Sump pump pit install

[Fluelikesymptoms]

Do we have any basement waterproofing people here?
Disclosure : I know waterproofing is better done outside than in, I just bought the house last week and am not in a position to afford waterproofing services, recently quoted 18k for a two sump system and crawl encapsulation, scared to know what exterior perimeter would run me.


Long story short I decided to at least install one of the sumps myself, becuase I figured something was better than nothing to help until I find a good solution.


My questions is this I dug my pit starting at 8 inches from interior foundation wall. The footer at the spot just so happened to extend out further than the footing at my test location so I decided to start my dig right up against it.

While digging down I start to dig a bit under the footer, after realizing I tried to correct myself and make that part of the dig flush with the edge of the footer.

Now I'm worried about having disturbed the soil the house will have settlement issues.

Attached are photos.

Should I make a form and try to fill the back half with concrete around the sump or do you think it's safe.

I'd prefer to keep it gravel for improved drainage

This sump is a beater sump FYI, this crawlspace is very wet so I was using it to help clear water as I dug

 

[d.mcfarland]

When you put the PERFORATED sump pump basin in the hole you will need to dump pea gravel sor something around it to fill the voided space you just dug. By doing that you made it as if you never dug the hole.

From what I learned, there are not as many holes in the preperforated basins you can buy. I'd get whatever basin you like and make sure the amount of small holes is up to your liking.

 

[Fluelikesymptoms]

When you put the PERFORATED sump pump basin in the hole you will need to dump pea gravel sor something around it to fill the voided space you just dug. By doing that you made it as if you never dug the hole.

Yes so the company that quoted there service said that they didn't need to bring in gravel as I had good pea gravel already. Are you suggesting this is likely going to be fine as it's not like I dug far under the footing or anything?

However that really had me confused as when I went to dig the layer was very thin so some sort of gravel surely would've still been needed ?
And secondly my pea gravel has some really small sized gravel to it, which I felt didn't support drainage well and also would clog up quicker.

I ended up buying bags of this from home depot

Vigoro 0.5 cu. ft. Bagged All-Purpose Decorative Landscape Rock 54775V - The Home Depot

Enhance the appearance of your landscape or garden with this decorative and functional Vigoro All-Purpose Decorative Stone.

www.homedepot.com

Do you think it is sufficient or is there a better option, as I would prefer to have the optimal gravel before I decide to dump it. I know alot of people recommend #57 however I was concerned about it compacting over time, it also prefer to avoid lime so it doesn't erode

 

[Chris705]

I agree you are off to a good start. The stone you bought is fine…. From the pics it looks like you have only undermined the footing by a couple of inches…it’s still sitting on plenty. I too would suggest plenty of added 1/4” holes in the basin.

 

[d.mcfarland]

Yep, you'll be fine with any gravel just like you purchased. The sump pump will not have any problems pumping the water that flows into the basin. You have the dirt stirred up making the water look muddy. The natural flow of water that goes into the basin will be almost clear.

 

[Fluelikesymptoms]

Okay thanks guys I've been up all night stressing it and over thinking it. I think I might switch to clean 57 stone to help and some soil retention, even though it may not allow as much drainage if it compacts.

I'm debating perforating the bottom amd the back half of that basin facing the footer, as the pump ***** from below it might help relieve some of that pull off the soil.

Then again I might just be overthrowing it and hurt the performance of my pump.

I fully intended on perforating the basin, however I'm starting to wonder if it's actually necessary once you go so deep, isn't the idea to remove water from around that foundation and not necessarily 2 feet below it?

 

[d.mcfarland]

Are you suggesting this is likely going to be fine as it's not like I dug far under the footing or anything?

Correct. You disturbed it but not like you dug a tunnel under it. Once you put the basin in and put new rock around it, the load from the footer will be transferred normally across the ground and new rock. Seriously, don't lose any sleep over it, you'll be fine.

 

[d.mcfarland]

I fully intended on perforating the basin, however I'm starting to wonder if it's actually necessary once you go so deep, isn't the idea to remove water from around that foundation and not necessarily 2 feet below it?

You'll want holes in the bottom to eliminate hydrostatic pressure pushing the basin up out of the ground once you've put it in there. Trust me on this one. I drill a dozen 5/16" holes in the bottom and it worked perfect.


The holes in the basin allow the water to flow from the soil into the basin. The water will flow within the soil, not on top of it. Once the water is flowing on top of the soil, you have a ton of water to pump out. You'll want the holes the entire length up and down the basin. Again about 5/16". Not too big to let rocks through, but need to be big enough to let water flow freely for years to come.

 

[Fluelikesymptoms]

You'll want holes in the bottom to eliminate hydrostatic pressure pushing the basin up out of the ground once you've put it in there. Trust me on this one. I drill a dozen 5/16" holes in the bottom and it worked perfect.


The holes in the basin allow the water to flow from the soil into the basin. The water will flow within the soil, not on top of it. Once the water is flowing on top of the soil, you have a ton of water to pump out. You'll want the holes the entire length up and down the basin. Again about 5/16". Not too big to let rocks through, but need to be big enough to let water flow freely for years to come.

I will heed your guys advice thank you!

 

[Fluelikesymptoms]

You'll want holes in the bottom to eliminate hydrostatic pressure pushing the basin up out of the ground once you've put it in there. Trust me on this one. I drill a dozen 5/16" holes in the bottom and it worked perfect.


The holes in the basin allow the water to flow from the soil into the basin. The water will flow within the soil, not on top of it. Once the water is flowing on top of the soil, you have a ton of water to pump out. You'll want the holes the entire length up and down the basin. Again about 5/16". Not too big to let rocks through, but need to be big enough to let water flow freely for years to come.

Last question, to fabric or no fabric, it's been a real debate for me

 

[d.mcfarland]

Last question, to fabric or no fabric, it's been a real debate for me

Here's the best advice I heard.

The fabric is going to work great for a little while because it's a filter. ALL filters eventually clog.

By the time the water is in your newly installed sump pump basin it will be as clear as rain water. The pump can easily handle it so there is no reason to have a fabric filter anyways.

Put a small layer of rocks on the bottom as a base to make the basin level. Put the basin in the center (make sure the height is what you want because you can't change it after that. Then hold the basin where you want it and slowly pour the rocks around it. A little shake every now and again will help the rocks fall into place and lock together.

 

[kbs2244]

all the sump advice is correct

but I would ask why you have the problem in the first place

are your down spouts routed at least 10 feet away from the foundation
is the dirt at the foundation graded do it slopes away from the house

 

[Fluelikesymptoms]

Thought is give you guys an update, got the basin in a did a bit of cleaning up my mess around the house. Still have to get the lid bolted down and get discharge and proper electric ran.

Either way it's not perfect, it's a bit unlevel but it'll probably do.

Still need to get some pea gravel spread around and the lid bolted down, also discharge and proper electric

 

[Jim_No_Garage]

all the sump advice is correct

but I would ask why you have the problem in the first place

are your down spouts routed at least 10 feet away from the foundation
is the dirt at the foundation graded do it slopes away from the house

Some houses with basements are built in areas where the water table rises above basement floor level at times. I grew up in one of those houses and 95% of the time the sump was empty but after a period of prolonged rain the water table would rise and the pump would kick on. The development was built on a filled in pond/swamp.

Many years ago a German friend of my Dad's came to our house and cluck-clucked on the basement design, stating that houses in Germany were built to last hundreds of years and they wouldn't have built it in that manner. He's right of course but after 60 years it's still standing.

Cheers

Jim

 

[Shiftless]

Lots of good advice so far.
I rely on a sump pump to keep my basement room dry. The only thing I would add to the above is to set up a battery powered back up in case your electricity fails during a big rainstorm. The best way is to have a 12 volt pump installed with the float above the other float. That way the 12 volt pump will run only when the 120 volt pump fails. Keep a big 12 volt deep cycle battery wired in with a battery tender kind of maintainer and replace that battery every 5 years or so.

My back up is a 12 volt deep cycle battery with an inverter that will run the regular sump pump. That requires me to be home and aware of the power failure so I can manually unplug the pump from the wall and plug it into the inverter. Not as good but that’s what I have now.

 

[Fav Onefour]

Nice work. I don't envy digging and mucking around in that space.

One item I will add. Manage your outside discharge. The main goal is getting water away so it isn't cycling right back into the sump. Hopefully to a slope away from the foundation. Those flexible hoses are convenient, but it's common to see them curled up right next to the foundation. They also hold water where there are dips in terrain. It is something to watch with freezing temps.

You did all that work inside to fix water issues. Managing the outside will help.

 

[Shiftless]

Good points Fav
My discharge is through 1 1/4 PVC pipe. No flex anywhere. I also put in a flapper style back flow preventer so none of the water I pump flows back into the pit when the pump shuts off.
I live in town so I run the discharge water into tubing that takes it all the way to the street and the city storm drain.

 

[65ranchero]

Also with 12volt back ups if you loose power for any amount of time the pump or pumps can be run off your ride on tractor or the daily driver.
I had to do that when hurricane Sandy 2012 hit our area when we still lived in NJ

Hurricane Sandy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[65ranchero]

it is good to eliminate flex drain as much as possible
over time there can be a build up of minut particles and those particle of dirt can keep building up until ther is a partial to full blockage .
and make sure your pump is not sitting on the floof of the pit small rocks can be sucked up and bind the impellor .

And if you have a lage amount of clay it's a good idea to clean the sump out every so often.

All the advice is from experience.

 

[BombShelter]

I don't think you need to cover the basket unless it's supporting the discharge pipe, personally I'd like to be able to see into it easily. Filter wrap could be installed further down the road if your getting too much dirt in it since it's such an easy install.

I'm more concerned with the amount of water I'm seeing in the pit and the water stains on the walls, I feel like you may have some large holes or cracks on the exterior. Each block can hold 1.5 gallons or more of water and they are all connected so the entire wall can fill up, then, with enough pressure, it starts moving through the wall. Exterior waterproofing is usually a fraction of the cost of drain-tile if done correctly and it stops the water outside the foundation. Interior drain-tile is not waterproofing, it's water-management.

"High water table" gets thrown around alot, you can call your city engineer to find out exactly where it is. If you're seeing a wet basement only when it rains, it's more than likely grade-level water. Older homes usually had 8'-20' of dry earth before hitting the water here in the Midwest. Although nowadays (the last 25 years) with less land they're building closer to wetlands than ever before and we're seeing 4' of spacing which is too close for me or they're hitting water during the basement excavation. Unfortunately I don't think contractors are drilling water check holes to avoid this issue.