Sub Panel Lug Questioin

[Augus7us]

Hey Guys,

I'm installing my subpanel and I notice that what appears to be a ground and a neutral bar and lugs next to the breakers. On either side of them is another grounding bar. Are my assumptions correct in the photo below?

Remove the bar connecting the neutral and ground bars and remove the bonding screw from the neutral bar? If so do I have to bond the ground bar with the screw on the neutral side or is it already grounded?

If not I'm assuming both bars next to the breakers are for neutrals and the outer bars are for grounds?

Thanks

 

[dscheidt]

Move the ground from the house to one of the ground lugs. Remove the green screw. The inner bars are for neutrals, and are isolated from the case. The outer bars are grounds, and are bonded to the panel. Land the ground from the house in one of those, as well as the wire for your ground rods (assuming this is a detatched structure, and you require them.).

your panel should have come with instructions about how to use it as a sub....

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Agree with above.

Is this in an attached or detached structure?

Did you run 4-wire feeder?

 

[Augus7us]

Yeah I realized why I was thinking that. It threw me why they would have 3 lugs the same size and a fourth that is the proper size of the ground but not bonded? I was thinking to myself why would you have to remove this ground lug from the neutral bar and reinstall it on one of the ground bars.

Then it occurred to me it is that way because most of these are installed as a main panel and not a sub panel like I'm doing, correct?

It is four wire wylie. I have two ground rods I have to drive in also.

 

[Augus7us]

Here's an updated photo. I still have to remove the ground screw, but its not hot yet.

 

[The Cobbler]

just an off the wall question, are you sure you want those 2x4's down each side? they impede most the locations for wire entry ...

 

[Augus7us]

I'm not too worried about it. There is about 1.5" between the studs and the girts. I am curious how the pros would run and secure a bunch of wires in a configuration like this (stud walls between posts and girts)l I'll try to post a photo of it tomorrow.

 

[teamextreme]

The vast majority of panels are mounted between stud bays and result in 2x4's down the sides. Not really an issue as everything usually comes out the top or bottom.

Augus, you should have put a plastic bushing on the conduit as well.

 

[Norcal]

It would have been a lot cleaner to have inverted the panel rather then have all that excess conductors in the panel, they are made for top or bottom feed. Code also requires a bushing on the fitting where the conductors are 4 AWG or larger as noted above in post #8.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Just curious here, I see it's a 200 amp main, are you feeding it with 200 amps or something smaller ? I'm no electrician but (to me) the wire looks rather small for that large of a service but I don't know how far your run is either.


Central Ohio, you have AEP or Consolidated Co-op ?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Just curious here, I see it's a 200 amp main, are you feeding it with 200 amps or something smaller ? I'm no electrician but (to me) the wire looks rather small for that large of a service but I don't know how far your run is either.


Central Ohio, you have AEP or Consolidated Co-op ?

The breaker in the subpanel is only a disconnect and can be sized larger than the ampacity of the wire.

 

[NUTTSGT]

The breaker in the subpanel is only a disconnect and can be sized larger than the ampacity of the wire.

Yes, my thoughts as well.

I was just wondering if he was feeding it with 200A, not sure what his set up is for his place. I don't know if he has a total of a 200 amp service or a 320A with a 200 for both the house and shop.

 

[Augus7us]

Wylie is on top of it. I wanted 40 circuits and a 200amp panel was the only way I was getting that.

The service is 90amp on 2-2-2-4AL wire.

I didn't know you could mount the box upside down. Always learning something new here.

Regarding that bushing... I bought a bag of them, told myself to install it and got side tracked, came back and wired everything up without installing it. Now I can't find the bag. Always something.

-Clint

 

[NUTTSGT]

Wylie is on top of it. I wanted 40 circuits and a 200amp panel was the only way I was getting that.

The service is 90amp on 2-2-2-4AL wire.

I didn't know you could mount the box upside down. Always learning something new here.



-Clint

Thanks Clint, I didn't think you had 200 going into the box. I figured you wanted many circuits to separate things as the reasoning for the large panel.

My garage had a 200 amp service prior to me buying the place even though I don't need it, it might be great for the next guy but putting many things on their own circuit is one thing I was happy about.

 

[Augus7us]

I could actually use the 200amp service here. I know I'm going to trip the 90 eventually. I'll just have to govern myself.

I missed you question Eric, I'm actually on edision where I live. I used to be AEP, I live out in the sticks and only work in the big city, now. I don't miss AEP btw. Or the city

I called about a separate meter or upgrading to 400amp at the house. It just wasn't possible to fit it in the budget to upgrade and they told me I'd have to pay like a $125 service fee every month and do a bunch of **** to the shop for another meter...

-Clint

 

[klassenl]

Wylie is on top of it. I wanted 40 circuits and a 200amp panel was the only way I was getting

-Clint

In my part of the world I can get an 80 circuit panel in 100 amps

 

[Jim greengo]

just an off the wall question, are you sure you want those 2x4's down each side? they impede most the locations for wire entry ...

Come in through the top or bottom of panel.

 

[NUTTSGT]

I could actually use the 200amp service here. I know I'm going to trip the 90 eventually. I'll just have to govern myself.

I missed you question Eric, I'm actually on edision where I live. I used to be AEP, I live out in the sticks and only work in the big city, now. I don't miss AEP btw. Or the city

I called about a separate meter or upgrading to 400amp at the house. It just wasn't possible to fit it in the budget to upgrade and they told me I'd have to pay like a $125 service fee every month and do a bunch of **** to the shop for another meter...

-Clint

Ohio Edison, that was originally my second guess but thought you might be closer to Consolidated so I changed it.

I have a second service, 200amp, in my garage with AEP. It generally runs me about $45/month on average. Since my place was originally a gas station, it had a separate service which has come in handy a few times. ... New service in the house, still had power at the garage and vice versa when putting the new service in the garage.

 

[alfredeneuman]

In my part of the world I can get an 80 circuit panel in 100 amps

Can you forward a link to one here?

 

[Fasthotrod]

Can you forward a link to one here?

I don't have a link to what he's talking about, but if you needed a panel that had 40 positions/80 circuits, you might be able to get a breaker panel and swap out the main.

When I started my shop project, I wanted a large panel for future expansion. So I found this Square D panel, model# HOM4080M200PCVP that seemed to fit the bill.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Square-D-H...ug-On-Neutral-Load-Center-Value-Pack/50311165

It comes with a 200A QOM2 main breaker, and the bus is rated for 225A. I checked the Square D catalog, and they have the following QOM2 breakers from 100-225A:

100A
125A
150A
175A
200A
225A

Here's the link to the breaker specifications:

https://stevenengineering.com/Tech_Support/PDFs/45CBMCC.pdf

From what I've seen, the breakers cost about $120 or so, but if you needed the space and a 100A main, to me that might be the way to go. You might even be able to recoup some cost by selling the 200A breaker.

Hope this helps.

Mark

 

[alfredeneuman]

You could always put a 100A breaker in the main panel, and use the 200A breaker as a disconnect, but that's not what I was asking.