I'm looking for the "ultimate" tap & die set...a set that is complete and high-quality enough so that I won't ever need to buy another one. What recommendations do you have? My immediate need is metric, but a combined SAE/metric set would also be of interest. Bonus points for sets that also include thread clean-up pieces.
ultimte tap & die set?
- Thread starter scottmlew
- Start date
Merkava_4
Banned
When you say "ultimate," do you mean quality wise, or do you mean completeness? Because I can throw some high quality taps and dies at you that will cost you about $10K. 
Well I certainly would not look at Snap-on. I've had better success with my Craftsman set than my S-O. On a couple of occasions I broke a S-O tap, and had no problem taping the same item with the Craftsman. S-O taps are definately MUCH weaker than the Craftsman...just about to the point of being useless.
Since there's pretty much no question that you will eventually break some of the smaller taps, (no matter how carefull you try to be!), I would stick with a set where you can get replacements locally.
Since there's pretty much no question that you will eventually break some of the smaller taps, (no matter how carefull you try to be!), I would stick with a set where you can get replacements locally.
pjcforpres2020
Well-known member
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- Jul 14, 2009
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How about one that is of quality, and covers auto needs? Or just some brand names? I am going to need one as well... The shop I will be at has a good set for anyone to use, but that won't always be the case.
senlow
Well-known member
Greenfield is good stuff. If you are really interested in quality, get a set in high speed steel - not carbon steel. As Skyline mentioned, avoid Snap-on tap and die sets. They are not very good.
alex71
Well-known member
Find them at a garage sale. Lots of old timers selling their old greenfield stuff for next to nothing.
You'll still have to buy the metric (unless you get very lucky) but you'll get all the SAE stuff for pennies on the dollar.
here is a pic of my tap drawer, filled entirely through garage sales and CL. taps from #2 through 1-1/4"
You'll still have to buy the metric (unless you get very lucky) but you'll get all the SAE stuff for pennies on the dollar.
here is a pic of my tap drawer, filled entirely through garage sales and CL. taps from #2 through 1-1/4"
FYI Greenfield is now chinese. A company called Top-Eastern Group bought them a few months ago.
This is what pisses me off so much about Obama's waste of government money. Billions are flowing to banks, automakers, etc and it is just all disapearing. None of this money is making it into the hands of the average guy. Here you have a company that has been manufacturing products that people use, in america, for what 50-60 years? And they get sold to china for a little bit of cash. Obama's money needs to go to keeping these companies and their jobs in the usa. The only thing that is going to get this country back on track is if we start making things again. Our entire economy is based on basically BS -moving paper around and speculating. A strong economy is based on producing tangibles that people want and buy. Where did all the cash china has now come from? Here. Why? Because they make stuff. All the money that disapeared from our economy (house refis, credit card debt, etc), where is it? China. Why? Because we bought stuff with it.
</rant>
This is what pisses me off so much about Obama's waste of government money. Billions are flowing to banks, automakers, etc and it is just all disapearing. None of this money is making it into the hands of the average guy. Here you have a company that has been manufacturing products that people use, in america, for what 50-60 years? And they get sold to china for a little bit of cash. Obama's money needs to go to keeping these companies and their jobs in the usa. The only thing that is going to get this country back on track is if we start making things again. Our entire economy is based on basically BS -moving paper around and speculating. A strong economy is based on producing tangibles that people want and buy. Where did all the cash china has now come from? Here. Why? Because they make stuff. All the money that disapeared from our economy (house refis, credit card debt, etc), where is it? China. Why? Because we bought stuff with it.
</rant>
Nealcrenshaw
Well-known member
This set is very nice.Seen it at machine supply store.
Metric
http://www.toolplanet.com/product/M...l-TAP-Die-Set-MM-MIT-7561/tap-set-and-die-set
SAE
http://www.bosstoolsusa.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=4344
Metric
http://www.toolplanet.com/product/M...l-TAP-Die-Set-MM-MIT-7561/tap-set-and-die-set
SAE
http://www.bosstoolsusa.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=4344
When you say "ultimate," do you mean quality wise, or do you mean completeness? Because I can throw some high quality taps and dies at you that will cost you about $10K.
Well, my original post mentioned both quality and completeness...but in light of these uber-expensive sets you've mentioned Merk, I'll need to amend my question. I'm looking for a reasonably complete set (meaning that I'm very unlikely to find a size I need for automotive work that I don't have on-hand) and "very good" quality (meaning that I have a minimal chance of breaking one of them, and that I get a good quality thread).
Unfortunately, the "old timers selling tools" situation is not very good in my area...it used to be much better when I was in New England. So please keep the suggestions and comments coming!
Merk, just out of curiosity, can you link us to some of these uber-expensive sets, and provide insight as to why they command such a premium?
Merkava_4
Banned
Alright. . . you asked for it. . . you're gonna be sorry.
http://www.brubakertool.com/catalogs.asp#brubaker
Alright. . . you asked for it. . . you're gonna be sorry.
http://www.brubakertool.com/catalogs.asp#brubaker
Wow, I guess those are nice
Surely not cheap, but I wasn't seeing anything that would be $10K for a set 
I wouldn't recommend the Craftsman set. I have their largest set for $300. Quality is kinda crappy. They are only marginally better than HF low quality set and lower quality than HF high quality set. I am slowly replacing my Craftsman set with used high quality stuff from swap meet for a fraction of the price. The attached picture show low quality HF on the far left, follow by craftsman, then high quality HF, and then high quality swap meet. It is kinda hard to see.
Attachments
pjcforpres2020
Well-known member
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- Jul 14, 2009
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There are guys with tap and die sets that cost 3 times more than the 70 inch snap on boxes they fill. At a recent local auction a 56 inch snap on roll away filled with tap and dies, plus proper extras went for 15 grand, and retailed at over 40 grand new. Machinist grade complete sets are not cheap, and are very, very, very large! They also don't stop at just tap and dies, they include many other special instruments that are part of a real machinist tap and die set.
But those are for entire shops using them non stop, and typically meant for use with precision presses, etc.
But those are for entire shops using them non stop, and typically meant for use with precision presses, etc.
Dr. Bolt
Member
I have a large Hanson tap and die set I bought at a yard sale years ago, old and very good quality.
Merkava_4
Banned
Surely not cheap, but I wasn't seeing anything that would be $10K for a set
You start buying Brubaker HSS taps and dies and then add on the Starrett sliding T-handle tap wrenches, die holders, some specialized thread insert kits, screw extractors and then some cobalt drill bits and it gets you into the money real quick.
MXtras
Well-known member
No such tap or die exists.
Titex are by far the highest quality thread cutting tools you can get in my opinion and based on my own experience. They are very tough and cut very accurate threads but they do wear out.
Balax are good, too. MSC has them.
Scott
MXtras -- thanks for the concrete suggestions. I know it's a fallacy that they won't "ever" need to be replaced, but I think you understand the sentiment I was trying to express. I'm not looking for some cheapie that needs to be replaced after every other hole I tap!
-B-
Well-known member
Ultimate and set are not going to happen real taps and dies do not come as a set. the only set is a three piece set of the same size( "3PC. SETS CONTAIN 1 EA. OF TAPER, PLUG & BOTTOMING TAPS PER SIZE")
Start with the most common sizes you use get the three piece set then move on to fill in as you please.
Dies should be round and adjustable hex dies are for basic chasing only not thread cutting.
If all you want to do is chease threads you should not be looking a T&D's but chasers.
Start with the most common sizes you use get the three piece set then move on to fill in as you please.
Dies should be round and adjustable hex dies are for basic chasing only not thread cutting.
If all you want to do is chease threads you should not be looking a T&D's but chasers.
sberry
Banned
I just replace a couple with ones from the parts store, a new 3/4 die was under 10$ to replace an old one that last 25 yrs of hard use. I replace a 5/8 nf tap about the same, some like 3/8 where the use is hard and hi I just bite the bullet and get new as needed, a 4$ or less tap just isnt a big deal, bought a new one for one job the other day.
B, yes, this is an interesting viewpoint, and I'm sure there is a lot of truth to it. But I've been burned way too many times by not having the size wrench/bolt/socket/etc. that I've needed b/c I had the "common sizes", but not a set. Then the project is put on hold for days if not weeks, since I need to order the tool and then wait until I have time to engage on the project again.
From what you're saying, perhaps I should look for a "pretty good" set, and get really high-quality stuff in the sizes I anticipate needing the most.
gkring
Well-known member
I bought a nice Hanson set for about $300 that is metric and standard up to 5/8. Covers anything I need for auto work as a semipro hobbyist. Obviously we do not need the everyday pro sets, if we did we wouldn't have to ask here what sets to buy. Anything I need bigger than that I buy one at a time. I always try to buy the "better than most" quality of taps.
For you pros, what is the difference in round dies versus the hex style? Adjustability I assume?
For you pros, what is the difference in round dies versus the hex style? Adjustability I assume?
Uncle Buck
Banned
I am not pro, but one big advantage hex dies have over button dies is the fact that you can use sockets to hold hex dies, which you cannot do with button dies. Both types of dies can generally be adjusted with a screw, or the die stock itself, so adjustability is not generally an issue either. I do think that most higher quality dies are hex dies, and not button dies. Additionally, I also suspect most button dies are lower quality carbon steel, and most hex dies are better quality high speed steel.
tatra
Well-known member
i agree with b about the "sets" as he stated but have used taps and dies for chasing with no probs, with impact guns , and nuts pressed on the end of taps to allow standard sockets.........course this method has only served me fo 7/16 ths and up...............probabaly as important as the tools is the cutting fluid you use...........even wd40 is better than dry, in my experience............now b does a lot of bike stuff and as such i am sure uses more machine screws so can't comment on the use of taps and dies for chasing in that regaurd..............
sberry
Banned
I should get some pics, have them to 1 1/4 I think, even fine to inch.
-B-
Well-known member
That is reasonable thing to do
I have pretty much good supplies locally so I almost never wait on a tool or tooling.
yes but theyre chinese now. see my post on the first page
I bought some Brubaker taps (HSS) at the swap meet for 50 cents each. They are in mint condition. I also bought a 3/4 Wiley & Russell tap for $1. Wiley & Russell was bought by Greenfield in 1912. So this tap is old, but the quality is excellent.
Vinko
Well-known member
Who are the good German manufacturers of taps?