The Best Light Fixture Ever!

[Platonic Solid]

What do you think of these new 'V' LED lights which have the LED strips at an angle from each other?

Wider beam spreads are good for lower ceilings. Once you hit 10+ ft the wider beam spreads will reduce workplane illuminance.

 

[bedn0009]

Platonic,

You're clearly very educated about lighting and the science behind it, and I think your information has helped dozens of GJ members. On their behalf - I thank you.

That said, I've read much of what you've posted over the past few months and your lighting suggestions tend toward more industrial solutions... many of which are significant and unnecessary overkill for the average wood/repair/storage shop. I understand that much of what is discussed on GJ is about "overdoing" things, and I generally subscribe to that as well, but there's a point of diminishing return -- there's a reason that my concrete slab isn't 8 inches thick with rebar spaced 6" on center. Though it might seem reasonable, the question becomes of what's adequate, necessary and accessible.

Once they're up, I'll post photos of my 22 - 100 watt fixtures, and I'll post them here because this 19 page thread is here for everyone - including those who can't afford/justify the expense of $1000.00's of dollars in unnecessary overkill.

 

[gpflepsen]

Platonic,

You're clearly very educated about lighting and the science behind it, and I think your information has helped dozens of GJ members. On their behalf - I thank you.

That said, I've read much of what you've posted over the past few months and your lighting suggestions tend toward more industrial solutions... many of which are significant and unnecessary overkill for the average wood/repair/storage shop. I understand that much of what is discussed on GJ is about "overdoing" things, and I generally subscribe to that as well, but there's a point of diminishing return -- there's a reason that my concrete slab isn't 8 inches thick with rebar spaced 6" on center. Though it might seem reasonable, the question becomes of what's adequate, necessary and accessible.

Once they're up, I'll post photos of my 22 - 100 watt fixtures, and I'll post them here because this 19 page thread is here for everyone - including those who can't afford/justify the expense of $1000.00's of dollars in unnecessary overkill.

Curious why you have such a significantly equipped slab. Is it a suspended floor? What psi concrete is in the slab?

Excellent lighting levels are a blessing and very much appreciated, especially as the eyes age. If it's in the budget, I'd say go there. Compromises are everywhere in our builds, some we regret and others are tolerable. It's what's right for the individual.

Ideal <------> Inadequate. Make an informed decision where you want or need to be in that range.

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[04chase]

Id send a pm but this may help someone in the future but ill take some critique of my plan but i think ill be ok since ive purchase most of my lighting. my ceiling is right at 15 feet and i choose t5 h.o. fixtures 2x4 foot bulbs each. (54 watts each producing 5k lumens)

in a 30x50 shop i put 4 in the middle according to my plans . After inspection i plan to install about 10 more . 5 rows of 2 and 4 in between those rows on the work bench side that runs the 50 foot legnth of the shop.

here is a quick plan i made up on paint with the roll up doors on the bottom left and small rectangles for light fixtures and
where i intend the lifts to go

 

[Platonic Solid]

bedn0009 - I'd be happy to provide alternate more conservative layout options as I already have your space modeled. I hardly think the typical 4ft wrap is industrial. That said, I wouldn't put them in my living room. I suspect you will not be satisfied with the 22 100W bulbs, thus end up seeking larger wattage lamps which will be annoying sources of glare.

At the end of the day, it's your space and I'm just here trying to offer helpful guidance.

Best of luck.

 

[mnoeltne]

Thanks for chiming in. The RFI issue is pretty standard with retrofit lamps and LED fixtures in general. I haven't found a commercially available retrofit lamp that doesn't kill regular radio.

How does the RFI affect WiFi frequencies? 2.4gHz and 5gHz.

I just started the process of building a new house, with a 6 car attached garage for my shop and regular parking. And I just started looking at my lighting needs for this area.

 

[Westbank]

Anyone has feedback on Energetic Lighting LED strip lights ? I'm having a hard time finding a 8ft LED strip fixture (at a decent price) so I'm now looking for 4ft fixtures.

I stumbled upon a 47in fixture from Energetic Lighting - 48W - 4000K - CRI 80.
Product page: http://www.energeticlighting.com/ProductDetail.aspx?prodid=1343

Would this be a good option for 10ft ceilings ? Anything better ?

Thanks.

 

[Platonic Solid]

How does the RFI affect WiFi frequencies? 2.4gHz and 5gHz.

I just started the process of building a new house, with a 6 car attached garage for my shop and regular parking. And I just started looking at my lighting needs for this area.

There’s no simple answer to your question as any number of wireless devices including fluorescent ballasts and LED drivers can interfere with / degrade your WiFi signal. LED bulbs and fixtures rated FCC Part 18 Class B Consumer are your best bet for the least possible interference, but that is near impossible to find. You should be fine if you keep your WiFi devices more than 4ft from fluorescent ballasts and LED drivers. It’s also worth noting that high energy efficiency is easier to achieve if you ignore EMI/RFI. Reduced interference often comes at a cost of PF (power factor). It should be universally accepted that cheap LED fixtures/lamps (such as the non-UL Listed Chinese eBay stuff) will have greater interference.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Westbank - The ideal 4ft strip fixture for 10ft ceiling surface mount will have an output of ~6000 lumens. Yes, you can make up for that by installing more fixtures. Without knowing the price it's hard to say how your 4000 lm linked fixture compares with the 4500 lm lamp and housing combination on top of post #1 in this thread.

 

[BurrWilloby]

Platonic,

I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge of lighting. Are your recommended led lighting choices at the beginning of the thread made in the USA by any chance? I'm getting ready to upgrade the lighting in my two car garage from six 100 watt incandesants to LEDs and would prefer USA made. Thanks again for your efforts.

 

[Platonic Solid]

BurrWilloby - Though many steel and plastic products are actually more cost effective to have made in the USA, I'm not aware of any commercial LED or fluorescent manufacturer that doesn't rely on Chinese made drivers, ballasts and LED PCBs. Keep in mind that a product that contains 15% foreign content qualifies to be labeled "Assembled in the USA", but not "Made in the USA". Very few multi-component products from any industry can meet this criteria.

 

[rsw686]

Has anybody tried hanging the MaxLite fixture from chains? The PDF shows it is a ceiling mount fixture, but I was debating how hard it would be to attached chains to it. My current fixtures hang off a sloped ceiling around 14ft off the ground and plug into outlets. I like the MaxLite with James bulbs option over the Home Depot commercial electric 4ft light as the bulbs are replaceable and the lumens is higher.

 

[Skelly]

Has anybody tried hanging the MaxLite fixture from chains? The PDF shows it is a ceiling mount fixture, but I was debating how hard it would be to attached chains to it. My current fixtures hang off a sloped ceiling around 14ft off the ground and plug into outlets. I like the MaxLite with James bulbs option over the Home Depot commercial electric 4ft light as the bulbs are replaceable and the lumens is higher.

Haven't tried it personally, however, i would not imagine it being too difficult with chain and S hooks.

 

[rsw686]

I found another fixture, the PLT 55027, which says its for chain mount. It is for direct wire bulbs and looks similar to the MaxLite fixture. I'll just order one of these and some bulbs to see how it works.

In the end I need 18 of these fixtures. When I moved in the shop only had 5 bulbs working out of the 36 bulbs installed. I was hoping to just removed the ballast and reuse the fixtures, but the ballast seems integral to the plastic end cap on the fixture. To add to that the ballast seems separate per bulb as only one slot in each of the 2 bulb working fixtures works.

EDIT: Shipping on the PLT is $7 per fixture regardless of the number purchased. This makes it much more expensive than the MaxLite. I ended up purchasing the MaxLite and will see if I can chain mount it. Worst case I can just drill some holes for hooks.

 

[ExxWhy]

These 18w LED ballast compatable T8 tubes are on sale for cyber Monday for $9.99. Good time to buy for anyone thinking about a switch.

http://www.shineretrofits.com/james...&utm_source=Klaviyo:+Customers+and+Newsletter

 

[INTMD8]

You got it exactly right.
Something like the Lithonia ZL1N series at $150 ea. (linked) would work quite nicely with 3 rows of 6, thus 18 x $150 = $2700

I just bought 16 of these for the open 36x32 section of my shop. Hoping that is a good start but will add more if necessary

 

[Skelly]

These 18w LED ballast compatable T8 tubes are on sale for cyber Monday for $9.99. Good time to buy for anyone thinking about a switch.

http://www.shineretrofits.com/james...&utm_source=Klaviyo:+Customers+and+Newsletter

Thanks dude. I just placed an order for 42 bulbs. I also used coupon code "10offshine" to take $10 off the order. $9.75 per bulb isnt bad!

Thanks again.

Kevin

 

[idleclamp]

I'm looking to put T8's in my garage. I like the idea of going with direct wire LED's instead of florescent bulbs. However, it seems like most of the 'direct wire' bulbs say they must be installed by a licensed electrician. Why? I would think you could install direct wire fixtures and plug in direct wire LED bulbs. What am I missing?

 

[soj]

I'm looking to put T8's in my garage. I like the idea of going with direct wire LED's instead of florescent bulbs. However, it seems like most of the 'direct wire' bulbs say they must be installed by a licensed electrician. Why? I would think you could install direct wire fixtures and plug in direct wire LED bulbs. What am I missing?

That is a lawyer statement. No company is going to tell the general public to do anything electrical beyond "plug it in" or "flip the switch". Note that most give you a wiring diagram and/or instructions on how to wire their product, then tell you to have a licensed electrician to do the work. It protects them from liability if you fry yourself, or burn your house down.

 

[idleclamp]

That is a lawyer statement. No company is going to tell the general public to do anything electrical beyond "plug it in" or "flip the switch". Note that most give you a wiring diagram and/or instructions on how to wire their product, then tell you to have a licensed electrician to do the work. It protects them from liability if you fry yourself, or burn your house down.

So they plug in just like a regular florescent?

 

[soj]

So they plug in just like a regular florescent?

First we need to establish your definition of "direct wire". Are you are talking about the LED tubes that require removing the florescent ballast and connecting the 120V hot and neutral directly to the florescent lamp holders? Then, yes, AFTER the ballast is removed and the fixture rewired, then the LED tubes "plug in just like a regular florescent". The rewiring part is what the mfg. is referring to when they recommend a licensed electrician.

 

[idleclamp]

So, if I buy LED light fixtures that have no ballast, then I can buy 'direct wire' LED tubes and they will plug straight into the fixture like a regular T8 fluorescent. Correct? Just want to make sure I understand it before I order a bunch of them.


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[Platonic Solid]

idleclamp - You are correct. The Maxlite enclosure at top of post 1 is just an empty fluorescent strip light housing with non-shunted lamp holders and no fluorescent ballast. The Hot and Neutral supply wires are plugged directly into the lamp holders at one end. The LED lamp is the same length and has the same pin spacing as a standard F32T8 fluorescent so the LED lamp will fit legacy fluorescent housings & lamp holders.

 

[idleclamp]

idleclamp - You are correct. The Maxlite enclosure at top of post 1 is just an empty fluorescent strip light housing with non-shunted lamp holders and no fluorescent ballast. The Hot and Neutral supply wires are plugged directly into the lamp holders at one end. The LED lamp is the same length and has the same pin spacing as a standard F32T8 fluorescent so the LED lamp will fit legacy fluorescent housings & lamp holders.

I was just getting ready to send you a PM. I've been reading through this thread and I'm getting more confused the more I read. I have a single bulb incandescent light fixture in my 600 sq. ft garage (plus garage door opener lights) with 9 1/2' ceiling. I was planning on installing in 2-4 two-bulb F32T8 flourescent light fixtures, then was turned onto the LED's (by this thread). Since I'm starting from scratch, it seems like I don't need to deal with any ballast/bypass/etc/etc BS. I just need to buy LED fixtures with no ballast and direct wire LED bulbs. Yes??

 

[Platonic Solid]

"Ballast bypass LED bulbs" and "direct wire LED bulbs" are the same thing.
You have many options to choose from. From lowest to highest cost:
Hanging Fluorescent Shop Lights (only available with cord & plug),
Surface mounted Fluorescent strip lights,
Hanging LED Shop Lights (only available with cord & plug),
LED Strip Lights (as detailed at top of post #1),
Complete LED Fixture (for your ceiling height: this ZL1N (linked))

 

[idleclamp]

It got complicated again. Let me try it this way:

I want to mount new flush mount light fixtures in my garage that I can put LED bulbs in without re-wiring anything (other than installing the fixtures to the ceiling). Can I install these:

LED ready 4ft wrap around

Or these:

MAXlite utility strip

...and plug in either of the following bulbs into either of the aforementioned fixtures:

4ft DLC LED T8 Tube - 5000K

LBP8F2041

 

[Skelly]

idleclamp - You are correct. The Maxlite enclosure at top of post 1 is just an empty fluorescent strip light housing with non-shunted lamp holders and no fluorescent ballast. The Hot and Neutral supply wires are plugged directly into the lamp holders at one end. The LED lamp is the same length and has the same pin spacing as a standard F32T8 fluorescent so the LED lamp will fit legacy fluorescent housings & lamp holders.

Thanks for the detailed response. Quick question for you. As the fixtures will not be using a ballast with the LED lamp, are you aware of any low profile fixtures as you somewhat arent using the area for anything where the ballast used to be? Would prefer something a little bit more slim.

Thanks!

Kevin

 

[Platonic Solid]

idlelamp - Looks fine to me. Suggest getting a book on basic wiring techniques at your local hardware store. Purchase the housing/lamp combination you desire. If you still have questions, post pictures and I'll walk you through anything you don't understand.

Skelly - The housing is still used for wiring. I considered filling that void with a shallow housing product, but it just isn't worth it. If you want smaller, skip the lamps and go for a whole fixture like the ZL1N linked above.

 

[gpflepsen]

In the realm of money not mattering...

The GE Albeo LED luminaries ABHG series are very impressive. I visited a power plant that had two module fixtures installed throughout the facility. Lighting was outstanding. They are a bit out of my price range though; $700 for a two module.

http://www.shineretrofits.com/shop-...warehouse-industrial-light-fixtures/abhg.html

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[Platonic Solid]

In the realm of money not mattering...

The GE Albeo LED luminaries ABHG series are very impressive. I visited a power plant that had two module fixtures installed throughout the facility. Lighting was outstanding. They are a bit out of my price range though; $700 for a two module.

http://www.shineretrofits.com/shop-...warehouse-industrial-light-fixtures/abhg.html

At those prices I expect much better L/W efficiency and CRI. Not to overlook that these are mostly for mounting above 15ft.

 

[gpflepsen]

At those prices I expect much better L/W efficiency and CRI. Not to overlook that these are mostly for mounting above 15ft.

7450 lumens out of a 21" x 4" apperature @ 100 lumens/watt is pretty high intensity, I thought. 100,000 hour rating seems respectable. Sure, the CRI could be better, but it's adequate.

How does the Big *** Light compare?

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[Platonic Solid]

100,000 hour rating is respectable, but 100 L/W is only fair. Making a high output fixture small is nice, but limits its use to 15ft + installations (same as the Big *** lights). If they concentrated on efficiency, the fixture might be a little bigger, but they wouldn't be producing some much heat that they need to provide a finned die-cast aluminum housing to dissipate it. Heat is wasted energy. With today's technology a product of this caliper and price range should be pushing >130 L/W (with lens) and >80 CRI. By end 2016 we'll be talking >150 L/W. LED technology is moving so fast that manufacturers can't keep up. By the time the product hits the shelf, it's already obsolete.

 

[idleclamp]

I ordered 4 dual bulb 4' fixtures and 8 bulbs rated at 5000k and 2250 lumens. Is this overkill for my 24'x30' garage with 9 1/2' ceilings? I have a couple of storage rooms in the basement that I want to add lights to as well (in case this is too much for the garage). I wanted to see how these turn out before ordering more.

 

[RayBob58]

This looks like a good place to ask for opinions on these fixtures. They were given to me, and I'm trying to decide if I even want to use them. There's no markings on them, but they're 4 bulb, 4ft fixtures and all the bulbs are there. I have 6 fixtures. Do I trash 'em? Do an LED conversion? Use them as is? My garage is 28x36x9h. Used more as a workshop than a parking space.

 

[Platonic Solid]

I ordered 4 dual bulb 4' fixtures and 8 bulbs rated at 5000k and 2250 lumens. Is this overkill for my 24'x30' garage with 9 1/2' ceilings? I have a couple of storage rooms in the basement that I want to add lights to as well (in case this is too much for the garage). I wanted to see how these turn out before ordering more.

Assuming fixtures are surface mounted to the ceiling - Using interior dimensions 23 x 29 x 9.5:
Qty.16 2-lamp 4ft fixtures (thus 32 LED Bulbs) = 63fc @ 30" workplane.

 

[Hop2it]

This looks like a good place to ask for opinions on these fixtures. They were given to me, and I'm trying to decide if I even want to use them. There's no markings on them, but they're 4 bulb, 4ft fixtures and all the bulbs are there. I have 6 fixtures. Do I trash 'em? Do an LED conversion? Use them as is? My garage is 28x36x9h. Used more as a workshop than a parking space.

I have a 24x32x10 pole barn and I used 10 of those lights however I changed out the ballasts and am using t8 bulbs, works great.
Doug

 

[typeshige]

I've been reading bits and pieces of this thread for a few weeks but still have a question about my specific case.

I have a modest 21x18x9 garage.

Given the 9 ft ceiling would the MaxLite utility strip and James LED T8 tube linked to from the very first post (as of 12/9/2015) be a good combination?

Thanks,
Shige

 

[RayBob58]

This looks like a good place to ask for opinions on these fixtures. They were given to me, and I'm trying to decide if I even want to use them. There's no markings on them, but they're 4 bulb, 4ft fixtures and all the bulbs are there. I have 6 fixtures. Do I trash 'em? Do an LED conversion? Use them as is? My garage is 28x36x9h. Used more as a workshop than a parking space.

Ok, I went through and read most of this thread, and from what I understand, I have T12 lights with unshunted lamp holders. Exactly what I need to do an LED conversion. So all I need is the tubes, and to remove these ballasts and direct wire to the holders on one end. The other end is dead, it simply holds the tube. I guess putting 4 tubes in these things would be overkill for my 28x36x9 ft space, and putting just 2 in each seems like a waste. Any opinions? I have $0 invested in these.

 

[Platonic Solid]

I've been reading bits and pieces of this thread for a few weeks but still have a question about my specific case.

I have a modest 21x18x9 garage.

Given the 9 ft ceiling would the MaxLite utility strip and James LED T8 tube linked to from the very first post (as of 12/9/2015) be a good combination?

Thanks,
Shige

Yes, 9ft ceiling works nicely. How many you'll need depends on what you're using the space for. As an example: 3 rows of 4 2-lamp fixtures, thus 12 fixtures (24 bulbs) = 72 fc avg @ 30" workplane in a drywalled finished space using standard 70-50-20 ceiling-wall-floor reflectance.

 

[Platonic Solid]

RayBob58 - Not enough info - every space, goal, usage and budget is unique. All I can say with the info provided is: Yes, you can wire those fixtures for LED bypass lamps.