Welder for beginner

[katit]

Welding is another thing I want to learn, plus I want to have welder around house for little things and maybe for bigger projects. I think it's one of those tools that if you don't have it - you get by, but when you do - there is many uses.

I read seems like millions pages on this forums. I will try to put my needs and wants in bullet points and then see what you guys have to say.

Immediate needs related to my cars hobby:
- Weld onto broken studs to get them out
- Assemble special tools for doing something like suspension puller, etc
- Weld exhaust, replace cats, etc
- Weld O2 wideband threaded ****** onto exhaust
- MAYBE do my own manifolds if I get into turbo my car, would be cool to make one myself
- Maybe do some sheet metal repairs

Around the house:
- Build some permanent metal work surfaces like table for lathe, mill, etc.
- Fix some iron railing around the house
- Build greenhouse using metal tubing (aluminum? stainless?)

At first it seems like MIG will do most of this, if not all. Seems like TIG will do all of this but be slow.

I was thinking if I go MIG than Hobart 190 will be good, but it's 220 only machine. I have 220 in garage but it would be nice if I can move it with extension cord and maybe use 110 when needed. Hobart 140 is highly praised and seem to be go to model for beginners. But I do see myself working with 1/4 metal and 140 is pushing it from what I read.

Also after reading so many pages and drooling over those TIG welds I'm not so sure and maybe I should learn TIG right away? What machine is good?

For budget: I want something which will work good and I won't have to fight with. But I am beginner and will use it occasionally only, don't need latest and greatest.

Any words of wisdom?

 

[HotWire]

The multiprocess inverter welders have gotten pretty nice. Look at Esab if you want solid, reliable, and cheaper than Miller. They are coming with 110/220 options as well.

https://www.esabna.com/us/en/produc...i-process-equipment-cv-cc/rebel-emp-215ic.cfm

Personally I love Miller but they are $$$.




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[Jim Pelosi]

Get a used ac arc buzz box arc machine and learn to play a good bead and not burn through thin stuff. Mig and tiger will be easy after you "get it".

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[Jim Pelosi]

Damn auto correct

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[plinker]

A Hobart 190 is a very capable machine overall. I'd say unless you need it to run on 110v or need the portability skip the 140.

Best thing to do is get some training, check local tech schools to see what programs they offer.

 

[XJPat]

Get a used ac arc buzz box arc machine and learn to play a good bead and not burn through thin stuff. Mig and tiger will be easy after you "get it".

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This is great advice. I will add to be very very very careful building pullers or suspension compressors of any kind. In fact I highly recommend you don't period.

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[tarmy]

Look on Cyberweld...call them and get some advice. They are cheap, informed and have Miller...

You will soon learn that you will want to weld 1/4” a lot.

 

[katit]

Best thing to do is get some training, check local tech schools to see what programs they offer.

Good advice! I am working full time running my own business. Is there schools in St Louis you would recommend? I'm not familiar but if there is night classes or even day classes close by I would love to attend them.

 

[katit]

I will add to be very very very careful building pullers or suspension compressors of any kind. In fact I highly recommend you don't period.

Thank you! I know what you mean and I definitely won't do anything stupid. But some stuff which is not under load and don't present any danger still need to be welded.

 

[driz]

Search Craig’s List for something like an old Tombstone or Hobart stick welder.. you’ll find them in AC ONLY for $100 all over the place. That gets you welding all the way down almost to the thin sheet metal on auto bodies. Use that until you find a decent AC /DC model. You might even luck onto an ACDC rig for $200 $250 right off. Remember, you can always resell them for the same when the day comes. Do check to see all the settings are working though before you buy anything. Even then it’s usually a switch needing a good cleaning.
I have a HH 135 many years now. It’s a fine machine and a pro can weld super strong with it 1/4”. If you’re not a pro it can look great and be [emoji90] so stick to the stick machine for the thicker stuff at least for now. Still weighs 40 ish pounds and is all you can carry in one hand[emoji3525], not all that portable especially if there’s stairs involved......ask me how I know that one.
Stick is easy enough to use , cheap to feed and oh so simple / fast to switch rod sizes on . It will also cut fairly well though a tad rough and ugly but it cuts! A DC machine can also be made to do scratch start tig with just a bottle of argon and clamp on torch head. You also don’t have to worry overly about dampness in the shop corroding circuits and such. They’re just big transformers, simple. It’s still a good idea to toss a tarp over it though and blow out with the air chuck occasionally.
Disadvantages, heavy and needing 220. That’s the big ones. Then there’s slow, ya need to clean up more and fumes, lots of them . Turn on a fan or weld in a doorway or toss on a respirator (always a good idea anyways).
Another thing on buzz boxes Common is having [emoji37] short leads. That is a pisser on anything post 70s. The cure is make your own 220 extension cord and or put extension cables on your existing ones. Neither is hard to do or overly expensive. Odds are good that used ones already have one or the other.
Unless you’re running a business it’s more about what you want to pay and cool digital readouts than much else. None of that really means much to us Farmer John types anyways.




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[matt_i]

You don't really want a 120vac welder imo, once word gets around there will be a line of people who want to borrow it. Goto 240vac and almost nobody can.

I'm a fan of tig welding, its slower but can do jobs the others would melt into oblivion. Mig is fast but I'm forever going back to clean/chip/grind/sand/file off weld splatter. Anything "high confidence" I want to try to 7018 stick weld it as a default.

Were I to start today with nothing I'd be looking at an inverter tig.

Should you get the mig welder make sure you are back-beveling on thicker work.

 

[Hagatronics]

Do you want to learn to weld or do you just want to weld stuff?

I'm in a similar position to you but i have a MIG and an inverter TIG/stick.

97% use is MIG.
3% use is TIG.
Stick welder torch is still in plastic

I say buy a MIG and focus on the jobs you'll get done when you can join some metal, rather than becoming a great welder. If you love it then buy the stick/TIG and improve your game

 

[rusty_ratchet]

I have an inverter stick welder for occasional work and like it a lot. There are a lot of inexpensive options like this one.

 

[Aaron_W]

If you don't have the time for a class there are tons of good welding videos on youtube.

Two of my favorites, both have years worth of videos posted, many aimed at new welders.

Welding Tips and Tricks

Weld dot com


Which machine is a can of worms, I came in here last year asking pretty much the same question. I ended up spending $3000 on a machine 2 months ago. A big part of that was because I also took a welding class which opened my eyes that I might like to do something more than just MIG.

Sticking with just name brands the Hobart 210MVP is the cheapest dual voltage MIG welder I found. About $900, maybe $800 on sale. If you just want to MIG that seems to be a solid honest machine.

If you are talking about doing TIG that has a much higher entry point, you can expect to pay $2000+ for a new name brand machine.


Price wise it seems to go Miller, ESAB, Lincoln, Hobart with a couple hundred dollars separating the high from the low.
There are a bunch of cheaper brands, Everlast, Harbor Freight, AHP, Eastwood etc. These can be less than 1/2 the price of the name brands. They have their fans who say they work well, as well as those who say they are junk. AHP has a multi-process stick, MIG, TIG machine that costs less than the Hobart 210 MVP MIG only machine.

I went with a Miller multi-process machine that my local welding supply can service, but I can definitely appreciate the appeal of these much cheaper brands.

 

[Kenskip1]

Sir, Like you this is another trader that I ventured into. I started out with a Longevity Model 100. This is a DC flux core.It did all right but I felt that I could do better with a more quality product. I then purchased a Lincoln 140 Mig. What a difference!This was using flux core also.Then I purchased the argon/co2 bottle and have not looked back.
So now I went into the stick welding arena. I wound up with the Alpha AHP 160ST.This is a bit more of a challenge however I am making progress.There are a few items that you will require.A good helmet, gloves,and assorted other tools. I now have a plasma cutter, band saw three grinders and the list grows on and on. The stick welder is 220 volt but the MIG is 120.Best of luck in your decision.

 

[MoonShiner]

I took a local tech school course about 10 years ago and bought the Miller model that ran on 110. It was new at the time and on sale at a big car show. $650 as I recall. I was very happy with both decisions.

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[dartworth]

Take a look at Everlast brand of welders. Lots of reviews on YouTube. Good value and well built. https://www.everlastgenerators.com/

 

[katit]

Sent request to
https://ranken.edu/programs/fabrication-and-welding/

Will see if they can offer something that is more hands on. Can't spend whole lot of time on this, but if it's good - why not.

 

[scubadoober]

You will get plenty of good recommendations, but do not use an extension cord with your welder.

 

[katit]

You will get plenty of good recommendations, but do not use an extension cord with your welder.

Even if it's 110v and I have to? There is heavy duty cords. What if I can't take work to garage?

 

[Mgdoug3]

I have either a 20 or 25 foot 220V extension cord and never have had a problem on two different welders.

 

[scubadoober]

Even if it's 110v and I have to? There is heavy duty cords. What if I can't take work to garage?

As long as it is sized properly you could be OK. I didn't want you to use a standard orange 16 gauge extension cord. Buy one dedicated, get the largest wire size you can find, and don't go over 50' tops. Just looking out.

 

[katit]

As long as it is sized properly you could be OK. I didn't want you to use a standard orange 16 gauge extension cord. Buy one dedicated, get the largest wire size you can find, and don't go over 50' tops. Just looking out.

Oh yes, I know better. I don't have any orange or green cords anywhere around in garage.

 

[emeraldcoupe]

even though this is pretty un popular around here with some, I bought a HF MigMax 215, it's a dual voltage with auto set / manual set. it welds nice and it's relatively inexpensive if you catch it on sale.

 

[Iluvbeer]

I absolutely love my Hobart 140 but it doesn’t like 1/4” material very well. What I do when welding 1/4 is preheat with my torch and then i get a great weld. It suits me perfectly for most everything I do.

 

[Coach James]

Some years back, I decided I wanted to learn to weld. Some buddies did the "MIG is easy, just buy a welder and practice, etc." I talked to the guys at the local welding supply and they were adamant that I take a welding course before they would sell me a machine.

So I took a welding class and it was a huge benefit. I first learned gas welding, then MIG. I got to use 130 and 200 amp machines. Best of all, I learned the difference between welds that look good and welds that are good and how to trouble shoot when the welds are bad.

After the class, I bought a Miller 135 and it has been fine for me. In my previous house, I put in a dedicated circuit, just one outlet on it for the Miller. I plan to do the same thing in my current house.

Coach

 

[ZRX61]

Hobart 190... or a used 187.


There's got to be a community college with a welding program in your area.

 

[ZRX61]

https://www.stlcc.edu/programs-acad...-industrial-occupations-technology/index.aspx


Quote:
"STLCC is not a welding school specifically but through this program students can take welding classes in St. Louis"

 

[ZRX61]

Sent request to
https://ranken.edu/programs/fabrication-and-welding/

Will see if they can offer something that is more hands on. Can't spend whole lot of time on this, but if it's good - why not.

From Rankin:
"$611 per technical credit hour
$3,666 per 6 credit hour course"

Run away!


Community college with likely be around $300... (if that)


Edit: Community college is $231/credit hour.

 

[Cryptic1911]

Start with a mig welder, and get something nice like a miller 211 autoset. It's 110/220v capable, and will handle anything you'd use it for. Once you get the hang of that, pick up a tig somewhere used, or something like an ahp alphatig 200 for around $800 new

 

[ZRX61]

Here ya go, this is perfect:
http://ceekay.com/services/welding-training/


"Not Confident in Your Welding Skills? No Problem! CeeKay offers FREE mig welding seminars for anyone that purchases a machine through our stores. Classes are designed for several levels of experience and will get you up and running on your new equipment fast."

 

[katit]

https://www.stlcc.edu/programs-acad...-industrial-occupations-technology/index.aspx


Quote:
"STLCC is not a welding school specifically but through this program students can take welding classes in St. Louis"

Thanks! Reached out to them. I will have a tour here tomorrow:
http://ranken.edu/programs/fabrication-and-welding/

I am not sure what full program means, I just need welding class. Can't imagine I need more then a semester with 6+ hours a week

 

[ZRX61]

My local college does a basic O/A & Mig class that runs 3 hours, twice a week for 16 weeks.
They don't have any prerequisites for any of the welding classes so students frequently take a bunch of them during the same semester. I recall doing 4 different classes at the same time.


The important thing is to keep going until you "get it" & you start welding instead of blowing holes in everything. My B-i-L never got there & gave up after a few weeks.
One minute you'll be pissed at making yet another hole.. & the next minute you'll be welding.

 

[ZRX61]

Thanks! Reached out to them. I will have a tour here tomorrow:
http://ranken.edu/programs/fabrication-and-welding/

I am not sure what full program means, I just need welding class. Can't imagine I need more then a semester with 6+ hours a week

I'd be calling Cee Kay, that Ranken place looks to be all about $$$$

 

[katit]

My local college does a basic O/A & Mig class that runs 3 hours, twice a week for 16 weeks.
They don't have any prerequisites for any of the welding classes so students frequently take a bunch of them during the same semester. I recall doing 4 different classes at the same time.


The important thing is to keep going until you "get it" & you start welding instead of blowing holes in everything. My B-i-L never got there & gave up after a few weeks.
One minute you'll be pissed at making yet another hole.. & the next minute you'll be welding.

Thanks a lot again! I reached out to community college, see what they do. Also checked with Cee-Kay, this format I like better. I will spend couple of full days to get basics..

 

[Aaron_W]

I'd be calling Cee Kay, that Ranken place looks to be all about $$$$

You are in California, community colleges here are a bargain compared to most states. We have one of the lowest community colleges tuition rates in the nation.

National average for in state tuition at a public community college is $4808 for one year (2 semesters).

California average is $1636.

Illinois average is $7978.

So that Rankin school looks like that is just what a Community College costs in that part of the country.


Another one of those areas where California is not the most expensive.

https://www.communitycollegereview.com/avg-tuition-stats/national-data


I know my local community college is only $46 per credit, my stick / OAW welding class was 3 units, so $138 + materials fee which I think was $20.

 

[BajaScout]

In San Diego Workshop for Warriors provides free welding and other manufacturing training to veterans.

https://wfw.org


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[mrjaw14]

I recently bought a Hobart handler 210 MVP so I can do dual voltage. I have 240 in the shop. my FIL needs things repaired from time to time, so the 120 comes in handy as well. It's old school transformer, but should last forever. I tried it for the first time tonight and that thing has balls. Very happy with it

 

[Wamsutta]

At first it seems like MIG will do most of this, if not all. Seems like TIG will do all of this but be slow.

When I first started welding school, they started us off welding with a gas torch because it was slow. You have to move the torch in half circles manually if you wanted to have a ripple pattern. I think that's the best way to learn because you can actually see what's going on as opposed to the weld process flying by at a 100 miles per hour.

 

[Jim Pelosi]

The local Vo-tech here in Jersey I took night classes at for my welding cert was pretty expensive. 4 semesters and each one was about $2,000.
Great course, very intensive.
I just weld for fun, but I have a Miller 200 MIG, Miller Synchmaster 200 water cooled TIG and a Lincoln tombstone arc machine.
I typically use the Lincoln for fast repairs. Just pop in a rod and torch it.

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