Storage in Oversea's Shipping Container

[LifeLongWNYer]

The fire department which I belong to has run out of storage space and is considering purchasing an overseas shipping container for the storage of (1) paper records mandated for retention and (2) surplus/unused turnout gear, until a better solution is figured out. In all likelihood, it will evolve into THE long-term solution.

I am wondering about the advisability of storing these moisture sensitive items in an unvented shipping container. Will condensation and the lack of cool/fresh air degrade the items stored?

Thanks,


.

 

[garageguy1]

Will start by saying I am not an expert ...

1)It really depends on the Condition/Quality of the container...YMMV
2)It will get very Hot/Cold in the container and you will need to install some sort of vents to ensure that condensation is not present.

you can likely rent a good quality storage container if its supposed to be short term...has the department inquired if any other municipal dept have some extra space in a basement or something ?

also googling "Using Shipping Containers for Record Storage Specification and
Description" returns some professions guides from a number of document/archive groups

 

[rsanter]

Often those containers are sealed and with the rise and fall of humidity they do get a bit musty inside with temp changed.
I have seen people put those whirlybird vents on the top and do other types of venting.

I would recommend painting with that white roof sealing paint on stuff to reduce temp swings.
You can also get those containers that adsorb moisture and out some of those In there

 

[LifeLongWNYer]

Actually, GarageGuy1, the town clerk and the highway department are looking for storage too, and are waiting to see if this works, before they buy their own containers.

Supposedly, according to the outfit that is trying to sell the container, it is "almost" air tight.


.

 

[kbs2244]

paper is tough stuff
Keep it below 451F (The ignition temp)
But you have to keep it dry
(Think Egyptian desert scrolls)
Well sealed plastic totes may be the answer.

 

[jack stand]

I am wondering about the advisability of storing these moisture sensitive items in an unvented shipping container. Will condensation and the lack of cool/fresh air degrade the items stored?

Thanks,


.

YES!
You can build in some ventilation with lower air intake(s) with a roof vent, but this done so to be leak & mouse proof is not so simple and no guarantee against musty conditions inside. I wonder if a local community minded "self storage" facility would consider hooking you guy's up with a free or low priced unit. It might be a deductible donation for him along with the possibility of a good advertising opportunity for him helping you guys out.

 

[OldNeons]

So, I have about a dozen 5' tall Lista/Vidmar tooling/parts boxes in such a storage container. HOT and humid here in the midwest in the summer and around zero for a good part of the winter. Am I going to cry when I pull these out to use in my new shop in a few years?

 

[thertel]

Are you prohibited from taking your record retention digital?

 

[jack stand]

So, I have about a dozen 5' tall Lista/Vidmar tooling/parts boxes in such a storage container. HOT and humid here in the midwest in the summer and around zero for a good part of the winter. Am I going to cry when I pull these out to use in my new shop in a few years?

I think you'll be ok with metal.
My story is several years, actually about 6 of household **** that suffered. The wood stuff got a little moldy and all fabric stuff smelled.
I had another 20' 'can' with all my shop stuff in it. For the most part everything was fine.

 

[rsanter]

So, I have about a dozen 5' tall Lista/Vidmar tooling/parts boxes in such a storage container. HOT and humid here in the midwest in the summer and around zero for a good part of the winter. Am I going to cry when I pull these out to use in my new shop in a few years?

Ideally if you closed it up when the humidity was low that’s a good thing.
I would also add a few of those things that pull the moisture out of the air.
Overall you should be fine but you may get some surface rust in areas

 

[highflier]

I have a couple of 40' I use for storage.
They actually have a pair of small, like 8"x3" vents on each end.
Not nearly adequate, but you may could enlarge to help ventilation.

My main tip is if you are buying unseen, be sure to tell them you need a clean/decent interior.
By that I mean no diesel or machine oil soaked floors, not a desirable smell.
I got one like that one time and had to make them take it back.

 

[matt_i]

So, I have about a dozen 5' tall Lista/Vidmar tooling/parts boxes in such a storage container. HOT and humid here in the midwest in the summer and around zero for a good part of the winter. Am I going to cry when I pull these out to use in my new shop in a few years?

If you coated everthing with a rust preventative when you loaded it, I don't think it will be an issue.

I don't like the containers for the potentially "bad" combination of high heat and high humidity that I've seen develop inside.

Like anything, a more "active" solution to control temp and humidity would be ideal. Dehumidifer comes to mind but I'm pretty sure those don't do well, left alone and expected to operate at 140F. So now you need airflow or cooling to reduce the temps...

 

[mike93lx]

If you care about the documents, use a service like iron mountain or access.

 

[finn]

Take the professional route and have a service digitize and store the records that must be maintained. It’s part of the cost of doing business, and storing them in paper format in a shipping container sounds kind of half assed.

 

[Captain Spaulding]

If they are only being retained because law requires it, bag them up and put the boxes in a conex. If the information is something that may be needed for informational purposes, digitize it and save future pain and the expense of storage.

 

[Dzlpete]

Just put a small automatic dehumidifier in there, with a small hole drilled at or thru floor level for a short hose to drain the condensate. It will be fine.
Set on auto, it will run only if/when the humidity spikes.

 

[SarcasticDwarf]

The fire department which I belong to has run out of storage space and is considering purchasing an overseas shipping container for the storage of (1) paper records mandated for retention and (2) surplus/unused turnout gear, until a better solution is figured out. In all likelihood, it will evolve into THE long-term solution.

Your fire department is a bunch of nitwits, and that is being generous. Storing records in a manner where it is well known* they will rapidly degrade would constitute negligence. Federal and state laws would then come into play, depending on the situation. Storing records in this manner is extra stupid as there are well-established local, national, and international firms with expertise in storing records. Iron Mountain is the best known company, but there are many, many others.

* How fast it degrades depends on the materials. Some paper will last forever, only becoming more brittle. Others will get darker, but still be readable. Handwritten documents will have problems near immediately. Thermal paper might not last a day. When the paper and ink was produced also has an impact (acidity, materials, etc.)

The entire Hewlett-Packard archives were lost last year in a fire due to some ******* storing them this way.

Edit: I have a background in records management and lots of experience storing weird **** in weird places. There is an entire profession dedicated to this.

 

[Ilikeike]

We have 2 containers at work for storage, 35'~40'. They both have small vents in the corners built in when they were originally built by the manufacture, maybe 3"x3" they're small. So we added a solar panel powered vent fan on the top of one, and a turbine style roof vent on the other with larger vents cut in and screened along the bottom.

We also installed a pre-hung stainless entry door on the side of the one that we enter daily, along with 120V power/lighting and a motion sensor connected to our monitored alarm system.

We paid around $3,000 each.

Painting the tops of the containers with "snow roof" helped keep them noticeably cooler.

 

[denis4x4]

See my avatar! I have a roll around with tools and instruction manuals along with gardening equipment. My problems have not been with humidity, but with mice. They have destroyed instruction books in the tool box drawers and built nests in the containers.

 

[rpcraft]

Your fire department is a bunch of nitwits, and that is being generous. Storing records in a manner where it is well known* they will rapidly degrade would constitute negligence. Federal and state laws would then come into play, depending on the situation. Storing records in this manner is extra stupid as there are well-established local, national, and international firms with expertise in storing records. Iron Mountain is the best known company, but there are many, many others.

* How fast it degrades depends on the materials. Some paper will last forever, only becoming more brittle. Others will get darker, but still be readable. Handwritten documents will have problems near immediately. Thermal paper might not last a day. When the paper and ink was produced also has an impact (acidity, materials, etc.)

The entire Hewlett-Packard archives were lost last year in a fire due to some ******* storing them this way.

GREat points. If the documents are supposed to be stored according to federal, state, or local initiatives, then they should provide a manner (i.e. guidance) for safe storage measures. Might be time to read the specifics and see. I come from a military background and pretty much everything spoils, rots, rusts, or gets destroyed in a conex box, given enough exposure to time, elements, and other critters, unless it is already in a proper storage device. There is a reason Ammo boxes have rubber seals on the leads, just like new rifles are grease covered...

 

[ny15]

Averdi in Rochester sells new containers. They are vented so there shouldn't be a condensation issue. I looked at buying a 20' container last year.

 

[LifeLongWNYer]

I am the OP, and I am not in favor of the idea, so take it easy on me. I started this thread, looking for reasons to attempt to disuade then from employing this type of strorage. I used these in the past, so I knw, but am looking for additional information.

To those who provided it, thanks for the good info.



.

 

[Barnabas]

Check your zoning regulations. I have a warehouse on property zoned Heavy Industrial, which means I can have all the 18 wheeler trailers I want for as long as I want, but shipping containers can stay only 90 days.

 

[6768rogues]

Unless you provide some kind of climate control, your paper records will get moldy. Temperature changes will cause moisture problems in a container that is not climate controlled, whether it is vented or air tight. The good news is that my brother in law runs a company south of Canandaigua that can restore those moldy documents, but if you cannot afford storage you cannot afford his services.
It would be better to build a loft in one of your bays for record storage, but not a whole lot better.
Is there any state grant money available for record retention? I worked for Monroe County and for a local public school district and both got grant money to digitize records and to build proper record storage rooms. Also, carefully check the state's requirements for record retention. Many records do not need to be saved and there are many that have time periods associated with retention. I helped eliminate a lot of records that had passed their expiration dates but were clogging up storage space. We started dating every box for destruction if it did not contain permanent records.
You can also look to off site storage at one of the storage companies. They have a bunch of crack heads shuffling documents around, but it is better than nothing.

 

[johnnyradiant]

You mentioned a couple other departments needing something too. What about getting all the different fingers of local govt together to see status of everyone's storage needs. Maybe a pooled storage facility could get done. If there is currently 3 looking I'm guessing there will be others in short order.

 

[pcmeiners]

"If the information is something that may be needed for informational purposes, digitize it and save future pain and the expense of storage. "

Digitalizing is not fail safe. CD media has a limited life time . Hard drive formatting fades over time as does tape media.

Have you given any thought to purchasing a used insulated container? Would be possible to maintain heat with a very small electric heater.