We're planning to build a pole building (48' D x 64' W) in the next couple years and one of my wants is a wash bay area that I can wash our vehicles, a very muddy side x side, and dirty tractor during the winter. Another want is radiant floor heat. How practical is it wash heavy mud off into floor drains and keep them from getting clogged up or is this not a realistic expectation for floor drains?
Wash bay in garage?
- Thread starter MattN03
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HOTFR8
Banned
I have seen it done before. A lot of work for the concreter to slope the floor but it can be done. I think the one I was shown had lift up grates so you could hose it out.
Woodman920
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You need a catch basin. Essentially a box in the floor with a grate on top and the drain outlet up off the bottom with a baffle or weir in front of it to knock down the solids. Sand silt and heavy stuff will settle out. You have to go in regularly and scoop out the debris. If built correctly and maintained, your drains will stay clear.
Dan, from my phone
Dan, from my phone
Free Willie
Well-known member
As far as getting the slope of the concrete correct I suggest using a trough drain near the door like I did. The floor should be sloped towards the door anyway (mine slopes 4" in 32'). Big pain in the *** to make a center drain work. I don't have a basin in mine but my vehicles aren't super muddy most of the time and when I do have a lot of mud I will shovel it off the floor when done.
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Farmall 1066
Well-known member
A friend incorporated a wash bag into his farm shop build. When washing really dirty
stuff, the catch basin will fill up fast. He made a large steel box to line his that can be lifted out with tractor and loader, and taken out and dumped.
Works pretty slick.
stuff, the catch basin will fill up fast. He made a large steel box to line his that can be lifted out with tractor and loader, and taken out and dumped.
Works pretty slick.
seagravedriver
Well-known member
We have them at several fire stations. Things on the wall WILL get wet. Maybe you are more careful then half a dozen tired guys nearing the end of a 24 hour shift, but trust me, things get wet. It is nice to have, however.
58Yeoman
Well-known member
The first house I built had an attached 24x30 garage with two 'pits', one on the double side and one on the single side. I had them (severely) slope the floors toward the drains in the middle of the bays. I then installed a 'catwalk' grate over both holes. They were probably 18" square, if I remember.
PIA trying to use a creeper under the cars, and if you don't keep them clean, they will begin to smell. If you can smell it, then it smells even worse when you shovel them out. My present shop has a 2" regular drain on the double side, and it drains to sunlight.
PIA trying to use a creeper under the cars, and if you don't keep them clean, they will begin to smell. If you can smell it, then it smells even worse when you shovel them out. My present shop has a 2" regular drain on the double side, and it drains to sunlight.
HOTFR8
Banned
Sadly I can not get photos of the wash bay I refer to. it was well set up with an over head swivel arm for the pressure washer. You could look to the coin wash bays for some ideas.
I've always thought having a pull around curtain like this...
...would be the ideal way to have a wash bay. Make sure you can close all 4 sides and then the walls would never be a problem. Bonus if you set it up to do light paint work too.
...would be the ideal way to have a wash bay. Make sure you can close all 4 sides and then the walls would never be a problem. Bonus if you set it up to do light paint work too.
ard
Well-known member
If I was going to do it for an inside location, I would absolutely be sure to control the water ABOVE the floor. Slopes and drains seem simple... Managing spray onto walls and ceilings would be the challenge.
4x12 plastic panels glue to OSB, edges & corners sealed? Watch the bottom of the wall detail- water drains downs and away- maybe a stem wall so there is no framing at the corner where floor meets wall....use FRP? https://www.frpshop.com/category/frp/
Given my weather, doesn't freeze, I have an outdoor area for wash then pull inside for drying / detail...but hot water outside.
4x12 plastic panels glue to OSB, edges & corners sealed? Watch the bottom of the wall detail- water drains downs and away- maybe a stem wall so there is no framing at the corner where floor meets wall....use FRP? https://www.frpshop.com/category/frp/
Given my weather, doesn't freeze, I have an outdoor area for wash then pull inside for drying / detail...but hot water outside.
sberry
Banned
I live on 2 miles of mud, clay and gravel. I have a drain but do not wash inside. I have a hot hi pressure washer and everything gets cleaned or deiced before it comes in. I don't want road salt and gravel, clay all over. Its enough of a problem as it is and I leave as much outside as I can.
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rburke65
Well-known member
duck face...Does new code prohibit this due to environmental concerns? .....what are these new rules.
Richard Cranium
Well-known member
for what ever reason you see very few shops with indoors wash rack.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
Most cities will NOT allow any kind of floor drain in a garage. The ones that do, want you to have a very expensive oil separator installed.
Plastic hanging drapes are a good idea.
Plastic hanging drapes are a good idea.
krcoomer
Well-known member
You don't mention if you are on septic or sewer, but no ground water is allowed in city sewers here and you would not want to add it to your septic system for sure. IMHO, this would be ground water if the intent is to only wash off vehicles. It would be no different than washing said vehicle on your driveway as far as chemicals added to the mix. Perhaps run the open trough to grade as someone else suggested. If you go this route, on the inside you would probably want a method to block it off to prevent cold air infiltration and critters from making their way in. Perhaps a slot at the head of your pipe for a plate like the blastgate on a dust collector.
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Jeepster04
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For whatever reason, some places have strick laws on washing a vehicle inside with drains. Grease trap and all that.
Im building a pole barn garage and when I am able to concrete it Im just going to slope the concrete to the center and out of the garage. My current house I live in with an attached two car garage is like that and it works fine for washing vehicles.
That way I dont need to worry with drains, codes, and clogs. Open door 1/4" in the winter and it all drains right out.
If my vehicles are too dirty for washing inside I simply spray them off outside first.
Im building a pole barn garage and when I am able to concrete it Im just going to slope the concrete to the center and out of the garage. My current house I live in with an attached two car garage is like that and it works fine for washing vehicles.
That way I dont need to worry with drains, codes, and clogs. Open door 1/4" in the winter and it all drains right out.
If my vehicles are too dirty for washing inside I simply spray them off outside first.
jedeyeben
Well-known member
Codes...? What are these codes you speak of? JK. Yes it's an environmental concern as stated by others. Oil run off contamination. It can't be released into public sewers and if you have a septic it's not a good idea at all over time based on how much you run into it. I live in an area with no real code enforcement, we don't even have an inspector in the county, but my builder wouldn't put in drains in my barn for these same reasons. Now he would pour to any "existing" structures or plumbing that said homeowner installed in his absence... so obviously I have floor drains now. I live in the country, and mine are tied into the downspout/perimeter drains that I installed as well. It runs out on top of the soil behind the barn. I only use it as personal wash space so it's not seeing overload. I put in one 9' grate drain in the bay and two hole drains in the center of he rest of the building for general wash down area cleaning, all plumbed into 4" schedule 40 sewer pipe.
And I agree completely with its going to get things around you wet, the curtain is a great idea that I may just have to use myself.[emoji1360]
And I agree completely with its going to get things around you wet, the curtain is a great idea that I may just have to use myself.[emoji1360]
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sberry
Banned
I wrote more in a pressure washer thread, Menards in the title.
It'll be septic. I'm thinking I might be better off with simple floor drains to wash the vehicles with a garden hose inside (with water heater), and just pressure wash the muddy stuff outside. Hook up the pressure washer to the water heater if it's super cold.
RAYJAY
Well-known member
why ......... all of my floor / sink drains in my shop area run with my outside driveway drains,
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RAYJAY
Well-known member
just do a trap at the end, of the building, and grate the end of the pipe
ct03911
Well-known member
I am planning a wash bay in my garage. I haven't quite gotten that far but close. A few small punch list items to go and I'm ready for drywall. I'll offer some ideas I had.
I lot of home supply places sell the polypropylene panels you see at car washes and a lot of commercial bathrooms. Gap seals, etc, etc. I plan on green board under that paneling and on the ceiling.
I am a bit slowed up by how best to seal the top of the concrete wall area where the wall sill plate sits. I need some kind of flashing and of course won't carry the wall board all the way to the concrete wall. I cant just caulk the area to death. The sill plate sits on the foam roll sealer they use. There isn't a clean edge to run a bead of caulk really. I need flashing.
A friend of mine has a detail shop and can source the curtains.
I plan to use a hose with no nozzle and "run" the water over the car vs "spraying" it. This is a great way to wash indoors. I have a pressure washer hand gun without the wand so I can get underneath the frame and in the wheelwells really easy. Works good outside, I may not like that level of spray inside. We shall see.
My code does not allow drains inside. I put them just outside the doors, running the length of the doors and they run to daylight. The drain grates are not removable but I didn't envision the level of dirt you plan on. I'd just do removable grates.
My floor is sloped 3 1/2" over 27.5'. Seemed aggressive but then I was stupid and put fiberglass in the pour. Now the floor has "texture", unanticipated, and the water runoff so far has been less than desirable. I'll need to paint the floor and use a squeegee too but that's ok. The water moves towards the door but it's not like it runs out and you are all set.
With all this in place I hope to be able to wash with the garage doors open and inch or so and let it all run outside and finish with the squeegee. With the heat on and a dehumidifier running I hope for a good result and dry garage.
Picture is rotated, sorry, something GJ did to my file. You can see the grate outside the door.
Good luck on yours!
I lot of home supply places sell the polypropylene panels you see at car washes and a lot of commercial bathrooms. Gap seals, etc, etc. I plan on green board under that paneling and on the ceiling.
I am a bit slowed up by how best to seal the top of the concrete wall area where the wall sill plate sits. I need some kind of flashing and of course won't carry the wall board all the way to the concrete wall. I cant just caulk the area to death. The sill plate sits on the foam roll sealer they use. There isn't a clean edge to run a bead of caulk really. I need flashing.
A friend of mine has a detail shop and can source the curtains.
I plan to use a hose with no nozzle and "run" the water over the car vs "spraying" it. This is a great way to wash indoors. I have a pressure washer hand gun without the wand so I can get underneath the frame and in the wheelwells really easy. Works good outside, I may not like that level of spray inside. We shall see.
My code does not allow drains inside. I put them just outside the doors, running the length of the doors and they run to daylight. The drain grates are not removable but I didn't envision the level of dirt you plan on. I'd just do removable grates.
My floor is sloped 3 1/2" over 27.5'. Seemed aggressive but then I was stupid and put fiberglass in the pour. Now the floor has "texture", unanticipated, and the water runoff so far has been less than desirable. I'll need to paint the floor and use a squeegee too but that's ok. The water moves towards the door but it's not like it runs out and you are all set.
With all this in place I hope to be able to wash with the garage doors open and inch or so and let it all run outside and finish with the squeegee. With the heat on and a dehumidifier running I hope for a good result and dry garage.
Picture is rotated, sorry, something GJ did to my file. You can see the grate outside the door.
Good luck on yours!
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krcoomer
Well-known member
The problem with a trap is the good Kentucky clay the op and I get to deal with.
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Majordisorder
Well-known member
This is exactly what I do. The hard part of a good drain system is in the preparation. Careful attention to sub grade, rigid foam, re-bar, pex pipe, the drain unit with accommodation for debris, and finally-getting rid of the water. All while maintaining an even 5" slab thickness. It is not uncommon even for pro's to screw up in the prep. Mine goes to a separate gravel bed and perforated pipe outside of the building.
I built mine so the area inside the OHD all slopes to the center just in the area where one vehicle is parked, and the rest of the floor is level. That way when I drive an ice encrusted vehicle in, all you see the next morning is a few trickles of water finding their way to the center drain and the dry grit gets swept out. I can do light washing in this area, but pressure wash outside even if it is freezing.
padroo
Well-known member
I made the mistake of installing floor drains in my garage and not only does it **** a creeper into it, it also messes up jacking a car and jack stands don't sit level. When I repair my floor I plan on taking them out.
Some of the old car dealerships I have been in have a dedicated area for washing cars and have a short concrete block wall to contain the water.
Some of the old car dealerships I have been in have a dedicated area for washing cars and have a short concrete block wall to contain the water.
Yea, I can vouch for plenty of clay
. I'm hoping I can save enough topsoil from the drive, shop, and home construction to prevent having to haul in a lot of topsoil for the septic.matt_i
Well-known member
Couple of points.
Have you ever gone to a "diy" carwash with the pressure wash gun and not gotten soaked from the overspray? It seems like nearly everything inside that bay should be designed to get doused with water. I would not want to store anything else in the bay lest it get watered or else will live in a bath of humidity, which, in freezing temps, takes very little to condense on all cold surfaces. If I were to build a wash bay it would be a large dedicated space with that purpose only and no other items stored inside it. I think the solution of washing outside would be highly preferred. The "pro" carwashes are actually better imo since they wash the underbody...which is where the road salt actually attacks the chassis components and body.
As said, a floor drain pretty well *****. I have one that the previous owner put into my shop, 10-12" square center pot with no outlet. I have had to shim drawer-cabinets so the drawers don't auto-glide open. The concrete is cracked randomly in all directions radiating out because apparently they didn't use any reinforcement. I have thought about sawing/breaking that entire 26' square bay out and repouring level without the drain, it just happens to be a few hundred places down on the mad-money list. Never ever could I wash inside due to large collection of precision tools and machines which don't tolerate the humidity.
Have you ever gone to a "diy" carwash with the pressure wash gun and not gotten soaked from the overspray? It seems like nearly everything inside that bay should be designed to get doused with water. I would not want to store anything else in the bay lest it get watered or else will live in a bath of humidity, which, in freezing temps, takes very little to condense on all cold surfaces. If I were to build a wash bay it would be a large dedicated space with that purpose only and no other items stored inside it. I think the solution of washing outside would be highly preferred. The "pro" carwashes are actually better imo since they wash the underbody...which is where the road salt actually attacks the chassis components and body.
As said, a floor drain pretty well *****. I have one that the previous owner put into my shop, 10-12" square center pot with no outlet. I have had to shim drawer-cabinets so the drawers don't auto-glide open. The concrete is cracked randomly in all directions radiating out because apparently they didn't use any reinforcement. I have thought about sawing/breaking that entire 26' square bay out and repouring level without the drain, it just happens to be a few hundred places down on the mad-money list
. Never ever could I wash inside due to large collection of precision tools and machines which don't tolerate the humidity.sberry
Banned
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=348136 That garage is a substantial investment, the equipment to keep it clean as well as some cars may be worth investment. I posted in the end of that thread.
LS6 Tommy
Well-known member
Directly spraying mud and such off a vehicle and into a floor drain is not very realistic at all. Floor drains are not meant for solids. At even 1/4" pitch per foot they run almost horizontally. Even if you use 4" pipe it will eventually clog. A grated trench sump with the floor pitched to it to allow solids to settle out below the drain outlet is probably the best idea, but you will need to open it up and clean it.
IDK what your AHJ requires, but I bet you can't just let car wash water discharge out of a floor drain onto your property.
Can't have floor drains in a garage around here at all. You're lucky.
Tommy
sberry
Banned
I cleaned 2 cars today for work on. They were dry by the time we got them on the hoist.
sberry
Banned
If I was going to put in a wash bay for bad roads would make a bay and not a shared space. I may paint there but if you are routine washing it makes to much humid and dirty. Even as fussy as I am some dirt comes in but in my case it would be hundreds of pounds and 1000's in ice with salt.
I washed a car before church this morning.
I park about half way up on the apron so most of it doesn't even end up on the cement. I have 100 foot hose and it is enough to get around and not have it all in front of the door.
that car isn't parked exact but in cold weather take the wand off and store inside the walk door. I have a port to put the hose thru the wall, connect the gun and switches are outside for both pressure and burner. There is some heat loss, I bight the bullet and use 30 to 60 or so gallons of diesel in the winter to clean and melt. I probably use the same for grease, mold etc, anywhere heat speeds cleaning.
I washed a car before church this morning.
I park about half way up on the apron so most of it doesn't even end up on the cement. I have 100 foot hose and it is enough to get around and not have it all in front of the door.
that car isn't parked exact but in cold weather take the wand off and store inside the walk door. I have a port to put the hose thru the wall, connect the gun and switches are outside for both pressure and burner. There is some heat loss, I bight the bullet and use 30 to 60 or so gallons of diesel in the winter to clean and melt. I probably use the same for grease, mold etc, anywhere heat speeds cleaning.
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