What are lifetime warantys really worth?

[Aberdale]

What are lifetime warranties worth?

For me, it's a subjective indicator that it might last longer than an equivalent tool with a one year warranty, or none at all, but it's subjective only. If I had more tools fail, it might matter to me more, but I can count on one hand how many tools I have replaced under warranty. Most of them were Cman ratchets.

If I have a product (tools or otherwise), that fails within the first 6 months, then I will typically return it for a replacement, or to get my money back since it was probably a defect in materials or workmanship. If it lasts six months, I figure it wore out, or broke because of abuse. Either way, I got my use out of it, and the reason it broke was it wasn't strong enough for the duty cycle, or I likely abused it.

At that point, I usually decide to replace it with something stronger or more capable. Therefore, the warranty doesn't matter much to me because if it broke the first time, it will likely break again in the same situation, so why would I want another identical replacement?

The fact that Cman, and others, are reneging on their lifetime replacement warranty and are discontinuing product for cheaper import replacements makes the warranty worth even less. Once again, if I were breaking tools every other week it would be more important to me. Since I rarely break a tool, it doesn't really affect me that much.

 

[route246]

I still buy Truecraft tools which carry a lifetime warranty. Unfortunately, they are not made anymore. I never really take those warranties seriously, anyway. The only one that matters are the ones that I'm going to use seriously and may break which is limited to wrenches, sockets, pliers, screwdrivers, cutters and a few other items. I buy Truecraft as a collector, never expecting to try to make a warranty claim.

 

[WhiteTrash]

Craftsman has tried to compete with overseas competitors in pricing yet still try and maintain Snap-On's style warranty. Sooner or later something major will change things if Craftsman doesn't go under first. It's just the current global economics.

Steve

SO clearly states in their warranty that it is only the original purchaser.

"Snap-on warrants to Customers who purchase Product from authorized Snap-on distribution channels for use in their profession that Snap-on® brand Products and Blue-Point® brand Products will be free from defects in workmanship and materials for a duration described in each Product's warranty code. ... This warranty only extends to the original Customer and cannot be transferred or assigned."

With those guidelines, anything bought at a flea market, eBay, Craigslist, pawn shop, other mechanics, etc are not eligible for warranty. Furthermore, anything given or received as a gift or promotion would be void of warranty as well.



And Sears is starting to help with the record keeping process of receipts. It is sad that it has come to this, but that is how it is. Anything purchased with you Shop Your Way Rewards card is saved to your account for a no receipt needed return (not just Craftsman or tools, but anything). They have also started to offer to email a copy of the receipt to have a digital copy for your records. No more faded thermal ink receipts.

 

[woody 73]

For me the warranties were my peace of mind (state of calm)if the tool broke I could take it back for an exchange. Now with that being said sure some tool companies in my time have gone under making their warranties worthless and yes sometimes you will get back some newer tool that is less then perfect,but if that job needs to get done you do what it takes to resolve the problem.

Am I happy about this; not really in truth I feel that the manufactures are doing what it takes to get by and survive but sooner or later it will mean you are going to alienate some of your strong customer base and that will have consequences.

 

[oldtools]

havent found any chinese made real snap on stuff

How about those Snap On with no COO?

 

[kc-steve]

SO clearly states in their warranty that it is only the original purchaser.

I thought that as well until others here enlightened me otherwise. But more importantly in my post is the fact that CRAFTSMAN cannot continue to do that any longer unless they raise prices and realize their true competitors aren't overseas.

Steve

 

[pipsters]

I thought that as well until others here enlightened me otherwise. But more importantly in my post is the fact that CRAFTSMAN cannot continue to do that any longer unless they raise prices and realize their true competitors aren't overseas.

Steve

You don't think Sears competitors aren't overseas? I beg to differ. Sears is in direct competition with Harbor Freight and Northern Tool and the Chinese imports. Go to a HF on a Wednesday afternoon and it still has a ton of people in it...Sears...no one.

 

[kc-steve]

You don't think Sears competitors aren't overseas? I beg to differ. Sears is in direct competition with Harbor Freight and Northern Tool and the Chinese imports. Go to a HF on a Wednesday afternoon and it still has a ton of people in it...Sears...no one.

If Craftsman wants to compete with HF and other foreign competition then they will surely lose that war. If they decide to change their marketing tactics, focus on quality, and compare their products to other US made tools then they stand a much better chance of staying in business.

The side benefit of that approach is they might actually convert the Chinese fans after all.

Steve

 

[WhiteTrash]

I thought that as well until others here enlightened me otherwise.

I provided the quote straight from Snap-ons website.

Snap-on warrants to Customers who purchase Product from authorized Snap-on distribution channels for use in their profession that Snap-on® brand Products and Blue-Point® brand Products will be free from defects in workmanship and materials for a duration described in each Product's warranty code. The warranty duration depends upon the nature of the Product. If the Product information for purchased Product does not include a warranty statement with the applicable duration or prior to a Product purchase, Customer can obtain the Product warranty code and warranty duration from a selling Snap-on dealer or representative or by writing Snap-on at the address provided at the end of this warranty statement. Consumable Products are warranted, at the time of sale, only against defects in workmanship or materials that prevent their use. Consumable products are goods reasonably expected to be used up or damaged during use, including but not limited to drill bits, saw blades, grinding discs, sanding discs, knife blades, files, O2 sensors and batteries. This warranty only extends to the original Customer and cannot be transferred or assigned.


I don't know how it would be otherwise. They may not follow it closely, but who is to say that they won't tomorrow or 10 years down the road.

And I feel that by removing the USA stamp from the tools, even though it states the COO on the website, is just telling us they will change the COO in the future and the only evidence will be something deleted from the web page. Plus if they feel that having USA stamped on the handle will hurt sells in other countries, does that mean USA made tools are looked down upon? Should I be buying tools from another country for the best quality?

 

[kc-steve]

I provided the quote straight from Snap-ons website.

Sheeesh! This isn't about Snap-on. Surely you understood what I meant by "Snap-on style warranty," in the FULL CONTEXT of what I said.

Steve

 

[VWandDodge]

You don't think Sears competitors aren't overseas? I beg to differ. Sears is in direct competition with Harbor Freight and Northern Tool and the Chinese imports. Go to a HF on a Wednesday afternoon and it still has a ton of people in it...Sears...no one.

If Craftsman wants to compete with HF and other foreign competition then they will surely lose that war. If they decide to change their marketing tactics, focus on quality, and compare their products to other US made tools then they stand a much better chance of staying in business.

The side benefit of that approach is they might actually convert the Chinese fans after all.

Steve

My beef is that Craftsman quality is actually kwality and is overpriced garbage whereupon the buyer is merely paying for a name.

Just go to Harbor Freight on any given day and observe the clientele. Do you honestly believe those people would pay for a quality tool that will last a lifetime? Nope, they're the epitome of the American consumer who will put price over value yet complain that "nothing is made in America anymore".

 

[warmpancakes]

How about those Snap On with no COO?

what ones? you mean the ratchets that if you ask them or look on their website they say USA? the ratchets you keep trying to make something out of nothing?

 

[scott37300]

Chalk up another thread that started out having nothing to do with snap on COO and someone turning it into another COO arguement.

 

[dankicksass]

Sears is a publicly traded company (SHLD) and all that offshoring and outsourcing is to make a buck. If an American ratchet costs $7 to make and a Chinese ratchet costs $1 but they're both sold to you at $22, that makes the board happy. Plain and simple math. I refuse to buy in to the notion that warranty costs are dragging the company down, it's just insurance. Poor management has been shoving Sears into the dirt for decades.

If I had to show my SYWR card or receipt for warranty and was denied service on a tool that the computer doesn't think I purchased, I'd be pissed. I've only had a card for nine months and keeping receipts is for taxes, not warranty. Sears does require proof of purchase for Evolv tool line lifetime warranty, FWIW.

 

[woody 73]

Perhaps we are in the minority and that most consumers think like this:

If I buy one hammer at HF and it costs $1.99 and it breaks after using it one time then I can return and buy nine more hammers and still it will be cheaper then buying one at sears with a lifetime warranty. (besides I think the hammer at HF has the same lifetime warranty).

 

[kc-steve]

You don't think Sears competitors aren't overseas? I beg to differ. Sears is in direct competition with Harbor Freight and Northern Tool and the Chinese imports. Go to a HF on a Wednesday afternoon and it still has a ton of people in it...Sears...no one.

. . . Just go to Harbor Freight on any given day and observe the clientele. Do you honestly believe those people would pay for a quality tool that will last a lifetime? Nope, they're the epitome of the American consumer who will put price over value yet complain that "nothing is made in America anymore".

Just to clarify something here, . . . I THINK what we are all seeing with Harbor Freight and others is there are those who are likely buying those tools to fill voids in current tool collections.

HOWEVER, the vast majority of HF customers are most likely "newbies" so to speak. Most are people who never had tools before, don't know what quality is or means to them, but always longed to have a full set. But you can bet there will be many of those who show up here and learn, those that eventually long for quality as they polish those Pittsburgh wrenches, yada-yada.

In other words, the proverbial "pie" is growing instead of cutting the pie-pieces smaller among tool makers. It's a tool revolution! . . . and not unlike the revolution in tools of the 1930s depression era when many tool makers had their start.

Just my opinion,
Steve

 

[oldtools]

what ones? you mean the ratchets that if you ask them or look on their website they say USA? the ratchets you keep trying to make something out of nothing?

Dual 80, screwdriver, etc.. What do you think the two Snap On manufacturing plants in China are making? Shoes? I also have Matco hardline tools with no COO. I know alot of MAC tools are made in Asia. Here are some more Snap On tools made in Asia.

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=24716&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=19890&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=19889&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

 

[scott37300]

Dual 80, screwdriver, etc.. What do you think the two Snap On manufacturing plants in China are making? Shoes? I also have Matco hardline tools with no COO. I know alot of MAC tools are made in Asia. Here are some more Snap On tools made in Asia.

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=24716&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=19890&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=19889&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

And this has to do with warranty how????

Quit turning every thread into a stupid COO arguement. You don't believe snap on that the ratchets are made in the US then the simple answer is don't freakin buy them. There are NO cordless drills made in the US anymore so the one linked to in your post doesn't mean jack ****. Go start a new thread called "oldtool COO conspericy theory" and argue over there instead of all these stupid COO arguements in threads that have NOTHING to do with COO.

 

[clouseau]

There are many companies that offer the lifetime warranty on the tool against normal usage.

Some of the tools are **** and they have figured that most people won't bother coming back to change it when it breaks.

Now if some company would warranty about broken knuckles and cuts then it might be worth something.

What is the point of queuing up every week because something failed to just have it replaced? Better to get something that rarely fails.

my .02 centimes worth

 

[Moose-LandTran]

I like that i very rarely have to use warranties of any duration.

 

[oldtools]

And this has to do with warranty how????

Quit turning every thread into a stupid COO arguement. You don't believe snap on that the ratchets are made in the US then the simple answer is don't freakin buy them. There are NO cordless drills made in the US anymore so the one linked to in your post doesn't mean jack ****. Go start a new thread called "oldtool COO conspericy theory" and argue over there instead of all these stupid COO arguements in threads that have NOTHING to do with COO.

I believe this is related to COO. I don't think the opt is concerned whether SO, MAC, etc.. will warranty the tools (they will). The opt is not too happy with warranty tools coming from Asia (with the assumption that all tools from Asia are ****). If the warranty tools come from Europe, this thread (and thousands of other threads) would not have come about. In fact, there would be admiration threads for the warrantied European tools.

 

[WhiteTrash]

Unless it is France. I don't want no French tool.

 

[VWandDodge]

Just to clarify something here, . . . I THINK what we are all seeing with Harbor Freight and others is there are those who are likely buying those tools to fill voids in current tool collections.

HOWEVER, the vast majority of HF customers are most likely "newbies" so to speak. Most are people who never had tools before, don't know what quality is or means to them, but always longed to have a full set. But you can bet there will be many of those who show up here and learn, those that eventually long for quality as they polish those Pittsburgh wrenches, yada-yada.

In other words, the proverbial "pie" is growing instead of cutting the pie-pieces smaller among tool makers. It's a tool revolution! . . . and not unlike the revolution in tools of the 1930s depression era when many tool makers had their start.

Just my opinion,
Steve

I respectfully disagree with your opinion that HF is helping "grow" the tool market and most people there are newbies. I am on a few automotive forums where many tool "veterans" yammer on or even advise newbies to buy HF tools, which is then followed by whining that buying good, quality tools costs money.

Really? Life *****, get over it. I wasted more time and money on a damned H/F parts tumbler (I went through four in a 6 week period) than I care to remember. I've recently been hauling loads of scrap metal and chucked both the metric and standard flare wrench sets and the curved end wrench set I had in my tool box. Why? None were cast with any degree of accuracy. The flare nut wrenches rarely, if ever, securely grabbed a fastener, and on the end wrenches one was cast to sloppy that it was a poor oval with thinning walls than a 9/16" opening. There was the Chicago Electric sawzall that literally vibrated itself to pieces in my hands, not to mention the Chicago Electric Heat Gun that burned itself out after an hour of use and didn't get all that hot. Oh, and then there was the Chicago Electric triangle shaped sander that upped and died after 20 minutes of use.


That's why I tell people to use the right tool for the right job and to pay once/cry once. There is nothing wrong with saving money until one can afford good tools. I do that now, which means I don't have to stop whatever project is in progress because some POS I went cheap on broke during the weekend, and also I don't have to expend time, gas, and effort driving all over town (not to mention 20 miles to town) in hopes of getting a replacement.

 

[tweety652]

I'm totally stealing that for my sig quote lol!!!
You are right though, and I agree. It's a frightening path to go down especially into the future

isn't that quote from "Tommy Boy"?

 

[chilly460]

I can understand the frustration in getting inferior quality, or different tools (12pt vs 6pt), but do you think it's feasible for a company to keep making older models simply for warranty replacement? At some point, they have to change the product line.

 

[ryan_289]

Its nice to know that the warranty is there. I can honestly say that I have NEVER broken a tool of Craftsman quality and above (excluding crapsman screwdrivers) if I was using it PROPERLY. I dont use my tools everyday, but I use my tools quite a bit on the farm and at home. The only time ive ever busted any tools involved cheater bars, double wrenching, etc. Of course thats being done on the farm when you use the tools at hand to get it done NOW

I have some older bonney tools that I still use but dont really worry about busting them. I just dont use them the wrong way!

 

[metalgodlb]

only craftsman tools I have broken with normal use is the standard quick release ratchets (they really aren't great) and the tape measure blades. well screwdriver tips too. but guys i have seen the way some people treat these warranties (im not shitting you, bringing in 5 gallon buckets of broken tools from flea markets, jobsites, etc.) and if I were calling the shots in the craftsman tool line, it would be hard to watch that everyday. Still, that was the business angle (warranty) that craftsman chose years ago and you reap what you sow. all i'm sayin i guess is that setup is destined to drive quality down, especially when your target consumer is not making money with their tools, only saving it.

 

[SpiderGearsMan]

it is a sad state when we have run off all traces of manufacturing to the evil empire death star

 

[zoomzoomjeff]

I don't understand the anti-flea market/estate sale argument. If a company warranties a tool forever, and doesn't implicitly state that it's for the original owner, which Craftsman has not, then it shouldn't make a difference which generation owner you are. It matters that the company originally made that promise, and continued to make that promise for decades while churning out tools.

If at some point in time they realized that "hey...estate sale tool returns are hurting business", they would have (or should have) stopped the lifetime warranty. And it sounds like they are starting to do that from the above posts. But I somewhat take issue with the fact that a 2nd-hand tool that was warrantied for life to begin with....is now suddenly void from a moral standpoint because you bought it from someone and you're screwing over the system.

The company in effect stated "this tool is so well made it will last forever, or we'll replace it". They're making a claim about the tool itself, not whether you yourself originally bought it from Sears. They all came from Sears at one time. They're all subject to the stated warranty. And if that isn't working for the company, then they need to change the terms of their warranty and quit making a promise they can't fulfill anymore.

Instead, they chose to continue the "lifetime warranty" as more than likely a branding/marketing strategy in an attempt to generate sales on the front end, only to then change the game on the back end by discontinuing tools so there IS no warranty anymore. Would've been better to simply be up front, change the terms of the warranty, and compete on quality instead of ******* off generations of customers....if you ask me.


And yes, the "guaranteed box of ****" quote above is from Tommy Boy.

 

[wafrederick]

Cornwell will not warranty a broken chrome socket if it was used on an impact,warranty is void.I get on Cornwell's facebook page and someone from Cornwell posted this.I have sent broken Mac tools into to get replaced and did get them replaced.With Craftsman,no questions asked when getting a tool replaced.Craftsman does not warranty their screwdriver bits including taps and dies.

 

[plinker]

Sears has been having issues for at least ten years or better(since k-mart got'em anyway). I'd call it a management issue.

You never hear of any other tool company having trouble like Sears Craftsman does, except for the previous owners of S-K.

 

[Old Donn]

Sears put restrictions on their tape measures soon after Katrina. My daughter's ex worked at a Sears in Mississippi. They didn't have tools on the shelves for customers, tape measures in particular, after all the contractor's exchanges every day.

 

[MattT]

I believe this is related to COO. I don't think the opt is concerned whether SO, MAC, etc.. will warranty the tools (they will). The opt is not too happy with warranty tools coming from Asia (with the assumption that all tools from Asia are ****). If the warranty tools come from Europe, this thread (and thousands of other threads) would not have come about. In fact, there would be admiration threads for the warrantied European tools.

Quality deteriorating due to asian COO is definitely a problem with some tools but it seems variable. Some brands have done a better job of maintaining quality than others and you'll even get a variable impact with some brands. For example I warrantied three MAC pullers last year. Got back taiwan Pitman arm and 3 legged pullers which look, and perform, the same as the USA ones they replaced. The china battery terminal puller is a really cheap looking sheetmetal contraption though to be fair it does work. I didn't expect it to going by looks