What are these for?

[LordTom]

I am working on a fountain at work and was wondering if it mattered what side of the connector bar we hook the wires to. One side is just the screws and the other has u shaped jumper looking things. So does it matter what side and what do they do?

I tried to post a picture and please forgive me if it did not work. I have never tried before on here.

 

[LordTom]

I am working on getting the photos up. Sorry

 

[LordTom]

 

[where2]

Doesn't look like it matters to me, looks like an ordinary terminal strip.

 

[Mechtech]

Terminal blocks are short side to side so which side you connect to depends on the wiring you are doing. Yours looks like a power distribution block, so as long as you are not cross connecting the hot (black wires) with the neutral (white wires) then it shouldn't matter. Although using washers for terminal jumpers is a dumb move in my opinion.

Just double check the wiring diagram for the machine before doing anything. (To make sure that what you think you're doing IS what you're doing)

 

[LordTom]

It is a city fountain and a custom build so we don't have a wiring diagram. The local electrical company built it this way. I took pictures last year so the city could save money by having me hook it back up after the winter is over. I figured the black and white had to be right but the left and right of the bar does not matter right? I have very little experience in electrical work but I want to do what I can for the tax payers to save money. I hooked up the wires to the "washers?" on the green bar and did not know if I should go back and change it.

 

[LordTom]

Here is the whole box.

 

[larry_g]

You are correct that those are standard terminal blocks. I do not recognize the brand but the jumpers are most likely made for the terminals. The jumpers make the terminal strips a distribution block. I would not put the wires on the the jumper side. The picture of the whole box is correct as far as connections look except that I prefer to have the feed wire land on the jumper side and the load connection of the individual terminals.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Steevo]

The terminal strips look OK, but you have the wrong kind of spiders in there.

 

[kevin47]

Spiders...? I thinking more along the line of rats... lol

 

[LordTom]

Thanks guys. This site is such a great place.

 

[where2]

The terminal strips look OK, but you have the wrong kind of spiders in there.

Most of the spiders look dead. As for the lack of proper single line diagrams (as built drawings) to go with the system, that sounds like a common result from a selection system based on cost alone.

I love photos like this. They give me hope that the company I work for is actually doing "above average" work when we install stuff.

 

[Doug Arthurs]

No strain reliefs on anything?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

What voltage is this fountain pump? Usually green is ground, white is neutral black is hot. If green IS ground in this setup, then hooking the pump wires up to the green wire terminal block like u said u did, will not work. But you also have 3 other colors which are close to the 480v 3 phase color scheme- brown, orange, yellow. Since u have limited electrical experience, u should get a multimeter and figure out where your incoming power is. Then figure out what voltage the pump is.

EDIT: I just noticed there's labels next to the br, rd, and yel terminal bars but cant read them due to the camera angle. What do they say??

 

[G_P]

That is a mess!

 

[trbomax]

That kind of stuff really pisses me off. As a home owner doing work in your own home in that town,what would the "inspecter" say about that mess? He would probably have your meter pulled. No strain reliefs,no bushings in those holes,bare ends of terminated wires sticking up,black and white wires with no color ID tape-are the black ones hot connected to nuetral?? Who the hell knows? I can see there is not a washer connecting the black section to the white section,but they shouldnt be on the same strip regardless.And how do plated steel washers make an accepible buss?Shouldnt they be brass or copper? But because it belongs to the city they will never look at it,much less make any recommendations. That is a discusting case of politics and another example of an accident waiting to happen that nobody even knows about.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Good point trbomax! And since the OP has limited electrical experience, he could get into trouble real fast, especially since that panel could have 3 phase coming into it judging by the color scheme of the 3 wires on the left!

 

[svronthmve]

Just like a good government setup. Want to try "save" the taxpayers money when they know nothing about what they're doing and could end up "costing" way more than is "saved" when all is said and done.

I can pick off a number of code violations in that box.

 

[trbomax]

Good point trbomax! And since the OP has limited electrical experience, he could get into trouble real fast, especially since that panel could have 3 phase coming into it judging by the color scheme of the 3 wires on the left!

Yeah,and how would you know what anything was ,single or three,w/o any labeling anywhere? Is that even an approved enclosure? It dont mater,it belongs to the city!

 

[LordTom]

The first row of 4 "blocks?" (the black, red, yellow and green) are for led lights. So maybe they don't have that many volts going to them? The white and black bar are for a led light and a solenoid to a small jet. None of these are pump wires. I'm not sure if that makes a difference of not?

 

[LordTom]

This is just one of like seven "grey" boxes inside of an bigger enclosed fiberglass box that has the pumps and other stuff in it.

 

[trbomax]

The fact that none of it is properly labeled makes a big difference,at least as far as I'm concerned.I'm not getting personal with youTom,its the people higher up that know better but dont care because they are not subject to scrutiny.

 

[LordTom]

I don't take it personal. If I took everything from work personal I would not be able to work for the gov. However it is a way to feed my wife and kids (even if it's just enough to get by) so I stay and just do what I am asked.

 

[LordTom]

Also if it makes you feel any better I'm trying to get on with another city that I hope is better to its employees.

 

[trbomax]

I know what your saying,but they send you in there to work on an unsafe piece fo **** that a licensed electrician probably wouldnt even touch,and if or when you **** it or yourself up its your fault! Thats most of what gets me going.I'm in a pretty volitle mood tonight anyway after listening to oboobie go on and on about you know what,so I'm easy to get going tonight!

 

[wyliesdiesels]

The first row of 4 "blocks?" (the black, red, yellow and green) are for led lights. So maybe they don't have that many volts going to them? The white and black bar are for a led light and a solenoid to a small jet. None of these are pump wires. I'm not sure if that makes a difference of not?

The larger wire on each of those bars, third screw down, is awfully large for LED lighting! Looks to be #10! And if this is all for LED lighting, why are u hooking up a pump to it? Are u sure u are hooking the pump up to the right panel?

 

[LordTom]

These are the pictures from last year of what the licensed electrician had it set up like. This is the first time we/I have worked on it. It was not the city that put it in. All the work was bid out.

 

[LordTom]

P.S. Don't listen to obama.

 

[trbomax]

So what are all those snipped off wires for then? They are not taped off or even have wire nuts on them,they are just there!

 

[LordTom]

The larger wire on each of those bars, third screw down, is awfully large for LED lighting! Looks to be #10! And if this is all for LED lighting, why are u hooking up a pump to it? Are u sure u are hooking the pump up to the right panel?

From what I understand each wire (yellow black or whatever) is a different hue on the led's. I noticed that I need to move one of the big wires at the top down to the bottom half. The big wires are what power the lights. None of these are pump wires. We do not unhook the pump that I know of. If I make it to work tomorrow (I'm sick) I will check to see the ga of the wire if you want. I think I striped the small ones at 16. I don't mind answering you guys questions.

 

[LordTom]

Trbomax, thoes are not wires. It is paper insulation.

Edit: If we are talking about the same thing.

 

[trbomax]

OK,I see the cable sheath now,the one that is supposed to be anchored to the box as a strain relief,not hanging below the hole leaveing the wires chafeing against the steel edge of the hole! Unbelievable! And a licensed electrician installed this!

 

[wyliesdiesels]

If youre not hooking up a pump, then what do the wires that u hooked up to this panel, go to? This whole panel is for lighting?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

These are the pictures from last year of what the licensed electrician had it set up like. This is the first time we/I have worked on it. It was not the city that put it in. All the work was bid out.

Wow, thats some REAL sloppy work for a licensed electrician!

P.S. Don't listen to obama.

I'm not an Obama fan/supporter but IMHO Bush was just as bad! Obama is just continuing where Bush left off!

 

[LordTom]

I don't like Bush or Obama. I have a beef with politicians in general. That is why crazy as it is I'm going to run an internet campaign and run for president in 2016. I know what you all will say but I fell like I have to do something.

Yes these are almost all lights.

 

[trbomax]

No need to use names and getoutwardly political.We will end up locked or gone.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

No need to use names and getoutwardly political.We will end up locked or gone.

Yeah, FEMA interment camps!

 

[Coolerman]

I run into this kind of stuff at most of the sites I work at. NOTHING labeled, no up to date wiring schematics, wires all one color and not numbered and seemingly going everywhere and nowhere. Here is an example from a recent trip... You have to trace down EACH wire to see what it is...

 

[kamesama980]

The first row of 4 "blocks?" (the black, red, yellow and green) are for led lights. So maybe they don't have that many volts going to them? The white and black bar are for a led light and a solenoid to a small jet. None of these are pump wires. I'm not sure if that makes a difference of not?

It makes a difference because you don't know what voltage is where. If you don't know, we don't know. Anything anyone here tells you about which wire to hook up where is guessing because who knows what's what in that box.

I've entered projects partway through or after the fact trying to diagnose problems or add features and had to re-do the whole pile due to no labeling and hooking things up just well enough to 'make it work'. It's not fun and not worth it since they never want to pay 5x the price of normal installation to fix the botched original parts.

If I were you I'd keep my hands and my name out of that box!

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Since the OP has no idea what he's doing, and there's no wiring diagram, the best thing to do is leave it alone. But if he must work on this mess, the first thing he should be doing is testing the terminal bars with a voltmeter to see where the voltage potential is!