ThermoWorks (Thermapen) 18% off

[pizza]

ThermoWorks (Thermapen) 18% off site wide (still active)

edit: deal still active

https://www.thermoworks.com/

in case you're not familiar with thermoworks, they make measurement equipment and related gadgets. a lot of it's food focused. quality stuff all around.

pictured above is the thermapen. it's their most popular product and is pretty much the industry standard temp measurement tool. you see guys use it on TV all the time in food shows. there are cheaper knockoffs out there, but this one is pretty well built.

i've used mine outside the kitchen many times.

anyway, if you want that or something else from them, everything's 18% off (no coupon needed). doesn't say when it ends.

shipping's 4 bucks flat rate i think.

here's some stuff i have from them that i think is worthwhile:

https://www.thermoworks.com/Thermapen-Mk4
https://www.thermoworks.com/ChefAlarm
https://www.thermoworks.com/TimeStick-Trio

 

[Car_Guy]

if you like cooking or know someone who does it is hard to resist the thermopen. I love how quick and accurately it works. (and for as much money as i know many of us have spend on quality tools for the garage, a quality tool for the kitchen is quite nice as well)

 

[esvee]

I love my instant-read thermometers - but there is no reason to spend that much on one of these anymore. The markup is horrendous compared to the competition. You can get dozens of equivalent fast read thermo from Amazon for $20. Some for even less depending on what features you do or don't need.

Edit: Worth mentioning even cheaper ones serve the same quality and warranty. I had one break after two years of use, they replaced it no questions asked. That was a Lavatools - MSRP of half of the thermapen.

 

[Dumber than lumber]

I got my wife one of those.
She was always concerned about whether she had cooked meat long enough.
It has been a wonderful device. You could buy a really cheap one for less.
For us the higher cost is justified since ThermoWorks has high quality stuff.

 

[Buy2Much]

Thank you!

Have any recommendations for a kitchen scale?

 

[dscheidt]

I love my instant-read thermometers - but there is no reason to spend that much on one of these anymore. The markup is horrendous compared to the competition. You can get dozens of equivalent fast read thermo from Amazon for $20. Some for even less depending on what features you do or don't need.

Edit: Worth mentioning even cheaper ones serve the same quality and warranty. I had one break after two years of use, they replaced it no questions asked. That was a Lavatools - MSRP of half of the thermapen.

Most of the cheap fast reading thermometers are much much slower than the thermopen. I haven't used them all, but I've used lots, and they all were at least several seconds slower at reaching a real temperature. That doesn't matter for a lot of things, but for stuff it does, it matters a whole lot.

 

[pizza]

Thank you!

Have any recommendations for a kitchen scale?

idk, totally depends on your needs.

for me...

i suggest having two scales. one for measuring smaller masses, and one for measuring larger ones.

here's what i have and can recommend:

this battery-powered 500x0.01g one goes in the drawer:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07KVLBK72/?tag=atomicindus08-20
there's a million differently-badged variants of this design from different sellers, and it's all the same **** afaik. just browse amazon for "500g scale" and pick a cheap one that looks like this. if you pay more than about 10 bucks, you're overpaying.

ime, these do suffer from a bit of upwards measurement drift, so don't turn it on until you're ready to take your measurement. if it's been on longer than a minute, power cycle it. if it's a critical measurement, always take it right after powering it on.

this mains-powered 4000x0.5g stays plugged in on the countertop:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004C3CAB8/?tag=atomicindus08-20
the AC adapter is an important feature for me. **** alkaline batteries.
not expensive for what it is, either. i bought it 6 years ago just as a beater scale for baking or whatever. i set cookware right on it and dump in ingredients. i also use it for weighing packages that i mail. i got it because it was cheap (but had great reviews) thinking i'd replace it after abusing it, but it's lasted all this time. i guess it's robust.

and then i have some much fancier analytical balances, but those aren't in the kitchen.

 

[jocww]

i almost bought the smoke last night for 30 percent off. Im hoping they have a bigger scale on actual black friday

 

[Tduby]

I love my instant-read thermometers - but there is no reason to spend that much on one of these anymore. The markup is horrendous compared to the competition. You can get dozens of equivalent fast read thermo from Amazon for $20. Some for even less depending on what features you do or don't need.

Edit: Worth mentioning even cheaper ones serve the same quality and warranty. I had one break after two years of use, they replaced it no questions asked. That was a Lavatools - MSRP of half of the thermapen.

Agreed many quality products out there with out the price and for temperature controllers check out ink bird

 

[Tduby]

idk, totally depends on your needs.

for me...

i suggest having two scales. one for measuring smaller masses, and one for measuring larger ones.

here's what i have and can recommend:

this battery-powered 500x0.01g one goes in the drawer:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07KVLBK72/?tag=atomicindus08-20
there's a million differently-badged variants of this design from different sellers, and it's all the same **** afaik. just browse amazon for "500g scale" and pick a cheap one that looks like this. if you pay more than about 10 bucks, you're overpaying.

ime, these do suffer from a bit of upwards measurement drift, so don't turn it on until you're ready to take your measurement. if it's been on longer than a minute, power cycle it. if it's a critical measurement, always take it right after powering it on.

this mains-powered 4000x0.5g stays plugged in on the countertop:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004C3CAB8/?tag=atomicindus08-20
the AC adapter is an important feature for me. **** alkaline batteries.
not expensive for what it is, either. i bought it 6 years ago just as a beater scale for baking or whatever. i set cookware right on it and dump in ingredients. i also use it for weighing packages that i mail. i got it because it was cheap (but had great reviews) thinking i'd replace it after abusing it, but it's lasted all this time. i guess it's robust.

and then i have some much fancier analytical balances, but those aren't in the kitchen.

If you are looking for a good robust small weight scale hard to beat this model used all over the world to measure and sell high value substances around the world. Goes down to .01 gram and is pretty accurate without being a lab model
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06Y61YW7S/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[kngelv]

I love my instant-read thermometers - but there is no reason to spend that much on one of these anymore. The markup is horrendous compared to the competition. You can get dozens of equivalent fast read thermo from Amazon for $20. Some for even less depending on what features you do or don't need.

Edit: Worth mentioning even cheaper ones serve the same quality and warranty. I had one break after two years of use, they replaced it no questions asked. That was a Lavatools - MSRP of half of the thermapen.

The Chinese ones are not instant read. They are fast but not as fast as a Thermapem. They use thermistors while Thermapen uses an actual thermocouple. I’d pay a few extra bucks for something made in England with higher quality than the slave labor **** from China.

James

 

[pizza]

If you are looking for a good robust small weight scale hard to beat this model used all over the world to measure and sell high value substances around the world. Goes down to .01 gram and is pretty accurate without being a lab model
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06Y61YW7S/?tag=atomicindus08-20

that's an older design, been around since i was a kid. was distributed by myweigh among others like 15+ years ago. nothing wrong with that, just commenting. although i've had a bunch of those break. part of that could be i wasn't as careful with things back then, idk.

however, the one you linked has only 100g capacity. you can do better than 100x0.01g for 10 bucks.

 

[Buy2Much]

Thanks @pizza and @Tduby for the scale suggestions!

There's so many out there it's hard to know what's good.

 

[esvee]

The Chinese ones are not instant read. They are fast but not as fast as a Thermapem. They use thermistors while Thermapen uses an actual thermocouple. I’d pay a few extra bucks for something made in England with higher quality than the slave labor **** from China.

James

Thermoworks are made in China, and whether they use a thermistor or a thermocouple is not a sign of quality, just a difference in design. In this particular environment, it doesn't make a difference in speed or accuracy. The particulars of manufacturing of each component could result in one being more accurate than the other.

Thermoworks quote a 2-3 second read time, and so does the majority of the cheaper competition. In practice, I see the same or faster read time with the competition.

If you want to get real nerdy about available options, alternatives and speeds, Wirecutter has been doing regular write ups on these: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/the-best-instant-read-thermometer/

 

[dscheidt]

Thermoworks are made in China

My thermopen was made in the part of China called "England".

 

[dscheidt]

Thermoworks quote a 2-3 second read time, and so does the majority of the cheaper competition. In practice, I see the same or faster read time with the competition.

Like I said, I've used lots of them. I don't care what the Chinese ones claim. Actual performance, the thermopen is much, much faster. It's also more repeatable. the chinese ones are probably good enough for many people, but don't pretend they're great, because they're not.

 

[kngelv]

Thermoworks are made in China, and whether they use a thermistor or a thermocouple is not a sign of quality, just a difference in design. In this particular environment, it doesn't make a difference in speed or accuracy. The particulars of manufacturing of each component could result in one being more accurate than the other.

Thermoworks quote a 2-3 second read time, and so does the majority of the cheaper competition. In practice, I see the same or faster read time with the competition.

If you want to get real nerdy about available options, alternatives and speeds, Wirecutter has been doing regular write ups on these: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/the-best-instant-read-thermometer/

Mine is made in England. Their $98.00 MK4 does not say where it is made but their $79.00 Classic is Made in England. I think Thermoworks is an affiliate. Here is a link to the originator of the thing They are called Thermapen in the U.K.

https://thermapen.co.uk/thermapen-t...MIq8DU6_SS7QIVBWKGCh3l9wUqEAAYASAAEgIRBvD_BwE

James

 

[pizza]

Thermoworks are made in China, and whether they use a thermistor or a thermocouple is not a sign of quality, just a difference in design.
..
If you want to get real nerdy about available options, alternatives and speeds, Wirecutter has been doing regular write ups on these: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/the-best-instant-read-thermometer/

what? made in england.
also, all but one of the products recommended in that writeup you linked are from thermoworks, lol.

fwiw, that 2-3s read time depends a lot on the environment. depends on the ∆T between instrument and sample, the thermal conductivity of the sample, its specific heat, etc.

if you're using it in a liquid, it helps to stir the probe around in there so it can exchange heat faster.

https://blog.thermoworks.com/thermometer/thermoworks-eti-ltd/

ThermoWorks, headquartered near Salt Lake City, Utah, and ETI (Electronic Temperature Instruments, Ltd.) of Worthing, England are two independent instrument companies that have maintained a strong working relationship since 1992. Both are family-owned businesses and the respective founding families are close friends.

The Thermapen® was originally invented by ETI. Each subsequent version of the product has been engineered and manufactured at their factory in Worthing. The Thermapen is now in its fourth major generation (Mk4). Since the second generation, ThermoWorks has contributed significantly to the design parameters of each model. Most of the other thermocouple instrumentation sold under the ThermoWorks brand is produced in the ETI factory. Many designs are conceived at ETI and some are conceived by ThermoWorks then engineered and produced at ETI. All thermocouple probes are produced at the ETI factory.

All products from this cooperation are available exclusively under the ThermoWorks brand throughout North America. In Europe, Asia, the Middle East, Africa and South America the products are available under the ETI, Ltd. brand. Although there is significant commercial collaboration between the two companies, all marketing, sales, tech support, warranty fulfillment and commercial matters are managed independently by the respective brands in their respective territories.

 

[esvee]

what? made in england.
also, all but one of the products recommended in that writeup you linked are from thermoworks, lol.

fwiw, that 2-3s read time depends a lot on the environment. depends on the ∆T between instrument and sample, the thermal conductivity of the sample, its specific heat, etc.

if you're using it in a liquid, it helps to stir the probe around in there so it can exchange heat faster.

https://blog.thermoworks.com/thermometer/thermoworks-eti-ltd/

"Thermapen was" manufactured in England. That is long past.



Made in China, right on the label:
https://www.thermoworks.com/pdf/rt301wa_packaging_f.pdf

My point here is not that ThermoWorks is bad, or wrong, or even a poor choice! But they've become the kleenex of this kind of thing, and there are lots of other options out there. Some better, some worse. Moreover, something being made in Asia doesn't inherently make it bad.

 

[pizza]

"Thermapen was" manufactured in England. That is long past.
...
Made in China, right on the label:
https://www.thermoworks.com/pdf/rt301wa_packaging_f.pdf

My point here is not that ThermoWorks is bad, or wrong, or even a poor choice! But they've become the kleenex of this kind of thing, and there are lots of other options out there. Some better, some worse. Moreover, something being made in Asia doesn't inherently make it bad.

i see what you're saying, but that's not a thermapen. the one i just got in the mail says made in the UK on the packaging. it's the newest version (mk4). also, the site says made in england:

thermapen is partially designed by thermoworks, but it's manufactured by ETI in england (see my prev post). ETI is based there.

only the products made by ETI will be made in england as thermoworks is an american company. thermoworks sells more than just ETI products. i'm curious if any thermoworks exclusives are or ever were made in USA though. anyone know?

 

[pizza]

deal ends today, but i bet there will be other deals

 

[macgee]

Not to rain on the parade, its always good to support old world manufacturing, they really do a much better job with supplying us with high quality top products but for the ones who don't need to run around a pro kitchen checking food temps and on a budget, check these out. I have several different portable pocket temp readers but I found this one giving me (on avg) the best temps. I too have paid a lot of money for good ones that end up staying in the drawer or trashed.

https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/fantast-meat-thermometer-timer-digital-black-80100406/

It's stupid cheap, its got a magnetic base so I leave it by oven door frame but wire is also long enough to use/ prod items on the counter top next to it. Not the same as above but I can leave it inside a turkey or inside a stuffed-tied roast without having to open the door to check it and its pretty quick when need to do a quick check although were not talking mili-sec's.

Again, it's not like the one in OP but for you cheapie's out there complaining about the price, you may want to check this one out.

PS> Also works great in my shop for my Evaporust baths and Ultrasonic cleaner and no I don't use the same one to cook with.

 

[pizza]

i haven't tried that specific one, but it looks nice. decent looking remote thermistor unit.

and even for kitchen use, something like a thermapen isn't all you need. it's not a leave-in tool.

 

[rlitman]

The Chinese ones are not instant read. They are fast but not as fast as a Thermapem. They use thermistors while Thermapen uses an actual thermocouple. I’d pay a few extra bucks for something made in England with higher quality than the slave labor **** from China.

James

I'm not buying this argument. Thermocouples are less accurate than thermistors and are also slower, because they have a higher thermal mass.

I use thermocouples with my PID controller because I'm cheaper. That's all.

Anyway, look at the probe tip. The thinner, the better. Thermapen has a nice and thin tip. Most of the Chinese ones are thicker, but equally thin ones do exist. That's what you need to look for.

 

[pizza]

Anyway, look at the probe tip. The thinner, the better.

i agree 100%

The Chinese ones are not instant read. They are fast but not as fast as a Thermapem. They use thermistors while Thermapen uses an actual thermocouple. I’d pay a few extra bucks for something made in England with higher quality than the slave labor **** from China.

James

I'm not buying this argument. Thermocouples are less accurate than thermistors and are also slower, because they have a higher thermal mass.

you're right, the thermapen isn't good just because it uses a thermocouple. that is to say a thermocouple device isn't inherently "higher quality" than a thermistor. however, high performance metrology is all about implementation and pushing the engineering to the limit. ETI has done that in this product.

thermocouples are not necessarily less accurate, and they're certainly not slower. on the contrary. thermocouples have material benefits working in their favor.

most importantly, they can actually be made smaller than thermistors. they're pretty much limited by the wire diameter. if you use super fine wire and make a tiny junction weld, you can make a thermocouple with small mass. small volume too -- you can cram it way up into the probe tip. i suspect ETI has pushed that to the practical limit in this design.

also, thermocouples don't have to be encapsulated. you've seen how bare thermocouples can be clamped down onto things directly with screws and still work, right? glass or resin on the thermistor adds mass and thermal resistance.

you can also make them quite accurate with high end instrumentation (signal conditioning, compensation, software calibration, direct bonding to the board, etc). although high end thermistor instrumentation wins in accuracy. anyway, i just had a look on amazon, and the accuracy of thermapen looks better than the stated specs of a couple other random instant-reads i saw.

I use thermocouples with my PID controller because I'm cheaper. That's all.

for everyday projects, i'd use thermistor too

 

[pizza]

also, looks like they extended the sale.

good news if you still want something i guess, but i am not down with their mind games. such marketing is in poor taste imo.

 

[rlitman]

...
you're right, the thermapen isn't good just because it uses a thermocouple. that is to say a thermocouple device isn't inherently "higher quality" than a thermistor. however, high performance metrology is all about implementation and pushing the engineering to the limit. ETI has done that in this product.

thermocouples are not necessarily less accurate, and they're certainly not slower. on the contrary. thermocouples have material benefits working in their favor.

most importantly, they can actually be made smaller than thermistors. they're pretty much limited by the wire diameter. if you use super fine wire and make a tiny junction weld, you can make a thermocouple with small mass. small volume too -- you can cram it way up into the probe tip. i suspect ETI has pushed that to the practical limit in this design.

also, thermocouples don't have to be encapsulated. you've seen how bare thermocouples can be clamped down onto things directly with screws and still work, right? glass or resin on the thermistor adds mass and thermal resistance.

you can also make them quite accurate with high end instrumentation (signal conditioning, compensation, software calibration, direct bonding to the board, etc). although high end thermistor instrumentation wins in accuracy. anyway, i just had a look on amazon, and the accuracy of thermapen looks better than the stated specs of a couple other random instant-reads i saw...

Sort of. The limit on a thermocouple is the weld process. You can't just resistance weld them, because once the fine wires melt (and one side will melt before the other), they blob up under their own surface tension. Laser and plasma each have limits. You could probably do something with an electron beam in a vacuum chamber if you've got a military budget, but thermistors are easier to make significantly smaller (down to microscopic sizes).

Thermistors can be made using semiconductor processes that reach down to sizes hard to imagine.

The next issue with the size of the device is the thermal mass. The metals in the thermocouple act as a heat sink, causing it to not only be slower to respond, but requiring more than just the welded area to reach equilibrium with the surroundings.

Other disadvantages of thermocouples are discussed here in depth:
https://www.ametherm.com/blog/thermistors/temperature-sensors-thermistors-vs-thermocouples

One big disadvantage I'll quote from that link is:
An epoxy-coated NTC thermistor can change by 0.2 °C per year while a hermetically sealed one changes by only 0.02 °C per year. While thermocouples have much lower stability of approximately 1-2 °C per year.

So, the stated accuracy Thermopen quotes may be true the day the Thermopen ships out the door, but within a year, the Chinese thermistor knockoffs with the lower stated accuracy will actually be closer to the mark.

Here, I'll note that most chain restaurants with well engineered HAACP plans require thermometer recalibration be done on a regularly scheduled (normally WEEKLY) basis. Unless you're willing to recalibrate regularly, that +/- 0.4C claim is just BS.

 

[pizza]

i wish we could interrogate a product engineer at ETI and ask why they went with a TC in this design. it can't be just to save a buck, right? besides, i think good TC instrumentation is more expensive than with thermistor (though the TC itself is cheap).

 

[pizza]

Sort of. The limit on a thermocouple is the weld process. You can't just resistance weld them, because once the fine wires melt (and one side will melt before the other), they blob up under their own surface tension. Laser and plasma each have limits. You could probably do something with an electron beam in a vacuum chamber if you've got a military budget, but thermistors are easier to make significantly smaller (down to microscopic sizes).

Thermistors can be made using semiconductor processes that reach down to sizes hard to imagine.

The next issue with the size of the device is the thermal mass. The metals in the thermocouple act as a heat sink, causing it to not only be slower to respond, but requiring more than just the welded area to reach equilibrium with the surroundings.

Other disadvantages of thermocouples are discussed here in depth:
https://www.ametherm.com/blog/thermistors/temperature-sensors-thermistors-vs-thermocouples

the way i see it, you want low thermal resistance between the sample and the sensor. bare metal trumps encapsulated metal oxide (or carbon). you do want it to pull heat quickly from the sample.

as for size, yes, there are advanced processes that yield pretty damn small thermocouples. idk exactly how small, but i found this 2009 announcement:

https://www.controlengeurope.com/article/26664/World-s-Smallest-Thermocouple.aspx

OMC says the thermocouple has an “incredible response time of less than 1ms” and is
suitable for measuring the temperature of any small object or material. An outside diameter of 0.08mm means that the thermocouple element wires need to be extremely fine. In order to form the hot junctions, OMC says it has developed “highly advanced manufacturing technology” at its plants in Japan.

not sure what the state of the art is in 2020, but even 0.08mm is already beyond what's useful for a thermapen-like device lol. this is due to the overall probe size. it needs to be rugged enough to be stabbed into things of course.

the smallest thermistor i'm finding (from 2020):

https://passive-components.eu/murat...ermistor-for-smartphones-and-small-wearables/

Murata Manufacturing Co., Ltd. has succeeded in commercializing the world’s smallest*1 PTC thermistor*2 (commonly known as a resettable fuse*3) in the 0201 inch size (0.6×0.3×0.3mm) for mobile devices

but that's PTC. i can't find an NTC that small. also, i understand that the limitation there could be due to the 0201 SMD package size, but nonetheless, i couldn't find something smaller.

so idk, still seems to me that you can get smaller thermocouples than ntc thermistors, but i guess wouldn't bet my life on it lol.

https://www.ametherm.com/blog/thermistors/temperature-sensors-thermistors-vs-thermocouples
One big disadvantage I'll quote from that link is:
An epoxy-coated NTC thermistor can change by 0.2 °C per year while a hermetically sealed one changes by only 0.02 °C per year. While thermocouples have much lower stability of approximately 1-2 °C per year.

So, the stated accuracy Thermopen quotes may be true the day the Thermopen ships out the door, but within a year, the Chinese thermistor knockoffs with the lower stated accuracy will actually be closer to the mark.

Here, I'll note that most chain restaurants with well engineered HAACP plans require thermometer recalibration be done on a regularly scheduled (normally WEEKLY) basis. Unless you're willing to recalibrate regularly, that +/- 0.4C claim is just BS.

very true, they need to be routinely calibrated if you care about accuracy.

but for fun, i tested a thermapen mk4 i got at least a few years ago (and use all the time) against a brand new one i just got in the mail.

i prepared an ice bath, and both of them hover between 32.0-32.3°F. pleasantly surprised to see that they both agree with each other and that they're also within spec (±0.7°F [±0.4°C] from -58 to 392°F).

 

[pizza]

idk how accurate this figure is from the instruction manual, but seems like they could be using a pretty damn small TC if they have it that far in the tip:

 

[rlitman]

the way i see it, you want low thermal resistance between the sample and the sensor. bare metal trumps encapsulated metal oxide (or carbon). you do want it to pull heat quickly from the sample...

I'm not sure how they'd do that, when the thermocouple has to be electrically isolated from the stainless.

 

[pizza]

I'm not sure how they'd do that, when the thermocouple has to be electrically isolated from the stainless.

but it (the junction) doesn't have to be electrically insulated from the stainless probe sheath

you can even use bare/exposed junctions assuming they're beefy (and therefore rugged) enough for the application

that can be stuck on whatever and used directly

 

[rlitman]

but it (the junction) doesn't have to be electrically insulated from the stainless probe sheath

you can even use bare/exposed junctions assuming they're beefy (and therefore rugged) enough for the application

that can be stuck on whatever and used directly

The junction DOES have to electrically isolated from the stainless probe. Otherwise that adds another metal to the junction, which will throw the numbers off.

Yes, it can be used bare, but that's not food safe. I have several K thermocouples that are bare.

 

[pizza]

The junction DOES have to electrically isolated from the stainless probe. Otherwise that adds another metal to the junction, which will throw the numbers off.

Yes, it can be used bare, but that's not food safe. I have several K thermocouples that are bare.

it does not.

you're right that you're creating more junctions, but you're measuring the voltage signal across the junction of interest (the K junction) via the thermocouple leads. you'd get a different (undesired) signal if you measured between the stainless sheath and one of the thermocouple's leads (say the chromel lead).

(you can clamp a bare junction directly to a piece of metal with a screw or whatever. works fine.)

they actually sell tiny, sheathed thermocouples constructed this way:

https://www.peaksensors.co.uk/what-is/grounded-junction/

Grounded junctions are a type of thermocouple measuring junction. A grounded junction is formed by the two thermocouple conductors being welded together with the external sheath. This forms a completely sealed junction. As the thermocouple conductors are touching the outer sheath the thermocouple is not electrically insulated and may be affected by stray EMF’s. The junction is more robust than an exposed junction and is somewhere in between exposed and insulated junctions in response time.

idk for sure if the thermapen is like this, but i'm guessing it is.