JakeKohl
Well-known member
So....those stair forms come off today - right!? The anticipation is palpable!
The Concrete Underground
- Thread starter ConCretin
- Start date
Well, they didn't fall off the wall;
To be honest, I haven't walked on them yet. I'm confident they've gained enough strength to support their own weight but I won't load test them with my girth for another week or so. Actually I might never go upstairs again after we take down the temp stairs.
I'm actually very pleased with the way they came out.
The stairs are visible through the glass from the front entry stoop. We're planning to install some stair lights in the wall above the treads to create a cool focal point as you approach the front door.
They stripped pretty easy. I did it by myself in a couple hours. I just knocked the sleepers out from beneath the bents. Removing one screw allowed the bent to drop and be pulled out whole. In fact, you could build another set in a few hours using all the same parts and pieces. Anybody wanna buy some forms?
A couple other things going on. I'm trimming out the garage door openings in preparation for installation of the doors next week. This is the door we are converting to a rolling door. I needed to extend a mounting surface for the track that will allow the door to slide.
I didn't really think this detail through before we did the EIFS so I had to conjure something up. I wrapped some pre-painted pine boards in metal on the outside to protect them from the weather. We'll run the drywall up to them on the inside.
I also had some metal bent up to cover the jambs underneath the EIFS.
I also did some more work on the other staircase. If you recall, I'm trying to eliminate the need for a sloped ceiling where the stair stringers intrude into the hall ceiling. I think one of the tenets of modern architecture is to keep things simple and linear - a sloped ceiling wouldn't fit with this plan IMO.
Here's a closer shot;
I fabricated a steel frame to support one tread, which is just above the ceiling and the rest of the stringers to finish up the run. You might notice a little surgery I had to do to the corner of the AC wall. It's so the concrete doesn't stick thru the drywall. Much of the design for the project has been done on the fly and this staircase is no exception.
The treads you see are obviously just temporary and in fact I need to replace the stringers as well. The damn 2 x 12's I bought are so warped and checked they aren't even usable. Arrghh. I'll consider them templates and pick up some LSL's to make new ones.
I hung one side using a threaded rod epoxied into the concrete floor above.
I used a piece of angle with a couple expansion bolts on the other side. I'm using 1/2" coil thread, which is designed for concrete formwork and is incredibly strong.
Meanwhile the window crew was back to install the last remaining window and do some caulking, which was delayed by the long Maine winter
And finally, a couple of the items we placed last week have been stripped. The main entry platform;
and the front stairs;
I'll strip the hearth and mantle as soon as I get a chance. Hopefully it came out as well as everything else since I'll be looking over it at the TV for the rest of my life.
To be honest, I haven't walked on them yet. I'm confident they've gained enough strength to support their own weight but I won't load test them with my girth for another week or so. Actually I might never go upstairs again after we take down the temp stairs.
I'm actually very pleased with the way they came out.
The stairs are visible through the glass from the front entry stoop. We're planning to install some stair lights in the wall above the treads to create a cool focal point as you approach the front door.
They stripped pretty easy. I did it by myself in a couple hours. I just knocked the sleepers out from beneath the bents. Removing one screw allowed the bent to drop and be pulled out whole. In fact, you could build another set in a few hours using all the same parts and pieces. Anybody wanna buy some forms?
A couple other things going on. I'm trimming out the garage door openings in preparation for installation of the doors next week. This is the door we are converting to a rolling door. I needed to extend a mounting surface for the track that will allow the door to slide.
I didn't really think this detail through before we did the EIFS so I had to conjure something up. I wrapped some pre-painted pine boards in metal on the outside to protect them from the weather. We'll run the drywall up to them on the inside.
I also had some metal bent up to cover the jambs underneath the EIFS.
I also did some more work on the other staircase. If you recall, I'm trying to eliminate the need for a sloped ceiling where the stair stringers intrude into the hall ceiling. I think one of the tenets of modern architecture is to keep things simple and linear - a sloped ceiling wouldn't fit with this plan IMO.
Here's a closer shot;
I fabricated a steel frame to support one tread, which is just above the ceiling and the rest of the stringers to finish up the run. You might notice a little surgery I had to do to the corner of the AC wall. It's so the concrete doesn't stick thru the drywall. Much of the design for the project has been done on the fly and this staircase is no exception.
The treads you see are obviously just temporary and in fact I need to replace the stringers as well. The damn 2 x 12's I bought are so warped and checked they aren't even usable. Arrghh. I'll consider them templates and pick up some LSL's to make new ones.
I hung one side using a threaded rod epoxied into the concrete floor above.
I used a piece of angle with a couple expansion bolts on the other side. I'm using 1/2" coil thread, which is designed for concrete formwork and is incredibly strong.
Meanwhile the window crew was back to install the last remaining window and do some caulking, which was delayed by the long Maine winter
And finally, a couple of the items we placed last week have been stripped. The main entry platform;
and the front stairs;
I'll strip the hearth and mantle as soon as I get a chance. Hopefully it came out as well as everything else since I'll be looking over it at the TV for the rest of my life.
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Vernmotor
Well-known member
So we going to take some measurement to see if they stay put ? Looks neat as hell ! I would be scarce to walk on them for a while !
signcrafter
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 9, 2012
- Messages
- 12,318
What is the finish going to be on that stair wall? I'd hate to drywall around all those stairs! Also what do you plan for a railing and how are you going to mount it to the stairs? Can you just drill and anchor into the concrete without it affecting the strength or chipping out if you drill close to the edge?
I love how it turned out and can't wait to see the mantle. Great job.
I love how it turned out and can't wait to see the mantle. Great job.
el Pedro
Well-known member
I looked at doing a similar staircase in our renovation but using steel and wood. We went with stringers in the end as it required less engineering and cost. Looking at yours I wish we had of spent the money and time. The stairs look amazing and will look even better as you start to finish of the internals of the house!!
redsand187
Well-known member
Kind of off-topic, but you seem to know a wee-bit about concrete construction... 
I've been looking through cool modern house designs, and I've noticed some that are bare concrete walls inside and out. It looks cool, and it looks like the walls are probably 8+ inches thick, but hows that work for heat transfer/insulation?
Sorry if it's been addressed in this monster thread, but jealousy has kept me from following too close.
I've been looking through cool modern house designs, and I've noticed some that are bare concrete walls inside and out. It looks cool, and it looks like the walls are probably 8+ inches thick, but hows that work for heat transfer/insulation?
Sorry if it's been addressed in this monster thread, but jealousy has kept me from following too close.
It was pretty obvious as I stripped the formwork that things were staying put. I'm not even sure I got the predicted 1/16" of deflection. Intellectually I know the treads aren't going anywhere but I share your trepidation about actually walking up the damn things.
By the way, I checked out the inline design website. It looks like they have some great systems that don't look outrageously expensive. Thanks!
I like both your suggestions, hpw. The railing design hasn't been determined yet but I think it's likely to be glass panels or SS cables just as you suggest. It's really one of the last major design issues we need to tackle.
The plan is to cover the ICF with drywall although that could change. I actually considered putting the drywall up before I formed the stairs but didn't get around to it. I guess the dry-waller will have to deal with it now.
While the style of railing hasn't been determined yet, I'm assuming it will have to be attached to the concrete treads somehow. We'll have to drill into the treads so careful planning will be required to ensure the anchors don't get too close to an edge.
redsand, if you go back to post 1052 on page 53, you'll see a product called Thermomass. It is basically 2" of rigid insulation that is encapsulated in a 10" concrete wall. It addresses the issues you refer to.
Thanks you all for your kind words and continuing interest. I was amazed when Eric mentioned that The Concrete Underground was one of the top ten threads on GJ - and we still have a long way to go. Believe me when I tell you that I've enjoyed this as much as you have.
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60766244
Active member
Building my own place and having my mind blown, once more.
I love the cantilevered stairs and have been hitting F5 on this page, every day for months now!
The wire staircase rails look the best in my book, but if you can work out how to do frameless glass handrails (I don't even want to think how much it'd cost to get the panels cut to shape) then that'd be even more Bond-Villain.
I love the cantilevered stairs and have been hitting F5 on this page, every day for months now!
The wire staircase rails look the best in my book, but if you can work out how to do frameless glass handrails (I don't even want to think how much it'd cost to get the panels cut to shape) then that'd be even more Bond-Villain.
TwoBytes
Well-known member
That's hilarious!
The stairs look amazing, good job.
I have a general question about the use of the ******** when you're placing concrete. How do you know how long to leave it in one spot, and how far apart the "pokes" need to be?
Do you wait till there's no more bubbles coming up, or is there some other rule of thumb?
I think I remember you saying that you don't want to vibrate it too much or it would liquify and start to separate, so it seems like there could be a fine line between too much vibration and not enough.
ahah I was about to post the same thing. But there's not many other options.
@LL: For the railing, you can chek these folks too. They ship in part and everything is assembled so it's very small.
http://bocani.com/products/rampe-escalier-en-bref#
(I don't know why their english link doesn't work, but some prices are there and it seems not too bad for the quality)
They have a configurator that tells you the price live.
http://bocani.com/info/rampe-escalier#configurer
Scooter Scott
Well-known member
Those stairs would scare the **** out of me to walk on...but they look amazing!
Well, they didn't fall off the wall;
To be honest, I haven't walked on them yet. I'm confident they've gained enough strength to support their own weight but I won't load test them with my girth for another week or so. Actually I might never go upstairs again after we take down the temp stairs.
I'm actually very pleased with the way they came out.
Coolest set of stairs on GJ. I think they deserve a YOU ****.
JordonMusser
Well-known member
freakin cool!
carlsondajj
Well-known member
I have been following this thread since Day 1 and continue to be blown away! Keep up the great work! 
cderalow
Well-known member
I wonder if you can get away with just doing a railing on the wall side. It would help maintain that scary floating factor
no way to do that and meet building code.
I'd suggest the standoffs with 1/2" tempered glass or some sort of decorative tempered art glass as a focus point. Perhaps from a company like Meltdown Glass, Pulp Studio or Bendheim.
Expensive, but very neat looking.
JordonMusser
Well-known member
My vote is no rails.
I recommend the hand railing have waves in it. That should give the mental illusion that the steps are bowing as you walk up/down them.
signcrafter
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 9, 2012
- Messages
- 12,318
After looking at it again it "might" not be too bad. If your drywaller is good he should be able to measure and cut out the stairs and then just slide the sheet right over and across the stairs! It would be a lot of cuts that would have to be perfect but it could be done. I hadn't even thought about cutting all the treads out and then starting at the outside and sliding over the stairs up to the wall. I was picturing the traditional way of cutting all the treads out and then making a cut threw all the cutouts and then hanging the two pieces and having to tape by each tread.
These are the little details I love seeing how you figure out!
Thanks to everyone for the comments and suggestions. I think we are all on the same page when it comes to railings. You can be sure that you will be the first to know what we decide.
I couldn't help but notice that we just passed 1 million views - amazing. We have a long way to go but it will be bittersweet when I finally finish this thing and the thread fades away.
The size of the ******** head determines its' field of influence. You want to ensure that the fields overlap. We used a 1" pencil ******** and dropped it every 6" or so. With a bigger head you could space the drops 12" or more.
The proper procedure is to let the ******** drop under it's own weight, pause briefly and then pull it out at a rate of 2 or 3 seconds per foot, which is quite slow. If you are placing in lifts you want to ensure the ******** drops 6 or 12" into the previous lift.
It is almost impossible to over vibrate concrete. If your doing AC, you need to be incredibly patient and thorough.
Thanks Beachboy. They have some very cool stuff but we'd have to overcome the language barrier. I couldn't get the english link to work either.
Wow, that might be my very first 'you ****'.
We used a 3/8, 4,000 psi mix with a mid range water reducer and no air entrainment. We placed it at about a 5" slump. PM me if you want the actual mix design.
I couldn't help but notice that we just passed 1 million views - amazing. We have a long way to go but it will be bittersweet when I finally finish this thing and the thread fades away.
The size of the ******** head determines its' field of influence. You want to ensure that the fields overlap. We used a 1" pencil ******** and dropped it every 6" or so. With a bigger head you could space the drops 12" or more.
The proper procedure is to let the ******** drop under it's own weight, pause briefly and then pull it out at a rate of 2 or 3 seconds per foot, which is quite slow. If you are placing in lifts you want to ensure the ******** drops 6 or 12" into the previous lift.
It is almost impossible to over vibrate concrete. If your doing AC, you need to be incredibly patient and thorough.
Thanks Beachboy. They have some very cool stuff but we'd have to overcome the language barrier. I couldn't get the english link to work either.
Wow, that might be my very first 'you ****'.
We used a 3/8, 4,000 psi mix with a mid range water reducer and no air entrainment. We placed it at about a 5" slump. PM me if you want the actual mix design.
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Bib Overalls
Well-known member
I can see it now. It is after dark and the illuminated stairs and the transparent railing seem to float on air. I'm visiting and you have plied me with incredible food and copious quantities of beer, wine, whiskey, and liquors. As I attempt to ascend to the guest quarters I find myself spinning in space and unable to levitate. Overwhelmed, I crawl underneath, assume the fetal position and drift away on your cozy hydro heated, hard as hell, concrete floor.
I can see it now. It is after dark and the illuminated stairs and the transparent railing seem to float on air. I'm visiting and you have plied me with incredible food and copious quantities of beer, wine, whiskey, and liquors. As I attempt to ascend to the guest quarters I find myself spinning in space and unable to levitate. Overwhelmed, I crawl underneath, assume the fetal position and drift away on your cozy hydro heated, hard as hell, concrete floor.
Nicely done Bib's. Definitely one of my all time favorite posts. I read it aloud to 'she who must be obeyed' and when we were finally able to compose ourselves, she indicated that she doesn't allow guests to sleep on the floor. We'd get you up the stairs one way or another
By the way, if you find yourself in this neck of the woods, I'd be glad to ply you with all the food and drink you can stand.
I've said it before but if any of you guys are passing through and would like to stop by, you are more than welcome to do so.
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gasgas17
Well-known member
I can see it now. It is after dark and the illuminated stairs and the transparent railing seem to float on air. I'm visiting and you have plied me with incredible food and copious quantities of beer, wine, whiskey, and liquors. As I attempt to ascend to the guest quarters I find myself spinning in space and unable to levitate. Overwhelmed, I crawl underneath, assume the fetal position and drift away on your cozy hydro heated, hard as hell, concrete floor.
Note to self......Never invite this guy over for supper.
I have already planned to go and my gf can't wait too. I can bring any canadian beer youd like.
Probably a little later this summer to see the kitchen for the lady.
we plan to check the trains in the middle of the wood at the same time
http://seriestrek.com/nmw.html
and we'll pick-up the plans for the guest house / garage too
Those stairs are awesome! A glass railing and some LED tape or fiber optic lighting on the underside of each tread would be a neat look. Just a little glow would really emphasize the cantilever design at night.
TwoBytes
Well-known member
+1 vote for this!
I think the less railing you have on those stairs the better, and under certain lighting this would look almost invisible.
I imagine (though I'm not sure) that drilling into the ends of the steps instead of down through the top near the edge would lower the risk of cracking?
Mat.
CoconutPete
Well-known member
OMG! Love those stairs!!!!! I would just stand on them all the time and giggle.