Vise Info Thread

[Outlawmws]

Pity my L.S. Starrett Athol wasn't.

Advertised as, or wasn't unbreakable?

 

[Vise_Squad]

Advertised as, or wasn't unbreakable?

Good point! Wasn't and probably wasn't advertised as such either: the arms/shoulders on the outside of the main casting on which the slide runs broke off taking a chunk of the body with them. Someone must have whacked it from above too hard, but wasn't me. I'm the guy who bought it for $20 without noticing the damage!

 

[ViceRoy2030]

I've got your estimated vise circa @ (1869-1900), based on the "1869 patent jaws" and the latest offering found in a 1900 catalog scan.

You'll probably never find the removeable "round jaws", however your missing swivel base "1867 patent wrench" does become available from time-to-time.

What a great addition to your vise collection...thanks for sharing!

There are three areas on this vise with patent dates:

"MAY 28 NOV 28 DEC 10 & 17 1867"

"APR 14 1868"

"SEP 25 1869"

 

[Fierljeppen]

BALL CLAMP or BALL BASE VISES
These are not regular vises attached to positioners. They are vises with a ball on the bottom.​

1883 Read, Gleason & Read
1894 Millers Falls
1930 Record *
1940 Parkinsons
The last picture is of a positioner offered on the same page. I included it as an illustration and because it's really cool.

* The catalogue was unclear about the maker of the ball base vice but all the other vices on same page were Record vices. Note that Record called it a "vice" even though the the picture uses the Parkinson's spelling "vise".

I had intended to post these and ask if anyone had ever seen another ball base vise but then KMScott posted that terrific ball base in post #3672. Has anyone else come across different one?

​

Checkout this interesting 1879 patent no. US-221,382 "Ball Vise".





As always with the early vises, I was interested in learning a little about the inventor and was expecting a British or German immigrant living in the North East of America.

But to my great surprise, the inventor "Fortunato Clemente Zanetti", was born in Turin, Piedmont, Italy.



It gets even more unusual to find out that in 1879, his residence was Bryan Texas.



I've got to be honest, I didn't see that one coming.

 

[skmbabon]

I get the impression they were a poor cousin to the Emmert in terms of quality.

The Yost No 1 had claimed some improvements on the earlier Emmerts, so I wonder if the quality difference wasn't the other way around in that comparison. Perhaps later Emmert models had sufficient improvements to get the edge, though I suspect some people claiming Emmerts are the "best" are being swayed by familiarity. Regardless, I would not hesitate to choose a Lee Valley Tucker vise over an Emmert or any of the other universal woodworkers / patternmakers' vises.

RAE were advertised as unbreakable: some kind of semi-steel or malleable iron used.

Ductalloy(TM) was Otaco's trademark for a ductile cast iron formulation licensed from the International Nickel Company in 1948. If a Rae vise is marked "Hamilton" it isn't made with Ductalloy; if marked "Orillia" it may be. Some of the Rae vises made in Orillia have a "D inside an oval" mark cast in to them. I'm trying to figure out if that indicates Ductalloy, but so far no leads. Surest way to tell is to compare the Orillia model with the same model made in Hamilton - if it's noticeably lighter then it's made of Ductalloy.

 

[CRSINMICH]

Yost and Emmert
​

This 1907 announcement of Yost Manufacturing beginning production in Mechanicsburg mentions that E.M. Yost had been a manager at Emmert Vise Company. He must have learned a lot.

 

[ranger08]

phoenix no 3, 2 inch jaws

 

[Outlawmws]

pheonix no 3, 2 inch jaws

Spell check on pheonix off the vise please? too much dust in the way...

 

[ranger08]

"phoenix"

 

[KMScott]

Geo. W. Diener Mfg. Co. 2-1/2" clamp-on.

 

[KMScott]

Samson 5246. 5" jaws that weights 76 lbs.

 

[KMScott]

Samson Clamp-On. No spec:s.

 

[KMScott]

Here is a possible Vietnam vise. The owner posted it living in Vietnam. Thought it was kind of neat.

2-5/8" jaws that opens to 3" and weights 6-1/4 lbs

 

[CRSINMICH]

STANLEY HANDYMAN NO. H1207
1 5/8" jaws same as STANLEY 707
​

The STANLEY 707 was in a 1934 catalog but the H1207 HANDYMAN version came in 1964. The original patent date was 1932.

 

[454ragtop]

STANLEY HANDYMAN NO. H1207
1 5/8" jaws same as STANLEY 707
​

The STANLEY 707 was in a 1934 catalog but the H1207 HANDYMAN version came in 1964. The original patent date was 1932.

Anybody have, or even seen those pipe jaws? Must be for some pretty small pipe.

 

[CRSINMICH]

I wondered about that too. They'd be more like 'tube jaws'.

 

[akasrick]

I wondered about that too. They'd be more like 'tube jaws'.

The 707 was shipped with some of their toolchests, e.g. 1942.

Guess their about the same size as a tap holder in some tap and die sets.

akasrick

 

[neophyte]

Anybody have, or even seen those pipe jaws? Must be for some pretty small pipe.

I wondered about that too. They'd be more like 'tube jaws'.

Clamp on Vises of this size and type were and still are included in the US Small Arms Repairman Kits.
I have no clue whether that was Stanley’s intention.

 

[akasrick]

Clamp on Vises of this size and type were and still are included in the US Small Arms Repairman Kits.
I have no clue whether that was Stanley’s intention.

At about that time, 1942, the manufactures were tasked with using less material in their products. (?)
Possibly that vise, the 707 was Stanleys answer to use less resources.

akasrick

 

[akasrick]

In regards too the Jaws. 1937 catalog cut of what was being sold, with no mention of the swiveling H1210.



akasrick

 

[CRSINMICH]

There are at least 3 different versions of Stanley vises in question here. The Stanley 707, Stanley 'Handyman' H1207, and Stanley 'Defiance' 1207 (see above). As far as can be told by catalog drawings, the Stanley 707 and the Handyman H1207 are identical but the Defiance 1207 is a bit different in shape. They all have the same specs. Here's a side view of the H1207 from post #3694 and a page from a 1915 STANLEY catalog giving the Trade-Marks they used at that point - including Defiance. I don't know when they started using Handyman.

CAUTION: The STANLEY rabbit hole is deep and dark.

 

[akasrick]

There are at least 3 different versions of Stanley vises in question here. The Stanley 707, Stanley 'Handyman' H1207, and Stanley 'Defiance' 1207 (see above). As far as can be told by catalog drawings, the Stanley 707 and the Handyman H1207 are identical but the Defiance 1207 is a bit different in shape. They all have the same specs. Here's a side view of the H1207 from post #3694 and a page from a 1915 STANLEY catalog giving the Trade-Marks they used at that point - including Defiance. I don't know when they started using Handyman.

CAUTION: The STANLEY rabbit hole is deep and dark.

CAUTION: The STANLEY rabbit hole is deep and dark.

 

[akasrick]

CAUTION: The STANLEY rabbit hole is deep and dark.

They must have made a few 707s, were still being advertised in 1957 included with sets. 1967 shows no repair parts.
That runs me out of catalogs.





akasrick

 

[akasrick]

They must have made a few 707s, were still being advertised in 1957 included with sets. 1967 shows no repair parts.
That runs me out of catalogs.

Oops, scratch the reference to a 707 in there. Vise is a 700.

akasrick

 

[RTM]

e. I don't know when they started using Handyman.

apparently the internet doesn’t have a consensus either



I’ll look in my Stanley history book later tomorrow.

 

[CRSINMICH]

RTM: Thanks for that extra information that I was too lazy to look up.

EVERYONE: RTM's post is another example of why I tried to warn you about the STANLEY rabbit hole.

 

[CRSINMICH]

WODEN clamp-on Vices
From their 1957 catalogue​

Woodworkers' vice:
Jaws - 6"
Opens - 4 1/2"
Weight - 9 3/4 lbs.

X260 'Titan':
Jaws - 3"
Opens - 2 3/4"
Weight - 4 3/4 lbs.

Note that the Titan had cast in "tube grips" and two "pipe benders".
It was finished with "Stove enamelled Woden blue" and came "Packed in a coloured, illustrated Box"

 

[akasrick]

An attempt to clean up a mess and of course it doesn't.
A 765 vise without Sq. or rectangular pockets for pipe jaws.
Round holes that aren't mentioned as having pipe jaws.
Also a Stanley excerpt.



akasrick

 

[Vise_Squad]

Speaking of ball mounts here's a little one I put together on the base of a Disston saw filer's vise which turned up without the vise part. Just so happened that an old 2" tow ball fit perfectly and the little school shop project(?) vise from the same source had a male threaded shank which matched the thread in the tow ball. When reefed down the ball is clamped very solidly.

 

[ron350]

Akasrick what are those round holes for.
One of my 766 has the holes and one does not.

 

[Outlawmws]

that's Nice VS!

I remember way back someone making a big ball mount and used an old bowling ball as the ball. it was for a medium but full size vise.

 

[akasrick]

Akasrick what are those round holes for.
One of my 766 has the holes and one does not.

I'd say that the holes held pipe jaws. They are in the right place. They're hollow jaws, there is a stop for the pipe jaws to bottom against as some of their ratchet bits did.
A thread wouldn't hold up with the clamping pressure.
As Crsinmich demonstrated with their ever changing designations a 766 And A 766V is not a stretch, just another variation.
My take on trying to understand the differences of when and why, along with them using up stock.
That's the long version of I don't know.
Reading all this a pamphlet with just focus on their vises would be quite an undertaking.



akasrick

 

[KMScott]

Howard Iron Works #0. 3" jaws that opens to 4-1/4” and weights 23lbs.

 

[ranger08]

Correction to vice information above
Phoenix number 8/0,
jaw width 54mm opens 45mm, swivel base, removable steel jaw plates,

 

[CRSINMICH]

ranger: 3/0 or 8/0 that Phoenix is still a WOWSER! Is that lever below the name a cam-action swivel lock?

 

[ranger08]

yes the lever locks and releases the swivel base, i will pull it apart to see how it works when i find time
interesting jaw plates as well
not sure of age, looks to be a watch makers/jewelers vice

 

[neophyte]

Correction to vice information above
Phoenix number 8/0,
jaw width 54mm opens 45mm, swivel base, removable steel jaw plates,

Is this the fist vise that has come up with jaws “dovetailed” in place?

 

[KMScott]

Interesting vise, how do you bolt it to a work bench? Neat jaw design. Added to Spreadsheet.

 

[PierceA]

akasrick: I seem to remember an add-on 'swivel-jaw' device that had a horizontal pin, with a vertical pin, so a 90* bent 'pin'.
The horizontal pin fit into a hole under the fixed jaw of a vise, such that the vertical portion was in front of the fixed jaw insert.
On the vertical pin, a jaw was fitted that swiveled on the pin. This jaw was thick in the middle, to allow for some strength around the swivel pin. The jaw tapered to be thiner out to each end. So it could swivel either left or right on the vertical pin.
This device allowed the vise to do the same as a true swivel jaw vise: securely clamp tapered items or non parallel surfaces.
I have the remains of such a device somewhere, If I run across it soon and can remember, I'll post a photo.

I seem to remember that there was a similar device that was part of a set of slip-on jaws, that fit over the existing jaws and created a swiveling jaw for clamping irregular or tapered items.. This was part of a set of different clip on or slip on jaw devices.

PierceA

 

[akasrick]

akasrick: I seem to remember an add-on 'swivel-jaw' device that had a horizontal pin, with a vertical pin, so a 90* bent 'pin'.
The horizontal pin fit into a hole under the fixed jaw of a vise, such that the vertical portion was in front of the fixed jaw insert.
On the vertical pin, a jaw was fitted that swiveled on the pin. This jaw was thick in the middle, to allow for some strength around the swivel pin. The jaw tapered to be thiner out to each end. So it could swivel either left or right on the vertical pin.
This device allowed the vise to do the same as a true swivel jaw vise: securely clamp tapered items or non parallel surfaces.
I have the remains of such a device somewhere, If I run across it soon and can remember, I'll post a photo.

I seem to remember that there was a similar device that was part of a set of slip-on jaws, that fit over the existing jaws and created a swiveling jaw for clamping irregular or tapered items.. This was part of a set of different clip on or slip on jaw devices.

PierceA

Pierce looks like you are thinking this...

also maybe Bonney's swivel.

Stanley was definitely trying to add pipe jaws to some of their's.
I called it a stop in the jaw, maybe I should have written "an index" to orient the one jaw, then the other jaw would find the pipe.

I'd say that the holes held pipe jaws. They are in the right place. They're hollow jaws, there is a stop for the pipe jaws to bottom against as some of their ratchet bits did.

Remains are good

akasrick
Edited