Tool brand ranking?

[MackMan]

I did a search for this and looked on sticky but only really found this
http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2232

What I have been looking for is a way of identifying what tools are "best" for a function, but overall what brands are acceptable.

Example

Tool: 3/8 Ratchet
Best: Snap-On
Alternatives
1) SK
2) Craftsman
3).. etc

(I'm not saying that is valid just an example of the type of information I'm looking for).

Same thing for hand wrenches, and so on. I understand that the ranking of best might be subjective (i.e. one ratchet might have finer teeth, but another may have the strongest gears), but the point is generally if I go to a pawn shop and see a good deal, or on Ebay or so on, I can identify something that would be a good addition to my garage, or if it is junk.

I know anything "Snap On" is among the best, but also among the most expensive. I'm sure there's lots of other brands that are good, that I have not heard of, and may be less well known and therefore end up being more affordable. At my local Pawn shop, Snap on stuff, even individual sockets get put in a locked case. But I found several Craftsman, Blue-Point, etc in the junk bins for $2.50/lb

If this information is available elsewhere, please forgive me, but if it is not, perhaps a good ongoing sticky?

 

[NC-Fordguy]

This is a highly subjective and at times inflamatory topic, especially with tools made overseas

What one persons experience is with a particular brand often will vary from another persons experience.

With that being said, I have a bit of everything in my tool box. Crafty, snappy, s&k, wright, proto, gearwrench, harbor freight, and a many others. All in all my personal experience is they all perform the same task at about the same level. Some brands have better refinements or features than others. This is of course reflected in costs most often. Some brands are easier to warranty than others. Some brands are easily available while others are more of an effort to aquire.

I personally think there is no finite answer to this type of question, but I'm sure others will chime in

 

[jdl25]

Fordguy is pretty spot on.

 

[MackMan]

Thanks for the responses and I understand... and perhaps I worded my question improperly. I guess I could say what is overall consensus on most desired brands or most respected brands. Almost every "home mechanic" I know will say something like "Snap-On" is great, but Craftsman is good enough and a lot cheaper. But it's clear that if both were priced the same, the vast majority of people would prefer Snap-On to Craftsman. Also there is a matter of consistency... For the most part you can assume that a hand tool with a Snap-On logo is going to be good... Harbor Freight is hit or miss...

So maybe the correct question is, as a whole for a particular tool type what would be the order of your preference, regardless of price.

Thanks!

 

[oldtools]

You are going to get alot of bias opinion. Tool A may be alot better than tool B, but people will blindly tell you tool B is better just because of COO.

 

[crewchief888]

interesting question,

and it got me to thinking...

i basically have 2 sets of tools, working tools, and garage tools.

for the most part, working tools are all truck brands, with SO leading the way, matco, mac, proto, armstrong, SK, CM, CM pro and a few assorted HF tossed in.
garage tools are a mixmatched mess, lots of CM, scattered SK, truck brands, stanley, proto, blackhawk, HF, duralast, great neck, KD, many duplicates of "working" tools

i dont think i've ever been disappointed in the purchase of any tool, no matter what brand or COO, they all do exactly what they are suppose to, and havent had many failures. of those failures most have been truck branded stuff.

 

[unslow1]

I for one am very happy with a Chinese tool I picked up at Harbor Freight for $3. I am very unhappy with a new pair of Snapon duckbill pliers that rusted within a month of me paying $55. It has to do with expectations as well. If it works for cheap you got what you hoped for. If it works more than once it's impressive. If I paid high dollar I want perfection and a lifetime troublefree.

 

[BrokewrenchLS1]

If I were building from scratch today, sockets and wrenches would be SK, ratchets would be Snap-on, pliers would be Channellock, hammers would be Estwing, prybars and punches would be Wilde or Mayhew, and screwdrivers would be Wiha and Wera. To me, those specific brands and tools combine the best aspects of price, reliability, quality, and ergonomics. If I got a good deal on Williams US or Armstrong wrenches, I'd pick those up.

For specialty stuff, like pullers, ball joint presses, etc, I'd go all OTC - quality is good for a weekend mechanic, they're not inordinately expensive, and they're easy enough to get on Amazon.

 

[Rico.]

I started a thread about 6 weeks ago looking to compile a list of Premium Grade
hand tool manufacturers and it went to 56 posts. Some very good
suggestions and it didn't turn into a Country of Origin **** fest either.

Well worth a look.....

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=151940

 

[d.mcfarland]

Value vs. Price is a topic that can be debated all day, with no consensus reached.

Is a $350 ratchet and socket set needed for a guy that changes his oil twice a year, or does an old hand-me-down Craftsman set work perfectly fine?

 

[MackMan]

Thanks for the thoughts. I'm somewhat surprised at the popularity of HF stuff based on the few responses I've seen so far. I do have some very specialized low use things from them (ball joint press, brake bleeder), but have been thoroughly unimpressed with the quality of their hand tools.
BrokeWrench, your kind of list is exactly what I'm looking for. I'm at the point in my own garage where I have enough of a starting point that I'm primarily purchasing tools for specific purposes, but by no means have a complete mechanic set. While a full set of SK or Snap On is well out of my budget, when I just need some particular size socket for a specific job or something I don't mind paying a premium. I figure in this manner over a few years I can amass a nice collection of premium tools. Craftsman forms the basis of my collection so far, I've added a few Kobalt when I needed something, got some Snap On wrenches at the pawn shop, few Snap On sockets off Ebay, and a bunch of 6-point Craftsman from the pawn shop (my starter set was all 12 point, except for 1/4" drive).

What is the reputation of "Cornwall" tools (or is it Cornwell?).

 

[bcradio]

Almost every "home mechanic" I know will say something like "Snap-On" is great, but Craftsman is good enough and a lot cheaper. But it's clear that if both were priced the same, the vast majority of people would prefer Snap-On to Craftsman.

I'd have to go with Fordguys response on this one too. For the most part Cman and Snappy are both good tools with Snappy having a slight edge in quality on SOME tools (certainly not all). Where the difference comes in is the slight refinements that Snappy puts on their tools (like knurling on their extensions). These little things make mechanics who use tools all day long really enjoy them over something like Cman.

 

[bcradio]

What is the reputation of "Cornwall" tools (or is it Cornwell?).

Cornwell tools are great if you can track down a truck or have one come to you. Ebay sometimes has used Cornwell for decent deals. I am not aware of any online sources for them new though.

 

[MackMan]

Value vs. Price is a topic that can be debated all day, with no consensus reached.

Is a $350 ratchet and socket set needed for a guy that changes his oil twice a year, or does an old hand-me-down Craftsman set work perfectly fine?

I understand the comment, but I'm trying to take "value" out of the equation, simply looking at the tool quality itself.

 

[2oolhound]

Another way to do this would be to compile a list (exhaustive) and have folks put their first 3 choices under each tool. No one brand rules in all the types of tools. There is no end to how often you break up a category for example you may prefer a different brand 3/4 dr ratchet than a 1/4 dr etc. This could be a never ending poll (as in the list of items is endless and it takes endless hours to complete it)

ie:

Ratchets -

Regular
1)
2)
3)

Flex
1)
2)
3)

Pass Thru
1)
2)
3)

Fine Tooth
1)
2)
3)
etc.

Wrenches -

Combo
1)
2)
3)

Off Set
1)
2)
3)

Angle/4 Way
1)
2)
3)

Box End
1)
2)
3)

Open End
1)
2)
3)

Ratchet
1)
2)
3)

Reversing Ratchet
1)
2)
3)

Flex Ratchet
1)
2)
3)

Double Box
1)
2)
3)

Line
1)
2)
3)

Sockets -

Chrome 6 Point
1)
2)
3)

Chrome 12 point
1)
2)
3)

Impact
1)
2)
3)

Thin Impact
1)
2)
3)

Flex
1)
2)
3)

Swivel Impact
1)
2)
3)

6 Point
1)
2)
3)

etc., etc., etc.

 

[plinker]

For the most part quality is easy to manage these day's, because Generally mostthing's are well made these day's with some exception. More so to where It all depend's on what you want and are going to do with it, and what you expect of it.

But for some thing's from a specfic brand are sometime's better or more highly thought of then other's. Snap-on's gold bit Torx socket's come to mind in this regard. Not saying all torx bit socket's that are not made by Snap-on are junk, just that they seem to be the best one's available, given the amount of people using them.

Alot boils down to preference and if your in doubt on what's considered the "best" tool for a specfic job, be it a ratchet, screwdriver, service tool, ete...., Post and/or run a search and you'll find answer's most all of the time based on experiance.

Researching what you buy before you buy it also mean's you wont get dissapointed near as much. That much I can tell you from experiance.

 

[d.mcfarland]

I understand the comment, but I'm trying to take "value" out of the equation, simply looking at the tool quality itself.

Right, so the person that doesn't abuse the lifetime Craftsman stuff is going to consider the quality extremely high. A professional who demands much higher quality and longevity is not going to rate it as high.

As for Cornwell Tools, they are very high quality if it's something they make in house. Ratchet, for example, use the highest quality steel available. They actually won't break. The socket holder will snap before the ratchet bends or breaks. Send it in or have the truck guy fix it, and it's good to go again.

 

[Hiball]

You are going to get alot of bias opinion. Tool A may be alot better than tool B, but people will blindly tell you tool B is better just because of COO.

This I agree with.

You can also find the Opposite end of the spectrum where Tool A might be alot better than Tool B but people with blindly tell you Tool B is better because it is Cheaper, And to be Honest there are probably just as many people who think because it costs more it has to be better. Its a 2 way street and the Best advice is to get your hands dirty..

To the OP: As others have stated there are a ton of Great tools out there, For most people it comes down to the Little things such as Fitment. In other words, Some people like Round Head Ratchets versus Pear head, Chrome grips versus comfort grips, Satin versus Chrome etc.. I have a Large variety of Brands in my tool boxes and Honestly there are very few that have given me problems over the years. Any Dumby can buy a Tool, It takes Experience to know what the proper tool for the Job is.

 

[franzdom]

I'd have to go with Fordguys response on this one too. For the most part Cman and Snappy are both good tools with Snappy having a slight edge in quality on SOME tools (certainly not all). Where the difference comes in is the slight refinements that Snappy puts on their tools (like knurling on their extensions). These little things make mechanics who use tools all day long really enjoy them over something like Cman.

Ok, you got me thinking, does Craftsman make ANYTHING that is higher quality than Snap-On's equivalent item?

 

[Roots]

Ok, you got me thinking, does Craftsman make ANYTHING that is higher quality than Snap-On's equivalent item?

Craftsman is a brand, not a manufacturer, they don't make any tools. Everything labeled Craftsman is sourced elsewhere and just relabeled or contract manufactured.

 

[franzdom]

Craftsman is a brand, not a manufacturer, they don't make any tools. Everything labeled Craftsman is sourced elsewhere and just relabeled or contract manufactured.

Ok, pretty much every tool manufacturer is guilty of the same thing for some item or another. So, I ask again, does Craftsman put their name on ANYTHING that is higher quality than Snap-On?

 

[Hiball]

Ok, pretty much every tool manufacturer is guilty of the same thing for some item or another. So, I ask again, does Craftsman put their name on ANYTHING that is higher quality than Snap-On?

I'd say they do, Obviously "Quality" is somewhat subjective but if you handed me a RP 1/2 drive wrench and a snap on 1/2 drive wrench and put 500 fasteners in front of me, I think both would finish the task. Now.. Would is the SO more comfortable to use? Would the extra length make the task easier? The thing about snap on is they cater to a specific need and it's the little things that make the difference when your wrenching 40+ hours a week, on top of the specific tools that take crappy jobs and make them a walk in the park. I think someone mentioned knurled extensions earlier... Awesome IMO I wouldn't own a set that wasn't.

 

[dsmnickk90]

Ok, pretty much every tool manufacturer is guilty of the same thing for some item or another. So, I ask again, does Craftsman put their name on ANYTHING that is higher quality than Snap-On?

Both have the exact same thread restore kit and the Craftsman labeled kit is over 50% cheaper

 

[dsmnickk90]

I'd say they do, Obviously "Quality" is somewhat subjective but if you handed me a RP 1/2 drive wrench and a snap on 1/2 drive wrench and put 500 fasteners in front of me, I think both would finish the task. Now.. Would is the SO more comfortable to use? Would the extra length make the task easier? The thing about snap on is they cater to a specific need and it's the little things that make the difference when your wrenching 40+ hours a week, on top of the specific tools that take crappy jobs and make them a walk in the park. I think someone mentioned knurled extensions earlier... Awesome IMO I wouldn't own a set that wasn't.

A better comparison would be the Craftsman Premium and a Snap-On.

 

[Hiball]

Both have the exact same thread restore kit and the Craftsman labeled kit is over 50% cheaper

If I recall sears has a limited warranty on that Kastar set where snap on is lifetime, it's not always as cut and dry as some make it out to be.

 

[Hiball]

A better comparison would be the Craftsman Premium and a Snap-On.

Nah... I don't think so, not in regards to quality.

 

[dsmnickk90]

Nah... I don't think so, not in regards to quality.

As in features the share. Both would be a little longer than your average ratchet both would be fine tooth. Both are shaped to fit the hand better. Obviously the Snap-On will have a better chrome but they could be seen as 2 comparable ratchets.

 

[ndoran]

it might be easier to just list the brands we have in our boxes and which items we have in more than one brand.

Quality is such a subjective subject, we would have to agree a common definition of it first and I think the internet will have ceased to exist as we know it before that happens

 

[Hiball]

As in features the share. Both would be a little longer than your average ratchet both would be fine tooth. Both are shaped to fit the hand better. Obviously the Snap-On will have a better chrome but they could be seen as 2 comparable ratchets.

Just another Example of how "Subjective" this Thread is.

 

[franzdom]

Subjective sure but does anybody here think CM puts their name on anything that is better than a SO equivalent? I am not trying to flame war, just straight out asking.

 

[Hiball]

Subjective sure but does anybody here think CM puts their name on anything that is better than a SO equivalent? I am not trying to flame war, just straight out asking.

In Regards to "Better".. Nah....

 

[KinzeMech]

Both have the exact same thread restore kit and the Craftsman labeled kit is over 50% cheaper

I think I've seen that set. Is it this one?
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00942275000P

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...roup_ID=675360&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

The case does look just a tiny bit different between the two, but they could be the same source and the case got changed at some point, and one pic is the old one. Anyone know for fact if they are the same or different?

That's what makes me leery of some of snap-on's stuff. I'd hate to buy something, to find out I could have gotten the same thing from someone else for 1/3-1/2 cost. Especially if the dealer looks you in the eye and tells you his is better (ridiculous argument if in fact they are the same, but I'll bet you a lot of dealers will do it).

As for best stuff...I don't think brand loyalty pays off. In anything. It's fine to have your favorite, but odds are, the best sedan, truck, minivan, and coupe are not all made by motor company X. Some have a better item x, while their competitor has a better item y, and still another has the best z. Service matters, too. I'm willing to spend a little more with a dealer/vendor that will take care of my problems in the rare times it does arise.

 

[plinker]

If I recall sears has a limited warranty on that Kastar set where snap on is lifetime, it's not always as cut and dry as some make it out to be.

Snap-on also has open stock available if you need to replace one or two as well.

I bought a Kastar (the OEM) set from Tooltopia and thought it was a better deal then Craftsman, IMO.

Both Sears and Snap-on rebrand Lisle tool's but the warranty *may* be better with Snap-on. It just depends.

 

[MarkH]

Good bad or ugly people fight to support what they buy. The arguments are all over.

Figure out what you do. What you want to spend and the best for you will be more obvious.

 

[Toolhorder]

These threads get so old. Always new members with the tool vs. tool questions/opinions

 

[shoturtle]

this is a silly thread, it is completely subjective. Everyone has their preference and brand loyalties at times. Craftsman vs snap really depends on what you are comparing. Craftsman 84t, matco 88, Armstron 88, SO dual 80. They are all excellent ratchets for US brands. There are excellent german ratchets and japanese ratchets as well. Are any in reality better then the other. They all do the job.

If you are not happy with the tool brand you have, sell it a buy what makes you happy. If you are happy with the tool, ignore what others say is better. As it really does not matter.

 

[MackMan]

Boy, yall are a tough crowd. Are there any objective measures you could use to determine?

For instance on ratchets
1) Who has the finest "movement" in terms of number of degrees rotation to get to the next tooth?

2) who has the strongest ratchet?

As a car guy what I'm hearing is that any tool brand is a Ford vs Chevy argument... Even though price wise, comparing HF to SO is like comparing TaTa to Rolls Royce. Of course we could make the same argument that a TaTa will get you from A to B just as well as a Rolls Royce, but we can also see by looking at them that they are clearly not comparable.

So.. is there really no "Rolls Royce" of tools? Regardless of the pure utilitarian view that a tool can "get a job done" there isn't a concensus that say Cornewell is a "nicer" ratchet than a Crafstman or Harbor Freight?

 

[d.mcfarland]

I guess a measurable chart could be made in order to rank any particular tool against another. For example use a 5 or 10 point scale and use a number of metrics to measure such as appearance, strength, fit, warranty, etc.

Someone did a socket comparison to show where they actually contact the bolt. Maybe that's the type of test you're looking for.

 

[franzdom]

I have been lead to believe that Snap-on makes the strongest ratchet while their Dual-80 don't have the finest movement. I guess in some sense the 84T Craftsman ratchet is better than a Snap-on 80T ratchet. However, Snap-On also makes 100T ratchets, though I believe these aren't as strong as their Dual-80 types they are probably not much weaker.

In the car analogy there are lots of Tata tools, and lots of luxury brands, and lots of mid-range Chevy/Ford/Honda/Toyota brands as well. I guess the luxury brands are Hazet, Snap-On, Stahwille, Cornwell, etc, the mid-range brands are Craftsman, Napa, Kobalt, etc, and the low ends are the cheapest ranges of tools from China, India, etc.