Two adults mess up epoxy-coat

[DGOZ06]

Our epoxy-coat is still sticky after 9 days. We ordered a kit & 1/2 to do our 3 car garage. Etched, de-greased, diamond grinded, de-greased & etched again. Then washed, rinsed repeatedly. After 2 days of drying with hi-capacity fans we thought we were ready. We read directions & watched the video & thought we followed directions to the letter. We pre-mixed part A, used the small-batch side of the large stick to mix in the large bucket. Even put a big X on the stick side we didn't want and a "yes" on the side we needed. We applied the epoxy in 6 10x10 sections and had just enough part A to the drop. But, we ended up with a strangely large amount of part B left and that's when we started to scratch our heads & cross our fingers.

Well, we are now left with 1 section that hardened well, 4 sections that are tacky but coming around and 1 section that is very tacky & not progressing at all.

Has anyone else messed this product up and known exactly what they did wrong? Chemistry tells me it is too little Part B, but with 2 people watching the stuff pour in the bucket to the first line, I'm having a hard time thinking 4 eyes could be so wrong.

We're hoping at worst we'll need to remove only 1 section & re-apply. But what if we do the same thing wrong again (whatever it was). Has anyone had to remove this stuff? How is it removed and what kind of re-prep is needed?

Christine at Epoxy-coat has told us to go away on a planned vacation & call her upon return. We hope we'll have good news for her.

 

[Drew_flux]

i think its going to dry, but just take a while. what do the distructions say about heating the space? wonder if some heat will speed things up.

 

[buzz4041]

If your humidity is high it will prolong dry time drastically.

 

[Edger]

I do not think it will ever go hard. There was a similar post last month, can you do some searching and email them about their result.

There have been other posts about wrong mixing just like yours, try searching for those too.

 

[Garage Flooring]

I have seen this a lot with epoxy. I created the brand EpoArmor back when I owned JNK and I saw it happen with that product and many others. The problem is not the epoxy. First and foremost, mixing is likely the issue. You need to make sure you get all the product out of the cans and then mix it with a drill mixer. If that is the case you may want to talk to the manufacturer as they may be able to get you a product that will cause it to dry.

It could be humidity or moisture in the floor. Did you do a moisture test?

It could also be an issue with poor prep --specifically residue from cleaning the floor...

 

[radchad3]

i personally think Epoxy-coat should do away with the "stick method" of measuring all together! It seems that there are a fair amount of posts of tacky floors secondary to wrong mixtures. I think getting measuring buckets and mixing in exactly 2 to 1 ratios is the only way to see and do this correctly. Sorry for your troubles! Chad

 

[gatchel]

i personally think Epoxy-coat should do away with the "stick method" of measuring all together! It seems that there are a fair amount of posts of tacky floors secondary to wrong mixtures. I think getting measuring buckets and mixing in exactly 2 to 1 ratios is the only way to see and do this correctly. Sorry for your troubles! Chad

I have to disagree. I thought the stick method worked very well.

 

[z28dad]

What would be a better way to mix the product? I know Lowe's sells those plastic buckets with markings on the side for # of oz. Does anybody know what the oz's are for part A and B for a single batch?

DGoz06, I hope it works out for you. I'm getting ready to do my floor soon. I have seen post like these, but many of them are not followed up with a conclusion. Some have said that theirs did eventually harden up.

One thing that does come to mind regarding the paint stick measurement, if I read it right you have to pour part B first, then add part A.

 

[PeterT]

Buy a $10 mixer and use in your recarcheable drill. Mix for a minimum 90 secs..

 

[rugerlady]

You also can use measuring buckets. For our product specifically, each batch consists of 1/2 gallon Part A and 1 Qt of Part B.
This is a ratio problem not a mixing problem. If it was a mixing issue they would have areas in the batch that were sticky and some that were cured. If the entire batch is sticky it is a ratio issue.

 

[fjr04]

I believe that the portions of A vs. B are off. Also thoroughly mixing the Part A before measuring out and mixing with B vigorously is important. The 2 liquids don't want to naturally blend so beating them together with the mixing rod and a power drill is the key. I just finished up with my 900 sq. ft. garage using 4 separate batches of the Epoxy-Coat product. It was tacky 1 hour after application and after leaving the house and returning 6 1/2 hours later it could be dented with a fingernail but hard for walking on.

 

[tncatadjuster]

Mixing with a stick is not for everyone, many just don't know what is required.

A simple electric egg beater with only one beater inserted makes a great mixer for small batches, and can be had a garage sale or thrift market.

 

[CAOS]

We have a piece coated with a two part epoxy at work, the mixture was wrong and a few years later it is still tacky!

 

[pd59]

Our epoxy-coat is still sticky after 9 days. We ordered a kit & 1/2 to do our 3 car garage. Etched, de-greased, diamond grinded, de-greased & etched again. Then washed, rinsed repeatedly. After 2 days of drying with hi-capacity fans we thought we were ready. We read directions & watched the video & thought we followed directions to the letter. We pre-mixed part A, used the small-batch side of the large stick to mix in the large bucket. Even put a big X on the stick side we didn't want and a "yes" on the side we needed. We applied the epoxy in 6 10x10 sections and had just enough part A to the drop. But, we ended up with a strangely large amount of part B left and that's when we started to scratch our heads & cross our fingers.

Well, we are now left with 1 section that hardened well, 4 sections that are tacky but coming around and 1 section that is very tacky & not progressing at all.

Has anyone else messed this product up and known exactly what they did wrong? Chemistry tells me it is too little Part B, but with 2 people watching the stuff pour in the bucket to the first line, I'm having a hard time thinking 4 eyes could be so wrong.

We're hoping at worst we'll need to remove only 1 section & re-apply. But what if we do the same thing wrong again (whatever it was). Has anyone had to remove this stuff? How is it removed and what kind of re-prep is needed?

Christine at Epoxy-coat has told us to go away on a planned vacation & call her upon return. We hope we'll have good news for her.

I can safely say the problem is not enough hardener. Sounds like at least the one section will need to come up. A couple of times in the past, I have had a new guy on my crew mixing and forget to add hardener in a batch altogether. We used flat drywall scrapers to scrape up all the bad epoxy, and then used xylene and rags to wipe up the rest. You need to get ALL of the uncured material off of the floor. Then, do another batch. Go to home depot and buy some of the marked mixing containers in the paint dept. and measure out your batch.

You may get lucky on the other 4 sections, but 9 days is a long time. Cold temps won't slow it down that much, and as crazy as it sounds, humidity will actually help cure times. I did my floor in the winter time (south Texas winter, around 45 degrees at night), and my second coat took about 14 hours to set.

Good luck to yall. I hope for the best.

 

[matty d]

I am going back and forth between epoxy and RaceDeck. Epoxy catches my eye and is more cost effective but when I hear about horror stories like this....I hope your epoxy floor turns out well and dries OK...

 

[jerethemiah]

I felt the stick measurement method was tricky too. I bought my kit from Lowe's and it was a tall black 6 gallon bucket. We used the smaller batch side of the stick and felt it was hard to see the level all the way at the bottom of a dark bucket tall 6 gallon bucket. I also had 4 eyes checking the level as we mixed, and luckily mine didn't turn out tacky but we did mine in 4 sections. The 1st section is nice and glossy wet look to it, the other 3 sections have a shine to them but it's more dull. Its hard to explain. I'm not sure if it's a mixture issue or drying affect. I'll try to post a pic. A measuring cup would have been easier, to ladle it out of the partA/B buckets and mix in the larger one. I'm **** about things like that especially on an expensive floor coating. Looking back on the process we did a lot of:
Friend: "A little more? or does that look like it's level with the line?"
Me: "Uhh, maybe a little more?"

Hope yours just needs longer dry time and turns out.

Maybe epoxy-coat should include in the printed instructions the partA/B measurements for the large and small batches.

 

[Quantum Coatings]

I've seen the mixing stick method end up with problems before. One of the biggest causes for error with this method is the container being mixed in. A standard 5 gallon pail does not have straight sides, and usualy not a completely flat bottom. For an example, using a mixing stick marked at 6 and 12 inches and water, I found that our pails took 7.7kg to fill to 6 inches, and 8.65kg to fill from there to the 12 inch mark. Thats more than a 10% difference, which is a huge variance from the desired ratio! We discovered this when one of our customers complained of mysterious 'vanishing' iso, every few pail sets he would have an extra pail of resin left over. He was baffled but on looking into it we found out he was using the stick method, switching to measuring pails fixed his issues.

We use cheap plastic mixing pails that have graduated sides (see attached photo) for the various mix ratios our products use. If you look closely you can notice the lines are not evenly spaced, as they take into account the sloped sides as the level in the container increases. After the material cures you can pull it out and re-use over and over. Using two equal sized containers and mixing in another container works well, but is more messy.

If you are using the stick method, it is very important to add the hardener component second! If the sides are sloped and you end up adding more, you always want more hardener, never more resin!

 

[Ron Lombardo]

Turn on the heat ...

 

[ManxRacer]

I've been watching these posts pretty carefully as I have three epoxy-coat kits and three clear-coat kits that I've not applied yet. I prepared the floors and was ready to put the kits down, but the temperature went to 100 degrees the day I wanted to put it down, then the humidity went over 90 the next day.

I'm now on travel, but plan to try to put the kits down in early October.

RugerLady, if you're reading this, I've had the excess flakes boxed up and on my porch for pickup for weeks. I'll probably just pay for postage and ship them back to you.

 

[A**holes Garage]

Some projects are worth paying a few extra bucks for others to do, and warranty.

Good luck.

 

[PontiacFan]

Location?
Temperature?
Humidity?
Mixing container type?
Too many unanswered questions & the guy doesn't appear to have returned from vacation yet, ...

We need an update!!!!

 

[DGOZ06]

Well, as predicted we still have two 10x10 areas out of 6 sections that need to go. The rest looks wonderful. In thinking back we wonder if the bottom of the bucket was bowed up causing us to use less part B. We used electric hi-speed drill for mixing, used an electronic timer.

We'll use some of the ideas above to get the stuff off and then re-apply. this time we will use something other than the bucket provided to measure.

We still think we went above & beyond in planning & execution. We're not total novices - one of us has over 30 years experience working with concrete, stains, etching, etc. But this was the 1st time with epoxy application. Maybe we were too confident. My advice - this is a project that probably goes better the 2nd time you do it... Kind of like ***. And we'll be too tired this weekend after scraping a floor for ***.

 

[DGOZ06]

P.S. Application weather was near perfect with low humidity, mid to upper 70's day and night. 27 year old garage slab was well prepped and tested negative for moisture. Used mixing containers & stick (both "large") provided by Epoxy-coat.

 

[DGOZ06]

Update today - we found a shotblaster to rent and think it will be $250 well spent to save time & body parts. We'll still have to scrape as much goo as we can before shotblasting and will hand-grind the wall edges & curbing.

Not ready yet to give up and this is our chance at one more tool-toy to try. Hope to be able to park vehicles in the garage before the snow flies. If we ever get this right, we want to install vinyl base. The diamond-plate wall cabinets will have to wait as we're now over-budget on the floor. Stay tuned next week for another episode in the saga.

 

[ssathre]

we just finished our epoxy coat project last night. turned out pretty good using the stick method. I might be wrong but one thing that I think might cause an issue is mixing on a unlevel surface like on a driveway with a slope. we made sure to have the mixing bucket level and had no problems. ymmv.

 

[blue dog]

Glad you got past this nightmare. Sorry to read about your troubles, now enjoy a cold beer and look at your hard work.

 

[DGOZ06]

Just a quick update- we tried to park a car on the "good" areas overnight and got tire marks of varying kind. All the way from just a slight scuff to downright coming up. After much gut wrenching, we decided to take up the entire floor. We stripped and grinded all the curbing and along all the walls today. Tomorrow is shot blasting day. We are still committed to re-epoxying it with Expoxy-Coat but maybe we could be talked into something else. After this adventure, we aren't sure we want to try again. Hiring a professional to do the application is on the table as well but damn it, we should be able to do this!!!

 

[rugerlady]

You CAN do this. Call me when your kits arrive and I can help you with a couple things.

 

[ishiboo]

I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you.

 

[Hottrod]

best of luck, looking forward to some stellar results!

 

[z28dad]

Just wanted to thank you for this post. It got me questioning my mixing ability with the stick. Talked to Christine over the phone and she gave me the mixing ratio. I ended up using two containers for the base, one for part A and one for part B. I re-used them for all my batches. Switched to new ones for the clear. To me this was way easier than the stick method. Beside the extra cost was less than 15 bucks. I still mixed both parts together in Epoxy Coat's provided bucket for each batch.

FWIW on my full kit I had about 0.5 quart of B left over.

Good luck on your project. I'm looking forward to seeing your progress.

 

[rugerlady]

We usually always overfill the Part B buckets, just to make sure no one runs out of the hardener.

 

[DGOZ06]

We shot blasted yesterday (and into the evening). Used a "Blastrac" walk-behind unit with an 8" swath. This is a nice, easy to use machine that is very similar to using a commercial carpet shampooer. We rented it from a local contractor tool rental company. Rental cost was around $300 and worth every penny. It left a dry fully prepped surface - in the areas where it worked.

The one section that was sticky needed to be hand-stripped using Zip Strip and scrappers, then several applications of zylol and rags. After getting the majority of the goo off, we let it dry & then went over the area with the shot blaster.

We were glad to see how well-bonded the epoxy was. That made us even more sure that our mess-up was due to mixing ratios and that we can easily correct it next go-round.

Thank you to the previous poster for your encouragement and also the photos of the marked mixing containers. We also thought of testing the stick & bucket with pre-measured water to see how close they were to the desired ratio.

Also, thank you Christine from Epoxy-Coat for lending your shoulder to cry on. If you want to come to WI this weekend and help us you are more than welcome. However, you will need to listen to the Packer game instead of the Lions.

 

[DGOZ06]

Re: Two adults mess up epoxy-coat- Round 2

Fresh kit and a half arrived from Epoxy Coat. Ready for round 2 this Sunday. Glad we kept the list of misc supplies & tools to gather up from the last attempt. And of course we have added callibrated measuring containers this time. Wish us luck!

 

[rugerlady]

Good Luck, call me if you need anything, my cell will be on (I'm oncall all weekend, my number is on the website)

 

[Dragster Racer]

I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you.

Love the movie quote.

 

[buzz4041]

Boy I'm glad my encounter went smooth as silk. I used U-coatit though.

 

[NitroPress]

Epoxy floors are something for pros to do using pro materials. There are just too many variables for even an experienced DIYer to be certain of getting the result he wants, and materials intended for pro purchase and use are light-years more difficult to manage than the ****-in-a-box from Lowes. It's not something you can just wing your way through and you're likely to get a satisfactory result only if (1) everything miraculously goes right and/or (2) you have very low standards...

Up your budget for the floor by 50% and call a pro.

 

[BL50]

Epoxy floors are something for pros to do using pro materials. There are just too many variables for even an experienced DIYer to be certain of getting the result he wants, and materials intended for pro purchase and use are light-years more difficult to manage than the ****-in-a-box from Lowes. It's not something you can just wing your way through and you're likely to get a satisfactory result only if (1) everything miraculously goes right and/or (2) you have very low standards...

Up your budget for the floor by 50% and call a pro.

I'm afraid I'm starting to agree with you. I was going to try to get my floor done before winter but after reading a few of the horror stories over the past year I think I'll save a few more bucks and have the pros do my floor next spring.

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

I'm afraid I'm starting to agree with you. I was going to try to get my floor done before winter but after reading a few of the horror stories over the past year I think I'll save a few more bucks and have the pros do my floor next spring.

Horse Pucky.

When you weigh the amount of sales that are made vs. the percentage of "floors gone wrong" the odds are extremely good that you will produce an outstanding end-result.

Very few post the successful floors and nearly all the "floors gone wrong" hit this site.

I am speaking for our company only. However, I would imagine Ruger-Lady (Chrsitine) has a similar story to tell.