Upgrade to 200amp panel

[--TRACTION--]

I'm just starting the planning for upgrading my 100amp panel to a 200amp panel. The general idea is to replace the 100 with a 200 and use the 100 as a subpanel in the garage.

The 100amp panel runs everything in the house fine (smaller house) but right now I only have a single 20amp circuit feeding the garage (20'x24') and realistically that's not enough.

The run from the main panel will stretch under the house probably 80 ft and then 15ft underground to the detached garage.

I'm anticipating a small 220 welder, a stand up freezer, and twelve overhead 2 bulb florescent lights (bright!) plus enough general outlets to power tools, radio, TV, etc in the garage.

I'm looking for general recommendations for this project of what to include in the project, etc. My buddy is a licensed electrician and I'll be getting all the permits, etc. Overall I'm looking to do this as reasonably priced as possible but make sure it's to code and power enough for my purposes.

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[ishiboo]

I'm just starting the planning for upgrading my 100amp panel to a 200amp panel. The general idea is to replace the 100 with a 200 and use the 100 as a subpanel in the garage.

The 100amp panel runs everything in the house fine (smaller house) but right now I only have a single 20amp circuit feeding the garage (20'x24') and realistically that's not enough.

The run from the main panel will stretch under the house probably 80 ft and then 15ft underground to the detached garage.

I'm anticipating a small 220 welder, a stand up freezer, and twelve overhead 2 bulb florescent lights (bright!) plus enough general outlets to power tools, radio, TV, etc in the garage.

I'm looking for general recommendations for this project of what to include in the project, etc. My buddy is a licensed electrician and I'll be getting all the permits, etc. Overall I'm looking to do this as reasonably priced as possible but make sure it's to code and power enough for my purposes.

Any advice would be appreciated.

That's a lot of work... are you sure you need more than 100A? Very few people use more than 100A at once, especially with your list of items.

If you have a clamp meter, carefully measure each hot coming into your 100A panel during your "typical" household usage to see how many amps you have left.

I think you have two better, more cost-effective options:

1. Install a couple new breakers for the garage. 15A for lights (you are only using 8A with those lights), two 20A for recaps, and whatever's necessary for your welder - probably a double 20A.

2. Install a 60A breaker or so in your 100A panel, feeding a new sub-panel in the garage and fill the sub-panel with as many circuits as you want to create. Remember the garage panel can safely be a 70A if that's a convenient size for you, it will be limited to 60A by your main panel.

A lot of people are going to disagree with me here, but in reality VERY few people especially with "normal" sized houses these days use over 100A at any given time, especially with your description!

 

[ishiboo]

Sorry - based on the whole underground part I missed before I would go with option #2 to consolidate to a single line to the garage.

 

[tfi racing]

What is your location and type of heating(gas or electric),that will help in getting the correct advice.

 

[--TRACTION--]

In in Western Washington for location and my heating in the house is gas furnace.

If there's a way to do it correctly and it's cheaper that's fine. Keep the suggestions coming.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Sorry - based on the whole underground part I missed before I would go with option #2 to consolidate to a single line to the garage.

You cannot run multiple circuits to a detached garage, code does not allow it. One circuit (two hots, neutral and ground) are the most allowed under the NEC.

Considerations when moving the existing 100 amp panel to the garage. You must run four wires, two hots, a neutral, and a ground. They must all be separate at the subpanel. The neutral bar cannot be bonded to the panel and cannot be connected to the ground bar.

Currently, if you do not have a disconnect outside your HOUSE right now, and you depend on a 100 amp main breaker in you existing house panel for a disconnect, you can bet the ground and neutral are tied together in that panel, and depending on the panel, it may not be designed in such a way as to separate the neutral and ground. Hopefully, the neutral is insulated from the panel box. you could then add a ground bar. Where I'm going with this is that the existing 100 amp panel may or may not be suitable for use as the subpanel in the garage, and you need to investigate this.

You are also required to have a disconnect at the garage, being detached. If your panel has a main breaker, this will serve the purpose.

Charles

 

[VHF]

You might also consider having your new 200A service come into the garage and then make the existing 100A house pannel become a subpannel. You would need to run 4 wires between pannels and separate neutral and ground in the subpannel. This approach would likely reduce the amount of work required (wouldn't have to remove & replace pannel in house), but wouldn't give the house an upgrade, although a small house probably doesn't need more than 100A. This approach might make sense if the garage is near where the power comes in from the utility.

 

[--TRACTION--]

Unfortunately the garage is not near the power pole. It could be done but would require another overhead wire which I'd like to avoid.

Other than crawling under the house (tight space) I don't mind the work part. My buddy the electrician will be doing most of the technical stuff. I'll just be the labor part.

 

[hidollartoys]

Follow the recomendations of you electricial buddy.

 

[--TRACTION--]

Follow the recomendations of you electricial buddy.

Yeah I figured I would but thought I'd do a little homework to see if anyone has an experiences we could benefit from.

I checked out a Siemens 200amp panel kit at Lowes and will probably go that route and move the 100amp panel to the garage. The existing 100amp panel is full of breakers as is so reconfiguring it isn't really an option that I can see without combining circuits, no room to add breakers, etc.

Found out my feed is a 200amp feed already so that won't have to be upgraded at least. Can't wait to have the power in the garage!