Switch and outlet

[Rachelhoff]

I need help figuring out how to wire a switch and and outlet. They are beside each other in the same box. Please see attached photos.

 

[pattenp]

Is the switch controlling the outlet? If so, do you want half the outlet controlled or the whole outlet controlled? Or is the switch and outlet separate?





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[Rachelhoff]

No the switch does not control the outlet and I would prefer it not be if possible? So yes they are separate.

 

[n8n]

need more info... you're going to have to figure out what's the hot side and what is whatever the switch is controlling. I can't really see in the picture, how many cables coming into the box? And is the light (I'm guessing) that the switch is controlling on the same circuit as the receptacle or a different one? And why do you think you need help, what is not working correctly?

 

[Rachelhoff]

There are three sets of wires coming coming into the box. The switch controls the ceiling light and there are no other switches that control the same light. Also, they ( the switch and outlet) are on the same circuit. The outlet is working fine but I believe the switch isn't wired correctly.

 

[rockwithjason]

did you change this wiring or add the receptacle? what has changed? it will be difficult to help from just that one picture

 

[Rachelhoff]

I updated the switch and outlet to white from the old brown style. I just can't remember how the switch was wired. I'll take more photos.

 

[Tyberius]

Posting from my phone,
I see blacks on one side of the outlet and whites on the other. Blacks (I assume hot) going to switch and then using white as a switch leg. Don't see the other black. Is this a 3 way switch?
White is pigtailed which usually means neutral, but is switched. Switchlegs should be tight so no one will try to tie into them. Probably should label them with orange.

 

[pattenp]

With 3 cables I assume the switch is on one cable with the black and white wire connected to the switch. The other 2 cables are connected to the outlet which means the power comes into the outlet and then goes out to the light or possibly to another outlet. If everything works why do you suspect that the switch is wired wrong?

Edit:Sorry I type slow, so the switch is not working?

 

[Rachelhoff]

Another photo
Exactly the switch is not working. I have a two blacks and one neutral going to the switch. I had a three way switch installed, but that didn't work either, so I switched it for the one you see in the photo.

 

[n8n]

I don't think you need the black jumper from the recep to the switch, just get rid of it. You don't put two wires under a screw anyway, if you need to do something like that make a pigtail with a wire nut.

If everything works right then then the wires to the switch are a "switch leg" and you should put a ring of black tape around the white wire as it has been repurposed as a hot.

Do you have a test light, NCVD or meter?

 

[pattenp]

The black to the switch from the outlet is what's throwing me a curve. Did the original switch when working have 3 wires going to it?

 

[Rachelhoff]

I am going to remove the switch leg and see what happens. Well I removed the switch leg and still nothing.

 

[n8n]

Just to clarify, the cable going to the switch is what looks like a "switch leg" not the black wire I told you to remove and try.

http://www.electrical-online.com/wiring-a-basic-light-switch-variation-1/

I know what you meant, but learning the correct terminology will help get the right answers and also with searching for information.

My best guess, looking at the pictures, is that the switch is on a switch leg, and the other two cables are part of a string of receptacles, completely separate, the only connections that should be made between the two groups are the ground wires. I may be wrong of course so if removing that jumper doesn't make everything work properly then more troubleshooting may be needed.

What's the issue? breakers trip when turned on? That could be explained if the lighting circuit and the recep circuit are on opposite phases, then you have a dead short with 240VAC across it when you turn the 2nd breaker on...

 

[Rachelhoff]

Here is how it is wired currently. Sets of wires 1 and 2 on the right and both connected to the outlet. Wire set 3 on the left is connected to the switch. There are no wires going from the switch to the the outlet.

 

[electrican]

why is there a neutral going to the switch?

 

[n8n]

Here is how it is wired currently. Sets of wires 1 and 2 on the right and both connected to the outlet. Wire set 3 on the left is connected to the switch. There are no wires going from the switch to the the outlet.

Does everything work correctly now?

If so, put a ring of tape around the white wire on the switch to properly identify it as not a neutral and button it back up.

If not, let us know what's not working correctly and we can go from there.

Another possibility of how things "could have been before" is that the light is on the same circuit as the receptacle and the "switch leg" is not a leg at all but is getting power from the recep. In that case you'd wire nut the two blacks together for the recep and have two pigtails as well, one to the recep and one to the switch. The black from the light would go to the other switch terminal. All whites would be connected together and no connection between any white wire and the switch.

It may be helpful to drop the light fixture that that switch is controlling to have a look in that box.

 

[pattenp]

If the switch is operating a light you need to open the light fixture to see if there is only 1 cable with 2 wires to the the light fixture and there are no other cables/wires interconnected. It there is only 1 cable with 2 wires at the light then the power is being picked up from the outlet. If that's the case then the black wire from the outlet goes to one terminal on the switch and the black wire from the switch cable goes to the other switch terminal. The white is removed from the switch and connected to the other whites at the outlet. You will need to use the wire nut to pigtail one set of whites to the outlet. This is a hundred mile away guess.

I think it's like this....
View media item 39134

 

[Rachelhoff]

All I can say is THANK YOU. I did exactly what you said and now it works. You save me a ton of money and time.

 

[n8n]

pattenp, unless the recep is a "back wire" (not backstab) and can take 2 conductors under a screw OP should use a wire nut on the blacks as well.

I think we're all on the same page here but your diagram shows two blacks connected at one terminal on the recep which shouldn't be done, to be more clear that should look like the whites.

 

[pattenp]

Yep... my drawing was a quick thing and I didn't think about the type of outlet to show the blacks with a wirenut. The better outlet with the back compression terminals usually have 2 connection points for each wire. If that type of outlet was used then the whites don't even need the pigtail.

pattenp, unless the recep is a "back wire" (not backstab) and can take 2 conductors under a screw OP should use a wire nut on the blacks as well.

I think we're all on the same page here but your diagram shows two blacks connected at one terminal on the recep which shouldn't be done, to be more clear that should look like the whites.

 

[pattenp]

If you are referring to me I can send you my address to mail the check.

All I can say is THANK YOU. I did exactly what you said and now it works. You save me a ton of money and time.