Welder advice

[G-ManBart]

Unless there is a specific compelling reason anyone telling most people on this forum to buy something other than a 200 mig as a first machine is doing them a dis service.

I'm glad nobody tried to confuse me with this idea before I started welding.

 

[joshuab90]

For that price, I'd buy it. Since you are beginning, you don't need an expensive welder. You need practice and I would practice with that.

 

[WittHay]

That Lincoln welder is more than a decent welder, They are good welders that would last a lifetime for backyard use.

My opinion on stick, mig and tig is that people who weld on farms usually weld steel and don't have time to set up welders for non-ferrous metal. The buzz box is for welding the rusty stuff outside in the wind and the mig is used for fabricating larger projects inside using clean steel and for thinner stuff

For backyard use, If you like welding I would get a tig, more precise for hobby work and you could still stick weld for thicker steel. Tough recommending welders, sorta like when some one asks, Whats the best tool box for my home shop?

 

[rnscustom]

Ok , for me it's all about fixing things , and it doesn't have to be pretty some times ( even though I clean it up ) . Cars is my hobby and everyone is different . Nice thing so far about this forum is people tell it like it is , don't see much anger just opinions . i'm a tool pack rat so I have just about everything I need ( I buy used or clearance , not rich ) . For me the mig is the go to for a quick fix or patching sheetmetal . For art it might be different . Great post and great people here . The post is Welder Advice so I don't see any apologies necessary from anyone here . I'm sure the OP wasn't expecting everyone to tell him to buy it or there would be no post

 

[-->]

I'd buy that. My first real welder was the AC version of that......shown here in about 1982. Still have it at my present location.

Dude cool setup. It looks like you made the most of a very small space there. Where are you working out of now ?

 

[dtrojcak]

I've been told that I should be able to weld aluminum with a low amperage DC weld.

I don't really have any plans to weld aluminum, but is that correct?

 

[dr_clyde]

I've been told that I should be able to weld aluminum with a low amperage DC weld.

I don't really have any plans to weld aluminum, but is that correct?

You can't get the oxide film off with DC, so it will be like welding pudding with the skin on it. As far as low amperage, only on thin sheet maybe. Either way you're looking at a headache.

Edit: I realize now you mean with a stick electrode. Yes it is possible but for sure not easy. It wouldn't be my first choice.

 

[dffay]

You can't go wrong with it. AC and DC have their benefits, you can weld in high winds, go hot enough to burn through poor metal conditions, and dissimilar metals with "problem-solver" rod, cast iron, etc. Those things, when not abused will outlast you and the next three weldors. The older ones (and it looks like that one is by the muted color of red) have all copper windings too.

 

[Cope]

Nope

Pretty useless reply. If that's not correct (and it used to be) then what is it?

 

[Brad54]

since I didn't see it asked, what are you planning on mainly welding with the machine? thick steel farm equipment, or a VW beetle resto project? would be good for one, but not the other. If its going to be light steel and sheet metal and something decent all around, I would also look at a lower tier mig, like the Hobart 140 that was mentioned. if its going to be farm implements or something, it will be fine

I can't believe it took 14 posts before someone brought up the most relevant question.

If you have access to a 240v circuit, or even have to put one in, I'd save up and go with a 240v MIG machine.
Flux core can be done, but the results just aren't that great in my opinion.
240v MIG will weld everything this side of heavy equipment, down to thin stamped valve covers.

-Brad

 

[jubilee]

That's a great economical welder. In the sixties and seventies there was one of those in about every shop. I learned to stick weld aluminum on the D.C. Side of one of those, an ability I still use today in the field. You can't spool or tig when the winds blowing 20 mph.

 

[xjfish]

People get good at welding by welding, not by going out and buying a more expensive welder.

When I learned to weld in high school, I was much better at stick welding vs MIG...

 

[Loscaldazar]

Pretty useless reply. If that's not correct (and it used to be) then what is it?

That setting used to be advertised as the setting you could use to thaw frozen pipes. Lincoln has taken it out of the manuals for at least a decade or two (if not more) and no longer recommend using a welder to defrost pipes.

However, one of the reasons 70/75 amps was the setting recommended for thawing pipes is because the machine has a 100% duty cycle there. So not necessarily wrong either.

I've seen this question come up a few times in different places and people get really heated over what is the correct reason for the circle. It's a little crazy to watch sometimes.

 

[ducksface]

To thaw pipes.
The 100% duty cycle is coincidental to the pipe thawing. If it meant to be to show 100%duty cycle(my lack of electrical knowledge may be showing here)it would have all amps circled UP TO the maximum 100% duty cycle amps. (unless less amps somehow makes for NOT 100%duty cycle.)
The pipe thawing question is an easy delineator of who burns stick and who knows the how and why of the machine they are commenting on. If you don't know the machine it is ridiculous to comment on it comparatively.
It's a kind of
Where did they bury the survivors of a plane that crashes on the US Canadian border type question.

I answered in the
way I did so others could play.
My dad spent a bad winter in Missouri as a pipe thawed and didn't weld anything all winter.
I bet he had 300 feet of lead. I dragged a **** load of lead through a **** load of cow **** that year.

 

[L.Cheapo]

You can't spool or tig when the winds blowing 20 mph.

 

[L.Cheapo]

To thaw pipes.
The 100% duty cycle is coincidental to the pipe thawing. If it meant to be to show 100%duty cycle(my lack of electrical knowledge may be showing here)it would have all amps circled UP TO the maximum 100% duty cycle amps. (unless less amps somehow makes for NOT 100%duty cycle.)
The pipe thawing question is an easy delineator of who burns stick and who knows the how and why of the machine they are commenting on. If you don't know the machine it is ridiculous to comment on it comparatively.
It's a kind of
Where did they bury the survivors of a plane that crashes on the US Canadian border type question.

I answered in the
way I did so others could play.
My dad spent a bad winter in Missouri as a pipe thawed and didn't weld anything all winter.
I bet he had 300 feet of lead. I dragged a **** load of lead through a **** load of cow **** that year.

I thought the old buzz boxes were 20% duty cycle on ANY setting?

 

[jubilee]

Yeah, I wonder how that would work on aluminum?

 

[great white tj]

Would this be a decent welder for limited use for a beginner?
The only welder I have ever used is the AC only version of this welder.
I found this one for $300.
New, they are around $550.
Is this a decent welder for that price?

I don't think this post went south to fast, I think the posts on the first page helped him a lot. As time went on this post did go south... He asked if the welder was """decent for limited use for a beginner""" answer yes.... He ask about the price... answer yes... If you look at the pic. you will see that some one on took care of the welder. It still has the original plug, the leads looked to be in very good shape, and the welder is clean. ( this welder has some age... it is not new ) It is a decent welder for that price. Weather it be a Hobart or Lincoln or any other brand of welder... these AC/DC stick welders just don't come up for sale every day. The OP is a new member... hell he just might have a lot to offer in other areas of this site.... I just wish all of us would read the posts and answer them with your knowledge on the question.

 

[L.Cheapo]

Yeah, I wonder how that would work on aluminum?

Given the source, I doubt it works on steel too.

 

[dtrojcak]

I don't think this post went south to fast, I think the posts on the first page helped him a lot. As time went on this post did go south... He asked if the welder was """decent for limited use for a beginner""" answer yes.... He ask about the price... answer yes... If you look at the pic. you will see that some one on took care of the welder. It still has the original plug, the leads looked to be in very good shape, and the welder is clean. ( this welder has some age... it is not new ) It is a decent welder for that price. Weather it be a Hobart or Lincoln or any other brand of welder... these AC/DC stick welders just don't come up for sale every day. The OP is a new member... hell he just might have a lot to offer in other areas of this site.... I just wish all of us would read the posts and answer them with your knowledge on the question.

Some of the posts were a little off topic and it seems that there is some "history" between some of the posters.

In general, I value all of the responses since they either educated me or reaffirmed something I already knew.

I appreciate all of the responses and TBH, I didn't expect to receive so many.
Thank you to all who helped me with my questions.

Now I need to figure out where I want to put my plug(s) for it.

Another question on the plug situation.
Is it safe to run 2 plugs off the same breaker?
My breaker panel is in the middle of a side wall.
I'm thinking to put a plug directly out of the panel and another on the opposite front wall corner of shop.
Only one plug would be in use at a time.
Most of my welding would be done under the carport in front of the shop.
The plug at the panel would allow me to weld in the back of shop if necessary(probably never).

 

[Cope]

Now I need to figure out where I want to put my plug(s) for it.

Another question on the plug situation.
Is it safe to run 2 plugs off the same breaker?
My breaker panel is in the middle of a side wall.
I'm thinking to put a plug directly out of the panel and another on the opposite front wall corner of shop.
Only one plug would be in use at a time.
Most of my welding would be done under the carport in front of the shop.
The plug at the panel would allow me to weld in the back of shop if necessary(probably never).

You got a nice machine at a fair price.

I don't think code allows multiple receptacles on the same circuit for welders.

 

[great white tj]

I am using the same set up. One plug under the panel, and the other in my shop area. It's about a 25' run to the plug in the shop area. Copes post was made as I was typing this, I am not sure on the code. My set up is a two stall barn, a tack/ hay room and a 24'x24' shop, here in my area of Fl. it is still a barn by code here.

 

[Cope]

That setting used to be advertised as the setting you could use to thaw frozen pipes. Lincoln has taken it out of the manuals for at least a decade or two (if not more) and no longer recommend using a welder to defrost pipes.

However, one of the reasons 70/75 amps was the setting recommended for thawing pipes is because the machine has a 100% duty cycle there. So not necessarily wrong either.

I've seen this question come up a few times in different places and people get really heated over what is the correct reason for the circle. It's a little crazy to watch sometimes.

I thought about the pipe thawing after I posted. I used to have a .pdf of the owner's manual for a 1950-60 vintage machine that my son-in-law has, but I had deleted it. Looked at a couple of copies on Lincoln's website and couldn't even find a reference to the 100% duty cycle.

 

[great white tj]

All one needs to do here in this county to keep there shop area as a Barn is to keep a Tractor in side.

 

[Cope]

I am using the same set up. One plug under the panel, and the other in my shop area. It's about a 25' run to the plug in the shop area. Copes post was made as I was typing this, I am not sure on the code. My set up is a two stall barn, a tack/ hay room and a 24'x24' shop, here in my area of Fl. it is still a barn by code here.

Meant to add that I can't see what it would hurt for a one man shop.

 

[MJD1]

You can't get the oxide film off with DC, so it will be like welding pudding with the skin on it. As far as low amperage, only on thin sheet maybe. Either way you're looking at a headache.

Edit: I realize now you mean with a stick electrode. Yes it is possible but for sure not easy. It wouldn't be my first choice.

Actually you are dead wrong on DC cleaning the oxide. DC ,positive is where the cleaning action occurs, that's why you MIG weld aluminum on electrode positive. AC current is the machine switching from DC negatively to DC positive. On machines with balance, when welding castings, the balance is set to allow more cleaning action. On a typical aluminum weld the white band alongside the weld is caused by the DC cleaning action.

 

[ducksface]

About the plug.
Berry uses long leads.
I use a long extension cord so I can put it away when not needed and I won't be wrestling with 100ft leads when I don't need them.
A second plug is nice, but if you want to weld elsewhere....

 

[dtrojcak]

I'm outside city limits and my county has no code enforcement/rules.
A 50amp breaker is only $16 at Lowe's, so I'll probably just install a 2nd breaker if I actually install a 2nd plug.

After thinking about it, it would probably be difficult to get two 6g wires into each breaker slot anyway.

Thanks again for everyone's advice.

 

[dr_clyde]

Actually you are dead wrong on DC cleaning the oxide. DC ,positive is where the cleaning action occurs, that's why you MIG weld aluminum on electrode positive. AC current is the machine switching from DC negatively to DC positive. On machines with balance, when welding castings, the balance is set to allow more cleaning action. On a typical aluminum weld the white band alongside the weld is caused by the DC cleaning action.

Right, but you're not gonna actually get a TIG weld on DC+. Your tungsten will melt off. I assumed the electrode to be DC -. You'll notice I edited my post once I realized he was talking about stick.

 

[ducksface]

I'm outside city limits and my county has no code enforcement/rules.
A 50amp breaker is only $16 at Lowe's, so I'll probably just install a 2nd breaker if I actually install a 2nd plug.

After thinking about it, it would probably be difficult to get two 6g wires into each breaker slot anyway.

Thanks again for everyone's advice.

I don't know that anyone welcomed you to GJ.
Welcome.
It's refreshing for a new guy to take part in his posts.
We get so damn many drive-by one post wonders.
It's been a refreshing pleasure to have you here.

 

[dtrojcak]

I don't know that anyone welcomed you to GJ.

Welcome.

It's refreshing for a new guy to take part in his posts.

We get so damn many drive-by one post wonders.

It's been a refreshing pleasure to have you here.

Thanks.

I may have questions later.
Don't want to piss everyone off by only posting a question with no follow up, lol.
That always bugs me on other forums and FB groups.
I, along with others, will answer a question and/or give advice, then we never know how it turned out because that guy never posts again until he has another question/problem.

 

[Cope]

About the plug.
Berry uses long leads.
I use a long extension cord so I can put it away when not needed and I won't be wrestling with 100ft leads when I don't need them.
A second plug is nice, but if you want to weld elsewhere....

I have both options. About sberry, he is always advocating that everyone set their machine to DCEP and break the knob off, but I notice his Lincoln still has the knob.

 

[rnscustom]

Can you do it , yes . I do it for my machines . Legal probably not . That's som big wires you'll need a big box to jump off to the next box

 

[rnscustom]

You wouldn't do at in the breaker run to first box and join in there , big box ?? . But again not sure if it's legal

 

[great white tj]

So far this has worked... Then there is a 25' run to the other plug..

 

[ez-duzit]

Exposed wiring? LOL.

 

[great white tj]

Safety orange... If it is glowing don't touch it..

 

[G-ManBart]

So far this has worked... Then there is a 25' run to the other plug..

Yeah you'll know for sure when you come home and see the smoke and flames

 

[sberry]

I have both options. About sberry, he is always advocating that everyone set their machine to DCEP and break the knob off, but I notice his Lincoln still has the knob.

I put one back on for the pics. There are some rules about multiple plugs, one being you would need to use full size wire in case both would be used at the same time. Inb theory you could have 2 recepts running to a 50 with 2 number 12 for welders but they could not be daisy chained. You could daisy number 6 or tap the 6 for another outlet with 12.
This is a case where understanding the wire size requirements makes this less painful. Its not such an issue to run 2 circuits with 10, so much cheaper and easier.
The only factory cord and plug units that require a larger wire are some 250 class migs and even then from a user or safety standpoint those don't either unless they are running processes not found in typical home shops. If one notices ready made cords are number 8.

 

[sberry]

I have both options. About sberry, he is always advocating that everyone set their machine to DCEP and break the knob off, but I notice his Lincoln still has the knob.

The reason I say this is that so many beginners want to start off trying every rod and setting they ever invented. I just don't think of it out of habit but don't believe my machine has ever been used on DC- and only a couple times on AC.