Tv antenna

[ckucia]

So we're in our new house. It's in a valley and there's hardly any tv or radio reception at ground level.

I have a pretty nice amplified antenna off our RV. Put it in the house as high up as possible and received two stations. Got a pole last night to mount it outside and higher up. But the garage next to the house is a good 12feet higher.

The garage has a metal roof.

The easy thing would be to put the antenna up in the rafters of the garage. Would the metal roof basically moot that?

Alternatively, I could mount the pole to the side of the garage and get it up even higher. It's a little cold outside right now, but we're getting a little stir crazy so it could be worth it. If I did that, do I need to run a ground wire from the antenna pole down the side of the garage?


In either case, seems like it would be nice to have a tv in the garage too. Anything I need to know about tv antenna splitters?

Any other considerations I may have missed?

Is there any way to build a cheap and effective fm antenna while I'm doing the tv?

 

[930dreamer]

When we moved into our house the tv antenna was in the attic.

 

[cvairwerks]

Going to depend on what direction relative to the roof you need to point it. If you need to point it out the gable end, and it's not metal sheathed, should be no problem. On the other hand, if you need to point it through the metal, it will be severely attenuated.
Better idea is put it on a pole on the gable end and point as necessary.

If the antenna on the pole is the highest thing in the yard, I'd ground it.

 

[58Yeoman]

I'm in a lower area also, and a few years ago, I put up a 40' tower that I found locally. I wish it had been a bit higher, but I get all the local stations from 30 to 40+ miles away. I do lose the farther channels sometimes. I have a double UHF antenna, with an cheap amplifier in the basement where the wire comes in.

 

[brownbagg]

if you got a metal roof and the antenna inside the attic, the metal roof will cancel, reflect any signal

 

[66cj225]

Do a search for broadcast stations in your area and get some compass bearings for those stations relative to your location. Metal roof makes a good reflector (like a microwave dish) and ground plane. You might be able to use it for an advantage pulling in a weak station.

 

[larry4406]

Regarding locating TV stations/aiming your antenna, I recently found this linked site and like it much better than the TV Fool version I started with.
https://otadtv.com/tvtower/index.html

Use the calculator on the site to convert your decimal, minutes, and seconds (DMS) for longitude and latitude of your house then copy that into the form. Note that when you put in your longitude coordinates it needs to be a negative number for north America. I used the compass Ap on my Iphone which shows my longitude and latitude. Once you've done this, the site generates a polar plot with your house at the center and then locates the transmitter locations. It also provides tabular information. I chose 100 mile radius as that is the maximum.

Using the table, you can then sort the information by columns. I sorted by Angle which is useful on grouping stations with a common target direction. I separately sorted by dBm to see which stations I was likely to receive. This link has a decent graphic explaining signal strengths. I have found that I am able to receive signals listed as low as about -53 dBm. The table lets you put in check box on the far right column which I am using to track the stations I currently get. I have had to print the various sorted tables to a PDF as saving the URL in my bookmarks does not work as the GPS location is not saved. Would be nice to get the output and put it into Excel or Word.
https://otadtv.com/digital_tv/signals.html

Antenna installation details with good pictorials and grounding information here
https://otadtv.com/installation/index.html

I installed the below linked DB8e long range dual bay antenna on my chimney, about 30' up. I also bought the VHF kit for it. I am not done tuning it in, but I am able to pull in clearly and reliably Baltimore MD and Annapolis MD which are 70+ miles away in addition to the Washington DC channels. When weather permits, I will aim the other bay towards Richmond VA and hope to pick up many more channels (likely repeats though). The dual bays let you aim in two different directions (ie - toward different cities).
https://www.antennasdirect.com/store/DB8e-Ultra-Long-Range-Outdoor-DTV-Antenna.html

I am using a Channel Master Spartan 2 pre-amplifier (old obsolete unit I found in the attic after we moved in) and it helped bring in about 15 more channels than without it. Free was nice as well.

Here is the TV Fool link where I started this antenna/cut the cord journey about 6 months ago. Velocity Channel is about the only thing I miss from our Comcast Cable subscription.
http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=90

 

[ckucia]

Thanks everyone. Sorry for not responding sooner - 4 hour round trip running errands.

Unfortunately, the two major cities we're between are both on the metal sides of the garage roof, so I guess I'm going to go up.

 

[Bert_]

What sort of antenna do you have now? You said it's for your RV so I'm guessing it's kind of small.
Are the stations you want from the same direction? Many antenna's are directional.

Get the antenna up above any roofs and try to keep it away from tree's /ect.

As far as an FM antenna there's lots of options out there for that too. I have a loop antenna that performs well, it is directional. It's also extremely easy to build.

 

[ckucia]

Antenna isn't rv specific, but it is on the small side. An older version of this

 

[Hiball]

I'd suggest finding out what channels you can pick up, I used antennaweb.org when setting up mine. My understanding with the digital signal used now is that it relies a lot on straight line for signal strength, where is Analog would follow valleys and provide a stronger signal for someone in your situation. I could be wrong on that, regardless it sounds like your gonna need some kind of tower/pole. In regards to splitters, everytime you split the signal there is a percentage of signal loss. I had to purchase a channel master booster to offset the loss created when going to 3 Tv's, all was good after it was installed.

 

[Dentaltec]

So humor me, if you have internet at your home why do you need an antenna for TV/FM?

New smart TV, hooked to the internet means all the channels you could ever want. That and then you don't have to see an eye sore of antenna as well.

 

[Hiball]

So humor me, if you have internet at your home why do you need an antenna for TV/FM?

New smart TV, hooked to the internet means all the channels you could ever want. That and then you don't have to see an eye sore of antenna as well.

What streaming service would allow you to get "local" channels for free?

FWIW.. I'm aware of some of the IPTV options thru some of the favorite streaming programs such as KODI, but IME the Live tv options are somewhat iffy, at least for my neck of the woods.

 

[ckucia]

So humor me, if you have internet at your home why do you need an antenna for TV/FM?

New smart TV, hooked to the internet means all the channels you could ever want. That and then you don't have to see an eye sore of antenna as well.

I'm using my cell phone. I only get intermittent data, and it didn't work at all until the snow fell two days ago.

I'm guessing I'll have it for another week as we're expecting it to go above freezing next Sunday.

 

[ckucia]

Just for giggles, I hooked up the TV rabbit ears, on which I couldn't receive any tv stations, to the fm jack on the tuner. Got bunches of stations. So I'm ok with my fm.

Have a plan of attack and am heading out to the garage to mount the antenna.

 

[kbs2244]

Use as tall a pole as possible.
Use 2 antennas, one for each city. (They are cheap.)
Aim them as recommended.
Combine the wires from each antenna with a co-ax "splitter"
They work fine in reverse.

I an half way between Chicago and Milwaukee.
The above gives ne all the broadcast stations in either city.
The signal "search" function on the TV works just fine to find the channels.

 

[ckucia]

Got the antenna up last night. Was after dark when I finished.

My ladder wasn't high enough to reach the peak so my mounts are on the next two supports down. That means the antenna's just above the roof by a few feet rather than 8-10 feet above like I originally planned.

Unfortunately, the motor seems to have froze on the antenna. I tested it before installing it, but it was in the single digits last night by the time I got it up and below freezing overnight. Maybe it will work again once we thaw.

It's generally pointing in the right direction, but I only have the same handful of stations I had with the antenna inside by the window. That said, the stations are stronger and very clear. I'm expecting I'll get a few more when I can rotate it better. I can loosen the pole and rotate it manually - I might give that a try. It's not grounded yet, but I do have a ground wire attached.

Appreciate all the advice.

 

[Strouty]

So humor me, if you have internet at your home why do you need an antenna for TV/FM?

New smart TV, hooked to the internet means all the channels you could ever want. That and then you don't have to see an eye sore of antenna as well.

I don't get FOX at all, can't even get it with an antenna due to a large hill blocking the signal. I have internet and use a computer linked directly to a TV, that trumps a smart TV tenfold. I am sure I can find some random sketchy site that will allow "local" channels, but I am not interested in getting involved in questionable we browsing.

 

[BrendanBehan]

https://www.antennaweb.org is a good site to find directions of stations and their ability to receive relative to your location and elevation.

If you have a good antenna, rotor, and are in a valley with lots of multipath signals, you WILL spend lots of time dialing in the directions to get a signal for the various stations. You will be surprised (or disappointed) at what you pull in. They will likely not be in the same direction as shown on antenanweb but slightly off left or right. Lots of trial and error but a rotor is a must.

The picture quality of antenna based stations are the best there is. Cable, internet, everything else is junk because of compression. I always switch to antenna whenever possible.

Good luck.

 

[larry4406]

I found antennaweb to be useless for me. It’s free so no harm no foul. Tv Fool is much better and the other site I linked to I found to be much more helpful than TV Fool.

 

[Hiball]

I found antennaweb to be useless for me. It’s free so no harm no foul. Tv Fool is much better and the other site I linked to I found to be much more helpful than TV Fool.

Dunno.. I didn’t have any issues, it gave me the compass direction down to the degree based off my address to every station within range. I’m not sure what else a person would need, unless it was giving you bad information.

 

[larry4406]

Dunno.. I didn’t have any issues, it gave me the compass direction down to the degree based off my address to every station within range. I’m not sure what else a person would need, unless it was giving you bad information.

Clearly antennaweb gave bad info for me. Glad antennaweb worked for you. Said maybe 9 Channels. I currently get over 40 and still need to tune both bays on the antenna. Never hurts to use all the tools available.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I'd suggest finding out what channels you can pick up, I used antennaweb.org when setting up mine. My understanding with the digital signal used now is that it relies a lot on straight line for signal strength, where is Analog would follow valleys and provide a stronger signal for someone in your situation.

The lower analog channels (2-9) were very high frequency (VHF) and did "bounce" of off objects.

All most all digital channels are ultra high frequency (UHF) and are definitely more "line of sight".

In regards to splitters, everytime you split the signal there is a percentage of signal loss. I had to purchase a channel master booster to offset the loss created when going to 3 Tv's, all was good after it was installed.

This amplifier/splitter is what the cable company put in my house years ago and it works good.

 

[Hiball]

Clearly antennaweb gave bad info for me. Glad antennaweb worked for you. Said maybe 9 Channels. I currently get over 40 and still need to tune both bays on the antenna. Never hurts to use all the tools available.

Mine only showed like 4, but every one of the channels has a sub channel, for instance 8-1, 8-2 etc.. so I ended up with 13 different stations. I just wanted a bearing to set the antenna towards, I figured the rest would take care of itself.

 

[Diesel Dan]

So humor me, if you have internet at your home why do you need an antenna for TV/FM?

New smart TV, hooked to the internet means all the channels you could ever want. That and then you don't have to see an eye sore of antenna as well.

Don't have internet at home so this thread is of use for me.
Marginal data at location as well, most web browsing done in town now.
All the info regarding TV antenna is much appreciated as we will most likely have to get a tower as well. All steel roof doesn't play well with attic mounted antenna.

Was finally able to get someone at the AT&T store to pull up a more detailed coverage map for my location. As it turns out we have a dead spot slightly larger than our address that we fall in. The standard coverage maps show us having good/great signal but when the pulled up the tower maps it revealed our issue.

 

[Miss the Pontiacs]

When we moved into our house the tv antenna was in the attic.

When I was a kid and we had built a new home and the antenna went in the attic. Made a lot of sense 50+ years ago. Probably still does.

 

[ckucia]

When I was a kid and we had built a new home and the antenna went in the attic. Made a lot of sense 50+ years ago. Probably still does.

Really dig your screen name!

 

[paulm12]

KBS: I am in NW Chicago burbs as well. Can you provide any detail on the antenna you used?

thanks

Use as tall a pole as possible.
Use 2 antennas, one for each city. (They are cheap.)
Aim them as recommended.
Combine the wires from each antenna with a co-ax "splitter"
They work fine in reverse.

I an half way between Chicago and Milwaukee.
The above gives ne all the broadcast stations in either city.
The signal "search" function on the TV works just fine to find the channels.

 

[Miss the Pontiacs]

Really dig your screen name!

Thanks Bud

Someone was mentioning about putting up 2 or more antennas. At the lake we simply used one antenna and put it on one of those antenna rotor drives. Then when you wanted to change to another locale for your viewing you simply turned the control knob by your chair and it would pick up a total different carrier.

 

[larry4406]

Regarding 2 antennas, that’s why I chose the DB8e I linked. It is two, with a combiner, ready to go on a single mast. Point one bay one way and the other bay another direction. Also the range for me is quite amazing.

 

[kbs2244]

Sorry, I don't know the name or number.
My nephew did the install as a surprise when I was gone one day,
(My huge, old antenna had blown down and I was without TV)
We had talked about how to do it since his family was building a new house with the same "in between 2 cities" type location
I think he just got them at Wallies.
They are about 12x18 with one inch squares.
I am less than 50 air miles from either city center so I don't need an amp.

I went with 2 vs a rotor because I had had one before.
I spent too much time on the roof fixing the motor, control wires, etc.
With my set up there are no moving parts.
And it is cheaper.

 

[Diesel Dan]

Little update on this thread as I'm still using some of the links.
Installed my 25' tall, 1/4" wall galvanized light pole. Will have an RCA rotator up top for antenna, WeBoost cell booster, and up to four 1500W Metal Halide "yard" lights.
This is the antenna I just ordered: Directional Antenna
With an overall length of 93" it should help with cleaning up some of the signals.
Under ground runs of 2-RG6, quad shielded cable, comm cable for rotator and couple 12-2 runs for power.

 

[ronkz650]

Digital signal is not reliable due to weather conditions. Best antenna in the world works fine one day, next day-no signal. Wind is the worst. On a windy day, think about another past time, as the best antenna will be worthless. Turn the antenna with a motorized pole, and still one day reception will be fine, next day-no signal. The government mandate of Digital was probably the most stupid thing ever for use with an antenna. Not surprising though. No one should get free TV. Make it so unreliable to force everyone to pay. That's the only reason I can see.
I was in the TV business for 34yrs and installed 100s of antennas. I would rather be shot than take a job installing an antenna for Digital TV.

 

[i4ni]

When I was a kid we had 2 Tv's. One Black and white on top of the other and we rarely got all 3 channels switching leads between both of them. It was my job to go out and turn the antenna pole rain or shine, snow or fog. My mom drew the line at lightening. We didn't even have a telephone until I was in Jr. High. Not that it had to be that way but I'll leave it at that.

 

[Diesel Dan]

We currently have a cheap antenna mounted less than 1/2 the height (16' 2x4) of the new pole and get a decent number of channels.
Hard to think this new setup will be worse.

 

[58Yeoman]

We lost our OTA tv reception last week. The antenna is on a 40' tower, and I checked everything in the house, which was good, so I guess it's the preamp on top of the tower. The tower is made with a hinged bottom plate, and I put a pulley on top with a rope to raise another rope in case it had to come down again. Last year, I replaced the rope because it was weathered, and it came off the side of the pulley, so it's now worthless. I bought a new antenna and installed it in the attic and it pulls in all the channels we got before, and it's easier to get to. I'm trying to figure a way to get the tower down in good condition, as a ham operator is interested in it.

The rungs are 22" apart and hard to climb at my age, 73. I may try throwing a weighted rope to try and snag a high rung.

 

[Diesel Dan]

I bought a new antenna and installed it in the attic and it pulls in all the channels we got before, and it's easier to get to.

That's not a viable option for us since we have a metal roof.
It is also why we have to have an external cell phone booster.

 

[Mike65]

We do streaming through our internet provider. We only pay for the add On's we want. When we went from cable when we lived in NJ to streaming when we moved to Va we were able to slash our bill in half.

 

[larry4406]

We lost our OTA tv reception last week. The antenna is on a 40' tower, and I checked everything in the house, which was good, so I guess it's the preamp on top of the tower. The tower is made with a hinged bottom plate, and I put a pulley on top with a rope to raise another rope in case it had to come down again. Last year, I replaced the rope because it was weathered, and it came off the side of the pulley, so it's now worthless. I bought a new antenna and installed it in the attic and it pulls in all the channels we got before, and it's easier to get to. I'm trying to figure a way to get the tower down in good condition, as a ham operator is interested in it.

The rungs are 22" apart and hard to climb at my age, 73. I may try throwing a weighted rope to try and snag a high rung.

My father in law used to use a bow and arrow with fishing line tied to the arrow to get pull rope up high on trees. He used the fishing line to pull up the pull rope.

I have seen towers similar to yours but I don't have any experience with them.

 

[58Yeoman]

My father in law used to use a bow and arrow with fishing line tied to the arrow to get pull rope up high on trees. He used the fishing line to pull up the pull rope.

I have seen towers similar to yours but I don't have any experience with them.

I thought of that, but don't have a bow and arrow. Funny thing, at work years ago, there was a flare stack to burn waste gases, and it went out. Apparently, the ignitor failed, and one of the tech men tried to light it by shooting a flaming arrow at it. He never lit it, guess he wasn't an archer.