Welder advice
- Thread starter dtrojcak
- Start date
$300 isn't bad, and they are very reliable boxes, but the 15 amp increment steps would be annoying to me.
In the past year I've bought two Miller thunderbolt AC/DC machines for $250 and those have a dial you crank for any amperage you want....it's handy. I got the first one and was really happy with it, so I grabbed the second one a few months later at an estate sale, cleaned it up and flipped it for $350 a week later.
In the past year I've bought two Miller thunderbolt AC/DC machines for $250 and those have a dial you crank for any amperage you want....it's handy. I got the first one and was really happy with it, so I grabbed the second one a few months later at an estate sale, cleaned it up and flipped it for $350 a week later.
IndyGarage
Well-known member
Personally I would start with a MIG welder vs a stick welder if I was a beginner.
I would find the best used Hobart, Lincoln or Miller Mig welder I could - with a tank of gas.
I see those old tombstone welders around here for less than $200 quite frequently.
I would find the best used Hobart, Lincoln or Miller Mig welder I could - with a tank of gas.
I see those old tombstone welders around here for less than $200 quite frequently.
Since he already has experience with a stick welder, it shouldn't be a problem.
I see the AC version of the Lincoln Tombstone for less than $200 regularly, but not the AC/DC version.
bcradio
Well-known member
I also would go with a MIG
great white tj
Well-known member
If it was me starting over, I would p/u this AC/DC welder put it on the DC side and don't look back. That is a good price for that welder and it looks clean. Then I would p/u a small Mig. You can start off with Hobart 140.. you will hear all the negatives about 110 volt welder. This is what I started out on and it worked for me. Then move up to a 200 amp welder, Look at the Hobart 210 and the Miller 211, each of these are 110/220 units. As in any tool buy..... Money can be an issue. You will not make a bad deal on any Hobart or Miller unit. I hope this helps. I have the Miller 211 the older unit 2009 and a Miller 252. I use the 211 a lot more than the 252.
rnscustom
Well-known member
110 mig , put the spool in and go , will do anything that will , portable , no rods to deal with . Those are nice for thick metals ( I know you can do thin ) . You need a beefy outlet and extension cord or your limited to working in one area .
Cope
Well-known member
With all due respect, a 110V Mig cannot do anything that Lincoln can.
alskdjfhg
Well-known member
Youll learn better technique by starting with stick.
I, and countless others, started with the ubiquitous buzzbox. Simple and cheap. Now my main machine is a 500 amp engine drive miller and I'm gonna be getting a heavy mig soon.
Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
I, and countless others, started with the ubiquitous buzzbox. Simple and cheap. Now my main machine is a 500 amp engine drive miller and I'm gonna be getting a heavy mig soon.
Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
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James-W
Well-known member
We have a local technical college and they have a beginners welding course you can take for not too much money. If you are just starting out in welding I would suggest taking a course like this because you can try different welders and get a better idea of which welder would be best for you.
Thank all that is right in the world for this sentiment finally taking root on GJ.
I am so tired of the lack of talent trying to be hidden by the most expensive or complicated of tools.
Buy the Welder. You can use it the rest of your life.
If the 15 amp increments bother you get better at solving problems.
I'd buy it.
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Stooge
Well-known member
since I didn't see it asked, what are you planning on mainly welding with the machine? thick steel farm equipment, or a VW beetle resto project? would be good for one, but not the other. If its going to be light steel and sheet metal and something decent all around, I would also look at a lower tier mig, like the Hobart 140 that was mentioned. if its going to be farm implements or something, it will be fine
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ez-duzit
Well-known member
Yes, it's a decent welder.
sberry
Banned
Great white and cope hit on it here. The steps are not really a problem and down where it counts they are not 15a but 5 and 10. A 200 class mig can do most of the work but this little machine is really part of a complete shop especially if one does equipment repair.
This is a very very good machine, professional quality arc, just about as good as any. You could fudge around and try to score one 50 cheaper but it really isn't worth the effort and they don't hang from the trees everywhere. It would go fast at that price here, in Seattle Scott V says they are 150 all the time.
There are 3 electrodes to go with it. 1/8 6011 (could use 10) 3/32 7018 and 1/8 7018 and as the man said, put it on DCRP and bust the knob off so you aint tempted to fool with it.
I got 10 machines, one cost 1000's. I am a career welder and this is still my go to stick machine in the shop. I have ran it way past the duty cycle and then some, burn a whole handful of 1/8 lo hy at a time as fast as I could chuck them in the stinger.
I have mine hooked to a common ground, a couple ground leads and 2 stingers, one goes to the welding booth and reaches my benches and the other to be able to work outside.
I like 2 machines, I can get by without tig but this one and a 200 class mig.
This is a very very good machine, professional quality arc, just about as good as any. You could fudge around and try to score one 50 cheaper but it really isn't worth the effort and they don't hang from the trees everywhere. It would go fast at that price here, in Seattle Scott V says they are 150 all the time.
There are 3 electrodes to go with it. 1/8 6011 (could use 10) 3/32 7018 and 1/8 7018 and as the man said, put it on DCRP and bust the knob off so you aint tempted to fool with it.
I got 10 machines, one cost 1000's. I am a career welder and this is still my go to stick machine in the shop. I have ran it way past the duty cycle and then some, burn a whole handful of 1/8 lo hy at a time as fast as I could chuck them in the stinger.
I have mine hooked to a common ground, a couple ground leads and 2 stingers, one goes to the welding booth and reaches my benches and the other to be able to work outside.
I like 2 machines, I can get by without tig but this one and a 200 class mig.
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sberry
Banned
I have a 180 and a 250 and also use the smaller one a lot more. It hangs out at my bench and I like the smaller wire for all the trinket work.
I finally moved it after a few years, the way I have it rigged now it will reach about 1/4 of my shop from one plug in location. Its super fast and easy.
Only a little water on the floor, not grease,,, ha
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Well we will see how I like it since I picked it up earlier.
He even threw in a ~50' cord with a plug on the end.
My shop is 40x60 with the breaker panel in the middle of a 60' side.
I should be able to weld just about every where inside.
He even threw in a ~50' cord with a plug on the end.
My shop is 40x60 with the breaker panel in the middle of a 60' side.
I should be able to weld just about every where inside.
Great choice.
sberry
Banned
A cord is good. I actually like lead better. I use connectors due to the fact I have lotso machines but a guy could split bolt it just outside the machine and add some number 2. As I mention I essentially have a Y with 2 sets on it, just a convenience thing.
Mine is on the floor, I could hang it if I was more cramped for space there but its not an issue.
It can produce better than this.
Mine is on the floor, I could hang it if I was more cramped for space there but its not an issue.
It can produce better than this.
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rnscustom
Well-known member
And viseversa , as posted depends on what you want to do with it . Mine sits in the corner since I got my mig . ( he did get a nice cord which I didn't have ) . I've welded 1/2" steel with my mig but it's a rarity for me and most . Recently I bought a tig which also does ac / dc stick . Havnt used that feature yet . Point is all the guys who learned on stick say you should start there if you want to learn . That's ok but the issue is what would be most versatile if that was all you had to spend on something that could be an all around machine . My answer would be mig not stick . Portable , easy to learn and can weld 22ga all the way to ?? ( depending on amp ),
bczygan
Well-known member
Mine was $70.
Cope
Well-known member
Used to be 75, it's the 100% duty cycle setting.
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dr_clyde
Well-known member
There is a reason they teach welding in a certain order. Oxy-acetylene first, then stick, TIG, and MIG last. There are certain characteristics of the arc and puddle that are critical to getting good welds, and it's easy for a MIG to fool the untrained eye.
Wire welding is very easy get wrong. Setting up the machine propery to not have cold lap, lack of fusion and bad bead profiles takes skill and practice. If you have the settings wrong, the welder doesn't care, it's gonna keep spitting out wire and making sparks. It may or may not be making a good weld. With stick, chances are good if you have enough amps to keep it lit, you're in the ballpark, settings wise.
As far as versatility, the answer there is a good AC/DC TIG/stick machine. By far. Welding any weldable alloys, 2 processes, maybe even 3 with a spoolgun on some machines. The ultimate in control and precision, as well as reliable welding for the thinnest to the thickest metals. Very portable, especially with a 200a inverter and a small gas cylinder. I put mine in the small scissor lift at work and take it up with me.
Mig only is faster if you happen to need to weld steel within the range of the wire currently in the machine. It's very convienient for the occasional steel quickie, don't get me wrong. I have and use many wire welders. Difficult to weld metals like stainless, aluminum, copper, magnesium, and titanium, especially thin sheet or tube, don't weld especially well or easily with MIG. I realize the home shop may never encounter some of this, but I do, and I can't be alone. Aluminum radiators, stainless exhaust, magnesium tool housings, common copper fittings; these are all things the home shop may need to weld.
OP, good score on the Lincoln. They are a solid, dependable machine.
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rnscustom
Well-known member
Yes , in school we learned gas then stick . We didn't have mig or tig . I can weld bertter with gas than stick or mig . I still havnt had enough practice to be good at either . But of the two I mig better ( never could get the hang of that little stick machine I have ) . Tig I havnt even tried the machine . The kids have used it a few times . If they taught a class in welding that included mig and tig I would take it but stick is all they teach in summer courses . When I retire I will have time to play with them . Yes good score .
sberry
Banned
I got about as big a selection of moving machinery, cars and trucks as most, I never weld that stuff. I cant even remember the last time I weld stainless, copper never, mag alloy never. The only non steel I do is alumin8um and that's really due to the fact I have 10 miles of alum irrigation pipe most people dont have and the mig has replaced the tig for that.
Its not that I cant tig, actually not bad at it and better than some but I just don't need it. It would be different if I hung out my shingle as a specialty weld shop but its really a steel world and to tell the truth could do 99,5% of it with a small feeder, only reason I use some stick outside of portable is because I can.
I would be lost without a mig, the world is getting lighter all the time. Way more stuff built from sheet than ever.
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sberry
Banned
When I was a kid we braze and torch weld sheet all the time, I cant even remember the last time I did that since we went to mig. Even copper piping s becoming obsolete at the homeowner level, cant recall if I ever owned anything with stainless exhaust.
I passed my first open **** cert in 1980, have never owned or welded an alum radiator. As for stainless, last major work was reman a 40 ft semi trailer, just not something most homebodies do.
I passed my first open **** cert in 1980, have never owned or welded an alum radiator. As for stainless, last major work was reman a 40 ft semi trailer, just not something most homebodies do.
Zeke
Well-known member
I'd have bought that in a heartbeat. I have the AC only version and it's a good machine. But I do know the advantages of DC welding and you can run a TIG torch off that machine if you wish.
dr_clyde
Well-known member
I never said that a mig wasn't useful. I just said it's not as versatile. See, there's way more to welding than just fixing things. Repair is a common use, but in most of your posts, I don't see you create things. The world has a lot of people that do things just for the challenge, or simply for the fun of it. TIG welds look nice. They just do. That can an be a reason to TIG something, even if you can do it with a MIG. Fabricators like to have lots of different solutions at their fingertips. And TIG simply is more useful, due to the ability to literally weld anything that can be welded.
If you have a car hobby, as tons of guys with home shops do, you're gonna run into a lot more than steel. Modifying aluminum bellhousings, repairing rims, re-routing cooling lines, air conditioning components, there's a lot of aluminum in the world. I'll admit, copper isn't as common, but I've modified a fair bit of common plumbing parts. Racing, motorcycles, off road, side by sides, homebrewing, I could go on. My point is, when all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.
sberry
Banned
I will agree a specialized hobby is one thing, motorsports certainly falls in to that. But my Bud have auto repair shop, not once in 30 years he call me to tig something and I can count on one had the times I really been jammed up with aluminum not including irrigation.
You make a living welding specialty metals, it may seem like everyone needs to do this but I know lots of people made it in life with a buzzer. I do create and if its possible do it with common steel. Its not a hobby though but **** I need to keep moving.
As I mention I do aluminum but I tend to consider whether the avg person has this, I have 1000's of pieces most don't have so I take that in to consideration. I do have the rest many or most do, some auto body, the proverbial mower deck, auto repair, jig and fixture and along with the tig I have never need a super flat bench with dozens of holes as I can easily make do with a few simple common clamps for the 1 off types of things I do.
You make a living welding specialty metals, it may seem like everyone needs to do this but I know lots of people made it in life with a buzzer. I do create and if its possible do it with common steel. Its not a hobby though but **** I need to keep moving.
As I mention I do aluminum but I tend to consider whether the avg person has this, I have 1000's of pieces most don't have so I take that in to consideration. I do have the rest many or most do, some auto body, the proverbial mower deck, auto repair, jig and fixture and along with the tig I have never need a super flat bench with dozens of holes as I can easily make do with a few simple common clamps for the 1 off types of things I do.
great white tj
Well-known member
sberry
Banned
Unless there is a specific compelling reason anyone telling most people on this forum to buy something other than a 200 mig as a first machine is doing them a dis service. I say this despite the fact my real expertise is in stick welding. I am not confusing what I like, or that fact with what is the right machine for most that want to build and repair general stuff found in most daily life.
This does not obviously apply to a special hobby but I like to see the first time user get some real use and return, most have an objective and have something they want or need to do, they are not destine to become career job shop welders or work on specialty processing equipment.
This does not obviously apply to a special hobby but I like to see the first time user get some real use and return, most have an objective and have something they want or need to do, they are not destine to become career job shop welders or work on specialty processing equipment.
My point is when you work in a special business it may seem everyone has a need to do this which is not accurate.
sberry
Banned
I got every one of these machines, its not the only tools is a hammer scenario, I just tend to do and use most practical I can. A 210 with spooly gets me thru most problems cant be done with steel wire. I have other machines due to some cost. I have a 250 mig, could get by without it on most days, weeks, did use it the other day building a post driver. Used it cause I could, wouldn't have been worth getting and could have used other stuff if I didn't have it.
sberry
Banned
dr_clyde
Well-known member
It may seem like I can only view the world through my own lens. Because I weld a lot of stainless, the rest of the world must too, right?
I deal with a large variety of shops and people. I feel like I have a decent handle on what the common guy welds. This forum isn't populated by the common guy.
We are a group of mechanically inclined shop guys. We do the weird things, the custom job, the racecars, the artwork. We are exactly the group that would come across a large variety of materials. The motor swap into the car that doesn't really fit, the repair on that thing the common guy throws out, the the situations demanding a versatile welder.
Yes, a little mig welder will weld all the cracked lawn mower decks and cut up washing machines you can throw at it. But that wasn't the point.
The point was, if you can have one welder, which one is the most versatile? You will never be able to convince me that a small, 200 class mig is more versatile than a AC/DC TIG. It's simply not the case. Let's eliminate all non ferrous from the mix and only talk about steel. I still would choose TIG. A TIG will weld something as thin as razor blades, as thick as you want. You have the ultimate in control. You can weld without filler! Try that with a mig. My point is, with a little practice, the TIG becomes the scalpel, putting exactly the right weld when the situation calls for it.
MIG has a very clearly defined place in industry and in the home shop. I have 2 wire welders, and use them often. I am not saying they aren't useful. Their advantages are speed and cheap. That's it. Bar none. Every single thing a wire welder can do, another process can do. But not the other way around.
I deal with a large variety of shops and people. I feel like I have a decent handle on what the common guy welds. This forum isn't populated by the common guy.
We are a group of mechanically inclined shop guys. We do the weird things, the custom job, the racecars, the artwork. We are exactly the group that would come across a large variety of materials. The motor swap into the car that doesn't really fit, the repair on that thing the common guy throws out, the the situations demanding a versatile welder.
Yes, a little mig welder will weld all the cracked lawn mower decks and cut up washing machines you can throw at it. But that wasn't the point.
The point was, if you can have one welder, which one is the most versatile? You will never be able to convince me that a small, 200 class mig is more versatile than a AC/DC TIG. It's simply not the case. Let's eliminate all non ferrous from the mix and only talk about steel. I still would choose TIG. A TIG will weld something as thin as razor blades, as thick as you want. You have the ultimate in control. You can weld without filler! Try that with a mig. My point is, with a little practice, the TIG becomes the scalpel, putting exactly the right weld when the situation calls for it.
MIG has a very clearly defined place in industry and in the home shop. I have 2 wire welders, and use them often. I am not saying they aren't useful. Their advantages are speed and cheap. That's it. Bar none. Every single thing a wire welder can do, another process can do. But not the other way around.
dr_clyde
Well-known member
I would like to apologize to the OP. We terribly derailed this thread. Sberry and I have been going rounds on this for years. We both have valid viewpoints and things get a little heated sometimes.
Nope