The Ultimate Tool Set? Grainger Seems to Think So?

[VolvoRyan]

I work for a major university. Somehow, buying from a small list of approved vendors saves money and reduces waste.

It's also a handy way to make certain purchases impossible: I need a wrench.... but you must buy the set from the approved vendor..... but the set is $49K.... then you don't get a wrench.

-Ryan

 

[signcrafter]

I dont get why anyone would care or even argue why something costs so much. It obviously isnt for everybody. And as mentioned many times when they sell this set it is for half price. Not saying that's a great deal but sometimes in business you spend whatever it takes to get a job done. This set is mainly for industrial maintenance men. And when a machine goes down there are many people getting paid good to stand around and wait for it to be fixed. If you dont have the right tool to fix it quickly it wont take long to pay for that 25 grand set of tools you wish you had so you could fix the machine and get back to work.

There are plenty of times I pay higher then I should in order to get a tool or part to get the job done quickly. When in business it's a necessity in order to keep working sometimes.

There are plenty of things out there that are crazy priced. Purses, clothes, watches, and the list goes on and on.

 

[VolvoRyan]

but I do doubt that usability in suitable situations would be significantly different

Best CYA statement. Ever.

-Ryan

 

[Kuma601]

The nice thing with Grainger even though I'm the little guy is that when you need something they will be able to get it. Their prices are fairly competitive on the consumables I tend to use: drill bits, taps etc in low quantities. Through Travers or MSC I have to buy by the dozen to get a decent price break with shipping involved. For business that has to have an approved supplier they are that.

Their PPE prices are 2X what my usual places are but Grainger was able to get them unlike others who could not quote any delivery times during the peak of the covid panic buying. I used to buy P100 filters in sets at $45 for 5 packages. Grainger is $170 for the cartridges. Big industry buys them by the pallet so their prices is more favorable them my buying quantities. During covid those I knew some that ran shops were unable to order pallets of them. I came across enough guys who were wearing the surgical types for their duties, they were not happy. For my uses I was able to buy low quantities of R95, N95 or P100's because there were ordering limits in place.

 

[Garcky]

I work for a major university. Somehow, buying from a small list of approved vendors saves money and reduces waste.

It's also a handy way to make certain purchases impossible: I need a wrench.... but you must buy the set from the approved vendor..... but the set is $49K.... then you don't get a wrench.

-Ryan

Yeah, I get that, for sure. For those using company or organization tools on the job, you're sort of dependent on what is supplied. For most people in the trades, though, they have to buy their own tools, mostly. Two different situations, for sure.

 

[Garcky]

Best CYA statement. Ever.

-Ryan

Yeah? OK. Mostly, I don't have high-end tools. I have some, but most of my tools are second tier stuff, or even cheaper stuff for some tools I don't use often.

I just watched a YouTube video comparing Icon combination wrenches with Snap-On. The person in the video tested them by using the open end side of 3/4" wrenches to tighten an nut on a bolt in a vice until the wrench rounded the bolt. The Icon wrench rounded it with less force applied than the Snap-On one did, but both brands eventually rounded off the fastener. The designs of the two wrenches were different. I learned very early in my working life that open end wrenches were not appropriate when used to apply high torque levels to fasteners. For applying high torque with a hand wrench, the box end is the right tool for the job. That's what I mean by "suitable use." I don't know anyone who uses open end wrenches to tighten things to the point of rounding off the fastener. Why would anyone do that?

You don't use an open end wrench to remove lug nuts on wheels. It's not the appropriate tool for the job.

Like I said, I don't care what tools other people buy. I only care about what tools I buy. I don't break tools. I use the right tool appropriately for the job at hand. Tools are expensive, and breaking tools causes injuries.

 

[finn]

It’s pretty obvious that many, or maybe even most people here are pretty oblivious to the internal costs a multi billion dollar company, especially one with multi state or international operations, incurs in sourcing support items like tools and other generic supplies required to run the business.

It would be ridiculous to cut a purchase order for any vendor like Harbor Freight for a $15 Icon ratchet when a full service supplier can provide literally tens of thousands of items, under one contract, with one billing process and contact point, and the after discount price is virtually the same. That, plus the order can be placed with one click, and the tool or other supply will show up at the receiving dock the next day.

The cost of these support items is tiny compared to the cost of raw materials and sub assemblies that go into production, revenue generating operations.

Some of you guys would probably be appalled to find out that you can probably get toilet paper cheaper at Costco or Dollar General than from a full service supplier like Grainger.

 

[Garcky]

Some of you guys would probably be appalled to find out that you can probably get toilet paper cheaper at Costco or Dollar General than from a full service supplier like Grainger.

I always buy toilet paper at Costco. So, maybe I'm not "some of you guys." I suppose you could probably buy it from Grainger, but I haven't seen a Grainger catalog for years. They have it at ULine, too, where I do have an account I used to use to buy cardboard boxes. But, I buy TP from Costco, because that's the cheapest source I have access to.

See, I'm not really calling out Grainger. They serve a different clientele that me. They're a wholesale outlet that focuses on corporate and government customers. The point of my post was the folly of spending $50 per tool for a highly-respected tool company. That's the cost per item of their 1000-something toolset. That simply makes no sense at all. If someone says it makes sense, they aren't thinking about this in any rational way.

Yes, Grainger's customers do not spend that much. Probably half of that, but even $25 per tools is essentially outrageous. That is my point. And yet, the fact that they offer such a set of tools at such a high price shifts the expectation of cost upward. The same thing applies to companies like Snap-On and MAC tools, who sell to individuals from tool trucks, for prices that are far higher than from other suppliers for similar tools.

The difference in quality is not that much, really. I have one Snap-On tool in my tool box. It's a 3/8" drive 3/4" wobble socket that I bought at a garage sale for 50 cents. It's a nice wobble socket, but I wouldn't pay the Snap-On price for one. I have a set of wobble sockets in both SAE and Metric sizes. I use them from time to time. The Snap-On one and the other ones I own work just fine. None of them have ever broken, and I've had them for decades. I used them as they were intended to be used. They aren't ever going to break. None of them. So, the 50 cent Snap-On one isn't really any better than the other ones I own. They all work just fine. I wouldn't buy a new one from the Snap-On truck. I won't need to.

Grainger doesn't charge its customers less for that tool set. In fact, it charges them more, because they have to buy from Grainger, because they have a contract and must choose suppliers from a list of approved suppliers. So, Grainger can actually charge more. I haven't had a Grainger account for a very, very long time. I never found a real need for it.

I'm interested in the individual tool buyer, not the corporate or government one. I find that Proto master tool set to be a joke. A very, very expensive joke. Proto was once a top tier tool company. Now, it's just part of Stanley. I have some old Proto tools from the 50s and 60s. I like them. But, I like all the tools in my tool box, whatever their source. If I didn't, I would have replaced them at some point.

I just don't buy tools based on the name imprinted on the tool. Nope. I don't have many Harbor Freight tools, either. There's not a store nearby where I live.

 

[VolvoRyan]

That's what I mean by "suitable use." I don't know anyone who uses open end wrenches to tighten things to the point of rounding off the fastener. Why would anyone do that?

Jam nut on tie rod ends in the rust belt. 13mm vs 21mm. Thank gawd for Wright Grip. And acetylene.

-Ryan

 

[Garcky]

Jam nut on tie rod ends in the rust belt. 13mm vs 21mm. Thank gawd for Wright Grip. And acetylene.

-Ryan

Ah, there you go. I hate that! The hot wrench saves the day. I have always hated suspension, alignment, and exhaust stuff. Somehow, I've managed to avoid it most of the time. I used to live in coastal California, and now in Minnesota. Everything rusts. I remember a hitch ball nut on the coast of California. After 10 minutes, I replaced everything from the receiver back. Screw it! Rust *****!

 

[finn]

I always buy toilet paper at Costco. So, maybe I'm not "some of you guys." I suppose you could probably buy it from Grainger, but I haven't seen a Grainger catalog for years. They have it at ULine, too, where I do have an account I used to use to buy cardboard boxes. But, I buy TP from Costco, because that's the cheapest source I have access to.

See, I'm not really calling out Grainger. They serve a different clientele that me. They're a wholesale outlet that focuses on corporate and government customers. The point of my post was the folly of spending $50 per tool for a highly-respected tool company. That's the cost per item of their 1000-something toolset. That simply makes no sense at all. If someone says it makes sense, they aren't thinking about this in any rational way.

Yes, Grainger's customers do not spend that much. Probably half of that, but even $25 per tools is essentially outrageous. That is my point. And yet, the fact that they offer such a set of tools at such a high price shifts the expectation of cost upward. The same thing applies to companies like Snap-On and MAC tools, who sell to individuals from tool trucks, for prices that are far higher than from other suppliers for similar tools.

The difference in quality is not that much, really. I have one Snap-On tool in my tool box. It's a 3/8" drive 3/4" wobble socket that I bought at a garage sale for 50 cents. It's a nice wobble socket, but I wouldn't pay the Snap-On price for one. I have a set of wobble sockets in both SAE and Metric sizes. I use them from time to time. The Snap-On one and the other ones I own work just fine. None of them have ever broken, and I've had them for decades. I used them as they were intended to be used. They aren't ever going to break. None of them. So, the 50 cent Snap-On one isn't really any better than the other ones I own. They all work just fine. I wouldn't buy a new one from the Snap-On truck. I won't need to.

Grainger doesn't charge its customers less for that tool set. In fact, it charges them more, because they have to buy from Grainger, because they have a contract and must choose suppliers from a list of approved suppliers. So, Grainger can actually charge more. I haven't had a Grainger account for a very, very long time. I never found a real need for it.

I'm interested in the individual tool buyer, not the corporate or government one. I find that Proto master tool set to be a joke. A very, very expensive joke. Proto was once a top tier tool company. Now, it's just part of Stanley. I have some old Proto tools from the 50s and 60s. I like them. But, I like all the tools in my tool box, whatever their source. If I didn't, I would have replaced them at some point.

I just don't buy tools based on the name imprinted on the tool. Nope. I don't have many Harbor Freight tools, either. There's not a store nearby where I live.

You continually either miss or ignore the point that it’s likely half that cost, at the contract price, for any decent sized corporation.

I buy my tp at Costco, too, but the $15 billion corporation I spent my career at certainly didn’t. Their purchasing agents, by and large, were dedicated to managing multi million dollar supplier contracts for steel, forgings, paint, $500 million dollar transfer lines, and the like.

It’s a financial black hole to chase Pennies on one time purchases of trivial items like hand tools, for a corporation of any size. That $20000 tool kit (after discount) tool kit is a rounding error compared to the tools required to set up a quarter mile long machining line.

 

[CS454]

I could buy a lot of Starbucks for the price of that set.

 

[Kscardsfan]

Harbor freight does not sell hand tools that can compare or compete with Proto. They just don't.

Stanley has owned Proto for almost 40 years.

Not to mention, there’s a lot of overlap between Mac and Proto from what I can feel in my hands and see on the printed page. They’re damned high quality tools to be sure.

 

[fastev]

I have two of those sets in my shop. Bought both for about half the list price for one. Everything delivered in about a week.

I run a maintenance group for a major shoe manufacturer. We use Grainger all the time, including their Keepstock program for consumables. My rep is amazing, if there is something I need she usually has it in a day or two, regardless of whether or not it is in their catalog.

Yes, they can be expensive. In an industrial environment you are paying for their buying power, which often is far more important than price. I know I can save a few hundred on a motor, but knowing Grainger is stocking it ultimately saves me millions because I’m not waiting on shipping from god knows where.

All about the target audience. Not for everyone, but everything to some.

 

[Wrench97]

Or there is the Williams JHWMEGATB set for a discounted price of $16k > https://protoolwarehouse.com/williams-960-pieces-complete-mega-tool-set-with-tool-boxes

 

[regguy1]

I'm sure that's true. I just think it's funny. That set is far from being a complete set for, say, auto mechanics. Lots of missing stuff in it. Plus, current Proto tools are not top-of-the-line, although I'm sure they're quite good. You can get an equivalent Snap-On set for quite a bit less money, which makes the Grainger set something of a joke to me.

I'm sure you could duplicate the Proto set with Icon-grade tools from HF for well under $10,000. Quality would be just as good. BTW, the Grainger set includes a rolling toolbox, although there's no description of it.

There is no such thing as a "complete set" of tools

 

[iamhomeless]

I'd be interested in some hard performance data, on a tool-by-tool basis, of a comparison between comparable current Proto and HF Icon hand tools. I don't know of any actual comparison tests of that kind. I don't doubt that there would be differences, but I do doubt that usability in suitable situations would be significantly different between the two brands, across a range of tools.

If you know of some such comparisons, I'd be glad to look at them.

I just put in an order for a bunch of Proto stuff at work through MSC, if you want to send me some icon stuff I will gladly do a comparison, I'll even compare it to my old proto stuff at home.

 

[garfunkle24]

Breaking news/TLDR; Purchasers for national accounts and governmental entities do not browse flea markets or pawn shops trying to find killer deals on tools. They're so highfalutin they don't even check if there's a HF coupon when they need something. Also, Grainger sells overpriced stuff.

I will be back later with some revelatory insight regarding the moisture content of water.

 

[iamhomeless]

Contrarians? They're just stating facts. Like said multiple times, this isn't for the buyer who thinks about things the way you are. I'm sure Grainger doesn't (and doesn't plan to) sell a ton of these even to their typical large industrial buyer. However, they have them available because on the occasions that type of buyer DOES need a relatively complete (for industrial purposes) set of quality hand tools ASAP, they provide that option. It comes at a cost, but everyone understands that.

I have worked in an industrial setting for 20 years, and a) we would rarely if ever buy tools by the set like this, b) whenever we do buy tools they will be coming from Grainger/McMaster/Fastenal/etc., all of which will be relatively overpriced for what you get by the standards of the average forum member. It just doesn't matter. A company like us is simply not going to call the Snap-On guy to order tools. Even if we had one of the fabled industrial reps show up, it would be a hard sell to get purchasing and maintenance administration to be interested in setting up another vendor just to be able to buy expensive (if extremely high quality) tools when it works just find to use one of our industrial suppliers.

Cost in an environment like this is a whole different animal. An occasional $50k is not a drop in the bucket of operating costs for a reasonably sized industrial company, and they have different priorities than a typical buyer. This isn't like a home user, prosumer, or even a small business like an auto shop or small manufacturer. When you need to get millions worth of product out the door, spending much time worrying about whether a one time indirect expense that has useful life of years or decades costs $20k or $50k is generally not very efficient. Yes you want to get the lowest price you can through your established channels, but it's not worth using too many resources to find something else.

We actually have a Snapon account at work, but to be honest, unless I need something special, it's a lot easier to order the Williams or CDI version through MSC, it raises less eyebrows where going through purchasing, and it causes less drama of people second guessing costs when they see the tool sitting on my bench, even if the reality is that I can get a better price from a snapon franchisee than I can from MSC even with our discount.

This is whynim waiting on a new williams box and not a new snapon box

 

[metaldad]

when i needed anything, i would avoid grainger like the plague.
tools, motors, air filters, pulleys, belts, grease, bearings, anything.
i would call every vendor in my book to purchase whatever.
just NOT grainger
don't like their whole bizness dealings.
especially 'its not in stock. we can have it tomorrow'
mcmaster has 99.9% of their catalog in stock. at will call, in 2 hours or less

 

[speed bump]

I looked a little closer at this set and one thing I really do like is the puller selection. Kind of wish I could buy that individually with the foam for our bearing assembly and pump rebuild area

 

[Kuma601]

Grainger is a first look place and they are close which makes them convenient for my supplies. When I'm it is small companies - sole owner guys picking up sub $500 orders. I'm treated well. Their phone support is good and in store if I have questions on a product the staff there generally is able to advise.

I ordered an igniter for the furnace through Amazon and they messed that one up. I didn't think to call Grainger but afterwards while looking they were in stock for the same price. I took that queue because one of the guys picking up parts was an HVAC repair guy and Grainger supplied him with a bunch of stuff for his job.

IDK about McMaster-Carr. They are local too, when I was sourcing some bearings, they were 2X what the bearing supply was quoting. May have to look into them more.

All these supply places have their place and loyal buyers.

 

[1982fxr]

I'd be interested in some hard performance data, on a tool-by-tool basis, of a comparison between comparable current Proto and HF Icon hand tools. I don't know of any actual comparison tests of that kind. I don't doubt that there would be differences, but I do doubt that usability in suitable situations would be significantly different between the two brands, across a range of tools.

If you know of some such comparisons, I'd be glad to look at

Real post ^^^^^^

 

[pfaustus]

Zoro, Grainger's consumer version. More pieces, but I'm not going to try to figure out what is different. $19,868.72 My guess is that $19K price reflects something closer to what a Grainger customer would actually pay.

https://www.zoro.com/proto-master-t...pieces-jcs-1258mas/i/G0473719/#specifications

 

[jsmeece]

There are plenty of things out there that are crazy priced. Purses, clothes, watches, and the list goes on and on.

Yep, my wife will spend $500 or more on a new purse without blinking an eye, crazy!

 

[cannuck]

Everyone has better prices than Grainger.

My "day job" client has national accounts with Grainger on both sides of the border. In Canada, we only go to them as a last resort as even with our pricing it is far cheaper to pay retail at other suppliers. When we DO need something from Acklands/Grainger the guys hate the bother as you need to go out for a quotation to get anything near reasonable pricing. US prices seem to be better, and since one of our offices is literally within easy walking distance of the Grainger order completion warehouse in Minooka IL we go there often as great inventory. BUT: for many things, I still prefer McMaster-Carr for instance over the convenience of Grainger.

I actually don't mind Proto tools, and even have some. As others had said: the offer in the OP is meant for equipping a new shop without wasting the time to build a tool set. Hardly anyone with their own tools doesn't already own most of what's there collected in stages over the years.

 

[Garcky]

You continually either miss or ignore the point that it’s likely half that cost, at the contract price, for any decent sized corporation.

I buy my tp at Costco, too, but the $15 billion corporation I spent my career at certainly didn’t. Their purchasing agents, by and large, were dedicated to managing multi million dollar supplier contracts for steel, forgings, paint, $500 million dollar transfer lines, and the like.

It’s a financial black hole to chase Pennies on one time purchases of trivial items like hand tools, for a corporation of any size. That $20000 tool kit (after discount) tool kit is a rounding error compared to the tools required to set up a quarter mile long machining line.

I don't miss the point, but I'm not a corporation. I'm just a person. Obviously, I'm not in the market for a $50k toolset. Really, I don't think we have too many corporate purchasing department folks on GL. No individual would be foolish enough to order that set from Grainger. What corporate or government agencies do is beside the point, really.

 

[Bubba Fett]

We order from Grainger all the time, mainly because they are on contract, and nearby. We had a situation arise where I needed an item as soon as physically possible, and they made it happen. We ordered that evening, and the item was in the receiving department the next morning. Yes, we paid a lot for shipping, but it was way less than what we would have paid had we not gotten the issue fixed in time.

Do I shop there for my own tools and parts? Nope, but they are an answer for many needs.

 

[VolvoRyan]

It's obviously a lot of money, but there's also a *LOT* of tools not shown in the pictures.

On the other hand, what's the annual cost of each bean counter at a big institution? It's a world we don't really understand. It's pretty easy for people to nickle and dime away a million bucks here and there at these places.

-Ryan

 

[pbon]

The grainger kit is a great opportunity for a new tradesman who missed out on a bunch of college debt to accumulate a bunch of tool debt.

 

[Garcky]

The grainger kit is a great opportunity for a new tradesman who missed out on a bunch of college debt to accumulate a bunch of tool debt.

Good ironic point!

 

[Garcky]

It's obviously a lot of money, but there's also a *LOT* of tools not shown in the pictures.

On the other hand, what's the annual cost of each bean counter at a big institution? It's a world we don't really understand. It's pretty easy for people to nickle and dime away a million bucks here and there at these places.

-Ryan

Well, I read through the entire list of tools in that set. It's pretty comprehensive, but also includes a lot of stuff that most shop guys won't need, and leaves out a lot of stuff they will. The exact makeup of the set isn't really the point, though.

 

[finn]

I don't miss the point, but I'm not a corporation. I'm just a person. Obviously, I'm not in the market for a $50k toolset. Really, I don't think we have too many corporate purchasing department folks on GL. No individual would be foolish enough to order that set from Grainger. What corporate or government agencies do is beside the point, really.

Then you aren’t the target market, so what difference does the list price make? They aren’t trying to sell it to you.

Grainger and the like are essentially business to business outfits. They don’t target homeowners. For that, you go to Lowes, Menards, or Home Depot, or even Harbor Freight.

Even if you’re a professional mechanic, Grainger and the like aren’t your best bet. A tool truck is a better match.

The industrial supply houses provide one stop shopping for a wide variety of consumables required to keep industry operating. They aren’t the cheapest, but they “deliver the goods” with little fanfare, leaving the business to concentrate on their mission.

It’s really not that difficult to understand.

 

[Garcky]

It’s really not that difficult to understand.

It's not difficult, you're right. And I do understand what Grainger is. Again, not my point. You don't see complete (more or less) tool sets with a price out there. Grainger has one. My point is that the list price is straight-up nuts. A $50 per tool average is completely ridiculous. No matter how "good" those tools are, there is no way they're worth that kind of money, frankly.

I also understand the market they're targeting. You're opening a new facility and the vehicle maintenance department needs a set of tools. So, here's a set of tools that will cover most needs. Purchasing guy orders it, it arrives, and the shop is equipped, more or less. It's a drop in the bucket as costs go.

I just find the price point really, really amusing. It literally makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[ATC]

I dont get why anyone would care or even argue why something costs so much. It obviously isnt for everybody. And as mentioned many times when they sell this set it is for half price. Not saying that's a great deal but sometimes in business you spend whatever it takes to get a job done. This set is mainly for industrial maintenance men. And when a machine goes down there are many people getting paid good to stand around and wait for it to be fixed. If you dont have the right tool to fix it quickly it wont take long to pay for that 25 grand set of tools you wish you had so you could fix the machine and get back to work.

There are plenty of times I pay higher then I should in order to get a tool or part to get the job done quickly. When in business it's a necessity in order to keep working sometimes.

There are plenty of things out there that are crazy priced. Purses, clothes, watches, and the list goes on and on.

Exactly. I work for a Fortune 50 manufacturing company. If maintenance is standing around with no tool to fix a machine, the supervisor WILL drive his *** to a local business and buy what they need vs. ordering from Grainger and waiting. A few hours downtime can cost a company A LOT more than a $50k tool kit (that they should have had in the first place). If a company is waiting on a breakdown to see what they need to buy to fix it....they won't be in business long. My boss has driven a mile up the road to Lowe's and bought items we've needed last minute.

 

[Wrench97]

The grainger kit is a great opportunity for a new tradesman who missed out on a bunch of college debt to accumulate a bunch of tool debt.

It's also a great opportunity to point out the pricing to the insurance adjuster when filing a theft/fire/flood claim.

 

[Nutria]

That set reminds me of the sets in the Sears Wish Book that I would look at endlessly as a kid. That was back in the day, and I don't think that it worked out to $40/tool, even after accounting for inflation. I did love looking at those sets as a youngster though.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Ah, there you go. I hate that! The hot wrench saves the day. I have always hated suspension, alignment, and exhaust stuff. Somehow, I've managed to avoid it most of the time. I used to live in coastal California, and now in Minnesota. Everything rusts. I remember a hitch ball nut on the coast of California. After 10 minutes, I replaced everything from the receiver back. Screw it! Rust *****!

So, uh, all the reasons you'd mainly use an open end? LOL

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Proto® 1046 Piece Foamed Master Set with Top Chest J556627-10SG and Workstation J556646-12SG - Proto Industrial

First of all, this kit includes foam, and a double bay top/bottom box. That's likely all of 10k right there. These tools are made in the United States. I don't care if you don't care about that - it raises the price. It's "$40/piece", but that ignores the 3/4 sockets, which are likely all of $40/each retail, a 1/2 drive torque wrench which is probably $200, and like $1000 worth of crowfeet. You're focusing on the low $$$ items, and ignoring the high dollar ones. I'm sure there's a few impact bits in there which cost $3. The ratcheting flare nut wrenches are a legit $40/each.



This also ignores what this set is actually about - procurement and efficiency. Ever tried to get the home office to do.... anything? Add another vender? Are you insane? Stuff like that takes literally WEEKS for them to get around to. Grainger, zoro, mcmaster, whoever has it TODAY, ready to go. And that ignores all the net 30/60/90, discounts, etc.

People who don't work for themselves, or have a close relationship with the dollars and sense of their place of employment don't get this. I bought a new/used scan tool last week. It has included basic service information. This feature alone has netted me over 10minutes of time on two alternator diagnosis. No going to service info, reading theory/operation, wiring diagram. Grab the scope, know what I'm looking for, done. Every tool I buy is like this, dollars=minutes, and minutes=dollars. A torque wrench with 80 teeth and a flex head saves me time over, and over, and every time it comes out I'm making time. Those minutes add up. Sneaking around that obstruction with a torque adapter, knowing the plug is oil fouled without ever seeing it, holding function bit sockets to squeeze past hoses. It all adds up. The people buying these kits DGAF about anything but downtime. They buy this type of kit, plus all the stuff the equipment manufacturers tell them to buy that goes in the tool room. When downtime costs $10000+ an hour, this is penny ante to buy. Same idea as batteries. Guys on here live and die to get every last day of life out of a POS battery. The people that live and die by downtime dump them on a schedule. The downtime isn't worth $200 bucks for a battery - that's NOTHING when the truck/van it powers is bringing in thousands per week.

 

[lardy1]

After reading two pages of this I'm still not sure what the point of this thread is. I have my own suspicion but will keep it to myself. Minding my own business isn't hard for me.