Tool advice for newbie techs....?

[mudflap]

It's that time of year again...Graduation is just around the corner, and the County will be hiring a new batch of Diesel techs from the local community college. I always look foreward to it...New faces, and these kids can be alot of fun to work with...The school includes a very basic set of Bluepoint tools, and a Bluepoint 3 drawer cart as part of their tuition, so they start out with some decent basics. None of us old timers mind loaning the kids our tools, for the most part they are very respectfull, and return them in good shape. Plus we remember what is was like starting out.. But eventually they will seek advice on what brand of tools to buy. I hate to see them run up a bunch of debt on the tool trucks. Its getting harder as the years go by to give them a straight answer. All the truck brands are becoming overpriced, ching-chong tool pushers, getting real fussy about warranties, and in my opinion probably wont be around 10-15 yrs from now, leaving them with no warranty..and greatly reduced resale value. Then you have Gearwrench, carlyle,etc, which seem to be a good value for pro grade tools. Keep in mind..made in USA is not nearly as important to the whippersnappers as it is to us old timers.

I guess my question is to all you guys that have made your living as a mechanic for 15-20 yrs...What tool line would you recommend to the kids just starting out...and why..

 

[skife]

as a new tech just starting out, my advice is to stick with one brand, i previously had an account on the matco and snapon trucks, $50 to one and $75 to the other each week is rough.

second, if there is a good deal and you'll need it in the future, buy it. Tools cost $**/week, doesn't matter if you owe $50 or $5000

 

[Fedwrench]

Do you guys have that high of a turnover rate or is this like an internship program?

I would recommend buying used on ebay. I would recommend Proto and SK in addition to the truck brands.

If Napa is available, there's nothing wrong with Carlyle tools especially if they can be had at a discount.

I think my biggest advice would be that less is often more. Buy what you need as you need it but, don't try to fill up a large box your first year just to fill it up.

In fact I would probably get a six or seven drawer cart from cornwell or sunex and combine that with a wallocker for lesser used items, than spend big bucks on a rollcab.

 

[trpearcy]

I would say tell them to buy the good stuff for the things that break regularly (torx bits, screwdrivers, air hammer bits, etc) and then buy things like gearwrench for the other tools. I will add here however that some of us younger folks do think that made in USA is important.
Also give them advice that you'd like to receive: one of the older guys at work told me to get an IR impact gun instead of spending hundreds and hundreds on a SO gun. I took that advice to heart and bought an IR impact and it keeps up with the SO and hasn't given me any problems.

 

[Piles]

Me personally, i would rather have tools from an easily accessible B&M store than something like SK and Proto. They are harder for me to get warranty on as there is only a couple places that do within a 100 km, and they are only open when I am working. I would prefer craftsman at work to be honest. For my home box though they are great. Tool truck is first choice for at work though. Obviously YMMV on that though.

 

[mypov]

Not everyone can do this. But when I was first buying tools I had a second job. The money from that second job went entirely towards tools, and a box. I spent quite a while saving up for my KRL1033, and have yet to fill it. Now I don't have a second job, and it's a lot harder to buy tools sensibly (so as not to go in debt). That is the biggest thing I recommend - do not go into debt - or carry large payments for the truck driver.
Definitely do buy the best you can afford, especially ratchets, extensions, wrenches, etc. Buy used as well - some people don't like the idea of buying used, but often when you do you will usually always get the money put out for them (if you buy for right price, and take good care of the tool).

 

[mudflap]

Do you guys have that high of a turnover rate or is this like an internship program?

I would recommend buying used on ebay. I would recommend Proto and SK in addition to the truck brands.

If Napa is available, there's nothing wrong with Carlyle tools especially if they can be had at a discount.

I think my biggest advice would be that less is often more. Buy what you need as you need it but, don't try to fill up a large box your first year just to fill it up.

In fact I would probably get a six or seven drawer cart from cornwell or sunex and combine that with a wallocker for lesser used items, than spend big bucks on a rollcab.

We have almost zero turnover rate...The County has 6 garages, if it moves, and is owned by the County, we get to service / repair it...Dump trucks, snow plows, salt spreaders, police cars, heavy equipment, emergency apparatus, trash pumps, street sweepers, etc.....It's a ton of fun..And the County aint bad to work for either..They pay for all continuing education ( hydraulic cert and CDL required by the end of your 3rd year ) Then 30yrs, and your out with a nice pension...You couldn't get anybody to quit if you had too....Some really good advice so far...thanks..keep it coming..

 

[mopar01]

I wored for indot for a shot time and they supplied alot like bigger wrenches, sockets, tap and dies ect. Does your sjop do that same? For that job you could have went to sears and got enough tools to do your job and more. Id tell them to hit napa as already stated or craftsman Industrial line.

 

[mudflap]

We really like the Carlyle tools, and our NAPA guy takes real good care of us. Hats, coffee mugs, frizbees, ink pens, etc. He is at the shop every day bringing parts, if we want to buy or warranty anything, he just brings it on his next trip. and he leaves these catalogs all over the shop for us to drool over the tool ****...lol. My only concern is that over my 20 something yrs , i have seen NAPA go from Easco,KD, Evercraft, and many others, to now Carlyle...Who knows whats next...?

 

[Brownsfan]

SK all the way. Plus there is a place in your city that sells and warranties SK. If I was starting over again most of my hardline stuff would be SK. But I would have some Snap On dual 80's mixed in. This is coming from a guy who has more snap on than he needs or could even use. I really like the Carlyle stuff now that I have seen it in person. If they could get more Napas to sell it. All the Napa stores near me don't stock it. If they could maybe have some tools with the parts guys that deliver they could have something.

 

[mudflap]

I wored for indot for a shot time and they supplied alot like bigger wrenches, sockets, tap and dies ect. Does your sjop do that same? For that job you could have went to sears and got enough tools to do your job and more. Id tell them to hit napa as already stated or craftsman Industrial line.

Yes, most "consumables" , specialty tools, or bigger stuff is supplied.

 

[RedneckWelder]

I'll probably be in their shoes in the not too distant future myself.

My advice is, as always, is to avoid debt as much as possible, and that goes for anything. Tool trucks in this case...being in debt to the Snap On man is kinda like being in debt to the company store in the old days.

Ebay, craigslist, garage sales, etc and the willingness to bargain hunt will save a lot of money, you just don't get the "easy financing" of the tool trucks.

There has been tomes written here on the non tool truck brands. SK, Proto, Wright, Carlyle (NAPA), Gear Wrench, the good items at Harbor Freight, Grey Pnuematic, etc. I'd get some catalogs from these makers to have on hands to show the newbies, show them that there is more than Snap On out there. Personally I'll likely be going SK many of my pro tools when it comes to that time.

 

[ez-duzit]

My advice for all newbies:

First, set aside 10% of all income--never to be spent--only invested.
Avoid debt--pay as you go.
Say what you mean. Do what you say.
Don't go crazy trying to load up on tools you're not even sure you'll need.
Do your own due diligence before buying--educate yourself.
See what the pro's are using and figure out why.
Watch for deals on new and barely used sets.
Buy quality. Avoid the cheapest imports--buy US-made Craftsman or better.

 

[Ruger_556]

My only concern is that over my 20 something yrs , i have seen NAPA go from Easco,KD, Evercraft, and many others, to now Carlyle...Who knows whats next...?

Carlyle is their 'pro grade' which was originally New Britain and then went to Napa Hand Tools. I would bet they'll keep Carlyle around for a while. Evercraft (The cheapo stuff) is here to stay also I think.

Even if they do change their tool line up again they'll still warranty the old stuff. I can exchange New Britain tools for Carlyle

 

[Gregg33]

Buy high-end brands like Gray or SO used. There isn't really any deflation if you resell them, especially if you take care of them. Don't buy junk. I can think of few if any instances that I bought high quality goods and regretted it, even if it hurt my wallet badly at the time.

 

[Darius6t9]

When I first started as a tech, I would buy depending on what I was getting. If it's a big ticket item (box, decent scanner or a set that was more than $200) I would more than likely get it from the truck just for the payments. You pay more, but being able to make payments on something I would need now or very soon helped a lot. If it is something small (small set of sockets, pliers, ratchet - non truck but decent or screw drivers) look around. Example, I seen some 10" Knipex Cobra pliers on the Mac truck. Wanted $75 for them. Saw the same pair at lowes for $35. Where do you think I got them? Looking more online if you can wait for the tool. Shop with your head, not your addiction.

 

[Tbirdtc]

Do not go into debt buying all the tool truck brands
U need good wrenches Sk to snap on
Cheap impact sockets work just fine
Ir impact gun cheap air tools for the rest
1 good 3/8 ratchet cheap doubles are ok for now
Gear wrench ratchet wrenches (on sale rite now at advance)
C man chrome sockets will do to start u may want snappys eventually
The c man ratcheting screw driver is great my snappy disappeared I replaced w cman
Snappy impact swivels eventually
The nice thing about snap on is it barley costs more to buy by the piece so start buying the one(s) u need
And don't start out buying a 10 k box to hold the tools u don't own
Snappy pry bars are not better than c man but cost 50x more
And don't do the matching green or pink tool thing buy what works and what u need
Prove to yourself and others you are gonna make it in the industry b4 going into debt w tools
And when u need one your snap on box will find you buy a 10 year old box . My snap on box is worth 500$ more than I paid for it now

 

[techenthusiast]

Sounds like the guys from that diesel tech school are set. I grad from diesel tech this semester too, but it's a little harder around here... I bought most of my tools and a cart through the student discount program using scholarship, grant, and low interest student loan money . Maybe a mistake but I figure I have to buy the tools anyway. And I want snap on. So this is my only chance to buy them for half off. The downside is there's Not too many jobs and the jobs that are available seem to be taken... And the openings want experienced seasoned techs. Oh well, all the more reason to worker harder and learn harder to make my tool investment pay off with a career. What state are you in?


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[Zeroek]

I ended up buying a HF red cart and filled it up with decent stuff you can buy from stores for now. Channel lock for pliers. Gearwrench for sockets, ratchets, extensions, and screw drivers. I keep my snap on bill at max $300 and usually it stays around $150 and lower. As for wrenches I'm using a set of Husky that I paid like $22 for that I'll eventually replace with something else. Also bought some of those kobalt cross wrenches on sale. Craftsman pro prybars that the shanks are identical to Matcos. I plan to buy a bunch of gray pneumatic stuff from Tooltopia for my impact sockets. As for bit sockets and e torx I got a big blue point set not long ago. Air tools I have a mix of junk from menards, home depot, and a Mac impact. I bought the Milwaukee cordless ratchet instead of buying air ratchets. And then some specialty tools from auto parts stores here and there. For people that are just starting out I'd recommend what I'm doing now and if you want replace it slowly later with better stuff and start taking tools home. I also bought a cheap Husky bottom box for $110 and had a cheap old top box to put on it. For doing brakes, alignments and maintenance on Hondas I'm set.

 

[mrborohachi]

Used on E-Bay for go-to high use items like truck brand Ratchets. You can't go wrong with Duralast or Gearwrench sockets or ratcheting wrenches.
IR, Astro, or CP for new air tools. Rebuild kits are easily accessible for "truck" air tools from their respective corporate websites if they want to go with truck branded air tools. There's just no reason to buy truck brand stuff at full retail unless it's something of a brand new design. (I just bought a brand new ratchet design SO TRLL72 "new design/length")

All the companies are keeping their word on Lifetime Guarantee Taiwan Coo tools. Stanley just requires a call with the part number and an explanation of how the tool failed and they mail you a new tool.

If there's ever a warranty issue with truck brand tools that need a "rebuild kit" that's not stocked on the truck it seems like your waiting 2weeks to a month.

 

[mikefromme]

Harbor freight, (w/coupon)

 

[mudflap]

Sounds like the guys from that diesel tech school are set. I grad from diesel tech this semester too, but it's a little harder around here... I bought most of my tools and a cart through the student discount program using scholarship, grant, and low interest student loan money . Maybe a mistake but I figure I have to buy the tools anyway. And I want snap on. So this is my only chance to buy them for half off. The downside is there's Not too many jobs and the jobs that are available seem to be taken... And the openings want experienced seasoned techs. Oh well, all the more reason to worker harder and learn harder to make my tool investment pay off with a career. What state are you in?


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I'm in Ohio, East of Cincy...We are bringing in 6 new tech's this year, and had to start the interview process back in November to try and get the cream of the crop. The school has had 100% placement the last few yrs. The County pays $15 an hr starting out, so we didnt get a couple of them that we wanted..they went with jobs that pay book rate, and will probably make better money for now...Your on the right track, i think Diesel is the way to go..alot more different kinds of opportunities ..They even had 2 kids hired on with a tug boat company in St louie, to service the big CAT Diesels that push barges up and down the Mississippi...how cool is that...?

 

[ChevyEFI]

I guess my question is to all you guys that have made your living as a mechanic for 15-20 yrs...What tool line would you recommend to the kids just starting out...and why..

Read the opening few pages of a Haynes auto manual.
Summarized:
Buy cheap that works.
Replace what fails or doesn't work well enough.
Let your work dictate your actual needs.
You'll be $$ ahead buying what you need, rather than a whole line of stuff in a particular brand for no particular reason.

Further, teach them how to identify quality. Broaching that's on-center and finished well. Chrome that's reasonably finished. Handles that are thick enough without jus being a big sloppy forging.

Buying by brand isn't beneficial. Buying what fits your hands well is. Your graduating mechanics students won't have as good a grasp of economics as they will later in life. Teaching them how to put their $$ to its best effect towards tools will help them.

 

[mudflap]

Read the opening few pages of a Haynes auto manual.
Summarized:
Buy cheap that works.
Replace what fails or doesn't work well enough.
Let your work dictate your actual needs.
You'll be $$ ahead buying what you need, rather than a whole line of stuff in a particular brand for no particular reason.

Further, teach them how to identify quality. Broaching that's on-center and finished well. Chrome that's reasonably finished. Handles that are thick enough without jus being a big sloppy forging.

Buying by brand isn't beneficial. Buying what fits your hands well is. Your graduating mechanics students won't have as good a grasp of economics as they will later in life. Teaching them how to put their $$ to its best effect towards tools will help them.

Thats a good point...and good advice. I dont know anybody that has just one brand of tools...We all have Mac, SO, Matco, or whatever. Due to different tool trucks coming and going thru the years. And we let them know, they dont HAVE to buy anything for for a while.. Us old farts have 3 of every tool known to exist...and we dont mind loaning stuff to the newbs...so they can slowly buy what they need, as they go...Every good mechanic i know takes pride in his tools...so even though some HF tools work just as good as Snappy..right or wrong..sometimes its just a status thing..and thats ok...

 

[Zedexseven]

As someone else mentioned, if you do buy truck brand, stick to one brand, not to own a single brand but it will be a lot easier for you to keep track of one account and not go too far into debt by owing money on 3 or 4 trucks. With that being said, you don't need truck brand tools, they are better in many cases but you are better off buying everything you need in a lower priced tools and gradually replace the ones you use most often with higher end stuff as yours wears/breaks/grows legs.

 

[ihateminimumwage]

The downside is there's Not too many jobs and the jobs that are available seem to be taken... And the openings want experienced seasoned techs. Oh well, all the more reason to worker harder and learn harder to make my tool investment pay off with a career.

The industry is being flooded with techs now, so opportunity is based on where you're willing to move. The city I went to school in had so many of the local kids that didn't want to leave mommy & daddy the local diesel tech pay averaged $12/hr out of school (average unskilled pay was $7.50-10/hr); not nearly enough to make it worth the student debt. Moved (and currently back in school doing general education requirements) and the average starting pay I've seen advertised is in the $18-24/hr starting range.

To the OP:
Good on you for looking out for the new guys, and trying to find them an alternative to going broke on the trucks. Have a younger buddy that got a good deal on a Snap-On box to hold his HF tools, and now is a major impulse buyer when the trucks come by, and the debt is killing him.

I've saved a ridiculous amount of money buying Williams USA (Snap-On) and Williams Taiwan (Blue Point) sockets, as well as lots of Gearwrench, Armstrong, SK, Craftsman Professional, Ingersoll Rand (including impact sockets), Husky USA torque wrenches (same torque wrench Matco sells), and a lot of misc stuff through Cripe Distributing.

 

[techenthusiast]

The industry is being flooded with techs now, so opportunity is based on where you're willing to move. The city I went to school in had so many of the local kids that didn't want to leave mommy & daddy the local diesel tech pay averaged $12/hr out of school (average unskilled pay was $7.50-10/hr); not nearly enough to make it worth the student debt. Moved (and currently back in school doing general education requirements) and the average starting pay I've seen advertised is in the $18-24/hr starting range.



To the OP:

Good on you for looking out for the new guys, and trying to find them an alternative to going broke on the trucks. Have a younger buddy that got a good deal on a Snap-On box to hold his HF tools, and now is a major impulse buyer when the trucks come by, and the debt is killing him.



I've saved a ridiculous amount of money buying Williams USA (Snap-On) and Williams Taiwan (Blue Point) sockets, as well as lots of Gearwrench, Armstrong, SK, Craftsman Professional, Ingersoll Rand (including impact sockets), Husky USA torque wrenches (same torque wrench Matco sells), and a lot of misc stuff through Cripe Distributing.

Where did you move to find such a good average starting pay ?


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[ihateminimumwage]

Where did you move to find such a good average starting pay ?

Coeur d'Alene, Idaho. We border Washington state, where the cost of living is WAY higher, so the pay here is much better than anywhere else in the state.

That and I've been searching more in Power Gen, heavy equipment, electrical and city or county work. Only took one summer working for a truck dealership getting paid less than I did moving furniture to realize I needed to find a specialty to stand out amongst all the other folks coming out of school. In the words of one of my coworkers at the truck shop, "You're too damn smart for this. Go back to school and be a lawyer or something, don't waste your life on this ****."

Where are you located, anyway?

 

[BlksnshN]

When I started out, I bought a lot of Craftsman off of ebay (back when there were good deals on ebay and not a bunch of idiots trying to sell used tools for more than what you can buy them for new.) for next to nothing.

Then as I broke or lost things, I would purchase new from Matco or Snap On.

Now, in the past year I've purchased a ton of stuff from Matco and Snap On, probably more than I should have as now I'm spending about $65 minimum a week in tool payments.

 

[mudflap]

Where did you move to find such a good average starting pay ?


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The placement counselor at your school should have a National database, If you are willing to re-locate, opportunities are endless. One of the local grads took a job in LA at one of the big ship yards. Those massive cranes run on electricty supplied by BIG..Diesel generators. He took a $500 chance, had to fly out there for the interview..but got the job..and is loving it. He emails us pictures of the PCH / beach sometimes. I get to know these kids really well, i'm an instructor at the school 2 nights a week TK, (Thermo-King ) class. It's a good cert to have on your resume. All those refridgeration units have to be serviced/certified every so many hrs of operation. If one of those things goes down, the trucking co will lose the whole load $$$$$......

 

[alexmaclean]

I'm wrapping up my first year, and one thing I learned is that a basic set of tools will work, but there are things you will never think of that will end up being nearly a requirment. When I was in college we were given a "recommended tool list" which my buddies and I promptly went to Canadian Tire and picked up. Learned that most of it was a waste.

I was lucky enough to be next to a well experienced tech (17 years) who was a great and willing teacher who was also willing to lend me anything I needed. And I needed a lot starting out. Switched to SO for most tools, I'm addicted, box included I have spend $12000~ so far, I have little other debt, so I paid it off quickly and only owe SO about 600 now.

I bought more than I needed, but I like nice tools, and we are flat rate so tools that save time pay themselves off fast.

Starting out, my advice is to admit you know basically nothing, even if you have been around cars for your whole youth...getting into the trade...you still don't know a damn thing. Accept it, it makes life a lot easier. Appreciate the help you get, because it can vanish if you don't.


Number one rule...if you borrow it at least once a month....buy it. You can never have a list of all the little special things that will make your life easier in your shop, you will figure out what special tools you should get one by one as you find a use for them. Don't run up a bill you will struggle to pay. I was lucky in that despite not making much, my other lack of debt allowed me to borrow a lot but pay fast. I buy things that make me faster but I certainly don't have to have. Tools don't have to cost a fortune, but they EASILY can.

Good luck, and the first year is the hardest. You may question your career choice several times, but stick it out.

 

[Ruger_556]

Coeur d'Alene, Idaho. We border Washington state, where the cost of living is WAY higher, so the pay here is much better than anywhere else in the state.

That and I've been searching more in Power Gen, heavy equipment, electrical and city or county work. Only took one summer working for a truck dealership getting paid less than I did moving furniture to realize I needed to find a specialty to stand out amongst all the other folks coming out of school. In the words of one of my coworkers at the truck shop, "You're too damn smart for this. Go back to school and be a lawyer or something, don't waste your life on this ****."

Where are you located, anyway?

Been told that many times... I'm like, "You don't want a smart mechanic or what?"

I live in WA and cost of living is somewhat high depending on what part of the state you are in. Starting wage is $14-16/hour and I'm at $17.76 right now.

 

[mudflap]

I'm wrapping up my first year, and one thing I learned is that a basic set of tools will work, but there are things you will never think of that will end up being nearly a requirment. When I was in college we were given a "recommended tool list" which my buddies and I promptly went to Canadian Tire and picked up. Learned that most of it was a waste.

I was lucky enough to be next to a well experienced tech (17 years) who was a great and willing teacher who was also willing to lend me anything I needed. And I needed a lot starting out. Switched to SO for most tools, I'm addicted, box included I have spend $12000~ so far, I have little other debt, so I paid it off quickly and only owe SO about 600 now.

I bought more than I needed, but I like nice tools, and we are flat rate so tools that save time pay themselves off fast.

Starting out, my advice is to admit you know basically nothing, even if you have been around cars for your whole youth...getting into the trade...you still don't know a damn thing. Accept it, it makes life a lot easier. Appreciate the help you get, because it can vanish if you don't.


Number one rule...if you borrow it at least once a month....buy it. You can never have a list of all the little special things that will make your life easier in your shop, you will figure out what special tools you should get one by one as you find a use for them. Don't run up a bill you will struggle to pay. I was lucky in that despite not making much, my other lack of debt allowed me to borrow a lot but pay fast. I buy things that make me faster but I certainly don't have to have. Tools don't have to cost a fortune, but they EASILY can.

Good luck, and the first year is the hardest. You may question your career choice several times, but stick it out.

AMEN.........When i was a newb at the shop, 25yrs ago, a cranky old mechanic named karl took a liking to me for some reason, and took me under his wing. I learned more from him than i could have at school in a hundred years, and he even covered for me a few times when i screwed something up. Karl retired in 1999, and passed away 3yrs ago. When i help out the new techs now...i feel like im sort of paying him back a little bit for all he did for me....I miss you Karl...You cranky old fart...lol

 

[ihateminimumwage]

Been told that many times... I'm like, "You don't want a smart mechanic or what?"

No kidding!

I live in WA and cost of living is somewhat high depending on what part of the state you are in. Starting wage is $14-16/hour and I'm at $17.76 right now.

East or West WA? I've kept an eye on jobs in Spokane/Spokane Valley, but the commute might kill any decent wages.

 

[Ruger_556]

No kidding!

East or West WA? I've kept an eye on jobs in Spokane/Spokane Valley, but the commute might kill any decent wages.

I'm in the NW... Worked in Pasco for a while too though.

 

[ihateminimumwage]

I'm in the NW... Worked in Pasco for a while too though.

Spent a portion of my childhood in Port Townsend, and some time in Seattle. Feels good to be back in the general region again; Even if inland and not Pacific.

 

[Ruger_556]

(Thermo-King ) class. It's a good cert to have on your resume. All those refridgeration units have to be serviced/certified every so many hrs of operation. If one of those things goes down, the trucking co will lose the whole load $$$$$......

This ^^^ I just got that certification a few weeks ago.

 

[mudflap]

This ^^^ I just got that certification a few weeks ago.

CERTI-TECH Factory program...?

 

[Ruger_556]

CERTI-TECH Factory program...?

No, Idealease training (Carrier and TK).

 

[mudflap]

No, Idealease training (Carrier and TK).

Your in the money with that....Could go anywhere in the country and find work. We have dealerships sending us students from all over right now...