Torque stick question....

[papshadalac]

When using torque sticks, how long do you guys actually hammer with the impact? Like 1 sec or a couple? I've tried using them with my ct 6850 and yes they tighten the wheel but they almost seem to over torque every time. Should I just let it hammer for a sec then check it with a torque wrench or ?

All opinions are welcome.

 

[signcrafter]

Have you "calibrated" your impact according to the torque stick manufacturer instructions?

 

[Buckgnarly]

Have you "calibrated" your impact according to the torque stick manufacturer instructions?

X2, and always at a set pressure.

 

[teamarctic]

I thought i read somewhere you werent supposed to use torque sticks with electric impacts?

 

[Buckgnarly]

I thought i read somewhere you werent supposed to use torque sticks with electric impacts?

Oops, missed that. I could understand that as you never know the charge.

 

[madosta]

I asked my buddy who is a prototype mechanic about torque sticks and he laughed at me and says "we don't use them you sissy!" So now I just hammer lugnuts home with a few raps of the impact.

 

[dragonballz]

. Should I just let it hammer for a sec then check it with a torque wrench or ?



All opinions are welcome.

That defeats the purpose of torque sticks.

 

[Rusty_H]

Been quite a bit of discussion on torque sticks.

My method is use 75lb torque stick on everything (when doing tires/wheels) For one reason, even pressure without fear of over torquing. Originally I was having issues with wheels that were hub centric, installing crooked and binding, when the vehicle was lowered to the floor, and the wheel settled, I would have make multiple passes with my torque wrench.

Sort of tough to explain, perhaps somebody who can relate can better explain.

Bottom line, always use a torque wrench. No matter what.

In the auto industry I see two scenarios, repetitive work such as wheels, where torque is critical to the occupants. Or repetitive work such as 20+ head bolts in an engine, which, though not critical to the occupants, can cause damage or premature failure to expensive parts.

IMHO, torque wrench with proper technique, when I see tire busters hammer on a set of wheels, dial in their torque wrench, and it clicks without budging the nut, I ask myself "why".

I understand this doesn't answer your original question at all, but since you mentioned passing with a torque wrench, I see a glimmer of hope.

 

[nicksnothereman]

I thought i read somewhere you werent supposed to use torque sticks with electric impacts?

To loosen maybe... Don't use them. Probably handy for drivetrain work though.

 

[dragonballz]

Been quite a bit of discussion on torque sticks.

My method is use 75lb torque stick on everything (when doing tires/wheels) For one reason, even pressure without fear of over torquing. Originally I was having issues with wheels that were hub centric, installing crooked and binding, when the vehicle was lowered to the floor, and the wheel settled, I would have make multiple passes with my torque wrench.

Sort of tough to explain, perhaps somebody who can relate can better explain.

Bottom line, always use a torque wrench. No matter what.

In the auto industry I see two scenarios, repetitive work such as wheels, where torque is critical to the occupants. Or repetitive work such as 20+ head bolts in an engine, which, though not critical to the occupants, can cause damage or premature failure to expensive parts.

IMHO, torque wrench with proper technique, when I see tire busters hammer on a set of wheels, dial in their torque wrench, and it clicks without budging the nut, I ask myself "why".

I understand this doesn't answer your original question at all, but since you mentioned passing with a torque wrench, I see a glimmer of hope.

Ive always used a 1/4" impact gun on the low setting with about 120 psi shop air. Hold the trigger for a few impacts after the lugnuts seat. Then follow up with the torque wrench @ 80 ft lbs. I would get about 1/8 of a turn with the torque wrench.

 

[sberry]

You cant vary the speed with electric impacts. Most of the times I follow instructions but due to the fact that they cant properly train every mechanic they come up with the best they can.
The old timers that invented the torque wrench listed it in the instructions, I got a snappy manual from old days,,,, says it in palin englaze,,, all values are for clean lightly lubricated threads. They know that then they know it now and way too many cases blamed on bolts coming loose are actually not ever clamped tight.

Penetrating spray is about perfect. Speed kills and the object isn't to get them as tight as they can be but with the same gun, same air and same settings with a little practice a guy can and should be able to do wheels with an air gun.

Having said that had an occasion to look in at tire dealers and I really don't like them doing wheels, if I can possibly help it take the wheels off and take in, strip the old rubber off and have a clean bare rim.

I never have stuck nuts and I don't got wheels fall off. I have checked a few against the wrench, one of my guys uses one, he is a pinch under and turns it just a pinch. I am a touch over but got a bolt not going to seize.
Have never used a stick, not likely to and its use untrained and attacked like a crazed chimp with a 6 pack waiting on ice is no substitute for whert they call :"mechanic feeling".

We missed a deal in a small engine engine, I highlighted the note wrong and 25% under, wondered wtf. We did 2, went back to look sure as ****, you could feel it. Would have got way better by hand. Over would have worked over but the under was a problem.

 

[sberry]

Plated fasteners do help but the still "stick". We have a bunch of common bolts exposed to the weather, one inch pipe thread alum to alum and steel bolts for clamps by the 1000's and I carry a combo wrench in my pocket as well as everything we drive to fit this. We should have a pocket size applicator similar to a bic we live with spray cans but I can tell years later if they were sprayed when they were installed. Bolts in hundreds of wet dry cycles and some dissimilar metal and even a few under water, nut rusting right off exposed threads eaten away and come off easy if some slobbered spray on it when they put it together.

This whole crowd worries to no end about removal but its the install that counts for a lot too. Yall putting dry bolts together by hand and often under torqued or faulty at best.

 

[sberry]

Intake manifolds were a common problem often solved by the mechanic giving a little extra pucker to the offending bolts. Same for exhaust manifolds on old engines.

There is a huge tendency on forums to have what is called estimating judgement and value of the effort. We got some that can push a pencil way better than I do and have way greater intellect but the experience has kicked in to know some o0f where that is at, to value it when needed but also to grasp concepts like a little, some, about right a lot and too much. It could be defined on a scale of 10 for further refinement but for the sense of concept is 5. Worst to best, in adequate, serves the load, how much loss is noticeable, all of these are judgement calls and most of it is based in fear and the real risk neglected.

I know people beside the road,,, yup, knew the tire was going one of these days with no spare, the odds of an issue from wrong stud torque being way down on the list. I know that we got p[eople think nothing of riding a Harley, they feel better with some leather but ride something that couldn't pass safety if invented today and wont fly commercial.

 

[sberry]

A high problem is stuck bolt, a minor one is a little oil throwing off a wrench value or compared to a dirty, dry or damaged thread.

On occasion I walk aro9und a car with a hand 1/2 ratchet, I figure if I cant loosen and reseat a nut then the operator cant with the factory wrench beside the road either. Trucks with larger studs get hit another level harder with the operator paying attn. to number of hits and socket rotation speed.

On a wheel want the wrench pressure adequate and the adjustment set so tight is about 6 or 8 hits in, make 2 passes, slow run up and snug on the first and tight on the second.

 

[papshadalac]

That defeats the purpose of torque sticks.

I really meant hammer for a sec while USING a torque stick.

 

[Rakoprtr]

At work we use a torque stick that's 20 lbs less than the manufacturer recomend torque than torque to spec with a torque wrench

Example torque is 100 ft lbs we use a 80 lb stick and them torque to 100 with the torque wrench

 

[dragonballz]

I really meant hammer for a sec while USING a torque stick.

Yeah.

Might as well just hit it for a split second on the low setting with just a regular socket so it's just under the recommended torque. Then finish it off with a torque wrench.

Dont even spend the money on the stick

 

[DieselFxr]

We will not allow them to be used in the fleet shop I work in due to over torque that is common when using them. They were allowed here in the past but several isues occured and the underlying cause was determined to be lugs being over torqued.

 

[928'er]

I thread lug nuts on by hand, break them loose by hand (alloy lug nut syndrome) and spin them on and off with a cordless impact. Final tightening is ALWAYS done with a torque wrench.

I found a pretty definitive write-up on the subject:

http://www.tirereview.com/article/105879/the_right_torque_procedures.aspx

I usually buy my tires through Costco. After the techs do the installation, the supervisor comes out and personally torques each lug with a torque wrench. The car does not come down off the lift until he's signed off on it. Seems like a good practice to me.

 

[durallymax]

I use the torque sticks as a way to limit torque but let me speed nuts on fast. You should always follow it up with a torque wrench.

When I used to work in tires we used CP impacts on level 2 with the torque sticks and didn't have any over tightening issues.

 

[Haveblue]

I like the idea of torque sticks, but I prefer final tightening with a torque wrench. I just start each nut by hand with a socket, and run them down evenly with the impact on the lowest setting, I have a good feel for my impact..just a quick "blip" of the trigger after seating gets me about 80 Ft lbs. Then I grab the torque wrench. After going through the sequence, I alternate back through it to double check torque. Might be overkill, but Its a lot faster than it sounds.

 

[egnorant]

I was in a local tire store (Discount Tires) and noticed that they had torque sticks on breaker bars. I pointed out to the young man working there that this was not how they were to be used and he "informed" me that the policy was to use them on every wheel to insure proper torque. 10 minute discussion on how they actually worked was fruitless.

Bruce

 

[tshetter]

I was in a local tire store (Discount Tires) and noticed that they had torque sticks on breaker bars. I pointed out to the young man working there that this was not how they were to be used and he "informed" me that the policy was to use them on every wheel to insure proper torque. 10 minute discussion on how they actually worked was fruitless.

Bruce

Sometimes the stupid hurts.

 

[T_Roze]

I've got a set of em', 60 ft/lbs through 150 ft/lbs. My boss had a few kicking around, never used, and I bought only after asking if he was ok with using them. I have not had any problems with them, but I completely understand the issues/concerns with them! I have a gotten a pretty good feel for them, and every so often double check against a torque wrench to see what my gun is putting out. I spin the lug nuts up snug, then about 3/4 of a second of trigger pull sets the torque. It took a bit of playing around initially to get a good feel, but I feel they do work ok.

As for the torque stick on a breaker bar, that guys an idiot. He has no idea how they work. He's using it as a colourful extension.

 

[Haveblue]

^^ Exactly. I should say, that I used to work in a shop that had torque sticks..and if you have a good relationship with your impact, you can get them very close. Its really all about the "feel". As for the guy with the breaker bar.. How does he know when it's torqued?

 

[Coach James]

I've got a set of em', 60 ft/lbs through 150 ft/lbs. My boss had a few kicking around, never used, and I bought only after asking if he was ok with using them. I have not had any problems with them, but I completely understand the issues/concerns with them! I have a gotten a pretty good feel for them, and every so often double check against a torque wrench to see what my gun is putting out. I spin the lug nuts up snug, then about 3/4 of a second of trigger pull sets the torque. It took a bit of playing around initially to get a good feel, but I feel they do work ok.

As for the torque stick on a breaker bar, that guys an idiot. He has no idea how they work. He's using it as a colourful extension.

If it is shop policy, it's not an issue of him being an idiot as he's just doing what his boss told him to do. Now his boss or someone up the chain could certainly be lacking in knowledge.

Coach

 

[not-required]

Everyone at work uses torque sticks and have a good feel for them. The torque wrench only comes out when we are working on one of the xB's or minivans.