Vertical Hardibacker shower install?

[The Money Pit]

Anyone used this stuff before? Just a few questions.

What to use for furring joints?

What to use to seal the joints?

 

[wilbilt]

They recommend using mesh tape embedded in thinset mortar for the joints.

I'm currently doing one with 2 layers of 1/4" backer, thinset in between, and staggering the joints.

The stuff tears up tools, that's for sure...

 

[dps]

You might want to check out USGypsum's Dens Shield, it's a heckuva lot easier to work with, especially if you're going to be putting a membrane over it and under the tile.

 

[Stephenw]

First, staple roofing felt to the studs, using caulk and 4" overlap. Cut your hardibacker by scoring with a utility knife and snapping it. I cut out holes by scoring with a utiliy knife and then knocking them through with the peening end of a ball peen hammer. Install the hardibacker with the special screws designed for the application. You should leave a 1/8" gap at the seams. Use fiberglass mesh tape and thin set mortar to fill the seams.

 

[The Money Pit]

So the materials I will need to install the hardibacker before I put up the fake tile sheets will include:

1. Hardibacker board
2. Correct screws/nails for installation
3. 2" fiberglass tape for corners
4. Thinset
5. Roofing felt
6. Caulk

Each board will be one continuous sheet from the top to the bottom because my shower isn't higher than 8' unless they don't make the board that size.

Am I missing anything?

I hate to pay someone to do this especailly if I can do it myself. I just don't want to screw it up.

 

[bmwpower]

So the materials I will need to install the hardibacker before I put up the fake tile sheets will include:

1. Hardibacker board
2. Correct screws/nails for installation
3. 2" fiberglass tape for corners
4. Thinset
5. Roofing felt
6. Caulk

Each board will be one continuous sheet from the top to the bottom because my shower isn't higher than 8' unless they don't make the board that size.

Am I missing anything?

I hate to pay someone to do this especailly if I can do it myself. I just don't want to screw it up.

I used Redguard on the outside of the backerboard joints in addition to plastic behind the board. I know people suggest using roofing felt, but I just don't trust roofing felt.

Before you do the joints, wet the seams with a sponge and water. This will help the thinset from drying too quickly (the dry board ***** water out of the thinset, making it weak). Don't make the joint too high with thinset, otherwise you will have a bump. Use just enough to make a strong joint.

I would use a sheetrock screw gun to drive the special Hardibacker screws into the studs. I don't trust nails for anything hanging on a wall.

Attached is the first shower I did thanks to:

www.johnbridge.com

 

[wilbilt]

The HardiBacker I just bought came in 3'x5' sheets. I don't know if it's available in other sizes.

 

[Willy Victor]

Welbilt I have never seen any other than 3/5.

Willy

 

[Kong]

If you are using fake tile wallboard (bad idea - my opinion) why bother with the hardibacker? If you are going to cheap out then really cheap out. Just use drywall - moisture resistant if you want. This is if you want a custom sized shower.

or save yourself a lot of time and buy a shower cabinet if a stock dimension is okay.

Kong

 

[carguy123]

Why not just use the Hardi Soffitt material or the Hardi sheathing? Those both come in 4' X 8' sizes.

Also, what is the purpose of the roofing felt or plastic/ I've never seen anyone use those, they always just attach the Hardi directly to the studs.

 

[bmwpower]

Why not just use the Hardi Soffitt material or the Hardi sheathing? Those both come in 4' X 8' sizes.

Also, what is the purpose of the roofing felt or plastic/ I've never seen anyone use those, they always just attach the Hardi directly to the studs.

Plastic/felt for waterproofing. If you don't attach anything to the studs before you place the hardi up, you should coat the outside of the hardi with Redguard or similar. The last thing you want is to have a leak and have to rip down the tile work to get to it.

 

[The Money Pit]

I don't want to use tile because of the weight. I know it's probably ok, but the lighter the better. I the won't be using the shower very often but don't want to worry about it leaking. I talked to someone in the tile deptartment at Lowe's and they told me they wouldn't use fake tile panneling because it's only for kitchens and other moist areas even though it says it's "perfect for showers...". I really don't know what to use for the walls other than the 4x8 sheets of textured fiberglass panneling or actual tile.

 

[bmwpower]

I don't want to use tile because of the weight. I know it's probably ok, but the lighter the better. I the won't be using the shower very often but don't want to worry about it leaking. I talked to someone in the tile deptartment at Lowe's and they told me they wouldn't use fake tile panneling because it's only for kitchens and other moist areas even though it says it's "perfect for showers...". I really don't know what to use for the walls other than the 4x8 sheets of textured fiberglass panneling or actual tile.

Why is weight a consideration?

 

[russlaferrera]

If weight is a problem . Look at ...http:// www.DUMAPLAST.com They use pvc that does not need a backer board. I have not used it, but it is low weight,waterproof and easy to install.

 

[The Money Pit]

The trusses are engineered for storage only. I've also got a lot of additional weight I'm going to put up there (couch, tv, fridge etc.). Also tile is time consuming & more expensive.

 

[KELLHAMMER]

If you want low weight an a durable leak proof shower. Use a fiberglass stall unit. My local plumbing house sometimes has a deal on unit that has minor cosmetic damage. Last one I got from them was a Lasco one piece unit for about 100 bucks.

 

[carguy123]

Plastic/felt for waterproofing. If you don't attach anything to the studs before you place the hardi up, you should coat the outside of the hardi with Redguard or similar. The last thing you want is to have a leak and have to rip down the tile work to get to it.

?????????????

I've been building houses for years and have personally redone 3 of my baths and I have never seen or heard of anyone waterproofing behind the hardi. None of the subs have ever suggested anything other than just plain backer board or waterproof sheetrook.

I thought the hardi itself was a waterproofer?

I have resisted using the "waterproof" sheetrock because I didn't see how it could really be waterproof.

One of the baths I redid did have a little water damage but nothing that would have required replacement of the studs. There had apparently been a long time with no caulk aroound the top of the tub and they had only used regular sheetrock.

 

[bmwpower]

?????????????

I've been building houses for years and have personally redone 3 of my baths and I have never seen or heard of anyone waterproofing behind the hardi. None of the subs have ever suggested anything other than just plain backer board or waterproof sheetrook.

I thought the hardi itself was a waterproofer?

I have resisted using the "waterproof" sheetrock because I didn't see how it could really be waterproof.

One of the baths I redid did have a little water damage but nothing that would have required replacement of the studs. There had apparently been a long time with no caulk aroound the top of the tub and they had only used regular sheetrock.

Hardi is not waterproof. Pour a glass of water on a scrap and see what happens. The stuff is like a sponge.

Greenboard is also not the right stuff to use behind tile in a shower.

Subs don't often follow the rules. Ask any of them what a "preslope" is. Chances are many of them have never installed a shower floor the proper way following code.

Believe me, I didn't know anything when I started tiling. It wasn't until research on the internet did I find out the proper way to do things.

 

[carguy123]

I'm in the midst of building my own home so to be safe I'll do the roofing felt thing on the walls, but I've seen a bunch of showers years later and I've never seen any real damage or rot.

Are you talking about using the felt on the floor in place of a rubber shower pan? I've been thinking you meant on the walls all this time.

Presloping is SOP for everyone I've ever seen.

Here is a good link to show making the shower floor. Notice they don't use roof felt or anything behind the backer board on the walls.

 

[bmwpower]

I'm in the midst of building my own home so to be safe I'll do the roofing felt thing on the walls, but I've seen a bunch of showers years later and I've never seen any real damage or rot.

Are you talking about using the felt on the floor in place of a rubber shower pan? I've been thinking you meant on the walls all this time.

Presloping is SOP for everyone I've ever seen.

Here is a good link to show making the shower floor. Notice they don't use roof felt or anything behind the backer board on the walls.

No, I was referring to the walls. You have to use a liner for the pan.

I don't see a link.

 

[carguy123]

Sorry bout that. Here's the link

http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html

I have always used the pan, but have never heard of using anything on the walls. Just to be safe, and since it's not really minimal extra work I'll do it on the 3 showers I'm just about to build.

 

[wrigh003]

http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html

Neat link.

To whoever was considering it, I urge you NOT to use the fake tile board, no matter how "moisture resistant" it is supposed to be. I am about to rip out a shower and start over because of somebody using that stuff 10-15 years ago. This is a guest bath on the far end of the house, so I know it didn't get a whole lot of use. What appears to have happened is that the back side of the board got wet at some point, and it started to break down. Rather than fixing it, the previous owners apparently just let it go, spraying water all around every time the shower was used, and making the situatino worse. So now I get to deal with rotten subfloor there, and who knows, I may even have to get in there and sister up a joist or two. If you don't want all the weight of the mortar bed for a tile floor, just buy a shower pan (or even a whole enclosure) that fits your needs.

Take your time and build it right once instead of building something that has to be torn out and done over again later. Building something right one time at greater cost is still cheaper than building it twice at low cost.

 

[The Money Pit]

This is what I have. I can't get a fiberglass prefabbed shower because of the roof slope on the left wall. I would have liked to but it wouldn't have fit.

 

[BEECHFRONT]

you do not have to use redguard on top of hardi or felt /plastic vapor barrier behind the hardi if its only a shower/tub area, the only reason you would waterproof would be in a steam shower,if you are going to use a waterproofer on surface like redguard dont use felt behind it, john bridge is a ok site, and yes this is what i do for a living 25+ yrs

 

[BEECHFRONT]

bmw, your right about preslope and guess what most plumbers that install pans dont even know about preslope let alone weep holes!

 

[The Money Pit]

So what other light weight material could I use besides actual tile? Does anyone know where I can get sheets of fiberglass to cut to fit?

 

[BEECHFRONT]

So what other light weight material could I use besides actual tile? Does anyone know where I can get sheets of fiberglass to cut to fit?

you can get frp panels at home depot or lowes it's fiberglass panels and come with various trims and can be used in showers, i used this on my garage walls as a wainscot great for water protection as well as cosmetic damage to the sheetrock.