USPS Insurance when shipping tools

[biscuit141]

Just curious, since a lot of us ship via USPS flat rate when selling tools to each other, do you insure the package? The chances of the tool getting damaged are probably slim, but what about if they loose it? Does it just depend on the value of the tool inside? I am always on the fence on whether or not to purchase insurance.

 

[Davefr]

Just curious, since a lot of us ship via USPS flat rate when selling tools to each other, do you insure the package? The chances of the tool getting damaged are probably slim, but what about if they loose it? Does it just depend on the value of the tool inside? I am always on the fence on whether or not to purchase insurance.

A couple comments:

1. The best insurance is proper packaging technique and labeling. (ex: don't put a heavy tools in a flimsy flat rate envelope)
2. Carriers rarely pay insurance claims for damage. Most of the time they claim the package was improperly packed to their standards. (ex: read UPS's standards - double boxed with 3-4" of padding and able to sustain a 5' fall with no damage to the contents).
3. Insurance may be useful for lost packages however I've shipped 1000's of items and have never had one lost. (some late, but never lost)
4. Consider self insuring. You'll be money ahead in the long run. (the only exception for insurance may be shipping a very expensive item.)

 

[biscuit141]

A couple comments:

1. The best insurance is proper packaging technique and labeling. (ex: don't put a heavy tools in a flimsy flat rate envelope)
2. Carriers rarely pay insurance claims for damage. Most of the time they claim the package was improperly packed to their standards. (ex: read UPS's standards - double boxed with 3-4" of padding).
3. Insurance may be useful for lost packages however I've shipped 1000's of items and have never had one lost. (some late, but never lost)
4. Consider self insuring. You'll be money ahead in the long run.

Thanks for the tips. I always over package my shipments so I am less concerned about damage and more concerned about a lost package. I have yet to have a package lost either, but there is always that "what if", I guess thats why its called insurance. What do you mean by self-insure, I have heard that term before but was never really clear on what it meant.

 

[Davefr]

What do you mean by self-insure, I have heard that term before but was never really clear on what it meant.

It means that the money I'd normally spend for insurance goes into my wallet. If and when there's a problem I'll take the loss.

Over time you'll save way more then you'll pay.

I apply the same concept to extended warranties. (never bought one, never will)

 

[wornoutoldman]

Your best insurance is delivery confirmation "I never received my item!" and tracking "where the hell is my item?" and also email the intended receiver the tracking info right away.

 

[pop pop]

With USPS, any service that will cause them to track the package will insure it gets there. If you just send general shipping where it isn't being tracked, you will eventually loose some. I have. Now I'll always buy one of their services that causes them to track. Holds them accountable. You can use insurance, signature required, whatever. Haven't lost one since.

 

[G1GRANDEUR]

I always pack my packages heavy-duty.

 

[GirlnAgarage]

I use insurance if the item or cost is enough for me to not want to pay out of pocket if it is lost. It's easier to pay a few bucks insurance than refund over $100 and be out the item.

 

[RKA]

Agree with what's been said above. I'll specifically add the only problems I've had is when the tools can be fished out of a small hole in the corner of the envelope or box. I've had a few instances with USPS where someone attempted to quickly tear/puncture the package and steal the contents. Dumb luck prevented them from doing it quickly without getting caught, so now I will zip tie the tool to a cardboard backer that fits the interior dimensions of the box it's being shipped in. This prevents them from fishing tools out of a small hole quickly. By the way I've had the same problem with envelopes appearing to contain cash or checks as well. And of of these issues were at 2 different mailing addresses in 2 different states, so I don't believe it's limited to my post office or anything. Just the nature of the beast, which in this case is USPS. Get a delivery confirm, pack it well, and 99.99% of the time there is no problem.

Going back to the original question...I don't insure for anything under than $150, and I'll absorb any issues that arise. But for anything more valuable, I'll usually pay up and make sure it's trackable as well. For anything more than $300, I'll use Fedex or UPS and insure.

 

[cbracer]

UPS insurance is practically worthless when making a claim. You'll spend more time arguing with them than the item is worth. USPS insurance is pretty decent from my experience. Never experienced FEDEX insurance.

One thing, when shipping USPS, always use delivery confirmation and your package will almost never get lost. Without that, your package might get lost.

 

[Flatintoone]

According to my ebay numbers, I've shipped probably 120-130 things-mostly tools-in the last 6 or 7 months. All USPS, 90% in flat rate boxes. What every one above said. The only time I paid for insurance was for a $130 pair of binoculars going overseas.

Haven't had a single problem. Not one.

If I did, I'd probably just offer a refund and move on with my life.

I do probably overpack-everything is wrapped in bubble wrap so no two things can contact each other. I think extra hard about shipping anything hard (i.e. a wrench, pliers) in an envelope, but if I do, it gets a single wrap of bubble wrap, then taped to a piece of cardboard before going in the padded envelope. I'd never ship a 1/2" drive ratchet by envelope.

Again, had zero problems to date.

 

[G1GRANDEUR]

I do probably overpack-everything

That's the word I was looking for. Yes, I over pack too.

 

[filtered]

For what it's worth USPS delivery confirmation only insures the package shows up, not it's contents. Twice i've had empty packages delivered to my house. Nothing you can do without insurance on it. They don't care, they won't call and check around for your items, they won't even refund shipping costs. I insure just about every package I send because USPS are incompetent morons that can't do the job they are paid to do properly.

Pay a couple bucks up front or give all the cash back, the choice is yours. I usually add the cost of insurance into the shipping quote.

 

[Packard V8]

UPS insurance is practically worthless when making a claim. You'll spend more time arguing with them than the item is worth. USPS insurance is pretty decent from my experience. Never experienced FEDEX insurance.

I usually add the cost of insurance into the shipping quote.

Agree, UPS and FedEx insurance is essentially worthless. I had two instances where while on a business trip I handed in a package at a FedEx office addressed to myself. I received it at my door, so only FedEx personnel could have stolen the contents. They never paid off in either case.

As near as I can tell, both FedEx and UPS have outsourced their claims department to some mental disability charity organization. If the phone is ever answered, their claims person can't grasp why we're having the conversation. If I did manage to get a claim opened, nothing happened. When I would call back, whomever answered couldn't find any record of the claim ever being opened. Their goal is just to wear you down and never pay for any lost or stolen packages.

The only thing I learned is grab the delivery person so he can't sprint away, look over the package carefully for any evidence of damage or it having been opened. If anything looks suspicious, refuse to accept it or sign anything. Once you've accepted the package, you're screwed.

Bottom line - I use USPS for most of my shipping and have only had one Flat Rate Box which lost the tools inside. I've redoubled my packaging efforts and hundreds more made it safely Only on larger, heavier items do I take it to FedEx.

One of our esteemed colleagues who sells here and on eBay, but who shall remain nameless, charges for insurance but never buys any, thus adds several percent to his profit margins. I noticed this when the USPS Flat Rate Box from him was just left at the door and no one here signed anything, no insured sticker on it. Obviously there wasn't the insurance for which he charged and I had paid.

jack vines

 

[timtim2008]

For what it's worth USPS delivery confirmation only insures the package shows up, not it's contents. Twice i've had empty packages delivered to my house. Nothing you can do without insurance on it. They don't care, they won't call and check around for your items, they won't even refund shipping costs. I insure just about every package I send because USPS are incompetent morons that can't do the job they are paid to do properly.

Pay a couple bucks up front or give all the cash back, the choice is yours. I usually add the cost of insurance into the shipping quote.

+1 i agree.... ive also received empty boxes

 

[bigcaddy]

According to my ebay numbers, I've shipped probably 120-130 things-mostly tools-in the last 6 or 7 months. All USPS, 90% in flat rate boxes. What every one above said. The only time I paid for insurance was for a $130 pair of binoculars going overseas.

Haven't had a single problem. Not one.

If I did, I'd probably just offer a refund and move on with my life.

I do probably overpack-everything is wrapped in bubble wrap so no two things can contact each other. I think extra hard about shipping anything hard (i.e. a wrench, pliers) in an envelope, but if I do, it gets a single wrap of bubble wrap, then taped to a piece of cardboard before going in the padded envelope. I'd never ship a 1/2" drive ratchet by envelope.

Again, had zero problems to date.

I pretty much do the same thing. I have plenty of free time on weekends after i get back from estate sales so i spend a good deal of time packing my customers items so the make it to them safely. They did pay for the service and expect the item to reach them in the same condition it was in when it left my garage.

I expect the same anytime i do internet shopping, why wouldn't they?

If an item is fairly inexpensive, i don't sweat the insurance. If its fragile or over 80-90+ bucks, ill insure since its only a $1 or 2

I usually pick up the items i sell for practically nothing so i'm not exactly losing money if i have to refund them the purchase price.

 

[Skyline]

If it's an item sold on eBay, their "Shipcover" insurance is great. Very little hassle to collect, it's cheaper than USPS insurance ($1.23 per $100) and can be used for international shipments. Takes less than 48 hrs to get paid on a claim. I self insure lower cost items, but anything over $75, and anything international, I insure.

 

[Plumber Crack Kid]

One of our esteemed colleagues who sells here and on eBay, but who shall remain nameless, charges for insurance but never buys any, thus adds several percent to his profit margins. I noticed this when the USPS Flat Rate Box from him was just left at the door and no one here signed anything, no insured sticker on it. Obviously there wasn't the insurance for which he charged and I had paid.

While it seems dishonest on the face of it, as you're expecting the insurance provided by USPS to be bought, if he is actually self-insuring as an earlier poster suggested, is there any difference? Insurance will only cover the declared value, and if the seller only "declares" the price you paid and reimburses you if there is a loss, can you expect anything more?

 

[Lkdelta]

Your best insurance is delivery confirmation "I never received my item!"
and tracking "where the hell is my item?" and also email the intended receiver the tracking info right away.

Absolutely..I have a "lost package"..never again without tracking and delivery confirmation
but putting all this on it ..and then "Brown UPS" is about the same $

 

[Packard V8]

While it seems dishonest on the face of it, as you're expecting the insurance provided by USPS to be bought, if he is actually self-insuring as an earlier poster suggested, is there any difference? Insurance will only cover the declared value, and if the seller only "declares" the price you paid and reimburses you if there is a loss, can you expect anything more?

Yes. Big difference. Shipping insurance is when a bonded third party (i.e. the shipping company) is paid an agreed-upon fee to guarantee delivery and a tracking number and insurance number is provided. For a seller to charge a fee and then "self-insure" is just jacking up his profit. What recourse would a buyer have if a seller here charged for insurance, didn't provide it and then stopped answering e-mails? Obviously, none. If the shipment was actually insured by the shipping company, even if the seller got run over by a beer truck, the buyer would still be protected.

jack vines

 

[W-Cummins]

What recourse would a buyer have if a seller here charged for insurance, didn't provide it and then stopped answering e-mails? Obviously, none. If the shipment was actually insured by the shipping company, even if the seller got run over by a beer truck, the buyer would still be protected.

jack vines

No difference at all, the buyer will not be protected. The insurance protects the shipper. If you call UPS after the item arrives smashed etc... they will come and pick it up that's all. They will only deal with the person that purchased the insurance and paid for the shipping. The only way UPS will pay the receiver for the loss, is if he is the one that pays and insures the shipment from his own account.

So if the shipper/seller doesn't refund the buyer it really matters little if they buy the insurance, if they are a crook they are a crook! Also as UPS takes their dear time to pay, the seller will probably be refunding the $$$ to the buyer LONG before they get the insurance $$ back....

William....

 

[mobiledynamics]

FWIW....I don't use USPS as their system *****, tracking is terrible, etc. I do think their flat rate is a steal depending on if you can fit it into the box.

FedEx ground ***** too as it's all franchise. NO quality control whatsoever.

This was about 7 years back. I can't recall the details....but USPS did PAY out $1800 on a claim and it was timely as well.

 

[Packard V8]

No difference at all, the buyer will not be protected. The insurance protects the shipper.

USPS insurance claim form definitely has an option to pay the buyer directly.

jack vines

 

[Davefr]

USPS insurance claim form definitely has an option to pay the buyer directly.

jack vines

A buyer should go after the seller. The seller can do whatever they want with any possible insurance settlements.

 

[purplezr2]

Who ever said that USPS,Fedex, and UPS doesn't pay insurance claim must have not gone about it very well, I have made claims with all three companies with no issues.

 

[mobiledynamics]

The UPS guidelines per double box, etc is very true......
I've never had to file with FedEx Express. They are great.
FedEx Ground...bleh, if UPS was not around, I would rather choose USPS over FedEx ground. This may be a regional thing, but FedEx ground out here are franchises and there is no quality control whatsovever

 

[Plumber Crack Kid]

USPS insurance claim form definitely has an option to pay the buyer directly.

According to the claim form (which will only come in to play _after_ the loss), it must be filed by the shipper. While the shipper could have USPS pay the buyer directly, if I was the buyer I'd want a faster reimbursement from the seller than that.

As a buyer, I think your best insurance is to pay with a credit card, either directly to the seller, or through Paypal. If what you get doesn't arrive/isn't as described, you can easily go to Paypal and/or your credit card company to get it resolved. I see insurance as protection for the seller, that the package will actually make it to the buyer.

I stopped trying to sell things on eBay when Paypal became the dominate form of payment (10+ years?). Prior to that people sent checks/MO's and were willing to wait for them to clear before the seller sent on the package. Feedback (at least as a seller) was important. Paypal made the transactions so much quicker, but it is far too easy for a buyer to screw a seller, and I've heard few to no stories of sellers prevailing when it happens.

I'll buy things with Paypal all day long now, and as long as the seller indicates ahead of time what the shipping/handling/insurance fees will be, won't argue with them (though I do get annoyed when the visible postage is much less than what they charged).

 

[Skyline]

While it seems dishonest on the face of it, as you're expecting the insurance provided by USPS to be bought, if he is actually self-insuring as an earlier poster suggested, is there any difference? Insurance will only cover the declared value, and if the seller only "declares" the price you paid and reimburses you if there is a loss, can you expect anything more?

When you use "Shipcover" insurance for an eBay package, and print the label through eBay, it will not show on the label that insurance was purchased. It will only show on the label if insurance is purchased through USPS. Since Shipcover is cheaper, and much easier to collect if something gets lost, I would guess many eBay sellers are using this instead of USPS.

 

[purplezr2]

According to the claim form (which will only come in to play _after_ the loss), it must be filed by the shipper. While the shipper could have USPS pay the buyer directly, if I was the buyer I'd want a faster reimbursement from the seller than that.

As a buyer, I think your best insurance is to pay with a credit card, either directly to the seller, or through Paypal. If what you get doesn't arrive/isn't as described, you can easily go to Paypal and/or your credit card company to get it resolved. I see insurance as protection for the seller, that the package will actually make it to the buyer.

I stopped trying to sell things on eBay when Paypal became the dominate form of payment (10+ years?). Prior to that people sent checks/MO's and were willing to wait for them to clear before the seller sent on the package. Feedback (at least as a seller) was important. Paypal made the transactions so much quicker, but it is far too easy for a buyer to screw a seller, and I've heard few to no stories of sellers prevailing when it happens.

I'll buy things with Paypal all day long now, and as long as the seller indicates ahead of time what the shipping/handling/insurance fees will be, won't argue with them (though I do get annoyed when the visible postage is much less than what they charged).

My mom shipped me some things, I filled out the claim as the receiver, and had a check in about a week. Did it all online. Uploaded pictures and linked an online amazon ad to show the retail price.

 

[Skyline]

Yes. Big difference. Shipping insurance is when a bonded third party (i.e. the shipping company) is paid an agreed-upon fee to guarantee delivery and a tracking number and insurance number is provided. For a seller to charge a fee and then "self-insure" is just jacking up his profit. What recourse would a buyer have if a seller here charged for insurance, didn't provide it and then stopped answering e-mails? Obviously, none. If the shipment was actually insured by the shipping company, even if the seller got run over by a beer truck, the buyer would still be protected.

jack vines

When I've had insured eBay shipments go missing, it's always been me as the seller who files the insurance claim, collects the insurance, then reimburses the buyer. If a seller does not answer emails, I don't think having insurance or not is going to make any difference, although it does make it an easier call for the seller to offer a refund.

It is the SELLER'S responsibility to get a package to a buyer with the contents intact and undamaged. Insurance or not, this is the seller's responsibility. So the insurnce only protects the seller, not the buyer. If the sale is through eBay, the Buyer Protection will in most cases protect the buyer as well, insured or not.

 

[Lone_Wolf]

I have made more than 100 transactions on ebay. No problems at all. Once I got refound from ebay, because seller never shipped item, he just disappeared! Most of world considered this part of Europe "wild east" with all its atributes: corruption, theft, fraud, bureaucracy....
But every package, for example from United Kingdomis 9 days after payment in my mailbox. Croatian post service is great! Once postman didn"t come 9-th morning, I went to post office same afternoon. Lady in post office gave me package personally, and apologized for postman. He stopped delivery because rain turned in "tropic storm". He was doing his delivery on motorcycle.
This is postman and his "motorcycle"

 

[930dreamer]

I was just notified by a eBay buyer, that he received my package with no contents. (2) 3/8" extensions & (1) 1/2" extension. I used a padded mailing envelope, wrapped and taped the tools and taped the seam. I have no way to prove it was empty on delivery, I didn't insure it either. Only thing I see I can do is a refund?

 

[Skyline]

I was just notified by a eBay buyer, that he received my package with no contents. (2) 3/8" extensions & (1) 1/2" extension. I used a padded mailing envelope, wrapped and taped the tools and taped the seam. I have no way to prove it was empty on delivery, I didn't insure it either. Only thing I see I can do is a refund?

That, and you have the option to add the buyer to your blocked bidder list. While one has to assume the buyer is being honest, who knows? Perhaps the buyer is honest, but has a tool thief in his local Post Office?

I just wish eBay had a policy where if you make it onto a certain number of blocked bidder lists, you lose your right to buy on eBay.

 

[930dreamer]

I going to start shipping items in the most convient way for me, flat rate USPS or nothing.

 

[jhelrey]

I shipped a guy $200 worth of Mac Wrenches. Long story short, I put them in a 4 inch PVC tube.

 

[930dreamer]

I shipped a guy $200 worth of Mac Wrenches. Long story short, I put them in a 4 inch PVC tube.

Cap the ends with pvc glue and you know the contents will be there on delivery.

 

[andywander]

It is the SELLER'S responsibility to get a package to a buyer with the contents intact and undamaged. Insurance or not, this is the seller's responsibility.

Well, actually that is not true. Once a shipper accepts the package, the buyer's responsibility, by law, is ended.

I found this hard to believe when I found out about it, but if you check it out, you will see it is true.

Now, most sellers will do everything they can for a buyer, even to the extent of taking a loss on a lost item, but they are not required to by law.

 

[jhelrey]

Cap the ends with pvc glue and you know the contents will be there on delivery.

as well as the bomb squad