System 2000 oil boiler

[Renfrick]

Anyone have one ? And what do you think? I’m thinking of getting one


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[Bondo]

So are We supposed to google this to see what the 'ell yer talkin' 'bout,..??

 

[yeldogt]

My memory was it being really nothing more than a typical oil boiler w/ nice controls ... slightly lower mass ... uses an indirect for HW or plate exchanger. They always used efficiency rating of the oil tankless coil to compare savings ... no one should still be using a tankless coil. It has a spiral combustion chamber.

If you have a good installer who has many installs -- that's the important part. Knowledgable people who understand the equipment, install it correctly and can do the required maintenance. We all want the best efficiency .. and no one wants to start out picking something less efficient .. but -- the need for reliability and longevity in a heating system trumps going for that last 5%. The $150 in savings is quickly lost if the product is not installed and maintained correctly. Oil burning appliances need yearly maintenance.

The last oil boiler I did was quite a while ago -- went with a Buderus unit. It was typical design w/ chimney ... I wanted to KISS ... and not deal with the problems of outside air.

The EK had a sound cover over the burner -- many do that. I can't comment on the sound level of the EK vs other boilers with the covers ... I'm sure you can compare.

 

[spam4us]

I have one. 18 years old. Only one problem with a temperature sensor. Very quiet. Can stand next to it and have a normal conversation. No jacket loss. You can put your hand anywhere on the cabinet while running and it will feel about room temp.

Make sure there are multiple installers in your area for it.
I have 4 zones.

 

[Jackfre]

Be careful what you wish for

Here you go!

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discu...s-not-lose-efficiency-to-short-cycling#latest

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I've been following them for a while. If (when) my Weil McLain CIS goes, it will be replaced by an Energy Knietics or a Buderus...

Tommy

 

[yeldogt]

Be careful what you wish for

Here you go!

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discu...s-not-lose-efficiency-to-short-cycling#latest

The high vs low mass has been going on for a long time ... I had two low mass boilers in my first house.

KE is based in NJ .. they have been around for quite a while ... remember them in the 80's. Most boilers were big .. EK made a smaller boiler .. not many did until Buderus came around. EK did DHW with a boiler in the 80k's using the plate exchanger .......Buderus was around 110k using the glass lined indirect.

 

[MikeinNorthWales]

We had an EK System 2000 for 15 years. The first thing we noticed was very quiet operation, as compared to the original high mass boiler it replaced. The second thing was substantial savings. Like, 40%. The house has HW baseboard heat. We installed an indirect water heater at the suggestion of our installer. They specifically recomended this over the EK plate exchanger, as they had a tendency to clog. I can't speak to that issue now.

The only issue we ever experienced was self inflicted. I let the service interval get away from me, and eventually the nozzle clogged. The flame sensor went out at the same time. Right or wrong, I accept the blame for that one, as I had no annual service that MAY have caught a problem early for several years. The only reason we don't have it anymore is that we switched to natural gas. Since we were doing a major renovation at the time, it just didn't make sense to try a conversion on a 15 year old boiler with no warranty.

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[Jackfre]

We installed an indirect water heater at the suggestion of our installer. They specifically recomended this over the EK plate exchanger, as they had a tendency to clog. I can't speak to that issue now.
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Plate HX are a problem if you have bad/hard water. I have spoken with many EK dealers across Me, Nh and Vt over the years and one fellow told me that they flush them once and then replace them. I agree that an indirect is better on oil.

 

[spam4us]

I have the plate exchanger. 18 years and no problems yet (Eddie Floyd ). Endless hot water.

 

[skippydoo]

I had a System 2000 boiler installed in July 2016. I live in North West NJ and my home was built in 1988. My previous boiler was a Slant Fin. The Sys 2000 is very quiet . I have a programable thermostat and I have the heat in my living area st to go to 62 at 9pm until 430am, then it goes to 70 untill 9am, back to 62 untill 3pm, back to 70 untill 9pm. Weekends are the same except it stays at 70 all day. I have a indirect hot water heater with a zone to the boiler. I had problems keeping my home warm in the winter unless I kept the heat at 70 all the time. I asked my plumber and he said I can change 2 settings , one will keep the boiler temp aprox 20 degrees hotter and the other , the hot water will no longer get priority , meaning if hot water was called for the other zone valves close. My boiler is downstairs and its alot cooler in the winter. I save 40 percent in the , but not in the winter. Happy, yes, but I thought I would save more. The unit holds about 5 gallons of water and heats up in 90 seconds from room temp. In the summer , the boiler water temp sits at aprox 70 degrees when off.

 

[yeldogt]

I had a System 2000 boiler installed in July 2016. I live in North West NJ and my home was built in 1988. My previous boiler was a Slant Fin. The Sys 2000 is very quiet . I have a programable thermostat and I have the heat in my living area st to go to 62 at 9pm until 430am, then it goes to 70 untill 9am, back to 62 untill 3pm, back to 70 untill 9pm. Weekends are the same except it stays at 70 all day. I have a indirect hot water heater with a zone to the boiler. I had problems keeping my home warm in the winter unless I kept the heat at 70 all the time. I asked my plumber and he said I can change 2 settings , one will keep the boiler temp aprox 20 degrees hotter and the other , the hot water will no longer get priority , meaning if hot water was called for the other zone valves close. My boiler is downstairs and its alot cooler in the winter. I save 40 percent in the , but not in the winter. Happy, yes, but I thought I would save more. The unit holds about 5 gallons of water and heats up in 90 seconds from room temp. In the summer , the boiler water temp sits at aprox 70 degrees when off.

Most manufacturers use worst and best case when making claims of savings. The key is to read between the lines. What's the efficiency and fuel use of a new modern Buderus CI boiler ... look at that when making comparisons. System 2000 lists around 10-12 % savings over what they consider a high mass boiler .. my memory was using the plate exchanger. Much of this depends on the summer usage. Still best case.

Summertime operation is only going to be heating hot water for domestic use. A high mass boiler needs to heat both the CI and the water in the boiler -- as it's heating the indirect tank coil to heat it's water. The boiler sits and cools down after this has occurred .. the heat is wasted. What's forgotten is that CI boilers also have some ways to avoid this loss. Mine only charge the indirect early in the morning .. so after 10pm they will not charge (unless overridden). They will also continue to feed excess hot water to the indirect if hot water is used. It's still going to use a bit more vs a low mass .. but it's not very much. In the winter .. the colder the climate the less it matters as they units are always hot.

I think this is why you see some negatives about systems 2000. Not that it's a bad boiler .. just, that it's often claimed to do things so much better in the literature they put out. They don't pick a current modern boiler from another manufacturer for direct comparison. Modern three pass w/ quality burners don't have a huge build up problem either.

 

[Jackfre]

The S2 is a steel boiler and the Buderus is Cast iron. That difference itself can and does lead to end of the world discussions in the heating trade. I had a gas fired Buderus in my MA home and it was outstanding. I have worked with many oil dealers who swear by the S2. They do have excellent proprietary controls and are US made. The Buderus is a German boiler. Buderus throws more cast iron than all other boiler manuf combined and their cast is excellent. Buderus has their own reset control package. I prefer CI, possibly because I'm old enough that I think that is the way it is supposed to be On these non-condensing boilers you have to take care of your return water temps and special attention must be paid to the vent system. The founder of S2 used to always stop by my booth at the trade shows back n the early 90's looking at what is new in venting as a vent system that is not "just right" will get torn up. The same goes for any mid-efficiency appliance. When they are riding that ragged edge of condensation you can have problems. As a reference, Appendix E in NFPA 31, Oil Installation, is an excellent guideline on sizing oil flues. It is an appendix because the 31 Committee (which I was a member of for 15 yrs and a dissenting member on this topic) did not want to mandate re-lining oil flues, as the gas industry had done. They feared that a SS liner would make oil non-competitive. Whatever you buy, and either will do nicely, remember that you are looking at a system, from the oil fill cap to the baseboard/radiant, to the vent termination. Look at all of it closely and make sure you installer does the same!!!! I think you will be well served by either appliance.

 

[yeldogt]

The S2 is a steel boiler and the Buderus is Cast iron. That difference itself can and does lead to end of the world discussions in the heating trade. I had a gas fired Buderus in my MA home and it was outstanding. I have worked with many oil dealers who swear by the S2. They do have excellent proprietary controls and are US made. The Buderus is a German boiler. Buderus throws more cast iron than all other boiler manuf combined and their cast is excellent. Buderus has their own reset control package. I prefer CI, possibly because I'm old enough that I think that is the way it is supposed to be On these non-condensing boilers you have to take care of your return water temps and special attention must be paid to the vent system. The founder of S2 used to always stop by my booth at the trade shows back n the early 90's looking at what is new in venting as a vent system that is not "just right" will get torn up. The same goes for any mid-efficiency appliance. When they are riding that ragged edge of condensation you can have problems. As a reference, Appendix E in NFPA 31, Oil Installation, is an excellent guideline on sizing oil flues. It is an appendix because the 31 Committee (which I was a member of for 15 yrs and a dissenting member on this topic) did not want to mandate re-lining oil flues, as the gas industry had done. They feared that a SS liner would make oil non-competitive. Whatever you buy, and either will do nicely, remember that you are looking at a system, from the oil fill cap to the baseboard/radiant, to the vent termination. Look at all of it closely and make sure you installer does the same!!!! I think you will be well served by either appliance.

I remember him as well. Guess this is all an oil issue now .. gas all going to the small wall boilers. Although --- had I the space -- would have done a conventional gas boiler in my new build.