Welder Wiring Help

[62Beaumont]

Hi, I'm new here, I'll post another thread to introduce myself.

Here's my question, when wiring a 230V 20A welder I know you connect hot/hot/ground on the outlet but what do you connect the ground wire to in the service panel? Ground bus or neutral bus?

Also, do you ground the outlet box first and than continue the ground wire to the ground terminal like all other outlets? Or do you just run the ground to the terminal on the outlet? Kinda confused on the matter because of the omitted neutral wire in a 230V circuit.

Thanks,
Joel

 

[sberry]

The neutral isn't omitted, the welder doesn't require it. If there is a separate ground bar in the panel connect it there. Are you using a recept that matches the factory plug? If so it is a grounding type recept and just connect the wires to it. It is internally bonded to the yoke that connects to the box grounding it. Does this recept mount in a cover or is it screwed to the box?

 

[62Beaumont]

Thanks for the help. I had run the ground wire to the ground bus but had no voltage at the outlet. Here's my outlet and breaker panel.
I think I figured out what's wrong. I used my voltmeter across the 2 poles in the breaker box and there's 0V. I'm gonna try another breaker spot to get 240V.

 

[LoneGunman]

Are you using a 2 pole breaker? From what you describe the red and black wires are on the same phase, it's not that you are not getting voltage, you most likely are, if you checked each one to ground you'd be able to read it. People have been killed by trying to measure hot to hot which reside on the same phase, got a reading of zero and then grabbed a hold of the wires.

I don't understand how you can be on the same phase if you are using a two pole breaker, if you are using two seperate breakers you need to change to the correct two pole.

 

[62Beaumont]

I'm using 1 double pole 40A breaker. I had the breaker in the wrong position on the panel, I just moved the breaker down 1 spot and now I have 240V and the welder works.
Rooky mistake and NO I'd never touch a wire. I turn off the main breaker switch and then confirm with my voltmeter there's is 0V at the poles before doing anything.

 

[GSSFC]

Hopefully that isn't a double pole cheater breaker.

Tim

 

[sberry]

What brand of panel is this in? Yes, you are good to go, some panels like old Federals will accept a double in the wrong spot. Just for giggles show a close up of the panel and breaker.
Yes, that is a grounding recept (not like old 3 wire dryer), notice how the ground pin is bonded to the backing plate.

 

[62Beaumont]

Federal Pioneer panel with Stab-Lok breakers. The house was built this year with a brand new 200A panel.
Here's what the breaker looks like.

http://eshop.msn.ca/specs/double-po...le-40-amp-stab-lok-nc-plug-on-circuit-breaker

 

[sberry]

Are you in Canada?

 

[rickairmedic]

Yep he is in canada and I think you were right as I recall some of the stablock panels will let you get a double pole in a spot that wont work.

Rick

 

[rickairmedic]

62 you might want to go into your profile and add your location to it so it will show up under your name in your posts . There are actually some guys here who dont actually do cars that wouldnt figure it out by your name .


Rick

 

[62Beaumont]

Are you in Canada?

I sure am, sorry I placed that in my intro thread but forgot most don't read those.

Yep he is in canada and I think you were right as I recall some of the stablock panels will let you get a double pole in a spot that wont work.

Rick

Yeah, I had the breaker right under the last breaker from the pic not knowing 2 pole needs to be in a certain location to get 240V. You can see in the pic how I moved it down 1 spot and voila 240V.

62 you might want to go into your profile and add your location to it so it will show up under your name in your posts . There are actually some guys here who dont actually do cars that wouldnt figure it out by your name .


Rick

Thanks for the reminder, I updated it my profile.

Thanks guys.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Are the two handles on that breaker tied together? so that when one half trips, it takes the other half with it? If not, then this is two single pole breakers intended for two separate circuits. If it is then this is indeed a double pole breaker. I cannot tell from looking.

If the handles are NOT tied together, they must be for this application.

Charles

WOW! that is a LOADED panel with 64 breaker slots. That would not be legal here in the US until the recently released '08 NEC. Prior to the new code, you were limited to 42 breakers.

 

[tfi racing]

I just knew it was a Federal panel!That used to be one of my favorite homeowner service calls,that and after replacing counter receptacles why does the breaker trip...I don't know how common FP panels are in the US,a wafer two pole breaker will fit in the bar on only one phase,the only brand of panel that can have that happen.It has driven many homeowners and apprentices nuts.