What to charge for electrical work?

[dthor68]

My wife has a coworker that needs some electrical work done. They want 4 can lights in their kitchen with switch and a receptacle above their fireplace for a TV. The attic above is clear, looks like everything will be easy access. They will be buying all of the supplies.

I did electrical work for 15 years but I am not licensed or insured. I have no idea how much to charge them? So, would really like to know what you guys would charge and would you even do the job without licence or insurance?

Thanks

 

[mike93lx]

Sounds like a nightmare. One thing to do a favor, but to do paid work in someone else's house without a license or insurance? Can't be worth the risk, IMO.

 

[rjn2649]

There is more to it than meets the eye..
Will they want the ceiling and walls finished, are you going to patch and paint?
Do a fast assessment of the existing electrical have they hired a bunch of hacks in the past to save a buck?
If you put your foot through the ceiling are they OK with you patching your own damage?
Can you do it to code?
If I felt comfortable, pure cash no paper trail...Can't say what I would charge maybe about 1/3 to 1/2 labour of someone that would supply permits and insuance.

 

[Movover]

Ill Say it 1st "no good deed goes unpunished"

 

[dthor68]

There is more to it than meets the eye..
Will they want the ceiling and walls finished, are you going to patch and paint?
Do a fast assessment of the existing electrical have they hired a bunch of hacks in the past to save a buck?
If you put your foot through the ceiling are they OK with you patching your own damage?
Can you do it to code?
If I felt comfortable, pure cash no paper trail...Can't say what I would charge maybe about 1/3 to 1/2 labour of someone that would supply permits and insuance.

Cutting in a can is quite simple, why would I need to patch and paint? Never made a mistake in the many I have done.

Putting foot through ceiling, that I worry about. Did it in my own house two months ago. First time ever in 50 years of life.

Code, no problem.

1/3-1/2 labor? I worked for contractors and I have no idea of what they charged

 

[PFSard]

I agree with mike93lx.

 

[readhead]

You have the skill and knowledge. Should be able to knock it out in a day. How about $300 and sign a brief agreement that you are not licensed or insured and they accept liability for your work.

 

[Richard Cranium]

you open up a whole can of worms when You are paid to do some thing, instead of doing a favor. Is it really worth the risk. As was said "NO good deed goes unpunished"

 

[PhysicsDude]

+/- $30/hour cash is what I would charge. A "real" electrician would probably charge $50-$75 an hour.

Don't forget you're also charging for the use of your tools, ladders, etc.

 

[sleek98]

I will wire just about anything in my own house. I will not wire something in someone else's house. Simply I dont want to get sued when something goes wrong, even if its not my fault and their house burns down. The cost to defend the lawsuit is high enough to not warrant the 300 bucks that I might earn.

 

[rlitman]

You have the skill and knowledge. Should be able to knock it out in a day. How about $300 and sign a brief agreement that you are not licensed or insured and they accept liability for your work.

I doubt that would hold water.

you open up a whole can of worms when You are paid to do some thing, instead of doing a favor. Is it really worth the risk. As was said "NO good deed goes unpunished"

Agreed. No way in hell I'd be doing electrical (or at a minimum, any other work requiring a license) for consideration without the license.

 

[driftpin]

Licensed electricians work cheap in Dallas. I am not an electrician, but I just had some work done, $100/hour and permits. Everything new from the weatherhead to where the meter can was installed, then to the existing conduit run to the new branch circuit panel, and a below-grade feed to a stand-alone garage, and complete wiring for the 1-car garage. That included an outside main disconnect, inside branch panel 100 amps, and multiple 120 and 240 volt outlets, outside LED motion detector flood lights and inside LED lamps and switches. I was happy to pay, they did a good job. What impressed me was the master license-holder got me a permit in 24 hours, it took almost six weeks to get a concrete permit to replace an existing asphalt driveway.

I agree with 'sleek98,' it's not worth the liability.

+/- $30/hour cash is what I would charge. A "real" electrician would probably charge $50-$75 an hour.

Don't forget you're also charging for the use of your tools, ladders, etc.

 

[reader2580]

Licensed electricians work cheap in Dallas. I am not an electrician, but I just had some work done, $100/hour and permits.

$100 an hour is cheap for a licensed electrician? I would hate to think what expensive is.

For a full day I think I could easily find a licensed electrician for $100 an hour labor only. Travel might be additional.

 

[reader2580]

I am an okay DIY electrical person who follows code to the letter and gets permits for any large projects. I would not do any electrical for someone else except for a friend and not for money. Too much liability.

The person you are doing the work for could pull a permit themselves as a homeowner in many areas, but a good electrical inspector can figure out if the homeowner did the work or not. A few questions to the homeowner can tell the inspector if they did the work or not.

Some inspectors don't care who did the work, but some inspectors could get the homeowner (and the person who did the work) in hot water. My father helped my uncle with an electrical project that my uncle pulled a permit for. The electrical inspector told my uncle I know you didn't do this work, but I'll sign off on it. (My father worked as an electrician in high school and college and knows his stuff.)

 

[bczygan]

Cash in advance.

No paper trail or video or phone records.

Do work with no visitors or onlookers.

Plausible deniability if needed.

Bill

 

[Mr. T]

I am not licensed or insured

Charge enough to pay a good lawyer if anything goes wrong. Not just with your work either.

 

[The Cobbler]

around here it's not worth the risk.
they are friends now, but if anything goes wrong they will blame you in a heart beat...

 

[ez-duzit]

Pretty sure that type of work requires a licensed contractor, and that you would be breaking the law if you did the job.

 

[Matt Matt]

I have almost stopped doing all electrical work for friends. Now I just merely give them helpful suggestions. Good friends or family I’ll help if they pull a permit as they’re doing it themselves. Personally, I am not allowed to perform residential electrical work or bill for it (outside my own personal owned property’s) . I’ve made my decision.

 

[Evan(CA)]

GJ has some of the biggest bureaucratic pu**ies I've ever come across.

The guy has 15 years experience in the field, he can cut in 4 cans and an outlet. That may seem like rocket science to the layman but that's as easy as it gets in the electrical world. The only thing I don't like is the home owners buying their own material. They ALWAYS buy the wrong or cheap **** that will cause you headaches. Just give them a bid for the job that compensates you wasting a day off, partially in the attic and the cost of the material of your choosing.

 

[Dirtydan69]

150 a hole, including materials, no trim or devices included. Patching is extra. 145 a square foot and 35 for every extra square foot. These are old prices too. Maybe 7-8 years. Your call. As others have said, licensing and permits, insurance? Could be risky but if everything goes well then your fine. If not........ As for putting a foot through a ceiling I made it 45 years until walking the 2x4 in a stand up attic I stepped on a coax cable which rolled under my foot and I went down. Guess how I spent my weekend.

 

[James-W]

I rarely do electrical work for anyone. If I do decide to help someone out, I make sure they understand that I am just helping them, I am not doing it for them. I never charge them anything because it is their project, they are doing it, and I am just their helper. As long as they understand that, I will, on occasion, help them out. If they want to give me a little gas money, that's OK, but I am not charging them anything.

 

[James-W]

GJ has some of the biggest bureaucratic pu**ies I've ever come across.

The guy has 15 years experience in the field, he can cut in 4 cans and an outlet. That may seem like rocket science to the layman but that's as easy as it gets in the electrical world. The only thing I don't like is the home owners buying their own material. They ALWAYS buy the wrong or cheap **** that will cause you headaches. Just give them a bid for the job that compensates you wasting a day off, partially in the attic and the cost of the material of your choosing.

It doesn't matter if he has 115 years of experience. If he isn't licensed to do the job and something unforeseen happens, he may very well be held responsible. It doesn't even have to be his fault, he is doing something illegal and he may very well be up to his neck in trouble.

I agree, most likely there won't be a problem and everything will turn out just great. But what if something does go wrong? Does it really make sense to risk so much for a small amount of money? If he wants to do the work, then he should take the time to get the license and then he can do all the work he wants.

 

[awdblazer]

do what i did to my brother in laws girlfriend
at least a thousand dollars, cause i hate working in the attic and good work aint cheap and cheap work aint good

 

[b-boy]

I rarely do electrical work for anyone. If I do decide to help someone out, I make sure they understand that I am just helping them, I am not doing it for them. I never charge them anything because it is their project, they are doing it, and I am just their helper. As long as they understand that, I will, on occasion, help them out. If they want to give me a little gas money, that's OK, but I am not charging them anything.

I agree with this 100%. I do the same thing. I'm happy to help, but I'm not doing the entire thing, and I'm not getting paid.

If their house ever burns down, they'll be looking at you. You were the last guy who touched it. Even if 10 years has passed, they'll still be looking at you.

 

[3robert 1]

Not worth the risk. Here in Ontario I need to get a permit for any electrical work I do. Then it's inspected after its done. The only work I'm allowed to do elsewhere is for my children, if they pull the permit I'm allowed to help them with the work. Again it's inspected after. I would never do any electrical work for a friend or stranger for money ever.

 

[sberry]

I just did a service job, call it maintenance but at least took a couple of the most dangerous faults out of it, 100$ cash and out the door, ha. I barely got a drivers licence, not qualified to do anything.

 

[driftpin]

The liability issue is something any rational individual would recognize. Some respondents may not care about their financial futures, obviously many on here do.

"Can" he do it? Yes, he's been working in the electrical field 15 years. "Should" he do it? As mentioned, the minimal financial gain is far-outweighed by the potential risks, and the liability.

Let's say he does it. No issues, everything works as-expected. Six months later, a short-circuit in another piece of electrical equipment in the wall causes a fire. In the fire investigation, the fire investigator and the insurance investigator notice the difference in the area where the work was done. They question the homeowner who informs them of the unpermitted work. Even if the unpermitted work didn't cause the fire, the insurance company may choose to exclude coverage, and now you have to fight to get them to cover the damage.

Let's say it goes to court. When a professional (whom we can reasonably expect this moonlighting electrician to be) breaks the rules, the courts tend to find greater fault because he should know better. The small profit just isn't worth it, to do the job.

I am not an electrician, nor am I an attorney. I am guided by a strong sense of liability, and concern for my financial well-being.

 

[Crazyjake8493]

I would pass, both on the fact that you're taking paid work without being insured and licensed, and the fact that they're buying their own materials.

I won't even do free work for friends anymore if they're buying all the materials. We end up wasting half the day going back to the store because they thought I could make a new-work box work without cutting any extra drywall, or because I don't want my name attached to a bunch of Romex they want to put underground. If they show me what they need, give me money to buy the stuff, then I'll do it.

 

[CJ7VFR]

I rarely do electrical work for anyone. If I do decide to help someone out, I make sure they understand that I am just helping them, I am not doing it for them. I never charge them anything because it is their project, they are doing it, and I am just their helper. As long as they understand that, I will, on occasion, help them out. If they want to give me a little gas money, that's OK, but I am not charging them anything.

Same with me. I have done lots of wiring jobs in my own home, and I try to follow as much of the NEC codes as I can. I am a pretty handy guy, and people are always asking me to do stuff for them.

Some things, like painting rooms, or putting up doors, putting in a new sink/vanity/faucets, or fixing things like furniture, toys, outdoor patio stuff are things I will do for people for money. But I won't do any electrical things for other people for the reasons everyone here is saying.

I will be the helper for the people, and I will guide them along with what to do, but they have to do most of the work.

As others have said, it is not that people are pu**ies, but that people know that if anything goes wrong, even with something that is not even related to what wiring work was done, the "friend" not only becomes the guy who will constantly get called to fix things, but he is also the guy who will get sued if something big happens.

Yeah Jim, right after you put the wiring in for my new light in the basement, the garage door opener light went out. It must have been something you did because the garage door opener light worked before you did your job. Can you please come over to fix it.

Yeah Jim, um, can you please come over tonight. The outside light on the shed is no longer working. It stopped working the day after you put in the new switch for the light over the kitchen sink. It must have been something you did because it was working before, so you can please come and fix it.

Nope. I have been there and done that. No more. I will help you, but if you don't want to do the work, then you have to hire someone that is licensed, bonded and insured.

Jim

 

[jd_1138]

I do some work for a buddy. I don't charge much, because then I don't have to do a perfect job. lol. I put in some new steps out front for him and was only paid a case of beer.

If the job's under $500, you don't even need to be fully insured, bonded, licensed as a contractor. I think that's how it is in most jurisdictions.

 

[finn]

How much per hour will a good lawyer cost when things go south?

Figure your rate backwards from that.

 

[alfredeneuman]

If the job's under $500, you don't even need to be fully insured, bonded, licensed as a contractor. I think that's how it is in most jurisdictions.

In CA, the limit is $500 or less TOTAL (materials and labor).
It holds true even if the customer buys the material

 

[tab2]

I work for food and beer/wine as compensation and only for people I trust. If I do it on your house it will come out even better when I do it at mine.

Sad to see all the softies. My goodness.

 

[Eriehunter]

$65 /hr + 10% on all materials I need to buy for the project.

I hate side work and don't normally do it.

 

[CJ7VFR]

I work for food and beer/wine as compensation and only for people I trust. If I do it on your house it will come out even better when I do it at mine.

Sad to see all the softies. My goodness.

Not softies. Just part of the "Trust but verify" crowd.

You even said you will only do work for people you "trust". Why? What if someone you know and trust recommended you to a friend of a friend of theirs? Would you do the work?

Or would you say no because you don't know them, and in essence can't really say you trust them?

Just curious.

For most of the jobs I said I will do for people, I also usually work for beer. Fix kids toy = 6 pack of beer. New sink or faucet with new shut offs = 12 pack of beer. New door = case of beer.

Jim

 

[ard]

I rarely do electrical work for anyone. If I do decide to help someone out, I make sure they understand that I am just helping them, I am not doing it for them. I never charge them anything because it is their project, they are doing it, and I am just their helper. As long as they understand that, I will, on occasion, help them out. If they want to give me a little gas money, that's OK, but I am not charging them anything.

This, but I am trading for help.

Next time I need to pour and finish 16 yards of concrete....

 

[jd_1138]

In CA, the limit is $500 or less TOTAL (materials and labor).
It holds true even if the customer buys the material

Yep, that's how it is here too I think. I think in the OP's case, the job still falls under that $500 amount.

 

[Dirtydan69]

do what i did to my brother in laws girlfriend
at least a thousand dollars, cause i hate working in the attic and good work aint cheap and cheap work aint good

If you play it right, glow rods and a quality fish, you won’t need attic access.

$ limits here in AZ are under 1000

 

[alfredeneuman]

The receptacle over the fireplace could be the deciding factor that puts him over the limit. Very often, there isn't enough space between the chimney and the drywall or plaster to install a receptacle.
In that case>
You'd need to chip out the chimney to accommodate the box.....or
You could also have it stick out past the drywall. In this case (behind the TV) it really doesn't make any difference until you remove the TV and expose the horrible mess when it sticks out from the finished wall.