Ugg merry Floodmas!

[bmxdukie]

Merry Christmas folks.
Our day started with 1" of water in our basement. Seems the sump pump float failed! Ugg.
That said all cleaned up and my back up pump dropped in place running to beat the band.
I had the floor epoxied a few years ago due to thinking the worst all the time.
So drywall is 3" off the floor so no damage there. Icf foundation. Baseboards are toast.
What would others recommend that i use in place of baseboards that would be waterproof?
The other idea is to fill in the basement ( we have 9.5' ceilings) and make it into a crawlspace. Its only the wife and i here. So the space is finished, but very rarely used.
Thanks in advance.

 

[sberry]

Take baseboards off, add another pump as a backup.

 

[PassnThru]

What is filling the 3" gap between the drywall and the baseboards? I don't have a basement so I'm not familiar with these things.
As for the baseboard, even if you found something that was waterproof wouldn't you have to worry about what got between it and the wall? I think I would rather sacrifice the baseboards when it happens rather than worry about what might be lurking behind them. Seems like you would want to pull them anyway?

 

[loganb]

Converting it to a crawl space seems rather expensive as it will cost money to do it, likely lower resale value and still may not solve the problem

Put in a dual pump setup with the secondary on battery backup and a separate float.

Install a basic flood warning alarm wherever the water starts draining when it comes out of the sump well

Install 6" vinyl cove base for the walls

Set an annual calendar reminder to check the pumps, clean debris out of the well and verify things are working correctly.

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[nadogail]

Vinyl cove base and a high water alarm.

 

[CombatNinja]

Unless you feel that it is legitimately adding value to the home (vast majority of 'finished' basements do not in my experience), just 'unfinish' it, chuck all the **** in a dumpster and just let it be the bare basement it once was. You flatly stated that with just you and your wife in the home, it is seldom used. No point in paying for the care and feeding of a space that provides you no benefit. Simplify simplify, simplify...

Disclaimer for my statement above about 'finished' basements: the majority of them are done in some way to make them habitable but they are often not finished to the same standard as the rest of the home. That, and they are one of those jobs that are quite often not permitted such that it is not on the tax assessment as Gross Living Area either. Don't get me wrong, I finished one of for my kid brother (I was 18 years older) and he and his buddies got a lot of use out of it. It was perfect for him at the time. But he grew up, a flood came and I did my Mom the favor of ripping it all out and returning the space to baseline. She was a single woman living in a 2200 sq ft home, she had no need for a finished basement.

 

[Jlbc212]

Unless you feel that it is legitimately adding value to the home (vast majority of 'finished' basements do not in my experience), just 'unfinish' it, chuck all the **** in a dumpster and just let it be the bare basement it once was. You flatly stated that with just you and your wife in the home, it is seldom used. No point in paying for the care and feeding of a space that provides you no benefit. Simplify simplify, simplify...

Disclaimer for my statement above about 'finished' basements: the majority of them are done in some way to make them habitable but they are often not finished to the same standard as the rest of the home. That, and they are one of those jobs that are quite often not permitted such that it is not on the tax assessment as Gross Living Area either. Don't get me wrong, I finished one of for my kid brother (I was 18 years older) and he and his buddies got a lot of use out of it. It was perfect for him at the time. But he grew up, a flood came and I did my Mom the favor of ripping it all out and returning the space to baseline. She was a single woman living in a 2200 sq ft home, she had no need for a finished basement.

^^^ This! I moonlighted for many years as a residential designer. I would never recommend finishing off a basement space to anyone who came to me for advice or a plan. And please don't build a crawl space floor over the existing concrete floor. This is the type of space that mold, mice and other vermin view as heaven!

 

[SJay3660]

I have a Honeywell water alarm on mine that sends me an email if the water gets to high. I also have a Wyze camera pointed at it so I can visually check on it.

Basement is partially finished and I put 4" vinyl base on mine

 

[CraigStu]

SimpliSafe alarms have a module to detect water. $19.99 each
https://simplisafe.com/build-my-system

 

[yeldogt]

PVC baseboards

 

[NORDFORD]

I love basements when done properly. Remember, it’s not the basements fault you didn’t check/inspect your pump. If your house is graded properly and your drain tile was done correctly, you shouldn’t have issues.

Most of the water issues I see and deal with are lack of maintenance or understanding what it actually takes to maintain a home.

OP not saying you are lacking overall maintenance, but you should be checking your pump monthly.

 

[Petvan]

Similar to others above, have a basement prone to leaks due to high water table and being near a very big lake. When we purchased the house we removed the sump hole with its single stick pump and replaced it with a deeper basin, two pumps the second of which drains via a different egress and is powered by a high quality batter backup with a marine battery. Also have the honeywell water alarm which has come in handy (when the furnace coil froze).

Well worth it to keep the water damage at bay.

 

[jkeyser14]

You can buy PVC baseboards.

 

[Northislander]

Heres a link to a water powered sump pump if your on city water these are a great backup to you electric sump pump.

https://www.google.com/aclk?sa=L&ai...icv8avjeztAhWM9Z4KHY-PD0YQ9aACegQIERBD&adurl=

 

[joey1320]

I would recommend a second sump pump, preferably a battery powered one. I would also recommend a water alarm to warn you if the water level has risen past the pumps, some are even wifi so you can connect them to your phone for warning you anywhere.

You can also build a retaining wall around the sump pit with enough floor clearance for a water pump that can be used only when needed.

There are many ways to go about fixing flooding issues if you're willing to entertain them.

 

[jimindm]

We live not far from a river. When the river gets high, our water table goes up and we get water into the sump.

We added on and included a full size basement in the new part, about 20 years ago. The old part of the house still has the duck under everything type of basement under it.

About 15 years ago we went through a 500 year flood for the river. The river stayed in its banks, but the water table went way up. The old basement experienced just a little water coming out cracks in the floor. Running right over and down the floor drain.

The new basement, which is about three feet lower was a mess. Our pump did not quit, but it could not keep up. At the river crest we has five pumps in the sump well and the top one quit cycling off and on. We did not have a lot of water in the basement area, but there were times we did not catch it in time to add another pump. We really sort of rethought how to fix it for the future.

Fix it may not be the right word, but rather deal with it better. We now have two permanent pumps in the pit. Both plumbed separately and both wire on separate circuits.

We took about four feet of the drywall out at that time. Cut the insulation off. We then added the Styrofoam type board. We have an 18 inch plain cedar board for the base. The foam board we cut so we could just get it out of the stud cavity, with the base pulled.

Numbered every cavity and piece of foam board. If it happens again, we can just lay it out to dry and clean if we have to and install it back where it goes.

We have never seen water coming in through the walls. It is always been through floor cracks. Of coarse by that time the pumps are running very regular in the pit.

I have the two pumps in the pit, one just a little higher than the other. I also have two identical pumps, all plumbed and ready to install. I have some heavy duty rubber couplers, that make it a job that take just a few minutes. I also have two new identical pumps in the box sitting on the shelf.

I actually ran some pex to install a water powered back up pump. All in all, I decided to more than they could pump, it would be a waste. I just put a faucet on the pex. I can just open it and fill the pit on a monthly basis to make sure everything works.

We have had a few 100 years floods since we have done this, and it seems to have worked. We also have the water alarms too.

I would say about the only thing left that we have talked about is a whole second pit in the opposite side of the basement. If we do that I would have the same pump set ups I have in the first one.

Of coarse if power goes out we may be in trouble. I do have a generator and have it sort of ready to run if needed. We have also talked about a whole house generator that would kick on with an outage. What we have now only works if some one is here to do it. No automation at all.

 

[DGersic]

Merry Christmas folks.

Our day started with 1" of water in our basement. Seems the sump pump float failed! Ugg.

That said all cleaned up and my back up pump dropped in place running to beat the band.

I had the floor epoxied a few years ago due to thinking the worst all the time.

So drywall is 3" off the floor so no damage there. Icf foundation. Baseboards are toast.

What would others recommend that i use in place of baseboards that would be waterproof?

The other idea is to fill in the basement ( we have 9.5' ceilings) and make it into a crawlspace. Its only the wife and i here. So the space is finished, but very rarely used.

Thanks in advance.

Rubber baseboards are impervious to water.



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[23ford]

What about the area around your home? Is ir slanted away from the home? French drain?

 

[NUTTSGT]

Converting it to a crawl space seems rather expensive as it will cost money to do it, likely lower resale value and still may not solve the problem

Put in a dual pump setup with the secondary on battery backup and a separate float.

Install a basic flood warning alarm wherever the water starts draining when it comes out of the sump well

Install 6" vinyl cove base for the walls

Set an annual calendar reminder to check the pumps, clean debris out of the well and verify things are working correctly.

Sent from The Garage Journal mobile app

This would be my plan of attack. My parents have a nice basement and I would kill to have useable such as theirs. Not to mention 9 1/2 foot ceilings heights.


You have no damage other than baseboards, you're fortunate. Adding something vinyl or PVC and call it a day.

 

[n8n]

If vinyl cove isn't fancy enough, you could use plastic trim board in place of baseboard and then caulk the gap between it and the floor. Probably would need to use the same stuff for door trims to make it all look correct too. If I had a basement that required a sump pump, this is what I would consider doing.

 

[bmxdukie]

Ok, i should have included more info..
We have a Cummins back up genny. We have high water alarms, this is what woke us up.
We have an inside sump pump (not connected to drain tile) that manages under floor water. There is an outside pit that the drain tile is attached to with two pumps in there. One main and another back up pump.. one float came off and couldnt manage the volume of water. (We got about 120mm overnight)
I like the idea of making the basement basic. It is very nice to entertain and do e professionally. Two beds, 4pc bath. However, my wife and i will spend likely a total of about 15 hours a year down there. Pretty sure we will just keep it as is. As clean up is easy. But id like to mitigate any possibility of mold.
The pumps only run in the spring for about 3 or 4 days in thaw and when we have the heaviest of rains. Never after early April to about October.
I know that even the best back up that is mechanical might/will fail due to being a machine. So earlier this year i tied my 4" house drain tiles from the outside sump to the 6" field tile. Gravity with mechanical back up.. what i believe happened is the volume from the 4" tile ended up making the 6" field tile to be too much with the amount or rain we got.
So, monday I have a very good friend coming over with his excavator and we will put in a dedicated 4" to the low spot in the next field. Bout 150' away.
As for the basement. It is ICF foam foundation (waterproof) i think ill leave the drywall and put in either pvc baseboards or tile.
Any thoughts or other suggestions? Maybe backflow protection?

 

[NUTTSGT]

If the excavator is coming and you can do the black flow preventor easily, I'd say why not.


Sounds like a nice space, something the next people will appreciate and little cost for you to remediate.

 

[bmxdukie]

If the excavator is coming and you can do the black flow preventor easily, I'd say why not.


Sounds like a nice space, something the next people will appreciate and little cost for you to remediate.

Thanks. It is beautifully done.. when we built it we had entertaining i mind.. the only thing worth money down there are my pinball machines and pool table. Id post pics but I have to figure out to again!

 

[NUTTSGT]

Thanks. It is beautifully done.. when we built it we had entertaining i mind.. the only thing worth money down there are my pinball machines and pool table. Id post pics but I have to figure out to again!

Pinball and pool table ? 15 hours a year ?

Add a wood stove and that's where I would spend my entire winter after being in the garage.


You can attach your pictures from your computer.

 

[bmxdukie]

Here’s some pics.

 

[BombShelter]

You have a much bigger issue going from what I can tell with the limited information. Your north of me and everything is frozen here right now so getting 1” of water is extremely difficult, I’m guessing it’s more of a sewer back-up or busted pipe but I’d need more information. Does your pump normally cycle a lot? Does it run when it’s dry outside but there’s water in the basket?

Some other things I’d look for, is your sump drainage hose frozen in the snow? Must of the installers here just lay the discharge in the snow, some stretched out 20’+. This freezes and your pump burns out trying to pump the water that isn’t moving. Some just have a few inches of PVC sticking out above grade that dumps water right at the exterior foundation. With snow and ice keeping the discharged water from moving, the water finds it way right back into the home creating a recirculating system. Throw in some low temps and the freezing water keeps expanding the openings making the problem worse.

Does any water come through the walls, or did all of it come up from the sump basket? I’d look for any exterior pooling water, even on the far side of the connected garage. Get that water moving away from the foundation. The early foam installers terminated the foam at grade level with no flashing; water loves to go over the top and down. ICF is usually covered with either a layer of concrete or cosmetic façade and terminates near the top of the foundation. Both products didn’t get really popular here until around 2005 so I’m assuming your home is newer.

Lastly, filling in won’t help, it will be worse, stinky wet dirt is one of the nastiest smells and the vapors will rot your floorboards, the best course of action is to identify where the water is coming in. Having a few floor pumps might also help, they come in handy for everything. Home Depot’s Bucket Head Vacuum is nice, it’s cheap and it fits on their 5 gallon buckets, you can get a bunch of buckets and just swap the top when you fill one up. They tap out around 40 lbs (4 gallons) so you don’t kill yourself emptying them.

 

[bmxdukie]

You have a much bigger issue going from what I can tell with the limited information. Your north of me and everything is frozen here right now so getting 1” of water is extremely difficult, I’m guessing it’s more of a sewer back-up or busted pipe but I’d need more information. Does your pump normally cycle a lot? Does it run when it’s dry outside but there’s water in the basket?

Some other things I’d look for, is your sump drainage hose frozen in the snow? Must of the installers here just lay the discharge in the snow, some stretched out 20’+. This freezes and your pump burns out trying to pump the water that isn’t moving. Some just have a few inches of PVC sticking out above grade that dumps water right at the exterior foundation. With snow and ice keeping the discharged water from moving, the water finds it way right back into the home creating a recirculating system. Throw in some low temps and the freezing water keeps expanding the openings making the problem worse.

Does any water come through the walls, or did all of it come up from the sump basket? I’d look for any exterior pooling water, even on the far side of the connected garage. Get that water moving away from the foundation. The early foam installers terminated the foam at grade level with no flashing; water loves to go over the top and down. ICF is usually covered with either a layer of concrete or cosmetic façade and terminates near the top of the foundation. Both products didn’t get really popular here until around 2005 so I’m assuming your home is newer.

Lastly, filling in won’t help, it will be worse, stinky wet dirt is one of the nastiest smells and the vapors will rot your floorboards, the best course of action is to identify where the water is coming in. Having a few floor pumps might also help, they come in handy for everything. Home Depot’s Bucket Head Vacuum is nice, it’s cheap and it fits on their 5 gallon buckets, you can get a bunch of buckets and just swap the top when you fill one up. They tap out around 40 lbs (4 gallons) so you don’t kill yourself emptying them.

So no sewer problems. 5 year old build. In the country. Im POSITIVE now that its the fact that i tapped into the drain tile. Wasnt until this year and no probs. (First water in basement was builder forgot to put a pump in the provided space.)
No water at all from april till Oct..
No freezing , lines are under ground (below frost) except back up pump that is over land. with no backflow on them.
This thread was more about finding a baseboard solution that "could" handle moisture in the event of another failure.
The pumps havent ran since spring(save testing each month with the garden hose) until now. So this shows me the gravity drain was working until the whole pipe syestm was overwhelmed. So, i believe a dedicated line will fix it for the future. We have about 3-4' of fall for the 150'of run. But thats a guess. The transit will verify it.
Thanks for all and any help folks.

 

[GRivera]

If other houses in your area have finished basements not having one will hurt resale. And, your basement is very nicely done so it makes sense to solve your water issues and keep the basement.

 

[bmxdukie]

If other houses in your area have finished basements not having one will hurt resale. And, your basement is very nicely done so it makes sense to solve your water issues and keep the basement.

Grivera.. i agree completely. Thank you.
Its been a bit of a s@#t show last two days. However, we have very little damage. Few books, and just the shoe on the baseboard.

 

[CombatNinja]

How did all that furniture/pool table/pinball machines get by unscathed? Maybe the event was short lived and nothing sat in water for hours or days.

Glad you had minimal damage. That is definitely a nice basement.

 

[lorne]

PVC baseboards

This...


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[BombShelter]

Love the pins and concrete floor bmxdukie, I typed my reply (way before your 2nd response) early today but for some reason it took forever to get posted. My internet has been glitching for the last seven days, my friends have said the same, maybe the Solar Winds Hack?

You guys must do your drain tile different up there. Here an underflow basket needs to be tied into inside perimeter piping under the floor and sometimes it connects to an exterior perimeter footing drain. The inside pump then pumps it outside.

We can't do cisterns here (which it sounds like you have), a modest home might collect over 600 gallons on the roof with just 1" of rain

I alway recommend 6" or larger solid PVC (not DWV) drain pipe outside, there's less chance of freezing and critters blocking the discharge. Don't use the crappy corrugated coiled black pipe, it collapses, freezes or quits working when it gets full of stuff.

I think your problem is preventable, if it only happens in the winter, the point of entry could be near grade level. But if that cistern is close to the home that could also be applying water pressure pushing back towards the home.

I haven't seen an effective baseboard in my travels, I always recommend putting a spacer under the bottom plate and using a sacrificial baseboard, that way if the baseboard gets wet you pull it off and put another on, hopefully the drywall or wood doesn't get wet. There are plastic and foam trim but I've never seen it used in your application.

 

[bmxdukie]

Ive pulled off some baseboard and no drywall damage. (The bottom of the drywall is 2" ish off the floor.
Really got away lucky.
Was talking to my brother (mechanical engineer) he said likely by hooking up to the farm feed drain tile the water from the field hydraulically pushed back to the house and thus the flood.
So like we said, tomorrow the excavator is coming out, and a dedicated line to the lower ground(re:ditch) will be installed with the sump pumps as back up.
Some books got wet that were in boxes from my sons college days, and my pool table is sitting on rubber pucks as i was afraid of water might one day get in.. never trusted basements, never wanted on but the wife insisted.. she has now changed her mind.. ugg.