Tips on welding

[jayc]

Hello,

Bought myself a welder a while ago (Lincoln 180A 220V Mig). I'm running an Argon/Co2 mix. I have a spool of 0.025 and 0.030 wire and associated tips.

I'm pretty much starting cold, no real experience. What would be a good practice to get started? Obviously welding scrap together, but what type of material? Size? what kind of joints? I'd like to start out with the easiest material so I can get used to what I'm doing.

Any guidance would be appreciated! There appears to be a lot of experienced self taught people here, I'm sure there are lots good nuggets of information.

I'd love to take a class, but the only thing I found offered here is a basic course for $700. That wouldn't be bad, but the course consists of a lot of welding techniques I'm not interested in. To take anything else is crazy expensive, mostly courses for certification ... there is an oil boom in my region.

An example of what I don't get:

I can get a pretty decent weld on mild steel plate, at the end of the bead I get a crator pretty much everytime. How do I stop this from happening? Is this technique or machine setup?

Thanks, I imagine this could end up being a helpful thread for a lot of beginners.

Jay

 

[russlaferrera]

When getting to the end I straighten the rod to a 90* then move it closer to the metal and fill the gap. Is this right? Thats how I do it.

 

[Franz©]

It's called craterfilling.
It's done differently onm MIG than it is with stick.

There are far more important things to learn first, like penetration.

With that machine play with some 1/8 steel and the .030 in a flat position till you can run full penetration stringers covering a 4" x 4" surface. Then move on to learning to fill gaps in flat position. When you have mastered stringers gaps will be easy.

Then, you move up to vertical down.

www.toolboxtalk.org

 

[brianpgriset]

Like you said, lots and lots of practice is best. Stick with basic 1018 or 1020 mild steels right now. Also be sure to experiment with different machine settings, as well as different orientations of you, the workpiece, the gun, "push" vs. "pull", etc. What is important is that you are comfortable and that you can see the weld pool very well. Developing a steady hand is key and knowing how fast to travel is key. Check angles of the gun with respect to the weld joint. There may be some text books you would want to invest in. I purchased Lincoln's "Procedure Handbook of Arc Welding". It is very useful and gives good technical aspects of arc welding. I believe Lincoln still sells it on their website for $25.

Also, here are another good forums, I actually was directed here by someone on this board --> http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtalk/

One last thing, some people will recommend using a "whip" or "C" motion for fillets, **** joints, etc, but I think personally its bad practice to do this when first learning to weld. I did this when I first starting welding and it had a tendency to produce very pretty but also very "cold" welds which had low penetration and small HAZ area. Stick to basics and run straight stringer beads. This will also improve your steadiness.

 

[toolfreak]

As far as practicing, I would start by running beads on a flat piece of plate, overlapping each bead by 1/3. After you are happy with the way they look then start welding two pieces of flat stock together. I prefer to bevel the edges to ensure full penetration. After that I would practice your horizontal welds by welding beads just like you did on the flat and then welding two pieces together. Next do your vertical, followed by overhead. I haven't ever welded overhead with a mig so I can't offer any advice on that.

When I weld two pieces together vertically I prefer to weld uphill, that way you get a stronger weld. That usually requires you to turn the heat and wire speed down to prevent drooping and allows you to watch and control your puddle better. Hope that helps anyone that is learning to weld.

 

[mike944]

Where are you located? Maybe someone knows of a different class in your area. I would highly reccomend it, if you can find one for a decent price. I just finished taking one myself. The one i took covered many different processes, but it was a very open-form class, you could pretty much concentrate on whatever you wanted to do.

 

[KCHOTBOAT]

Check with your local community college or area vo-tech school. I was going take a class this semester but they did not offer a evening class for the spring.

 

[george4]

Check with your local community college or area vo-tech school. I was going take a class this semester but they did not offer a evening class for the spring.

I am starting such a class this evening at the local JC.

 

[jayc]

It's called craterfilling.
It's done differently onm MIG than it is with stick.

There are far more important things to learn first, like penetration.

With that machine play with some 1/8 steel and the .030 in a flat position till you can run full penetration stringers covering a 4" x 4" surface. Then move on to learning to fill gaps in flat position. When you have mastered stringers gaps will be easy.

Then, you move up to vertical down.

www.toolboxtalk.org

Is there a non-destructive way to gauge penetration? If welding on plate, what should the back side look like?

Thanks for the tips guys, keep 'em coming!

 

[Franz©]

Nondestructive testing is VERY expensive.

At the stage you are in the game, SLEDGOMATIC or hacksaw testing will give the best indicators.

The MIG process is inherintly dangerous in that the arc density allows an inexperienced operator to lay down what appears to be a weld, while the deposit is only a layer of metal barely sticking to the top layer of the weldment. Stuck together AIN'T welded and it will get somebody killed.

Beginners get caught up in a lot of traps, especially when they are attempting to learn by themself. Welding, pretty much regardless of process involves sight, and hearing. I can lay MIG down without looking because I know the sound when it's running right. You MUST gain full ability to lay down stringers before you move on to the next step, or you will have to go back and figure out how to loose the bad habits you developed.

Get yourself some cupons about an inch square, and use them for tests. That size won't burn your arm out hacksawing them apart. Cut across the weld, polish the end up on some sandpaper, and look at it. The actual weld will be visible, worst case rub a little vinegar onto the edge to display it better. Your penetration will be evident.

 

[jayc]

All I've been doing so far is running welds a couple pieces of plate I have, and some old exhaust tubing. The thicker plate was a little easier to see the puddle and try to get a feel for what I was doing. The exhaust tubing was a little tougher since I'd blow through it in short order if I wasn't moving the correct speed or if the machine was setup a little bit off.

Can an ugly mig weld still be solid? Most of my welds to date have been kind of fugly. More practice.

 

[Franz©]

Like all beginners, youre getting entertained by the light show.

You need to learn to see the deposit, and ignore all the rest.

As far as the settings, way too much time gets spent by inexperienced people worrying about the settings. Find a setting that produces deposit you can control, and experiment with different length of stickout from the gun.

Learning to MIG properly takes some time. You'll be amazed at just what different stickouts accomplish in deposit control.

 

[edl]

Franz - when you say "stickout" do you mean distance of the tip of the welder from the metal? - and when you talk about "cupons" what are they and what do you do with them?

 

[dragginbalz]

Franz - when you say "stickout" do you mean distance of the tip of the welder from the metal? - and when you talk about "cupons" what are they and what do you do with them?

I am not Franz, but yes stick-out is the distance between the end of the contact tip and the work surface (wire length)

coupons are a term used to describe small pieces of metal usually used to practice or run samples on (ie 3"x3" 1/8" steel coupons)

You can purchase steel "strap" from many places (even Menards/Home Depot) and just cut it to size. As mentioned, purchase a few 4' pieces of 2" x 1/8" steel strap, cut it up into 3" long "coupons" and go to town. The **** metal you buy from Menards will be Hot Roll, so take some time and clean off the mill scale (coating) before you weld it.

Have fun and good luck

t

 

[russlaferrera]

jayc, One place to get scrap metal is machine shops or metal fabricator places in your area. Most will give you some scrap.

 

[edl]

DB thanks - what is the best way to remove scale? - just wipe it down with a solvent (thinner?)

 

[rickairmedic]

First Listen to the Franz he probably has more welding experiance than the rest of the board combined LOL ok to remove mill scale either a wire brush or flap disc on a grinder will remove the scale .

Rick

 

[Franz©]

Guys, not to be a ***** or anything, but I'm probably typing this for the 100th time.

Most if not all of it is already on www.toolboxtalk.org MIG absolutely NEEDS clean, especially for a beginner or on light gague metal. Clean doesn't mean operating room clean, it just means hit it with a grinder till you see clean metal.

Cupon is any piece of metal used for a weld test. Generally about 3" square and whatever thickness the test calls for so it can be bend tested when the weld is complete. For learning purposes, there is all kinds of free metal laying around this world, and generally getting some just takes looking and somethimes asking.

Hot rolled -v- cold rolled really don't mean squatt to a guy learning to weld, as long as you stay away from special purpose steels common to machine tools like lathe bits.

I don't mean to discourage anyone, but welding, and especially MIG process takes some time and considerable practice to learn to do right. There are a lot of machines sitting on shelves people bought cause they believed the ****** in the orange apron and the manufacturer who were only interested in pushing units out the door. Them machines are collecting dust because those people either didn't listen, or were too smart to listen. I been melting metal together over 50 years, and I still learn new things about doing it.

 

[edl]

Franz - i don't think you are being a ***** at all - this info (for a welding virgin like me) is extremely helpful - i have bookmarked your other site and will hopefully save you some additional retyping down the road! - thanks again - ed

 

[Vicegrip]

Miller has aN OK tutorial section on their site.

Practice and read together. Read a method and then do it some than go back and read it again. Many times it will make more sense after you lay hands on the method some.

Get Ok to good welding 1/8 stock in all positions this seems to be the thickness that is easiest for most folks to learn on. Then work on thicker, thinner and thick to thin welding.

Random thoughts on Mig welding tips. Make lots of welds on lots of scrap but make each one as if you are being tested or watched. This builds good habits. Work clean and plan the welding movements you will make. Take the time to improve you skills before diving into critical or observed work. Always try and steady the gun hand or arm with the other hand or something to keep your movements as smooth and accurate as you can. A paddle switch angle grinder with a knotted rope wire wheel is handy for cleaning rust paint and scale before and any splatter or smudge after.
good luck. Once you "get it" you get to keep it.

 

[edl]

VG - first of all...sweet 911 - second, thanks for this - do have a grinder (3 in fact) and some wire wheels...so that is good...appreciate the tips (sorry for the pun!)...i'll start scrounging for scraps and dive in ... thanks to all! - ed

ps JayC...sorry if i hijacked your thread a bit...hopefully this is helpful to you as well...