What I learned in Mini Split Installation

[Centex Hokie]

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I put in a mini split, MrCool 24K BTU Olympus ES Heat Pump in a 900 foot garage with a 10 foot ceiling that has R15 Rockwool in the walls and R30 insulation in the ceiling, 2 insulated garage doors, one man door, and one window. Is it the right size. Check back in August.

What I learned was the following:

1. Drilling in rock to make the hole was easier than expected. The stone was about 9" thick, but it just took some time and a lot of small holes.
2. The line cover set was not that great. The box got a little roughed up in shipping, but it need more "trim Clips" to cover transitions, and the fit up is pretty flimsy.
3. I ran the line down the inside of the garage to keep off of the "uneven stone". The challenge with that is getting the lineset routed to fit the cover. I wasn't comfortable with making the bend radius to match the cover so I am going to probably find an adjustable elbow to fit the line set a little better.
4. The start up of the unit took the technician 45 minutes making what they charge to start these up in our area ($400) seem very high to me.
5. Looking forward to having a year round garage. Here in Texas without some help we get about 6 months of comfort.

 

[jjrbus]

Was not happy with the plastic lineset cover, I was able to use regular lineset on 2 of mine and the 3rd is plastic, I do not like the looks of it, hope it holds up.

I did not have precharged lines and made new flairs, so took the cover off and used spring type tubing benders on mine.

$400 seems out of line to me. But if you Google cheap you will find my picture!

 

[Centex Hokie]

Was not happy with the plastic lineset cover, I was able to use regular lineset on 2 of mine and the 3rd is plastic, I do not like the looks of it, hope it holds up.

I did not have precharged lines and made new flairs, so took the cover off and used spring type tubing benders on mine.

$400 seems out of line to me. But if you Google cheap you will find my picture!

I didn't have precharged lines either. Should have used a tubing bender. As usual once you do something for the first time, you know how to do it better the next time

 

[Ohmthis]

Some of the line hide (that’s we call it around here) isn’t that great. The fittings don’t fit so well. The line set is pretty easy to bend, but carefully read the min diameter in the installation instructions. You can make them too tight and affect flow. I can’t comment on the tech charging $400, every region has different rates. I hope you enjoy you MSHP.

 

[MattT]

$400 is a reasonable price for properly commissioning a mini IMO. Problem is I really doubt it's possible to do that in 45 minutes.

 

[strutaeng]

Cool. I just started unboxing my Mr. Cool Olympus 24k. I think it is the same as yours. I was going to order the bracket, but just decided to build my own from misc. steel angles I had laying around.

Did you shorten your lines? Looks like it comes with 24.5' length or something like that. My installation may require a bit longer lines.

You should be good on sizing. My space in about the same size with 17' ceilings (R38 ceiling insulation.) I was cooling with a 22kBtu window unit last summer and maintaining set temperature of 75-77F when outside was 100-102F.

 

[Centex Hokie]

@strutaeng

Yes I shortened the lines. The final length was 11 feet so I had a lot left over. I didn't realize until I got the unit that there was a minimum length, but I was over that. The unit is very quiet even in "turbo" mode.

 

[Vermont]

Tech charge is variable, pretty much depending on how long it takes to charge the line, test for leaks and then take out all the O2. Depends on humidity, line length, line size, etc. My guy told me the whole process could take a couple hours or couple days. Depends on the system. It also depends on how much they charge an hour. I think mine was $260. Line run was 10 ft with low humidity and cold out.

 

[justinjoyal]

400$ is not so bad. Not cheap but not excessive IMO, considering a professionnal job, not some hack stuff.

24k seems oversized but we are missing data.

 

[GRivera]

Those tech prices sound decent. I’ve read horror stories of super inflated rates when one installs a mini split and a tech finishes set up. In fact, based on these stories, I bought the DIY Mr Cool 36k.

 

[jjrbus]

The tech price is missing a lot of info. Was the line pressure tested, and vacuumed when he showed up?

45 minutes is enough time to put a vacuum pump on for a few minutes and release the gas.

Most mini-split manufacturers will require a pressure test in the 500 to 600 PSIG range, up to a 24-hour duration. Here again, the manufacturers Installation Manual will provide the prescribed pressure test details, so don’t bypass this critical step!

 

[Centex Hokie]

The tech price is missing a lot of info. Was the line pressure tested, and vacuumed when he showed up?

45 minutes is enough time to put a vacuum pump on for a few minutes and release the gas.

Most mini-split manufacturers will require a pressure test in the 500 to 600 PSIG range, up to a 24-hour duration. Here again, the manufacturers Installation Manual will provide the prescribed pressure test details, so don’t bypass this critical step!

I had tested it before he showed up. There is no 24 hour or 500-600 psi test in the instructions. I had it hold pressure for an hour and tested my joints with soapy water. The technician tested it for an additional 30 minutes with his vacuum and I performed the function test. The instructions only require a vacuum for 15 minutes.

 

[boostaholic1]

Whether the tech was there 45 minutes or 2.5 hours....that seems a bit excessive for very little labor involved. Include a half hour of windshield time on that and its hard to justify $133 per hour for something as simple as adding freon. If it really were only 45 minutes....wow, I'm in the wrong business.
Bottom line is, these types of jobs have to be done by a licensed professional so they can charge whatever the consumer is willing to pay (and when my ac breaks in the summer, it's a LOT).

Sorry, rant over

 

[justinjoyal]

Whether the tech was there 45 minutes or 2.5 hours....that seems a bit excessive for very little labor involved. Include a half hour of windshield time on that and its hard to justify $133 per hour for something as simple as adding freon. If it really were only 45 minutes....wow, I'm in the wrong business.

Bottom line is, these types of jobs have to be done by a licensed professional so they can charge whatever the consumer is willing to pay (and when my ac breaks in the summer, it's a LOT).



Sorry, rant over

Part of it comes down to this :




And the service truck, thousands of dollars in tools, insurance, licences, equipment, storage, warranty, etc.

Same ol’ same..

 

[NewShockerGuy]

I'm going to ask a really dumb question but I don't know, so hopefully I will know..lol

In the picture of the OP the lineset is coming off to the right of the wall unit. Then it goes down.

All wall units I have seen have always had the lineset go directly behind the unit so you don't see anything.

I am at the point where I want to install a mini split in my garage and where I initially wanted it, will require me to move shelving and loose space. The new plan is having it mounted on the back wall, and then go through the current cubby that already has a huge duct in it. My reasoning is it will be easy to access the lineset if something were to happen. I have full access to it from the attic and then I go straight out to the side exterior wall and down.

Here's the dumb question. Do ALL minisplits have the ability to have the lineset come out the side (right side specifically when looking at it like in OP's picture)? OR do you have to pay extra to get this feature?

I can attach pictures when I get home or make a new thread but figured I'd ask since this is the first picture I've seen with exposed lineset that is NOT going directly out a rear/back wall.

Thanks,
-Nigel

 

[American Locomotive]

I cannot speak for "ALL" minispilts, but the Senville and Mitsubishi I did had the ability for the line set to come out the left, right, back or bottom.

 

[Rc_Guy]

Whether the tech was there 45 minutes or 2.5 hours....that seems a bit excessive for very little labor involved. Include a half hour of windshield time on that and its hard to justify $133 per hour for something as simple as adding freon. If it really were only 45 minutes....wow, I'm in the wrong business.
Bottom line is, these types of jobs have to be done by a licensed professional so they can charge whatever the consumer is willing to pay (and when my ac breaks in the summer, it's a LOT).

Sorry, rant over

Doesn’t the Freon come inside the unit when you buy it? Then it is released into the lineset when you open the valves I thought.

 

[NewShockerGuy]

I cannot speak for "ALL" minispilts, but the Senville and Mitsubishi I did had the ability for the line set to come out the left, right, back or bottom.

That's excellent to know! I know for sure the drainage pipe can be swapped left and right since I've seen videos of people doing that, but normally all videos are of the unit's piping going straight out the back of the unit which is annoying that I can't find other installs..lol

I think the brand I am ultimately going with is Daikin so I will have to inquire but from some of the videos it appears so! And one of the cool things of the one I am looking at is that it comes precharge for a 33' line set. All the mr. cool ones I've seen are less, and some of the amazon specials are even less than that at around 16'.

I have to do some measuring this weekend and get a really rough game plan.

-Nigel

 

[NewShockerGuy]

Doesn’t the Freon come inside the unit when you buy it? Then it is released into the lineset when you open the valves I thought.

The Daikins units I'm looking at come pre-filled for lines up to 33'. I was quoted by the HVAC people who we got a 3rd quote from for a mini split in the garage and they quoted me $8k. And the guy was talking about how involved and hard it is...etc.

I'm like it's fine if you want to make money but don't start blowing smoke up my ***. I've done some research and after hearing that ridiculous quote I'm 100% doing it myself. I installed my max jax 10 years ago and that's still going. I've done wood flooring and I solve way more complex problems at work on a daily basis that it appears to install a mini split from all the video's I've watched... Mind you I know it's a skill and what not, but seems like if you can drill holes/hang a bracket and then follow the directions per the instruction manual from the manufacture, you should be good to go....lol

-Nigel

 

[American Locomotive]

A lot of people have been having issues with Daikin units on this forum within the past few months. I would research carefully.

 

[pcmeiners]

"$400 is a reasonable price for properly commissioning a mini IMO. Problem is I really doubt it's possible to do that in 45 minutes."

In 45 minutes you can not possibly evacuate , test with pressure, purge with nitrogen, vacuum properly, and micron test; if you can do it in that time, you are producing a miracle, right up there with walking on water.

"And the guy was talking about how involved and hard it is...etc."

Must of been a pretty large shovel he was holding.

 

[NewShockerGuy]

A lot of people have been having issues with Daikin units on this forum within the past few months. I would research carefully.

That's disappointing to hear. I thought they were the top tier along with Mitsubishi. The Daikin I'm looking at is only 500 less than the Mitsubishi so it makes me wonder if I should just spend the money and get the mitsu.

-Nigel

 

[fitter30]

There are industry standards ( the way system should be installed and serviced) and industry practices ( how a person can short change a job from because it will work at least for a while). I've looked at the install manual for your system and shame on the manufacturer. Read the fine print on the warranty has to be professionally installed and started. Their recommendation on evacuation is a crime. Minimum 15 minute time for it through gauges with not a micron gauge and not with a minimum reading. Didn't see anything about blowing out lines after cutting and flaring to blow out any copper debris before connecting. Leak checking with soap bubbles or electronic detector after opening the valves. Most and I'm one unless a friend wouldn't start up equipment that a customer installed because there can be problems from the wiring to refrigeration.

 

[racecougar]

The OP will have to chime in as to whether or not that 45 minute startup has produced any ill effect, as that was over three years ago at this point.

I wouldn't hold out much hope on that however, as the OP also hasn't visited this site in over three years.

 

[pcmeiners]

"The OP will have to chime in as to whether or not that 45 minute startup has produced any ill effect, as that was over three years ago at this point."

Just like Russian Roulette some get lucky and some do not. With a 45 minute startup, it like placing 2 bullets in the revolver.

 

[vavet]

I have a friend/coworker who has a HVAC hobby and does some sidework. He helped me install my 18k Mr Cool Olympus (not the DIY unit) about 5 years ago. He agreed to do it for free to get the experience working on the mini-splits. I went with the olympus line for the following reasons:
significantly less expensive than the DIY
reduced warranty over the DIY, but I decided to roll the dice based on the price difference
ability to shorten the lineset - supposedly the DIY unit is not supposed to be shortened, although I guess you could if you knew how much refrigerant to remove. Since I had a person with the tools and knowledge to cut and reflare the line, I felt good about shortening them for a neater installation.
He used the micron gage to do a formal installation, even though you should not really have to do that. We felt good about the joints by the time we actually opened the valve to let the refrigerant flow.

He also took care of the heat pump on my rental house earlier this year before I found new tenants. He visited several times to make sure he had the right measurements before adding refrigerant - needing different ambient temps to calculate superheat. He charged me about $120 for this - well less than I would've paid any HVAC contractor. The unit was in good condition overall (we think), but I need to have him check it again next year to make sure there is no significant loss of refrigerant.

 

[My Old Tools]

I'm going to ask a really dumb question but I don't know, so hopefully I will know..lol

In the picture of the OP the lineset is coming off to the right of the wall unit. Then it goes down.

All wall units I have seen have always had the lineset go directly behind the unit so you don't see anything.

I am at the point where I want to install a mini split in my garage and where I initially wanted it, will require me to move shelving and loose space. The new plan is having it mounted on the back wall, and then go through the current cubby that already has a huge duct in it. My reasoning is it will be easy to access the lineset if something were to happen. I have full access to it from the attic and then I go straight out to the side exterior wall and down.

Here's the dumb question. Do ALL minisplits have the ability to have the lineset come out the side (right side specifically when looking at it like in OP's picture)? OR do you have to pay extra to get this feature?

I can attach pictures when I get home or make a new thread but figured I'd ask since this is the first picture I've seen with exposed lineset that is NOT going directly out a rear/back wall.

Thanks,
-Nigel

MrCool can go right, mine does.

 

[housewolf]

I'm going to ask a really dumb question but I don't know, so hopefully I will know..lol

In the picture of the OP the lineset is coming off to the right of the wall unit. Then it goes down.

All wall units I have seen have always had the lineset go directly behind the unit so you don't see anything.

I am at the point where I want to install a mini split in my garage and where I initially wanted it, will require me to move shelving and loose space. The new plan is having it mounted on the back wall, and then go through the current cubby that already has a huge duct in it. My reasoning is it will be easy to access the lineset if something were to happen. I have full access to it from the attic and then I go straight out to the side exterior wall and down.

Here's the dumb question. Do ALL minisplits have the ability to have the lineset come out the side (right side specifically when looking at it like in OP's picture)? OR do you have to pay extra to get this feature?

I can attach pictures when I get home or make a new thread but figured I'd ask since this is the first picture I've seen with exposed lineset that is NOT going directly out a rear/back wall.

Thanks,
-Nigel

I recently installed a Daiken in my shop and I believe the directions did say you could bend the copper to come out right, left, or out the back. The copper was already going to the left so in lieu of trying to bend it 90 or 180 degrees I made the flare connection there and continued on out the left side. I’m pretty experienced at bending soft copper but if I had wanted to do something differently I would have brazed fittings and made my flare connection outside from behind the unit. There isn’t much room in there as it is.

FWIW; the install/start up went well and my temps in the shop are mid 70s with outdoor temps around 100. It was well worth it!

 

[AA/FC]

Whether the tech was there 45 minutes or 2.5 hours....that seems a bit excessive for very little labor involved. Include a half hour of windshield time on that and its hard to justify $133 per hour for something as simple as adding freon. If it really were only 45 minutes....wow, I'm in the wrong business.
Bottom line is, these types of jobs have to be done by a licensed professional so they can charge whatever the consumer is willing to pay (and when my ac breaks in the summer, it's a LOT).

Sorry, rant over

I disagree..... If I am perfectly capable of starting up a mini split system for the first time (vacuum, leak check, charge refrigerant, monitor pressures, etc.) why would I pay someone else to do it?

Don't take this the wrong way, but..... just because you're not capable of doing this job, that doesn't mean nobody else is capable of doing it.