Vernon machine Co. Lathe

[Lssix]

Latest find, pretty rare as far as I can tell.


Grinder stand doing admirable work!



And in its new home, like the garage was made for it lol.


And a sad casualty.



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[Lssix]

Some pics showing the general condition, the largest gear under the left cover has about six chipped teeth, the rest seem OK though.



Oiler for the rear bearing cap replaced with cotter pin? Sure, why not.


The rack has definitely seen better days, dont know what I will do about it just yet, if possible I may flip it so the good teeth are near the chuck. What are the odds that some other gear will slip right in?



Playing with this knob, seems Im missing a pin.



And that knob seems to apply this cone clutch, not sure what it drives as it has split nuts and a lever on the back of the apron for power feed.



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[Lssix]

Split nut and lever, like almost everything on this machine they are stiff but seem to work with a bit of muscle.



Only actual broken part so far, the broken lever cams the shaft and its gears into matching gears on either end of the head stock cone pulleys. Reverse I assume?

The gears are dry and rusty compared to the rest of the gear train and the shaft appears to be seized.


The small gear on the rear of the cone pulley, rotates freely a few degrees, again Im assuming here but that seems like a bad thing. Or is it meant to ease engagement on-the-fly perhaps?



Originally flat belt driven but oddly the PO had it running off a V belt riding directly on the shaft! Wonder what that drive ratio was lol.



The motor, half horse but a beast compared to any motor in my shop.

Has lots of axial play and a bit of radial play. Supposedly runs a bit but boggs hard when lathe is engaged. Rebuild?



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[larry_g]

RE: the knob, it is for carriage feed for cutting and the lever 1/2 nuts are for threading. Check closely on the missing pin to confirm if it is straight or tapered as tapered pins were common in that era. The knob and 1/2 nuts are similar to what my Sheldon has and I know that there was a buyout of the Vernon shaper by Sheldon but I do not know if the Vernon lathe was part of that or not...?

Good luck on your gears.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Lssix]

RE: the knob, it is for carriage feed for cutting and the lever 1/2 nuts are for threading. Check closely on the missing pin to confirm if it is straight or tapered as tapered pins were common in that era. The knob and 1/2 nuts are similar to what my Sheldon has and I know that there was a buyout of the Vernon shaper by Sheldon but I do not know if the Vernon lathe was part of that or not...?

Good luck on your gears.

lg
no neat sig line

Thanks for the info, features from Vernon lathes did seem to show up on later models of other manufacturers machines from what I have read. Probably another case of a small company innovating but not having the backing to compete with the big boys, typically they either fold and their designs start popping up elsewhere or they are bought out. I havent seen any evidence of the latter happening in this case though.



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[Lssix]

Now for the tooling that came with the machine! Everybody knows that the difference between a screaming deal and a meh deal is how much **** gets thrown in with the deal.



Um, score...right?

Apparently some stuff got rained on when the barn sprung a leak, no big deal really but I brought even the worst of the lot home just in case.



Might need a new chuck key.



This post has seen better days but theres a slightly smaller one on the machine thats in better shape,and I bet thats why this holder is ground down to fit the small post.



Not sure if the chuck can be or is worth being rebuilt.



Not sure if these even fit this machine, like the extra cover I just dont see where they would fit. That and they are a different style from the ones I can see in the machine, these are flat while every other gear is dished or spoked.



Knurling tool and what I believe is a threading tool?

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[Lssix]

As far as the "extras" I guess it was a bit of a meh deal, a lot of it is probably no good and some of it will need significant work to be usable.

The machine in person looks like a 12" swing to my amateur eye but if that plate fits I suppose it is the 14 incher I assumed it was to begin with.

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[tombell572]

Lssix-as larry g noted,Vernon Machine was merged into Sheldon Machine Tool at some point, I think in the 1930's along with Sebastian. Vernon also produced a nice small mill and shaper that continued essentially unchanged as Sheldon machines for the remainder of Sheldon's existence. I've never seen a Vernon lathe, but the apron controls appear almost identical to my 1938 Sheldon. I've own my lathe for over 25 years and it is a great, beefy small lathe. You may have a 1 3/4" threaded spindle nose which Sheldon used and is an obsolete size now but chucks do turn up on Ebay or you can always make your own backplate. Good luck with it.

Tom B.

 

[Lssix]

Lssix-as larry g noted,Vernon Machine was merged into Sheldon Machine Tool at some point, I think in the 1930's along with Sebastian. Vernon also produced a nice small mill and shaper that continued essentially unchanged as Sheldon machines for the remainder of Sheldon's existence. I've never seen a Vernon lathe, but the apron controls appear almost identical to my 1938 Sheldon. I've own my lathe for over 25 years and it is a great, beefy small lathe. You may have a 1 3/4" threaded spindle nose which Sheldon used and is an obsolete size now but chucks do turn up on Ebay or you can always make your own backplate. Good luck with it.

Tom B.

Yeah, from what I found its a 10tpi thread.

I have my eyes on a Cushman 3 jaw and already looked into making a plate for it.

I,ll keep an eye out for sebastian/sheldon parts in case anything is compatible.

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[Lssix]

Teardown started after lunch today, things are nit a pristine as I would have hoped.



After carefully dismantling and cleaning in mineral spirits as I went.

Change gears and related left side hardware is all out with the exception of the reverse lever mechanism.



Heres a mystery, the clutch had this taper pin all but fallen out, another hole presumably lost its pin entirely...

But upon closer inspection I find that the receiving part has a single hole that the pin hapilly engages with and two shallow recesses that bolt leave the pin unseated.


Im not sure what I need here, two shorter pins to engage with the recesses?



Both the gears here are worn to a sharp edge, likely due to the lack of lubrication in the area.

I suppose taking dimensions to fabricate new parts is in order as there are likely no oem parts to be found.

I bet this contributes to lots of lash in the system but for now they will have to go back in.

Sadly a bunch of pictures didnt get saved by my phone, the ways are pretty beat up in areas.

I'll search my self but does anyone have any ideas how I should go about making the ways as usable as possible? Last thing I want is to tackle it the wrong way and make them worse. I thing some careful work with a stone to knock town the high points from the dings without marking the rest of the metal is possible.

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[Lahti35]

Neat lathe! Fun to tinker with... I just picked a new lathe myself but its a Logan.

 

[Lssix]

Thank you, its my first foray into larger machine tools and im both excited and anxious about the work ahead.

Im thinking that at this point it will never be a great machine in terms of putting out a lot of quality parts but it'll certainly teach me a thing or two.



Rear inner way is really hammered in the chuck area, I may just have to note that and avoid running the carriage that far left.



The ways are not the only things that were apparently used as an anvil.

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[Lssix]

It occurred to me that the hammered section of way might not even be used with the carrage all the way to the left, certainly not under normal use with the 4 jaw I currently have for it.

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[larry_g]

Thank you, its my first foray into larger machine tools and im both excited and anxious about the work ahead.

Im thinking that at this point it will never be a great machine in terms of putting out a lot of quality parts but it'll certainly teach me a thing or two.



Rear inner way is really hammered in the chuck area, I may just have to note that and avoid running the carriage that far left.



The ways are not the only things that were apparently used as an anvil.

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Go back up and look at your OP. It looks like the carriage rides on the outer ways so the inner way being buggered is not an issue. On the compound the chipping is from running into the chuck or work that is in the chuck, perty normal.

As for general condition and the wear on the gears, it still has some life in it but shows that the machine did not get a lot of care and was run a lot. On the upside your getting a good education on the workings of a lathe and what to check out on your next one.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Lssix]

I caught that earlier today when I was in the garage, the rest of the ways in comparison are down right pristine so I may still be doing alright for having a functional machine.

As for learning what to look out for lol, I did spend several weeks reading up and watching videos on the subject. I went out there prepared to inspect the ways check the spindle for obvious slop etc but I dont think I did much more than lay my hand on it before I started discussing loading it up. Even before I went out I knew I was making an emotional purchase and unless it was broken in half I knew I was takin her home.



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[gehang]

Can I join your club?

Here's an operating 100(?) year old Vernon (Vernon machine corp of Wooster mass.) metal lathe. I wish I knew some more about the history of the company. I don't think it's the same Vernon as the one from California that made metal working machinery out west around mid-century.

Probably originally looked something like this:
w*ww.vintagemachinery.org/MfgIndex/Images/4766-A.jpg

I'll take some more pictures when I get the new belt on. The old one wore through over the last 20 some years since it was last changed.

i.imgur.com/YA9eVgH.jpg

 

[rsanter]

On that rack, flip it or you can.
If you can't, the common way to fix it is brass brase it up and file the teeth to shape.

There is also a high wear epoxy called moglice, it is for repairing machinery surfaces that will have contact wear on them.

Expensive but cheap verses the alternatives

 

[ttpete]

You may be able to buy new rack from Boston Gear. They also carry spur gears.

 

[ehhbuddy]

McMaster care had the best deal n spur and rack they look like they are supplied by Martin. 14.5 PA 12 DP 12 tooth spur and 12 DP .417 pitch line rack
I have an old Vernon myself
Turned down the rack driver and drilled and tapped a hardened Martin spur then pressed it on the turned down driver.
That lever that broke I believe is tied to the spindle brake it locks up the spindle.

Also if your lathe is a 12” swing as well it probably should be a 3/4 hp motor I’m assuming since that is what came with mine that could explain some of the bogging. I believe it is all original since my grandpa worked on this lathe in 1956 and it was the same then and he inherited it from his friend who closed his electric motor shop in Little Rock a couple years ago still runs well other than rack and spur driver worn well down.