The Best Light Fixture Ever!

[Platonic Solid]

Therefore, there is not a wiring scheme that will allow installation of single end and double end lamps in the same fixture ?

Correct

 

[wescat]

I am rewiring some 4' fluorescent fixtures for use with 4' LED tubes. As per my research:

If I remove the ballasts, and rewire each fixture with non shunted tombstones such that each tombstone has 1 hot and 1 neutral, and each fixture side has 1 hot and 1 neutral, I can then safely use either single ended or opposing ended tubes, and I do not have to be end specific as to how I insert the tube into the fixture.

Is this correct?

You cannot use single end lamps with that setup. Double end or Universal (double/single/bypass/ballast compatible).

Therefore, there is not a wiring scheme that will allow installation of single end and double end lamps in the same fixture ?

Correct

OK, got it. And thanks for the help.

Are there any factors that should influence me to prefer either single end or double end tubes?

1) Reliability?
2) Lifespan?
3) Capital cost?
4) Operating cost?
5) Illumination quality?
6) Broader tube choices?
7) Is one type considered "standard"?
8) Which type currently has a larger share of the market?
9) Will one type force the other out of the market eventually?
10) If you were rewiring fixtures, which type tube would you rewire for, and why?

 

[Platonic Solid]

wescat - I expect double end to become the most popular over time. Double end powered can use either shunted or non-shunted lamp holders. Single end must have non-shunted lamp holders. No idea which has greater market share at the moment (I design integrated LED fixtures = I don't use LED retrofit tubes). The Greentek lamp (link) from post #1 is universal = it can be wired single end or double end. Not sure how that fits into your market share question.

To clearly answer #10 - I would select the lamp first and wire the fixture accordingly. If using a universal lamp and rewiring existing fixtures, I'd wire double end. Many of the new 4ft strip-light housings come standard single end wired and the retailers often offer double end wired for an additional fee. No point paying an additional fee for double end pre-wired housings when it's so very easy to change any single end housing to double end.

 

[wescat]

wescat - I expect double end to become the most popular over time. Double end powered can use either shunted or non-shunted lamp holders. Single end must have non-shunted lamp holders. No idea which has greater market share at the moment (I design integrated LED fixtures = I don't use LED retrofit tubes). The Greentek lamp (link) from post #1 is universal = it can be wired single end or double end. Not sure how that fits into your market share question.

Thank you Platonic Solid.

Is there a reason that the Greentek Energy Systems GT-T8-18W1200 BIXX 4000K lamp is omitted from your page 1 listing? Is it a "not recommended" lamp?

Also, be advised that the Greentek lamps are currently priced at $7.75 per.

While researching all of this, I found this very extensive linear LED lighting retrofit assessment done by the GSA: https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/GSA_GPG_Linear_LED_Retrofit_Assessment-508.pdf

 

[jgbnm]

Thank you Platonic Solid.

Is there a reason that the Greentek Energy Systems GT-T8-18W1200 BIXX 4000K lamp is omitted from your page 1 listing? Is it a "not recommended" lamp?

Also, be advised that the Greentek lamps are currently priced at $7.75 per.

While researching all of this, I found this very extensive linear LED lighting retrofit assessment done by the GSA: https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/GSA_GPG_Linear_LED_Retrofit_Assessment-508.pdf

The 4000k option wasn't available a while back when I was looking. Only available relatively recently.

Prices have generally been going up regularly, likely due to trade war, and are only updated periodically.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

 

[wescat]

wescat - I expect double end to become the most popular over time. Double end powered can use either shunted or non-shunted lamp holders. Single end must have non-shunted lamp holders. No idea which has greater market share at the moment (I design integrated LED fixtures = I don't use LED retrofit tubes). The Greentek lamp (link) from post #1 is universal = it can be wired single end or double end. Not sure how that fits into your market share question.

To clearly answer #10 - I would select the lamp first and wire the fixture accordingly. If using a universal lamp and rewiring existing fixtures, I'd wire double end. Many of the new 4ft strip-light housings come standard single end wired and the retailers often offer double end wired for an additional fee. No point paying an additional fee for double end pre-wired housings when it's so very easy to change any single end housing to double end.

True on the easy.

I am currently leaning towards rewiring my fixtures to UL type B, double ended, and using the Greentek Energy Systems GT-T8-18W1200 BIXX. Probably in 4000K.

I plan on placing a sticker on each fixture that reads:

*** Warning ***
This fixture has been rewired to “UL Type B double end” in 2019, to use direct wire double end LED tubes. All ballast(s) have been removed. ONLY INSTALL COMPATIBLE LED TUBES IN THIS FIXTURE. DO NOT USE FLUORESCENT TUBES. DO NOT USE A DIMMER.
*** Danger ***​

Something like that.

 

[bbursey]

Hi folks -

I've walked through all 2086 posts here, and reviewed most of the Light Fixture Layouts Collection thread. We're moving to a house with a 3-car garage (1 single, 1 double) that measures 30x22x10 with ceiling / walls drywalled and finished in white paint. My intended use is parking and occasional light wrenching. I'll have some storage and a work bench along the top wall.

I have created the attached layout, but will need to measure for interference (e.g. garage door opener, "lifestyle screen", etc.) after closing and maybe rotate some fixtures 90 degrees.

I'm intending to order one of the below, depending on whether there's any pricing change following a phone call to the vendors.

a) MaxLite Lamp Ready Linear Utility Strip, 4 Foot, 2 Tube (ledlightingwholesaleinc.com/LSS2XT8USE4803-p/lss2xt8use4803.htm)

or

b) TechBrite 48" 2 Lamp LED T8 Strip Fixture - 5000K - 5,346 Lumens - 120-277V (prolighting.com/t442ssubcxx00p0-18w5k.html)

I think I've done by homework, but before ordering, I would appreciate some validation that I'm not too far off base.

Cheers,
Bryan

 

[Platonic Solid]

wescat - Per UL the bulbs are supposed to come with a similar warning label, but many don't. So you're on the right track. Here's an example (link).

 

[Platonic Solid]

bbursey - Yes, you got it right. If it works better with respect to you garage door and car placement, you can change the existing 7.5 x 5.5 spacing to 8.5 x 5.0. This changes your 3.75 fixture center to wall dimension to 2.25.

 

[bbursey]

Platonic Solid - Great! Thanks for your reply.

Cheers,
Bryan

 

[MrOldwrench]

My local Costco had the FEIT Electronic replacement LED bulbs for T8/T12. Replaced every fluorescent in the house and garage at less than $10 per fixture (2x bulbs per fixture).

 

[HeadsUp]

Trying to figure out which way to go on the lighting in my new shop with inside dimensions of 26'x30'x11'. Here are options I've been considering

#1 Lithonia IBE 22LM MVOLT 50K qty 4
(cost estimate with shipping $550 from Amazon)

#2 Lithonia IBE 12LM MVOLT 50K qty 6
(cost estimate with shipping $660 from Amazon)

#3 Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803 qty 16
(cost estimate with shipping $740 from Bees lighting)

I'm leaning towards option #1 due to cost and install time. Just a little worried about shadowing. The space will be used for light wrenching. Will be using task lighting when needed. Has anyone installed high bay 22K lumen lights at 11'? Guessing closer to 10' when hung.

 

[Toomanytools?]

Trying to figure out which way to go on the lighting in my new shop with inside dimensions of 26'x30'x11'. Here are options I've been considering

#1 Lithonia IBE 22LM MVOLT 50K qty 4
(cost estimate with shipping $550 from Amazon)

#2 Lithonia IBE 12LM MVOLT 50K qty 6
(cost estimate with shipping $660 from Amazon)

#3 Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803 qty 16
(cost estimate with shipping $740 from Bees lighting)

I'm leaning towards option #1 due to cost and install time. Just a little worried about shadowing. The space will be used for light wrenching. Will be using task lighting when needed. Has anyone installed high bay 22K lumen lights at 11'? Guessing closer to 10' when hung.

That is too much 22K lumens at 10' will give you glare and with only 4 in that space you will have shadows.

I have a space 24x40x10.5" tall and I'm looking at 8000 to 8500 Lumens color is 5000K Visual plan calls for 12 lights giving me about 96 FC at 30".

I was going to ask Platonic about the brand "Deco DAL-LP-Led 65w with 8500Lm, that fixture is from my local electronic supplier.

 

[Platonic Solid]

HeadsUp - Absolute max lumen output per fixture @ 11ft = 12,000 lumens. Max fixture spacing = 10.5' (fixture center to fixture center). Minimum qty of fixtures at any lumen output in a 26x30x11 space to get even shadow free illumination = 9 fixtures.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Toomanytools? - Nice fixture choice! I think you mean Deco DHL-LP-LED (link to spec sheet).

Lumen Maintenance = Percentage of original lumen output loss over time
L70 = Hours of use before LEDs degrade to 70% Lumen output
L80 = Hours of use before LEDs degrade to 80% Lumen output
L90 = Hours of use before LEDs degrade to 90% Lumen output

Industry standard is to replace fixtures when output degrades to 70%

Lithonia IBE
L70 = >100,000 hrs.
Warranty = 5 years
CRI = 80

Deco DHL
L70 = 295,000 hrs.
L80 = 190,000 hrs.
L90 = 100,000 hrs.
Warranty = 10 years
CRI = 84

I see a couple of online retailers have pricing on the DHL-LP-LED:

LightDisty (link)
LEDSupply (link)

FYI - I get 15 fixtures in Dialux using 65W Deco IES file = 99fc @ 30" workplane.

 

[Toomanytools?]

Thanks Platonic, I have been looking at the Diva light 65W LHB-065W-U-50K-D10, on Beeslighting for $79. Trying to justify the $37 difference for 15 lights that's $550! Buying local also comes into play.
I guess what got me was on paper the Deco looks good the L70 rating of 295K compared to the Diva of 50K, but I have no idea on the quality of the fixtures compared to each other. Though the truth is it most likely won't matter in my lifetime running the lights 8 hours a day. Thanks for the Dialux, I just used a similar stock file couldn't figure out the Deco file.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Deco Light DHL IES files are on a download tab on this page (link). 295,000 hrs at 8 hrs/day = 101 years. Keeping in mind that this is LED life, not driver life.

 

[CarFire]

ANyone have a recommendation for new construction LED can lights? One the house we used the retrofit FEIT lights from Costco and those have been great. I've used behind-the-drywall, push to connect lights, but they are so shallow they don't have any recess which is a bit too much glare. I would like to find something like the FEIT retrofits for the office in the new garage we are building. Certainly don't need anything super deep that kills the insulation in the attic, but not flush.

 

[Vitalstang]

I can’t seem to locate any housings for the LED such as suggested at the beginning of this post. I’m in Canada so I’m limited as to where I can get them (I looked at a few online vendors suggested but they don’t seem to ship to Canada)! Has anyone found anything available in Canada?
BTW, I’m just waiting for my 24’x26’ to be wired so any suggestions would be much appreciated!

 

[number9]

Does anyone know if the light suppliers in this thread do Black Friday deals? I need to place order for fixtures & tubes, have signed up to a few of their email lists but not gotten anything from them. Just wondering if I’ve been waiting around for something that don’t happen.

 

[Toomanytools?]

Does anyone know if the light suppliers in this thread do Black Friday deals? I need to place order for fixtures & tubes, have signed up to a few of their email lists but not gotten anything from them. Just wondering if I’ve been waiting around for something that don’t happen.

Haven't seen much in the way of BF sales but you never know. One of the sites does give a discount to Garage Journal can't remember which might be Prolighting.

 

[number9]

Yeah, all I've seen so far was a text today from 1000bulbs that if you spend $400, you get a $50 rebate credit card.


On a separate note..........looking more at the single end tubes, I see them shown to have one pin "L" and the other "N". Is there a "standard" that all single end tubes are internally wired the same way, so that when you wire your fixtures, and down the road switch to a different LED tube, when you install the tube so the "L" and "N" pins are rotated into position, the correct side of the tube is facing down - so the light shines toward the floor and not straight up against the fixture?

 

[NateCCIE]

30x50x13 shop, looking at high bay LED that can be surface mounted, so I believe that disqualifies the cheapest option of ledlightingwholesaleinc HB, and leaves the deco at the top or the beeslighting option in the middle?

But the question I have is what is the maximum lumen output allowed for 13ft ceilings?

I am a big 2700k fan for light inside the house, is 4000k or 5000k preferred for shops?

 

[Toomanytools?]

Color is personal preference and also what your doing in the space, 4000k is fine for a lot but doing more detailed things 5000k may be better.
At 13' I think 12,000L is about the Max, you will get some overpowering glare like looking at the sun especially at 5000K. A better range around 10KLumens

 

[jgbnm]

Thanks to Platonic Solid and all the great info shared in this thread. Installed 18 Page 1 recommended Maxlite fixtures last week and they're great. Shipped from Shineretrofits and greenlightdepot. Both shipped quickly with no problems.

 

[Aegwyn11]

This is an awesome thread!

I have a space that's 18'*50'*9'. It'll be actually used for dog training...not your traditional garage... Any guidance on how many fixtures I would need?

 

[rd65]

I would like to add another row of light to my shop. I have the MaxLite LSS2XT8USE4803 fixture with the LumeGen LG-4T8-20WBC-SM50K bulbs. The MaxLite I can still get but it looks like the LumeGen LG-4T8-20WBC-SM50K has been discontinued. What would be a suitable substitute?

 

[Platonic Solid]

rd65 - The GreenTek in post #1 should be similar.

 

[SeanIAm]

I've been reading through this thread to avoid asking the question but I'm not sure if the strip lights or another fixture are what I need as it seems like the tall ceiling changes things. I'm building a 50x80 Morton pole building as a garage and area to work on my cars. 16' ceiling in white with white walls.

I'd appreciate any recommendation on both the kind and number of fixtures. Also, I assume you would you recommend running the lights length-wise between the cars to reduce shadows? The tool in the layout thread was orienting them in rows width-wise.

Thank you.

 

[number9]

So I waited on Black Friday and it didn't pan out. 1000 bulbs had 15% off TCP products, but wanted $133 shipping for 85 tubes

I ordered 85 of these tubes from GreenLightDepot


SKU:101-100082 (Milky 5000K)
Qualification: UL, DLC Listed
Power: 18W
Color:5000K
CRI: > 80
Power Factor: ≥ 0.90
Lifespan: 50,000 hours
Lumens: 2340
Lumens Per Watt (LPW): 120 LPW
Beam Angle (°): >220°
Warranty: 5 years
Materials: Glass

and 40 Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803 housings from ShineRetrofits. They gave me a price of $18.75 ea.

Probably be a couple weeks before the electrician gets them installed, but I'll post some pics when they're up.

 

[Vicdog]

I got some of these bulbs and fixtures for my garage. LEDMyplace WEN-T8-4FT-18WF(4000K) & Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803. I think they are too bright when I walk around, like I need a hat. Anything I can do or maybe some different bulbs?

Just have a 2 1/2 car garage with 10 foot ceilings. I only installed one light fixture so far.

Thanks

 

[Marctrees]

Subscribed.

Marc

 

[jimy]

I got some of these bulbs and fixtures for my garage. LEDMyplace WEN-T8-4FT-18WF(4000K) & Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803. I think they are too bright when I walk around, like I need a hat. Anything I can do or maybe some different bulbs?

Just have a 2 1/2 car garage with 10 foot ceilings. I only installed one light fixture so far.

Thanks

I was just about to order 4 of these lights for my basement (7' ceilings) and I noticed this post about them seeming too bright. Has anyone else noticed this? I do like good lighting and I will likely recess the lights between the floor joists.

thanks,

Jim

 

[Platonic Solid]

I got some of these bulbs and fixtures for my garage. LEDMyplace WEN-T8-4FT-18WF(4000K) & Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803. I think they are too bright when I walk around, like I need a hat. Anything I can do or maybe some different bulbs?

Just have a 2 1/2 car garage with 10 foot ceilings. I only installed one light fixture so far.

Thanks

Let's clarify - You have a single 4ft 2-Lamp fixture with 2-2400 lumen bulbs (thus 4800 lumens total) in what I'll guess is a 30x24x10 space. You can't judge by a single fixture since your pupils can't properly adjust. If you permit your pupils to adjust to the dark area of the space and then look towards the single light source, it will be uncomfortable. This is why even light distribution is important,. Once you've evenly filled the space with the remaining fixtures, your pupils will adjust and it will not be uncomfortable.

 

[bmwpowere36m3]

Since I can't possibly keep up with the demand for lighting layouts I went through the Visual Photometric Tool that is prelinked to Acuity Brand IES files and selected a similar output and wattage Lithonia fixture to the LumenGen/Metalux striplight combo on page 1 (link).

The closest I can find to the LumenGen/Metalux striplight combo which is Lithonia CLX L48 5000LM. The LumenGen/Metalux striplight combo is an affordable option for up to 10ft mounting height. Here is the link with the CLX L48 5000LM fixture preselected.

Now select "TOOLS" (at top left), then "Interior".

Insert dimensions of your area in the boxes.

Standard Ceiling,wall,floor reflectance is 70,50,20. If your ceiling and walls are unfinished wood, change reflectance to 20,20,20.

Insert 100fc or your desired level at workplane in the illuminance criteria box. (Industry standard for Automotive Maintenance and Machine Repair is 93fc @ 30" workplane.)

Note every time you make a change it takes a few seconds to update.

Near the bottom you can change fixture rotation and Suspension Length (distance of fixture from the ceiling).

See illuminance changes and fixture Qty. upper right corner.

Check "layout" box (middle right) to see fixture location dimensions.

If you need to mount fixtures higher than 10ft Lithonia has highbay fixtures similar to James, DivaLite,... you just have to load the most similar Lithonia IES file to the fixture you're considering via "Open" on the main Visual Photometric Tool tab. Then go to Lithonia Lighting/High Bay/IBH and search the specs. Fastest way is to download the fixture PDF and compare specs that way, then select the corresponding IES file.

Is this (linked IES/tool) still applicable to the current lighting selections:

Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803 fixture with either the LEDMyplace WEN-T8-4FT-18WF or Greentek Energy Systems GT-T8-18W1200 BIXX LED bulbs?

 

[thoyer]

Recently finished my 26 x 36 x 12 garage shell. Trying to select lighting and read / skimmed through many of the informative posts here.

I was looking at using 8' long fixtures but have only seen 4' fixtures being discussed here - is there a reason not to go 8'?

The garage is 2 bays wide with two 10x10 doors. There will be a 2 post lift in one corner and a 4 post lift in the diagonal opposite corner.

Could use some thoughts on spacing of fixtures as well as a quick discussion 4' vs 8'

Thanks
Tom

 

[Marctrees]

Someone steer me to a sub ? $30 light level meter... or I can start a new thread if more appropriate... do not want to hijack this thread... but figured you Guys could easily help.

Prefer handheld standalone unit rather than cell phone App.

Amazon link would be great.

Marc

 

[Platonic Solid]

Is this (linked IES/tool) still applicable to the current lighting selections:

Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803 fixture with either the LEDMyplace WEN-T8-4FT-18WF or Greentek Energy Systems GT-T8-18W1200 BIXX LED bulbs?

Yes. I see the WEN-T8-4FT-18WF is out of stock.

 

[Platonic Solid]

thoyer - 8ft is less popular and more expensive on a lumens/$ basis if dealing with actual 8' retrofit bulbs. 8ft strip lights that use 4 4ft bulbs are a good alternative. If you're interested in 8ft integral LED fixtures (not retrofit bulbs), that's certainly an option, but that tends to be pricey.

 

[thoyer]

thoyer - 8ft is less popular and more expensive on a lumens/$ basis if dealing with actual 8' retrofit bulbs. 8ft strip lights that use 4 4ft bulbs are a good alternative. If you're interested in 8ft integral LED fixtures (not retrofit bulbs), that's certainly an option, but that tends to be pricey.

Makes sense. This is a new build so no retrofit needed. It's not a low budget build but I would like to keep as many $ in my pocket as possible.............

I installed the "Visual Lighting" program from the web to try my hand at a layout but I'm finding it a bit confusing to use.

Thank you for taking the time to respond to everyone. You are a great resource!!

Tom