Wanted: Simplified Lighting Recommendations

[WBSurfer]

I've been reading through dozens of lighting threads, browsing tons of online info, and honestly I just don't have the patience nor complete understanding of all the "electrical lingo" related to whats what referencing different lighting. What I'm really looking for here is as simple and direct of recommendations as possible. Put more directly: If you have a good plan or thoughts for my needs including any links to the specific lighting that you recommend I'm all ears.

The Garage:

25 x 25 with 10' ceilings
North Carolina coast weather so not too freezing cold but I do want to be able to turn the lights on and have them be bright pretty quickly. LED is what I was originally thinking but again I'm clueless other than all I've read.(mixed reading of LED vs Florescent)
Budget: Roughly $500 Less obviously is best but would go a bit over for ideal plan. Just want it to be great...not ok.
I'm looking to turn on the lights and it be WELL lit. Bright.

Not sure what else I really need to say but if I've left info out which likely I have, just let me know and I'll respond.

I've spend soooo much time on my garage and I really want to go to Home Depot/Lowes/Ace Hardware/etc tomorrow, get all the lights and install. I'm worn out at this point and just want simplification and great lighting at this point.

Thanks for any and all insight and info.

Cheers!!

 

[rburke65]

Go to Home Dept and buy 9 eight foot, 4 lamp, T8 fluorescent fixtures and run three rows of lighting fixtures with three fixtures each. Start 6' off the wall with the first row and leave 6' between each row. You can put each row on a separate switch. Select the CRI of your choice. I like the CRI 100 or the 5000-6000k range. You will like it. Hope this helps.

 

[Showkey]

Simple solution on a budget:

Use T8 fluorescent fixtures........ 2, 4 or 6 bulb depends on the amount of light you want in a particular area.

Keep adding fixtures until your work and storage areas are lit to your needs and satisfaction.

Too dark you can always add or move fixture ......it ok to be a work in progress. Your needs might change with the type of work being done.

 

[Dagny]

Leds are still to expensive I think its hard to argue with reburkes advice.

 

[cybrdyke]

Go to Home Dept and buy 9 eight foot, 4 lamp, T8 fluorescent fixtures and run three rows of lighting fixtures with three fixtures each. Start 6' off the wall with the first row and leave 6' between each row. You can put each row on a separate switch. Select the CRI of your choice. I like the CRI 100 or the 5000-6000k range. You will like it. Hope this helps.

This.
5000k lamps.
Simple enough?
CD

 

[WBSurfer]

Go to Home Dept and buy 9 eight foot, 4 lamp, T8 fluorescent fixtures and run three rows of lighting fixtures with three fixtures each. Start 6' off the wall with the first row and leave 6' between each row. You can put each row on a separate switch. Select the CRI of your choice. I like the CRI 100 or the 5000-6000k range. You will like it. Hope this helps.

Perfect Advice! Simple and sounds effective. One thing: Select the CRI of your choice. I like the CRI 100 or the 5000-6000k range.".......what does this mean?

I've read that fluorescent lights are a bit weak during colder temps.....is that only in wicked cold locations at sub zero temps or what are your thoughts on this?

Cheers!

 

[Outlander]

My simple solution was to use whatever I had handy. This results in a collection of independent lighting solutions that confuses Mrs Outlander and keeps her away from my tools. I still have dark zones which I fix as I realise I could better use the space. Part of me struggles to throw out lights so I can buy new ones.

This question from the OP and the subsequent responses is a great idea for those who just want to get illuminated!

 

[Stuart in MN]

Perfect Advice! Simple and sounds effective. One thing: Select the CRI of your choice. I like the CRI 100 or the 5000-6000k range.".......what does this mean?

I've read that fluorescent lights are a bit weak during colder temps.....is that only in wicked cold locations at sub zero temps or what are your thoughts on this?

Cheers!

CRI = color rendering index. Basically it means what color light you're going to get from the lights. Incandescent bulbs have a CRI around 2700 and provide more of a warm, yellowish light. Daylight is generally in the 5000 to 6000 range, so getting fluorescents in that range give you a whiter light that's closer to what you would get outdoors on a sunny day.

Modern fluorescent fixtures with electronic ballasts are generally rated for operation down to 0 degrees F, so you don't have the problems with them turning on slow like the ones with magnetic ballasts in the old days.

 

[Highbeam]

Ignore cri. Just go the home depot and buy the tubes of the color you like. People are always going to make it harder than it has to be.

 

[tfi racing]

Ignore cri. Just go the home depot and buy the tubes of the color you like. People are always going to make it harder than it has to be.

Yep,save your cash,4100k lamps get the job done,not too yellow,not too blue.

 

[cybrdyke]

CRI = color rendering index. Basically it means what color light you're going to get from the lights. Incandescent bulbs have a CRI around 2700 and provide more of a warm, yellowish light. Daylight is generally in the 5000 to 6000 range, so getting fluorescents in that range give you a whiter light that's closer to what you would get outdoors on a sunny day.

Modern fluorescent fixtures with electronic ballasts are generally rated for operation down to 0 degrees F, so you don't have the problems with them turning on slow like the ones with magnetic ballasts in the old days.

Sorry, but this is a description of CCT, not CRI. Completely different. And since the thread is asking for "simplified"...I'm not going to elaborate
CD

 

[CGT80]

x10

8' T8 fixtures with 4 32w 4' lamps. I use 6500k (kelvin) lamps. They are called daylight deluxe. They look cool but provide great detail when working on small items. Colors look very close to how they would appear in sun light. 4100k will look a bit warmer and that is the lamp I most often used in office buildings when I worked in the construction industry. 2700k-3500k looks more orange or yellow. It will be hard to see colors accurately, but the light looks more like incandescent lamps.

You could always buy a few different t8 lamps (3500, 4100, 5000, and 6500k) and try them at home in a T8 fixture to see what looks best. Paint colors will look different under certain color lamps. This was apparent when I used tans and browns to paint offices and we compared warm white to cool white lamps. The warm white, lower kelvin temp, looked more rich in color.

Our workshop is a two car garage (19'x23') with 8' ceilings. The walls and ceiling are drywalled, and taped, and painted in Behr Swiss Coffee. There are 12 of the 8' fixtures in there, on 4 switches. The three perimeter walls have two fixtures set 18" or so from the wall, and parallel to the wall and the center has three pairs of fixtures which run from the roll up door to the back wall. There are 5 rows of fixtures that run from the roll up door to the back wall, and then just 1 row (2 fixtures) running the opposite way to light the back benches. This puts light over benches on all three walls, that is just ahead of a person as they work. This keeps people from working completely in their own shadow. Two lights end to end are 16', so that leaves 3 feet remaining on a 19' deep garage. The last 3 feet are split in half by the oddball (run the opposite direction) set of lights.

Each of the three walls in our shop have their own single switch to control a total of 8 lamps per wall. The center is on another switch and has a total of 24 lamps. All 4 switches are installed in the same box, next to the walk through (32-36") door. The lighting is great. More is better, and multizone or multilevel lighting will let you tame the light or shut off what you don't need. Some offices use 3 lamp troffer lights and have A B switching to turn on the center lamp separately from the outer two lamps, depending on how bright you want it. You could wire every other light fixture and do something similar in a garage. We chose to do it by zone as sometimes there is only one person working at a bench and other times there are three of us in there.


T8 electronic ballasts are the best bang for the buck. Home Depot doesn't stock anything over 4100k in T5 lamps, in the 4' length. T5 puts out more light, but the fixtures cost a bit more and the lamps are 10 bucks each as singles, and I don't recall seeing 10 packs of t5 lamps at HD. Costco LED's are 4100k and cost more than t8 fixtures and lamps, and don't seem to put out more lumens than a T8 fixture, from what I remember reading.

I went looking for some lights to make a light bar over my mom's quilting machine, last week. I looked at what was out there and chose two 4' 2 lamp t8 fixtures with 6500k lamps. I built a pair of legs and an 11' long bar that will sit at 5.5' so that the light is just over her machine. I thought a higher CRI was better and that higher temperature lamps usually had higher CRI ratings as well. I was surprised to see a higher CRI on the warm white 4' T8 lamps than on the 5000k/daylight lamps. The 5000k had a higher CRI than the 6500k, but I like 6500k better. The warm white lamps **** to work by. I am not sure I fully understand CRI ratings, unless the warm white were marked wrong. Color temp is very easy to understand and see, when you put a few next to each other and start to pay attention to where they are used.

 

[Worsedog]

CRI relates to how close colors under the light look compared to the same color under daylight, with the daylight being the "correct" color rendering. The closer to 100 the closer it is to daylight.

 

[atfulldraw]

I bought six of the four-bulb, t-8 fixtures with daylight deluxe bulbs and centered them off the main ridge, 3 on each side.

lights up my 60x40 just fine (the lights sit 16' off the floor)

they turn on pretty quick and are at full brightness in about ten seconds.

added one two bulb fixture near the workbench.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I had the 4100K bulbs and hated them, I think I have the 5000K now, looks like daylight inside now. I got my fixtures at Lowe's', Tandem T-8, 4-bulb fixtures $39.95 each.

Where are you on the coast? I'm not too far from there.

 

[Rockuf8]

I've read that fluorescent lights are a bit weak during colder temps.....is that only in wicked cold locations at sub zero temps or what are your thoughts on this?

Cheers!

I'm running 12- 4' T8 bulbs and I've had issues with the bulbs dying on me in the colder temps. The coldest my garage get's is 53° F, not exactly freezing cold. They also are a little weaker when I first put them on. I've returned several bulbs to HD because they lasted less than a few months averaging 10-20 hours a week or less. They are bright when they work though.

Here's an older pic of my garage when I first installed them with the garage door up blocking 3 of the lights.

 

[WBSurfer]

x10

8' T8 fixtures with 4 32w 4' lamps. I use 6500k (kelvin) lamps. They are called daylight deluxe. They look cool but provide great detail when working on small items. Colors look very close to how they would appear in sun light. 4100k will look a bit warmer and that is the lamp I most often used in office buildings when I worked in the construction industry. 2700k-3500k looks more orange or yellow. It will be hard to see colors accurately, but the light looks more like incandescent lamps.

You could always buy a few different t8 lamps (3500, 4100, 5000, and 6500k) and try them at home in a T8 fixture to see what looks best. Paint colors will look different under certain color lamps. This was apparent when I used tans and browns to paint offices and we compared warm white to cool white lamps. The warm white, lower kelvin temp, looked more rich in color.

Our workshop is a two car garage (19'x23') with 8' ceilings. The walls and ceiling are drywalled, and taped, and painted in Behr Swiss Coffee. There are 12 of the 8' fixtures in there, on 4 switches. The three perimeter walls have two fixtures set 18" or so from the wall, and parallel to the wall and the center has three pairs of fixtures which run from the roll up door to the back wall. There are 5 rows of fixtures that run from the roll up door to the back wall, and then just 1 row (2 fixtures) running the opposite way to light the back benches. This puts light over benches on all three walls, that is just ahead of a person as they work. This keeps people from working completely in their own shadow. Two lights end to end are 16', so that leaves 3 feet remaining on a 19' deep garage. The last 3 feet are split in half by the oddball (run the opposite direction) set of lights.

Each of the three walls in our shop have their own single switch to control a total of 8 lamps per wall. The center is on another switch and has a total of 24 lamps. All 4 switches are installed in the same box, next to the walk through (32-36") door. The lighting is great. More is better, and multizone or multilevel lighting will let you tame the light or shut off what you don't need. Some offices use 3 lamp troffer lights and have A B switching to turn on the center lamp separately from the outer two lamps, depending on how bright you want it. You could wire every other light fixture and do something similar in a garage. We chose to do it by zone as sometimes there is only one person working at a bench and other times there are three of us in there.


T8 electronic ballasts are the best bang for the buck. Home Depot doesn't stock anything over 4100k in T5 lamps, in the 4' length. T5 puts out more light, but the fixtures cost a bit more and the lamps are 10 bucks each as singles, and I don't recall seeing 10 packs of t5 lamps at HD. Costco LED's are 4100k and cost more than t8 fixtures and lamps, and don't seem to put out more lumens than a T8 fixture, from what I remember reading.

I went looking for some lights to make a light bar over my mom's quilting machine, last week. I looked at what was out there and chose two 4' 2 lamp t8 fixtures with 6500k lamps. I built a pair of legs and an 11' long bar that will sit at 5.5' so that the light is just over her machine. I thought a higher CRI was better and that higher temperature lamps usually had higher CRI ratings as well. I was surprised to see a higher CRI on the warm white 4' T8 lamps than on the 5000k/daylight lamps. The 5000k had a higher CRI than the 6500k, but I like 6500k better. The warm white lamps **** to work by. I am not sure I fully understand CRI ratings, unless the warm white were marked wrong. Color temp is very easy to understand and see, when you put a few next to each other and start to pay attention to where they are used.

I'd really like to see a picture or two of the ceiling set up of your shop. Sounds like a ton of light but definitely along the lines of what I'm looking to do. Can you take a few pics for me and post them.

Thanks

 

[laser3kw]

here is my shop. Pretty much what has been recommend to you by other. I just put the lights up around Thanksgiving. The area is 24' x 30'. There is two 8' tandem fixtures and one 4' fixture in each row. Home Depot Lithonia fixtures.4100k 32w bulbs - 30 total.

 

[WBSurfer]

here is my shop. Pretty much what has been recommend to you by other. I just put the lights up around Thanksgiving. The area is 24' x 30'. There is two 8' tandem fixtures and one 4' fixture in each row. Home Depot Lithonia fixtures.4100k 32w bulbs - 30 total.

Damn that's some good work you did there! Pretty amazing. Is it brighter in person than in your picture? For that much lighting it looks a lot darker than I would have imagined. Maybe picture or camera quality??

 

[laser3kw]

It does look dark in the picture. I took the picture from the unlit side of the shop. It is plenty bright when you are in that part of the shop. Here is another picture that shows the lighting better.
It took me about 12 hours to hang and wire the lights. The fixtures hanging on the walls are the temporary lights I had for the last 2 years.
ps - they are all T8 fixtures with electronic ballast. They come on right away, but when it is less than 40º the are dimmer for the first few minutes, but come on to full bright after they warm up.

 

[WBSurfer]

It does look dark in the picture. I took the picture from the unlit side of the shop. It is plenty bright when you are in that part of the shop. Here is another picture that shows the lighting better.
It took me about 12 hours to hang and wire the lights. The fixtures hanging on the walls are the temporary lights I had for the last 2 years.
ps - they are all T8 fixtures with electronic ballast. They come on right away, but when it is less than 40º the are dimmer for the first few minutes, but come on to full bright after they warm up.

Now that looks a lot better. Much brighter. How many switches did you put on all those lights?

 

[laser3kw]

I have 2 circuits (switches), One turns on the three 8' fixtures closest to the door and the other controls the other 6 fixtures.

 

[WBSurfer]

So what's the difference between T8, T5, T12.....etc?

Seems like the 6500 Kelvin is the brightness I'm looking for but not sure how the T? fits into things. Is it the fixture or the bulb?

 

[fabjunkie]

Don't rule out CFL's. I put 12 in my 30x40 on three circuits. Using regular old ceramic bases and getting the bulbs off Amazon I have about $200 in them, well less than fluorescent tubes. I don't have power to the building yet but testing them in the house, they are very bright. There's a couple good threads on here with night pics.

Mine up in the ceiling.

 

[hoffman912]

easiest thing is to get a bunch of these guys and daisy chain them together. (I think these might be the 4x T8 bulb Lithonia lights everyone mentioned at home depot - I love these guys). the female plug socket at the end of each light allows you to plug them into each other aka daisy chain, so you need fewer light sockets in the ceiling.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia...ty-Fluorescent-Shoplight-1284GRD-RE/202968125


I have 5 of these installed so far. I am planning on adding a few more.

https://scontent-b-iad.**.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/p600x600/1395945_10154932096015510_3882315235764565534_n.jpg?oh=b24aff35ac80c85a0c756d490fb3328d&oe=552BD030

 

[laser3kw]

Seems like the 6500 Kelvin is the brightness I'm looking for but not sure how the T? fits into things. Is it the fixture or the bulb?

The "T" is the bulb size. the number is the diameter in "8ths". T5 = 5/8 diameter, T8= 8/8 or 1" etc.
The "6500 k" is the light "temperature or how far down the spectrum it is. 6500k is a bluer and 2400k is more yellow. 4500k is typical.
The brightness is the wattage. Most T8 use 32 watt bulbs, but 40 watt are out there.

 

[WBSurfer]

The "T" is the bulb size. the number is the diameter in "8ths". T5 = 5/8 diameter, T8= 8/8 or 1" etc.
The "6500 k" is the light "temperature or how far down the spectrum it is. 6500k is a bluer and 2400k is more yellow. 4500k is typical.
The brightness is the wattage. Most T8 use 32 watt bulbs, but 40 watt are out there.

So for example, will a T5 bulb fit in a T8 light fixture? Or does the bulb have to be the same "T?" as the fixture itself?

Are any particular sizes of bulbs supposed to be any better than others? Example: Is a T5 bulb better than a T8 bulb or a T12 bulb? The prices are different so I'm just thinking there's gotta be something going on.

This looks like a pretty damn good deal for 25 T5 6500K bulbs: http://www.ebay.com/itm/27149206639...49&var=570330018700&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

I'm thinking once I get these questions answered I'm FINALLY friggin ready to pull the trigger and get these damn lights installed....lol.

 

[cybrdyke]

So for example, will a T5 bulb fit in a T8 light fixture? Or does the bulb have to be the same "T?" as the fixture itself?

Are any particular sizes of bulbs supposed to be any better than others? Example: Is a T5 bulb better than a T8 bulb or a T12 bulb? The prices are different so I'm just thinking there's gotta be something going on.

This looks like a pretty damn good deal for 25 T5 6500K bulbs: http://www.ebay.com/itm/27149206639...49&var=570330018700&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

I'm thinking once I get these questions answered I'm FINALLY friggin ready to pull the trigger and get these damn lights installed....lol.

No, the T5 wont fit in a T8 fixture. Plus, the ballast is specific to the lamp.
The bulbs aren't "better" than each other, just different. You look at lumens to determine brightness, not watts.
The bulbs you are looking at are T5HO, not T5 (just to clear up the semantics) and they are very bright (5000 lumens). These are too bright and glarey to be hung lower than approx. 12'. People have done it, but it's only OK if you're nearly blind. 6500 kelvin lamps are BLUE in my opinion. YMMV. If that kind of thing is cool with you, then dig in.
For lower ceilings, either use T8 strip fixtures or LED fixtures, depending on your wallet. T8's are what most people are familiar with as they are seen in nearly every building. Office buildings, hospitals, schools all vary between selecting 3500k and 4000k, but alot of folks on this forum seem to lean toward the 5000k, which is a little blue-er than white.
Good luck.
CD

 

[Orionrising]

those of you with a bunch of regular cfls, do you get any shadowing effects that can screw with your vision of sanding/ finishing due to the more point rather than linear light sources?

 

[laser3kw]

The T12 is being phased out. It also seems the T8's 8 foot length is being phased out.

(from an article online) DOE is regulating T12 lamps and some T8 lamps, incandescent lamps, and other inefficient technologies as a method of moving energy consumers to be more efficient. The new standards for linear fluorescent lamps is based on efficacy, or ensuring that newer lighting technology offers greater lumens (light output) per watt and a higher CRI (Color Rendering Index.) In effect since July 2012, the legislation eliminates nearly all 4-foot T12 lamps, some 4-foot T8 lamps, most 8-foot T12 lamps, and almost all standard halogen PAR38, PAR30 and PAR20 lamps from the market.

Is a T5 better than a T8? Compare energy consumption and lumens of two like sized bulbs. Generally they are equal in efficiency making it a moot decision. Economy would be the overriding factor.
I would go with either the 2 bulb, 4 foot T8 fixture or the 8ft tandem, 4 bulb T8 fixtures. I mixed 8 foot and 4 foot fixtures in each row to get the coverage I wanted.
When I did my shop, Home Depot had a 30 pack of 4 foot t8, 4500k bulbs for $55. I thought that was reasonable.

 

[wheels2]

Don't rule out CFL's. I put 12 in my 30x40 on three circuits. Using regular old ceramic bases and getting the bulbs off Amazon I have about $200 in them, well less than fluorescent tubes. I don't have power to the building yet but testing them in the house, they are very bright. There's a couple good threads on here with night pics.



I used CFLs after trying other more expensive lights. Painted the vaulted ceiling of my 20x30 shop white and am very happy with the bright even lighting.
I think you will enjoy yours.

Harvey