Vessel Impacta Pozidriv

[Dave455]

This is of more interest to British and European readers than those in the U.S, however…

Vessel have at last released some Impacta drivers with Pozidriv tips.

I don’t know how long ago, and they are not even on the Vessel website, but they are out there.

Only PZ 3 and PZ 3 seem to be available, but that’s fair enough. They are available on Amazon as part of a set including two Phillips, or individually from a few retailers.


On a general note, I’m not convinced Vessel ever really understood what they were doing with Pozidriv. They make a range of Pozidriv drivers with handles to match the ”Powergrip” series, but they don’t sell them in the U.K. or Europe, which is where Pozidriv is standard!

These Impacta’s are a good move though!

 

[dnschmidt]

The weird part is that Pozidriv is an American invention by the Phillips Screw Company. As I believe Christ once remarked no man is a profit in his own land.

 

[KnurledNut]

This is of more interest to British and European readers than those in the U.S, however…

Vessel have at last released some Impacta drivers with Pozidriv tips.

I don’t know how long ago, and they are not even on the Vessel website, but they are out there.

Only PZ 3 and PZ 3 seem to be available, but that’s fair enough. They are available on Amazon as part of a set including two Phillips, or individually from a few retailers.


On a general note, I’m not convinced Vessel ever really understood what they were doing with Pozidriv. They make a range of Pozidriv drivers with handles to match the ”Powergrip” series, but they don’t sell them in the U.K. or Europe, which is where Pozidriv is standard!

These Impacta’s are a good move though!

Amazon UK shows Date First Available as 2019.
These are 983 series. The + version is 980.
Plenty of PZ in the US. Its just most people attack them with a Phillips because they don't know any better or don't have the proper tool.
I wish the Impacta grips weren't so slick. The non-slip nomenclature is kind of an oxymoron.

 

[Dave455]

The weird part is that Pozidriv is an American invention by the Phillips Screw Company. As I believe Christ once remarked no man is a profit in his own land.

I have heard that said, but I have seen nothing to back it up. That doesn’t mean it’s not true.

However the original patent for Pozidriv was granted in the U.K. to GKN in 1962. It would have been filed some time before, possibly some years before, as the patent process is notoriously slow. Under British patent law, they could not have been granted a patent for something that already existed.

Furthermore, the suggestion that Pozidriv, although an improvement over Phillips in many respects, was partially designed to avoid Phillips Screw Co Trademarks (if not patents) seems plausible.

I also lived through the later stages of the Pozidriv’s introduction, and don’t recall any reference any screw manufacturer other than GKN. Even when screws (or screwdrivers) were produced by other manufacturers they were licensed by GKN.

I believe there was some sort of agreement between GKN and the Phillips Screw Co that gave Phillips the rights to use the GKN designs in the U.S. and vice versa. GKN had no presence in North America so would not have been interested in that market

Assuming the provisions of that agreement still stand, Phillips would still control and be able to license the use of the Pozidriv Trademark in the U.S, which I believe is the case.

And In the U.K. and Europe “Pozidriv” remains a Trademark of European Industrial Services Ltd, which is what GKN’s fastening division was renamed, so that all seems plausible.

I would be open to finding out more about this, but back in the 50’s and 60’s there was a lot of cooperation between British and U.S. manufacturers, and the full facts may now be hard to ascertain.

British companies are generally far weaker than their U.S. cousins at protecting their intellectual property, although there are always exceptions…

 

[Dave455]

Amazon UK shows Date First Available as 2019.
These are 983 series. The + version is 980.
Plenty of PZ in the US. Its just most people attack them with a Phillips because they don't know any better or don't have the proper tool.
I wish the Impacta grips weren't so slick. The non-slip nomenclature is kind of an oxymoron.

I suppose that shows what sort of a marketing job Vessel have done…! I would have bought one of these before if I’d known.

Strange they are still not in the catalogue.

Yes, I’d long suspected that when folks complain about badly fitting Phillips drivers, at least a proportion of them are working on Pozidriv screws.

I’ve ordered a No.2 so I’ll find out about the grips.

 

[KnurledNut]

@Dave455
What is your current favorite Pozidriv screwdriver?

 

[darkzero]

I don't have a need for pozidriv but I have these, can put whatever I need in them.

 

[i84x]

This set on amazon has PZ2 and PZ3 in it

 

[Dave455]

I don't have a need for pozidriv but I have these, can put whatever I need in them.

I noticed these also.

They have to be considered “interesting”.

Especially if you already own JDM bits.

 

[darkzero]

They have to be considered “interesting”.

That they were. I certainly didn't need them but because they are transparent, thought they looked cool & I had to have them.

BTW, they don't require Japanese shanks to use them but be sure to use bits that will hold up to axial impacts, ie don't use a common it holder with a magnet in them, or locking sleeve/ball bearing, etc.

 

[crashmtb]

@Dave455 I've noticed them on Amazon.de for quite a while now, but only as the aforementioned set with PH impactas. I already have a pair of PH impactas so haven't pulled the trigger. Being as I have an old Land Rover, I really want the PZ versions.

If I could find just the PZ ones I'd snap them up.

 

[Dave455]

BTW, they don't require Japanese shanks to use them but be sure to use bits that will hold up to axial impacts, ie don't use a common it holder with a magnet in them, or locking sleeve/ball bearing, etc.

Yes, of course, you can always use the bits with the smaller head, not vice versa! I hadn’t thought that through. Though I have a fair few JDM bits.

 

[Dave455]

@Dave455 I've noticed them on Amazon.de for quite a while now, but only as the aforementioned set with PH impactas. I already have a pair of PH impactas so haven't pulled the trigger. Being as I have an old Land Rover, I really want the PZ versions.

If I could find just the PZ ones I'd snap them up.

There are a couple of dealers in the U.K. selling the individual drivers, but nobody seems to be promoting the fact much.

I’ve just ordered a PZ 2, and might get a PZ 3 if I like it.

The drivers shown by darkzero above also have an impact function, but offer interchangeable bits.

You could also go for something like the Wera Impact Driver, but I appreciate it’s moving more towards “Impact Driver“ than screwdriver. And is of course more money…


The nice thing about the Vessel’s is that you can carry them much like a normal driver, but you have a bit of extra thwack if you need it. Probably just the right amount for Land Rover screws..!

 

[Dave455]

@Dave455
What is your current favorite Pozidriv screwdriver?

Now that’s a tough question…

Probably, everything taken together, PB Swiss with the multicraft handle.

I keep these (top) in my woodworking box and have another set (with classic handles) in my mechanics box, so I probably get more use out of these than any.


The downside of Pozidriv is that if the screws are poor quality (undersize - which they shouldn’t be, but newer ones can be) they can damage a blacked or chromed driver.

For that reason I keep drivers specifically for poor quality screws, and find the Wera Stainless (also shown above) to be excellent in this role.

I have to admit I do quite like the Vessel. The tips are tough, the handles nicely proportioned, and in the correct “Pozidriv” blue! The fact that I got all these really cheap may also have influenced my view though! Incredible value.


I generally detest soft handles, but do quite like these Irazola (now Bahco) Tekno drivers. They are very ergonomic and you can exert a great deal of force.


The old Stanley 5000 series were particularly good for the price. More so than the other drivers in the series as GKN controlled the specs for the drivers as part of the Pozidriv licensing process, and insisted on upgraded steel. This is another reason to favour Pozidriv over Phillips, as historically you didn’t get crappy Pozidriv drivers.



And if truth be known, I really like the old Snap On contour grip. They’re by no means the best fitting tips, which is odd as generally there is little variation among Pozidriv’s, but I love ‘em nonetheless!

 

[crashmtb]

There are a couple of dealers in the U.K. selling the individual drivers, but nobody seems to be promoting the fact much.

I’ve just ordered a PZ 2, and might get a PZ 3 if I like it.

The drivers shown by darkzero above also have an impact function, but offer interchangeable bits.

You could also go for something like the Wera Impact Driver, but I appreciate it’s moving more towards “Impact Driver“ than screwdriver. And is of course more money…


The nice thing about the Vessel’s is that you can carry them much like a normal driver, but you have a bit of extra thwack if you need it. Probably just the right amount for Land Rover screws..!

I'll poke around for a source that will ship to Canada, otherwise i'll probably finally cave and buy the set from EU amazon, and generously gift the redundant PH drivers to a friend who's elbows deep in a honda cub rehab.;

I'd rather the Vessels, as the impacta have come in handy, but I haven't been able to use them on the Solihull Sadness due to not being PZ.

 

[Dave455]

I'd rather the Vessels, as the impacta have come in handy, but I haven't been able to use them on the Solihull Sadness due to not being PZ.

Don’t be too hard on the poor old Landy (providing we’re talking ”classic” here - I’ll admit the newer ones are shite) I almost bought one myself a couple of years back, and still might!

Mind you, a neighbour has just parked / dumped a newly non functioning one in my drive, so I might have a different view tomorrow,,,!

 

[lotus_esprit]

I am still amazed at the poor fit of Snap On Pozidrive drivers, they are awful. I have had a couple of sets but they are no-where near acceptable, in fact I must put my instinct soft grip set on eBay. It’s almost as if Snap On produced them as an afterthought, as the slotted and Phillips drivers are superb.
I am currently using Wera for Pozidrive which fit really well, but seem a little cheap and nasty, and where I live the non chromed shafts tarnish in no time.

 

[crashmtb]

Don’t be too hard on the poor old Landy (providing we’re talking ”classic” here - I’ll admit the newer ones are shite) I almost bought one myself a couple of years back, and still might!

Mind you, a neighbour has just parked / dumped a newly non functioning one in my drive, so I might have a different view tomorrow,,,!

I only abuse it as much as it does me!
(it's a TD5 defender, so both old enough and new enough to be shite)

 

[Dave455]

Said piece of equipment arrived this morning!

I’m quite impressed.

First Impacta I’ve owned, and on a first impression I like it.

As others have suggested, no more weight (or cost really) than any other driver with a striking handle. You could use these as your only driver in a road box. In fact I might.

Will probably add the PZ3, and possibly the PH2.

 

[lund]

I am not a big fan of Vessel Impacta drivers. At least for stuck automotive stuff in the rust belt, i find they have far too much flex to work well relative to standard hand impact drivers that are much more rigid. They might be ok for stuff like getting out modestly stuck screws in deck work with a driver that you can also use for other purposes.

 

[Ruxpin]

Said piece of equipment arrived this morning!

Dave, by chance did you order this item from Tool Monster? I've been contemplating ordering a couple of items from them so was wondering what their service was like. If so, were the goods shipped in clean condition (i.e. not shop floor stock) in good protective packaging? Thanks.
I really, really don't need any more screwdrivers but a PZ2 Impacta might end up on the order...

 

[Steel_Rain]

Don’t be too hard on the poor old Landy

“Land Rover…turning Owners into Mechanics since 1948.”

 

[Dave455]

Dave, by chance did you order this item from Tool Monster? I've been contemplating ordering a couple of items from them so was wondering what their service was like. If so, were the goods shipped in clean condition (i.e. not shop floor stock) in good protective packaging? Thanks.
I really, really don't need any more screwdrivers but a PZ2 Impacta might end up on the order...

PM Sent.

 

[Dave455]

“Land Rover…turning Owners into Mechanics since 1948.”

I actually don’t have much of a problem with this!

At least the folks who owned Land Rovers were generally capable mechanics, and an awful lot of issues on a Series 1, 2 or 3 COULD be sorted out by an amateur mechanic.

Don’t get me started on the direction they ended up taking the company.

The long term cost of those short term profits is likely to be considerable.

 

[Steel_Rain]

At least the folks who owned Land Rovers were generally capable mechanics, and an awful lot of issues on a Series 1, 2 or 3 COULD be sorted out by an amateur mechanic.

RIGHT!

Last one. The South African's always say:

"Take a Land Rover if your going on Safari. Take a Land Cruiser if you want to come back from Safari."

 

[F-22]

Got a 49' 80 inch series 1 to sort out, project started by my father a few decades ago now.

What need do you find for an impact driver for pozidriv? Over here I'd only find them on wood-type screws, not really machine screws.

 

[F-22]

RIGHT!

Last one. The South African's always say:

"Take a Land Rover if your going on Safari. Take a Land Cruiser if you want to come back from Safari."

Seems every defender owner waves to eachother when they meet on the road. Not quite the same with the 70 series ) Both cool cars for sure, though I'd take the 70 series if I had to choose (probably the 79 single or double cab, that really has everything )).

Coincidentally, my brother in law took me in "the bush" near Franschhoek a couple weeks ago in his Defender What an experience! Luckily the car was fine but he does have persistent small issues with it endlessly.

 

[Dave455]

Got a 49' 80 inch series 1 to sort out, project started by my father a few decades ago now.

What need do you find for an impact driver for pozidriv? Over here I'd only find them on wood-type screws, not really machine screws.

Pozidriv are probably the most common type of screw head I find. Wood screws, machine screws, self tappers, the lot.

I most commonly find Phillips on Japanese vehicles, and certainly couldn’t be without, but all my Phillips drivers tend to the “underused” category

I also tend to do a lot of stuff on 1970’s classics, so find things like door hinges and catch plates held on by PZ4 CSK screws.

I think there are more Pozidriv screws out there than folks outside Europe / U.K. realise. They’re all over BMW’s for a start (though BM’s are notorious for “mix and match”) but if you’re not “tuned in“ to the things you don’t realise. Then, when you strip the screw heads you ease the problem with alcohol and go on this forum complaining about bad fitting Phillips drivers…

I swapped a header tank for a friend, and he looked most concerned about where I was going to shove the substantial PZ4 driver I was carrying, but despite owning the car for 5 years had no idea the drain plug’s were Pozi.

 

[Dave455]

Seems every defender owner waves to eachother when they meet on the road. Not quite the same with the 70 series ) Both cool cars for sure, though I'd take the 70 series if I had to choose (probably the 79 single or double cab, that really has everything )).

Coincidentally, my brother in law took me in "the bush" near Franschhoek a couple weeks ago in his Defender What an experience! Luckily the car was fine but he does have persistent small issues with it endlessly.

Very nice!

I was invited on a trip out that way by some colleagues when I had a weekend in Cape Town a few years back, but ended up declining.

I think you get to a point with the Landy’s where you have to bite the bullet and give ‘em a bit of a mid life rebuild! If not it does tend to be death by “persistent small issues”

Most of what I work on is older than that, which is great electrically, as I generally avoid Land Rover’s attempts at “modernisation”. On the downside, I can’t remember the last time I saw anything resembling an unmodified wiring loom!

“Good news - all the wiring is standard colours… Bad news - standard colours for a domestic residence that is….”!