T12 to T8 questions

[Cadman56]

I have several older 4' T12, 2-bulb, light fixtures in my garage and in an out building. I really like the fixtures because they have a wide white reflector like this light: http://www.lowes.com/pd_159578-337-...rentURL=?Ns=p_product_avg_rating|1&facetInfo=

I'd like to replace the T12's when they burn out with T8's. Can I just replace the tubes? I don't know if this is true or not but I was told years ago that you could replace a T12 with a T8 tube, but you can't replace a T8 with a T12 because you would burn up the ballast. Is this correct? Can I just replace the tubes or do I need to replace the ballast also? I don't want to throw the whole fixture out and buy complete new ones because it would be wasteful to me. Any recommendations on what to do with my current fixtures?

 

[pattenp]

You need to change the ballast to T8. Running a T8 lamp with a T12 ballast will shorten the T8 lamp life. At least that's what I've been told.

 

[socapots]

For some reason I think someone has a sale on the T8 ballasts now. Sorry I can't be more specific. But I'm drawing a blank on where I saw it.

 

[Gary S]

Menards sells similar looking new T8 fixtures for about the same price or less than new ballasts. If you shop around, you might find it easier to replace the entire fixture.

 

[nicobkn]

yup il will be easier/faster to get new light fixtures. I just did the switch a couple of weeks ago in my garage. I got lucky tho and found some used t8 ballast for really cheap, i was able to pick 6 ballas for $20.

 

[Gunnert]

yup il will be easier/faster to get new light fixtures. I just did the switch a couple of weeks ago in my garage. I got lucky tho and found some used t8 ballast for really cheap, i was able to pick 6 ballas for $20.

Ditto.... just as cheap and much easier to just replace the whole fixture.... They are not compatible with each other...

 

[trainer]

It¨s pretty easy to change the ballasts and bulbs if you want to keep the fixtures. t-8s are wired differently, but its no big deal. Just follow the wiring diagram on the ballast label. It may cost a few dollars, but not enough to break the bank

 

[eljefino]

They make universal electronic ballasts that'll run T8 or T12. Do this if you like the color your current T12s put out or have a case of them you're slowly working through. As a bonus the flickering and dancing of the light should be better with electronic ballast. The label on the ballast says what it'll do.

I say keep and fix up your current fixtures, they sound like they have character.

 

[ishiboo]

Menards has the "Performance Shop Lights" for $16.98 or so, often with rebate/on sale for as low as $10.00. They run T8 or T12 and seem to work nice, if you just needed ballasts you could likely easily remove them.

I've had 24 outside in the barn for several years (dusty and moist) with no complaints, they're also in my basement and a couple other locations.

 

[regancc]

I put these in my garage...$17.98 from Menard's.

Here is what they look like:

My wife says it looks like a 'solar flare' in there...which means they are just about perfect, because I cannot do anything right in her eyes.

 

[Falcon67]

As above - if you like the fixtures, just swap out the ballasts. That's what I did in the house when we moved in. Not very expensive and it's an easy wiring job.

 

[Cadman56]

Thanks everyone for the info. I just took inventory yesterday and I have (4) T8 fixtures and (7) T12 fixtures. I have a cord with plug and a chain pull switch on each light. That was two reasons why I was thinking about just replacing the ballast. I think what I'm going to do is see what a new fixture will cost and compare that to replacing the ballast. Not sure when I'm going to get to this because I have a medical issue I have to deal with first. Thanks again everyone for your input. GJ is a great forum!

 

[timewarp]

These ballasts are available at Home Depot, less than the price of a new fixture.

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...53&langId=-1&keyword=T8+ballast&storeId=10051

 

[Falcon67]

"I think what I'm going to do is see what a new fixture will cost and compare that to replacing the ballast"

Hah - don't bother. The two flo fixtures in our kitchen lights are a whopping $19.95 ea. at Lowes. I chose to just replace the ballasts because my time is worth something and wrecking out a light just to replace it with another with identical appearance was not to my liking. The T8 ballasts at that time were $23 each. Did the same thing at the old house - put a 2 bulb 36" fixture in the new *****. Fixture was like $16. Ballast went out in under 30 days. I could have bought another $16 fixture and maybe got the same problem. So I put $20 more into the light and it still works fine going on 4 years.

 

[sparky5982]

One thing I want to caution the OP on is the quality of the florescent lighting available at the home stores in the <$20 range. You might be able to get a complete fixture for $20, but I've found the fixture will often come with a cheaply made ballast that fails in less than a year, or has poor cold weather performance, or is unsatisfactory in some other way. Then you end up repairing the thing anyway. For that same $15-$20, you can get a good quality ballast from Advance or another manufacturer, that will perform without complaints for years. This has been my personal experience.

A good two lamp, T-8 strip light goes for $35-$45 around me. The home stores all have cheaper strips. Homeowner Specials are usually garbage. That's why they sell them to homeowners.

In my line of work as an electrician, I've installed thousands of fixtures from Metallux and Lithonia. These are not the cheapest, but I've rarely had problems. I've also had home and business owners opt to furnish cheapo fixtures themselves. It usually doesn't end well.

Good luck!

 

[Gary S]

I'm using these in my garage for about 5 years now with no ballast or lamp failures. They are on sale this week for $15. You can't screw with old fixtures and get them working any cheaper.
Mine work fine in my cold climate and unheated garage.
http://www.menards.com/main/lightin...escent-plug-in-shoplight/p-1385009-c-7495.htm

 

[Cadman56]

Thanks everyone for the replies. No Menards in my neck of the woods. Don't know if that's good or bad! I have (4) T8 Lithonia fixtures and (7) older Sim Kar T12. All have cords and pull switches on them. They also have a heavy 10-1/2" wide reflector on them which I think disperses the light better. Any way I've decided to replace the ballast. I was at HD today and checked out the GE ballast they had. Other than voltage, min start temp, T8 - 2 bulbs, electronic ballast, is there any other feature/specification I should look at when I make my purchase? Here is a link to some Advance ballasts I found online. http://www.1000bulbs.com/search/?q=advance+ballast&SearchButton.x=0&SearchButton.y=0 They reference a "Ballast Factor". Is this something I should be concerned about? I know I want a quiet ballast. What class or sound rating should I look for? The light over my workbench sounds like a swarm of bees above me and gets very annoying at times. I think I'm going to work on this one first.

 

[CamarosRus]

As above what causes the buzz in my T8 2 bulb 8' strips
and what do i shop for

 

[Cadman56]

Bump - anyone???

 

[Gary S]

The buzz is often simply physical vibration of something in the fixture.

 

[pattenp]

Cheap ballast with high sound rating of "F" have a loud hum. Look for a sound rating of "A" for the least hum.

 

[sparky5982]

CamarosRus- On buzzing florescent lighting:

You'll find that any electronic ballast will buzz much, much less than the older magnetic ballasts. Older T12 ballasts are essentially a big hunk of iron with wire windings, like a transformer or an electromagnet. That is why they are so big, heavy, noisy and hot under load. This is also why they last for 30 years or more. They are filled with mineral oil, and as long as they never leak, they can last pretty much indefinitely. BUT they are very inefficient and expensive to run; think of how hot they get. This style of ballast is being phased out because of inefficiency. Most any T12 or T8 ballast you can find now is electronic. You will not get the same life out of an electronic ballast, but the energy savings more than makes up for it. Also, Gary S. makes a good point- open the fixture up, press in various places. See if you can make the buzzing go away. If it is from the ballasts themselves, replace them if the buzzing bothers you.

Cadman56-
I think maybe you're over-thinking your ballast selection here. I like the Advance and Phillips ballasts, but If GE is what your local home store has, I imagine they will be fine. You might also look up a local electrical supply near you. "Ballast factor" is essentially a ratio of brightness compared to an ideal setup- closer to 1 is better, but we're talking garages here, not cosmetic dentistry. I will venture to guess the GE's are in the .75 range. .95 is the good stuff. Expect to pay more for it. For nice, bright-looking lighting, get those ballasts and pick up some new florescent lamps marked with the number "4500" or "4500k" somewhere on them.

Good luck!

 

[Cadman56]

Thanks sparky for the info. I have a tendency to over-think everything! I like to do things once and do it right. Anyway I got a GE ballast at HD that was suggested above. Wired it up and hung the light back up. Wow!! What a difference! Definitely a much brighter light. I can actually see things on my work bench much better now with the brighter T8 light. Thanks again to everyone who posted on the thread.

 

[milner351]

I just placed an order with totallightingsupply.com - by far the least expensive ballasts I could find on line, the shipping was a surprise at over $40, but it's still cheaper by a long shot. We'll see how the quality of these is after a few years - reviews were good.


Fluorescent Ballast for T-8 32watt 2 Lamp Single Voltage 120v
B2x32-120 T-8 Ballast NPF
16 for $143.68

Fluorescent Ballast for T-8 32watt 4 Lamp Dual Voltage 120/277v MOST VERSATILE B4x32-120/277 T-8 Ballast
5 for $69.85

Fluorescent socket for T12 or T8 lamps L23351
30 for $27.00 ($0.90 each)

Total Lighting Supply
1515 Golf Course Rd
Suite 101
Rio Rancho NM 87124

I'm updating the old lights because they are attached to a finished ceiling and appear to be high quality fixtures, so the PITA factor of updating is offset by the far greater PITA factor of drying to refinish the ceiling around new fixtures.