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Welding fishing hooks

franksinatra

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Joined
Nov 26, 2006
Messages
169
Location
Minnesota
I'm trying to weld up two fishing hooks for a fun little project with my son. We have tried soldering the two but we weren't happy with the results. The solder didn't seem to hold and if we skipped the bait near docks, many times it would break. Our first concern is getting the hook to hot while welding and losing the temper or hardness. I have seen laser welders that jewelers use and wonder if this could be used. If we can get this to work we may try to market our product. Thanks for any help you can give.
 
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EdT

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Sep 21, 2010
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North Georgia
I would suggest Harris Stay Brite silver bearing solder and its associated flux. It comes in both 5 and 8% silver and goes on at a temperature that won't ruin the steel (about 450 F IIR). I have used it many times for soldering music wire parts together. It would help a lot to bind the joint with fine copper wire and, of course, the parts must be clean, bright steel in order for anything to stick. Stay Brite is used in HVAC and also in the model airplane and other hobbies. You can get a little kit with some of the solder and a little bottle of flux. The flux is just as important as the solder. I you tried ordinary electronic or plumbing solder it probably will not work well if at all. Silver braze (often called silver solder or "hard" solder) goes on at a too high a temperature to not damage the steel. You would have to get the parts red hot for it to flow out..
 

zkling

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Jan 23, 2007
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StayBrite is a good suggestion. I have a feeling your biggest issue is cleaning the coating off the hooks to get down to the base metal.
 

kbs2244

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Nov 11, 2006
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First try would be silver solder.
If that is not enough go to brazing.
 
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franksinatra

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Nov 26, 2006
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Minnesota
I wasnt exactly forthcoming about my design idea. Im not really welding another hook but a small piece of metal. about 3/16 of an inch thick and It cannot be wired or wrapped. It Must be soldered or welded. I went to the jewelers today and his machine is awesome but I was charged 30.00 for 4 (lures to be welded). Not an option. If I can find someone that has this type of welder and did them for .25 a piece, I could possibly do it. I had checked on silver solder and may give it a try. Is there a best brand, size solder? I have a variable hakko soldering iron, old RC days, would this be acceptable for using silver solder? how much would I need to scuff the hook in order for the solder to hold well? 36 grit paper? steel wool? scotch brite? Thank you all for your ideas.
 

Thumper68

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May 16, 2013
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Location
Duluth MN
Harris is the brand along with their flux.

I would clean it well, wire wheel followed by acetone, soldering iron won't do it, need a torch, I have both a butane one and a smith jewelers O/A set up that I would use.

Where are you in MN if you would like I could take a shot at it.

Here is what I would use.

https://www.zoro.com/harris-brazing-kit-1145-1205-f-w175-oz-flux-56kpop/i/G2020401/?gdffi=047ada998cf641fa93e55ae8579df863&gdfms=29BFEDE3ADC643799D68B15356988018&gclid=Cj0KEQjw5ti3BRD89aDFnb3SxPcBEiQAssnp0pVLhT5VSO_NqCH7ax64Qkx2J2e7_VIIoQ3n3uJDowgaAnDC8P8HAQ&gclsrc=aw.ds

Z0F61vfo5oy.JPG
 
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franksinatra

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169
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Minnesota
Harris is the brand along with their flux.

I would clean it well, wire wheel followed by acetone, soldering iron won't do it, need a torch, I have both a butane one and a smith jewelers O/A set up that I would use.

Where are you in MN if you would like I could take a shot at it.

Here is what I would use.

https://www.zoro.com/harris-brazing-kit-1145-1205-f-w175-oz-flux-56kpop/i/G2020401/?gdffi=047ada998cf641fa93e55ae8579df863&gdfms=29BFEDE3ADC643799D68B15356988018&gclid=Cj0KEQjw5ti3BRD89aDFnb3SxPcBEiQAssnp0pVLhT5VSO_NqCH7ax64Qkx2J2e7_VIIoQ3n3uJDowgaAnDC8P8HAQ&gclsrc=aw.ds

Z0F61vfo5oy.JPG
It sounds promising. I ordered it up. I was watching something about borax as a flux. Would that apply to what I'm doing or is that geared towards jewelry repair? Thanks for your help.
 

zkling

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Jan 23, 2007
Messages
16,939
Honestly, with the questions you ask, unless you want to outlay a decent investment for a torch and training I would try and find someone local to do them for you. BTW 25¢ each, unless you are talking mass quantity is just being annoyingly cheap. Do a few yourself, after you buy all the materials and training, then see how you feel if someone approached you to do them at 25¢ each. And people wonder why manufacturing has moved over seas.
 
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bon3s

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Uniontown, OH
If you dont have the money to do this then dont attempt it, but dont complain about costs when penny pinching on something that you mentioned you are looking to possibly market and make money off of.
 

Thumper68

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May 16, 2013
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Location
Duluth MN
It sounds promising. I ordered it up. I was watching something about borax as a flux. Would that apply to what I'm doing or is that geared towards jewelry repair? Thanks for your help.

Borax is used as an O2 blocker for all kinds of welding, brazing and soldering while flux is a O2 blocker it is also a cleaner.
 

Kevin54

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Jan 12, 2005
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Urbana, Ohio
I wasnt exactly forthcoming about my design idea. Im not really welding another hook but a small piece of metal. about 3/16 of an inch thick and It cannot be wired or wrapped. It Must be soldered or welded. I went to the jewelers today and his machine is awesome but I was charged 30.00 for 4 (lures to be welded). Not an option. If I can find someone that has this type of welder and did them for .25 a piece, I could possibly do it. I had checked on silver solder and may give it a try. Is there a best brand, size solder? I have a variable hakko soldering iron, old RC days, would this be acceptable for using silver solder? how much would I need to scuff the hook in order for the solder to hold well? 36 grit paper? steel wool? scotch brite? Thank you all for your ideas.

Silver soldering takes a torch.

And personally, even if I were to do them, I wouldn't do them for less than $2 a pop depending on quantity. At $.25 each, it's not worth breaking a torch out to do it. Just a few feet of silver solder to buy is at least a ten spot plus shipping, then you have your gas for the torches on top of that, then you have to have your flux also. Just the materials add up and a person is losing money at $25 each.

How many pieces are you looking at doing? Possibly someone can cut you a deal for a few bucks, but at $25 each, I think you'll be hard pressed to find someone
 

zkling

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Jan 23, 2007
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I'd do as many as you want at $25 each. Kevin as a machinist, you of all people should know the difference a decimal point makes. :lol_hitti
 

bsaint

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Apr 26, 2010
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Manchester, CT
I think you need a tig with a pulse. I tried welding some really thin mild steel stuff with 10 amps and kept popping through it. With my old Syncrowave 200, it would've done it no problem with DC pulse.
 
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franksinatra

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Nov 26, 2006
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Minnesota
I'm bringing this back because I am moving forward with my design. I was able to get good results with the silver solder but I'm not happy with the small propane torch I had used. I need a torch about half the size of a pencil torch. Anything like this available?
 

DadsTools

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Jul 27, 2017
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1,852
I've worked with these kinds of fishing projects before. I am a holder of a US patent on a weedless hook design. I also had a lure on the market for awhile with my name on it. Since I don't know the exact configuration of your device, I can only speak in general. I'm going to assume based on your target price of $.25 a piece, that you're thinking of production and not just making a few for your own personal use:

1. If this is something that you hope to patent and market commercially, you need to know your target audience and the volume involved. If you're thinking of small scale 'garage' production, you'll need a product that can sell for a premium amount, and know that your target audience will pay that amount. If not, you're still in the imaginary stage, which is fine.

2> If you have a distinct design and you're planning on selling volumes commercially, then you're in the prototype stage. You don't need to make the final product, only a functional facsimile. Regular solder may work for this. Take any of the black nickel finished hooks out of Japan like Owner or Gamakatsu. The black nickel is laid on top of a copper undercoat chemically bonded to the underlying steel. You can finely sand the nickel off to get to the copper undercoat, which can then be soldered using regular lead solder. Consider a piece of brass for your metal plate, which can also be lead-soldered. Now you can prototype to your heart's content without becoming too elaborate, costly, or time consuming.

Once you have your design down, then you'll need to patent it. Once patented, you'll then need to license or sell outright to an established lure/tackle manufacturer. There's a good number of smaller premium producers today that are easy to approach with such ideas. Educate yourself on business though before settling on numbers--it's easy to get burned.

Or....

If you want to produce them yourself, you'll probably need to outsource production. If it's a modified hook, then the hook companies I mentioned would be interested. Even Eagle Claw USA will do contract work. If it's a lure, then you'll probably need it produced in China or Mexico. There are a few US mfrs that could do contract metal lure work for you, but the price will be higher. In this latter case, BE SURE IT'S FOR THE BASS FISHING MARKET. That's the best easiest market for quick turn around at premium prices. Unless you're making spinners, spoons or jigs for other species, but they don't sell for premium prices.

There's a whole lot more to it but that's a start. If you're a fisherman, you know everyone's a tinkerer and everyone's an inventor. For every viable product, there's 10,000 that are nonviable for a slew of different reasons. I can't comment any further without more specifics.
 
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