB&D are just generic patriotic-marketing-drivel designed to tug at the heartstrings of patriotic Americans. They spout nonsense about how important American manufacturing is to them, and how important American jobs are. Then they have the gall to import 90% of the product components, assemble them with a plant staffed by about 25 people and then go on and on about how they "support American workers".

Call me when SB&D fires up a Craftsman forging plant with a DeWalt motor-winding plant right next to it, and a gear-cutting shop across the street. Until they do that - it's all talk.

Thank you Debby

 

[kngelv]

Here is something worth a read. To the OP - thanks for the link. Don't pay attention to the knuckleheads.

James

http://toolguyd.com/dewalt-cordless-tools-built-in-the-usa/

 

[cheechi]

I'd like to see your opinion, American Locomotive on American workers having lost more work to automation and streamlining manufacturing processes than to offshoring. And please also address the fact that the 'Made in USA' label can accurately be put on an item that used to be made by an American worker but is now made by a machine. That the machine has possibly (or not) been made or assembled in the USA doesn't factor into it.

Would you rather have an item made by a machine that happens to be in the USA or a person in Taiwan? I'm interested.

 

[American Locomotive]

The pictures on that article are cute kngelv. Where's all the injection molding equipment, the motor winders, the gear hobs, the metal breaks, the machining centers? I only see a whole bunch of people taking stuff out of boxes

I'd like to see your opinion, American Locomotive on American workers having lost more work to automation and streamlining manufacturing processes than to offshoring. And please also address the fact that the 'Made in USA' label can accurately be put on an item that used to be made by an American worker but is now made by a machine. That the machine has possibly (or not) been made or assembled in the USA doesn't factor into it.

Would you rather have an item made by a machine that happens to be in the USA or a person in Taiwan? I'm interested.

Automation is inevitable, and I personally believe it's foolish to think that an administration change will magically bring back American jobs. If they come back, they will be back as machines.

Modern fully automated factories can run "lights out", where no one is present and the lights are literally turned off. The machinery will machine, assemble and package the product for shipping. You just have some guys at the loading dock taking boxes off the end of a conveyor and putting them in a truck.

As far as preferring an American-robot built product, to a Taiwanese-robot built product. That's a tough one honestly. With a local factory, you'll at least be paying local taxes and bills, but then again, with imported stuff you have things like import duty to make up for it. Unless we adopt Bill Gate's proposal to tax robots like people.

EDIT: I stand partially corrected, apparently DeWalt at least winds the rotors for their brushed tools in their US factory. Not sure about brushless or any of the other tool components.

 

[amason3]

I'm probably going to have to join the debbie downer club too. Stanley is buying the name. Craftsman has continued to sell well even though made in China...hell, a ton of poeple didn't even notice the change or COO, or at least didn't care. Craftsman always depended on other companies to manufacture their hard line tools, unlike MAC and Proto. Stanley did stick with USA made Mac and Proto because it was already in place and a money-making force in industrial tools. The likelihood that Stanley will begin USA production of Craftsman is highly unlikely, especially since Stanley has already introduced the "expert" line (foreign made) for Mac and Proto. Even the Blackhawk brand is being moved to more foreign production. Stanley is going to manufacture as cheap as possible, and it will still sell. The Craftsman name is as american as apple pie. This is proven by the fact all of their power tools and yard equipment have been produced oversees for well over 2 decades, but still sold on par with milwaukee (now mainly foreign), dewalt (now mainly foreign) john deer (now mainly foreign as well) even when those brands were still USA made. In short, new Craftsman is still going to **** until China starts producing like Taiwan has in the past few years. That should be about the time China becomes the new world power and we're playing 2nd or third fiddle in the world economy.

 

[PFSard]

I apologize to the readers of this forum for starting this thread this morning.

Don't be apologetic. I would probably not be aware of this news item if you had not posted. I'm interested in what Stanley will do with the Craftsman brand, although I am past my tool buying days (well, new hand tools anyway). I bought a lot of CM products back in my younger days. Sears failed to adapt to the changing retail environment, .....

 

[Super Sport]

(* emphasis added *)

Really? Where are these "more stores and locations" at, exactly?
Ace Hardware? They don't do enough volume to justify the $900 million dollar purchase price.
Menards? They're a Midwest chain only, with no distribution on the east or west coast. Again, not enough distribution outlets.
Home Depot and Lowes already have their Husky and Kobalt "house brands" and are doing a fairly good job with them.
What would be the incentive for a Home Depot or Lowes buyer to pull the plug on a brand name they've been nurturing for well over a decade and replace it with another offshore sourced product line? Do you honestly believe that Home Depot or Lowes buyers would drop their current "house brands" to pay more for Craftsman simply because of brand name recognition?

Seriously?

Yeah, actually I do think people could care less about the Husky and Kobalt names. I doubt anybody buys those brands for any real reason other than the store they're carried in. I'm not saying either chain will actually begin to carry Craftsman, but I do think they would see higher sales if they did. I think Stanley could (and might) use all of their same production facilities as well as sales channels to sell Craftsman tools and I think they will see a pretty dramatic increase.

 

[2000-cvpi]

Re: Stanley/Craftsman update - N. B. Heral

I apologize to the readers of this forum for starting this thread this morning. I thought that I was providing a service where a statement from the Stanley Management to the local newspaper would allay some fears that I have heard on this subject over the past few months. Instead, it has devolved into a paranoia-laced, opinionated sack of drivel that I want nothing to do with and I regret being the origin of these ceaseless attacks on a company trying to do their best at keeping a great American tool brand alive and living in the U.S.A. You "Debbie Downers" all should be ashamed of yourselves and give these people a chance to prove themselves before the mass condemnations start. Get a life and let's give American Business a chance to respond to the election of Donald Trump and give him a chance to bring back jobs to this country. I for one am damn sick of the whining I'm hearing here - ban we if you think I'm wrong!

If I could buy you a beer I would.

Very well said and something that a lot of posters here should consider before making assumptions only based on opinions and zero fact.

 

[kctyphoon]

The nerve of those bastards at SBD.. To think that so many people spent their hard earned money buying Chinese made Craftsman tools with a lifetime warranty, and now they are gonna force me to take home an AMERICAN MADE replacement if I can actually break one of these sockets or wrenches.....

That's not what I ****** paid for dammit!!