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Wazer table top waterjet machine

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paranoid56

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dr_clyde

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Its a neat idea, but they got a long way to go. The reason waterjets are expensive is due to the high pressures involved, and this machine is noticeably lower pressure, significantly hindering its ability to do the work that a waterjet is typically needed for. Their unwillingness to divulge the pressure tells me its nothing worth writing home about.

Waterjets come into their own for thick metals, hard things, and things that burn or reflect a laser beam. This machine cuts a MAX of 3/16" steel, at less than a half inch a minute. Meh.

For the low price of farming out CNC laser, waterjet and oxyfuel burning, I would have a really hard time buying that thing. It can't cut 1/4" plate, and that can be cut by the local laser shop so cheap there's no way I could compete.

Waterjets are amazingly useful tools, but I need them to do actual work, and this one doesn't look up to more than a hobby crafter's needs. I need to be able to buy my materials and garnet in quantites where it makes fiscal sense to cut my own sheet, and this doesn't really optimize that.

I do recognize the entrepreneurial spirit,and the hard work and development that went into making this. It's a great concept. It probably would work great for the guy/gal who makes onesy-twosy widgets to sell on etsy.

I realize this sounds snobbish and elitist, probably because it is. I'm just used to using industrial machinery, and once you get used to having parts cut by real machines, everything else is just a toy and frustrating to use.

If these guys can make a machine that will take a 4'x4' sheet, with a pump running at least 55K PSI, and a table capacity that can take a few thousand pounds, for about 15K, I'd be interested. That, to me, is a great hobby sized machine. Small enough to fit in a garage, but big enough to cut real metal, in sizes that real metal can be bought cheaply enough.
 
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paranoid56

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yea it starts at like 80k for a 4x4. this isnt meant for a production shop though. more for a hobbyist. already i spend almost 10k at the laser cutter up north (cant do any near me as the price is 3x then going out of state) This seems like it might be a perfect little machine. I was going to go with plasma table as i already have a 2x4 cnc router, however the amount of change over to go back and forth *****. and i cant really fit a huge machine in my garage, where as this might work.

still on the fence though lol
 

dr_clyde

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If you're spending 10k a year in laser work, you can buy a used smaller waterjet for less than 80k. A pretty nice unit with all the trimmings can be had for less than 50 grand, and you're looking at a pretty decent payback period.

I would look hard for a used unit before buying this one.
 

Gamble

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I've known about this guy for awhile now and I think it's going to be insanely popular!
3/16" plate is plenty thick for most home hobbyist or semi production stuff. Waterjets are slow by nature for sure but who cares.
You still can cut it in your garage. Smoke and fume free also compared to my plasma.
Same concept with a 3d printer. Just design it and cut it and walk away. No need for crazy fast speeds unless you are impatient or need to do rapid amount of work.
If I had the spare cash I would buy this in a heart beat as I have a nice place next to my cnc plasma for it.
What I will say looks like the downside from the video is that it looks like the kerf is rather wide.
 
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paranoid56

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the kerf is only 1/16" so not that bad. the slowness and the non recycled water seems like the downsides for me.
 
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Mike_C

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The abrasives are the downside, and it sounds like that machine uses more than a traditional waterjet machine. The kickstarter page says abbrasives will be $0.60-1.10 a pound, that sprocket they cut used 31 pounds and took 98 minutes to cut.

Now if you are cutting soft materials, such as leather, you can get away with water only. But a $2000 laser can cut soft materials as well.

A CNC plasma makes a lot more sense, or even a CNC mill.
 

kazlx

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The concept is awesome, but like Dr Clyde said, there is no way this machine is useful for stuff other than etsy widgets. Don't get me wrong, I love the tech, and the fact that this machine is even available is awesome, but look at the times. That knife blank was 118 min. Two hours. You could bandsaw it in 5 minutes and clean it up on a grinder in another 5. I do realize it has benefits to stuff that just isn't very conducive to metal type cutting. Maybe for someone that does glass/tile. It's definitely nifty.

I would sell my plasma and get a waterjet when feasible.

FWIW, if I remember right, I think the kerf on a decent waterjet is like .020
 
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Major Ramifications

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It's a neat concept, but I don't see it being very practical. There are much cheaper and cleaner ways to cut metal (as Doctor Evil would say, "With freakin' LASERS!"). It may be good for glass, ceramic, foam, plastic, stuff like that.
Also, they really glossed over all the down sides of using a waterjet. Granulated garnet is expensive, heavy as hell and STINKS to high heaven after it's been sitting in that tank for a while. The supporting grid rails need to be constantly replaced etc. Depending on the design, the machine needs to be baby-sat to toothpick parts to keep them from dropping out.
They will not divulge the pressure that their pump makes (I don't even know if it uses a true intensifier pump) they just say that it produces less pressure than an industrial waterjet. Also, the dudes look like hippies, which piss me off.
 

tarbellb

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Agreed, the idea is awesome. And any early adopter will tell you, its expensive and time consuming. Glad somebody out there has the time/$ to guinea pig these.


But $30+ in abrasives + the cost of steel + 98 mins for that sprocket... yikes.

I just ordered three unique pieces totaling 30lbs, one with 1/16" wide bridges for $62 laser cut.
 

Gamble

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The abrasives are the downside, and it sounds like that machine uses more than a traditional waterjet machine. The kickstarter page says abbrasives will be $0.60-1.10 a pound, that sprocket they cut used 31 pounds and took 98 minutes to cut.

Now if you are cutting soft materials, such as leather, you can get away with water only. But a $2000 laser can cut soft materials as well.

A CNC plasma makes a lot more sense, or even a CNC mill.

Wow that *****! So that sprocket has you ******* $30 in media, say $10-20 in material, design time and over 1.5hours to cut. Where is the damn profit?
 

gte718p

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It's a neat concept, but I don't see it being very practical. There are much cheaper and cleaner ways to cut metal (as Doctor Evil would say, "With freakin' LASERS!"). It may be good for glass, ceramic, foam, plastic, stuff like that.
Also, they really glossed over all the down sides of using a waterjet. Granulated garnet is expensive, heavy as hell and STINKS to high heaven after it's been sitting in that tank for a while. The supporting grid rails need to be constantly replaced etc. Depending on the design, the machine needs to be baby-sat to toothpick parts to keep them from dropping out.
They will not divulge the pressure that their pump makes (I don't even know if it uses a true intensifier pump) they just say that it produces less pressure than an industrial waterjet. Also, the dudes look like hippies, which piss me off.

It is 10k psi. It is in one of the videos. You can also look them up on hack-a-day and see the college project behind this. There is more info in the college senior design videos.

It is still over priced, but it is a first salvo that will drive waterjets down to a reasonable price.
 

rsanter

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I really want that machine
Perfect size for me

However I think I will wait till they actually become available and we see how well they really work. This is the tip of the iceberg. Once one is available then the market will open for others
Then perhaps a DIY version

Bob
 

rsanter

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Seems like perfect machine for someone that does a lot of prototyping.

The machine recovers the abrasives in a bucket. Can they be dried out and reused?

Edit: answered my own question: https://www.kickstarter.com/project...-waterjet-cutter?ref=email#project_faq_183282

Though I'm still not sure why it wouldn't be reusable to some extent if it was dried out.


As you cut the garnet abrasive as well as bit of the material that is cut will end up in the waste water. Just like what happens with a sand blaster, it is often the contamination that is responsible for the clogging of the works.
I would assume that if you are cutting steel or glass then you would likly have small enough particles that they would be as fine or finer than the actual garnet. Other materials would be more likly to clog the system.
Now if you could figure out the grit of the garnet and then get a screen that has that size of holes so you could filter/sift the garnet and clean it of the larger particles then I bet you could reuse the garnet abrasive.
Also if you were cutting certain other materials such as wood, paper materials, materials with a sticky nature...etc then you should likly concider the garnet contaminated

Bob
 

Major Ramifications

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There is no way in hell that the sludge that comes out of the waterjet tank could be reused. Maybe for something, but the waterjet needs very consistent, dry, and sharp media to function well.
 

dr_clyde

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The garnet can only be used once. It needs to be sharp, and once it has cut through material, it has been destroyed. It also is contaminated with the base material and is now inconsistent for the feed mechanism.
 

kkroger

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My Air Plasma cuts 18 ga at 300 IPM no problem and little to no dross, even a GOOD Waterjet is SLOW, running at maybe 30 IPM on 18 Ga, Lasers are not much if any faster to be honest... Depending on your level of detail for production Plasma is pretty damned efficient... I do some fairly detailed cuts...

https://wardjet.com/products/waterjets/wardkit Could always try Ward Jet....
A 2x2 Wardjet is about $69k tho... and it is a kit.... with a 30HP intensifier pump...
 
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