When did screwdrivers become consumable?

[sberry]

When I take one to Sears it cost nothing for replacement. But you paid for a complete warranty from the truck, they could give you 2 or 3 on that one item and still survive. But on a whole, a guy spends 10K on a truck and utilizes very little warranty.
Personally would rather pay 1/2 the price and take my chances. We had a guy come on this forum and ask if a Cman adjustable plier priced at 40 was a better deal than 2 Channelok at 20 a piece cause the Cman was warranted forever. Was considering as part of the purchase the what if scenario that his grandkids may need to replace them. Sad thing about it and I was scared to ask but the guy is prolly a college graduate.

 

[sberry]

When I take a hard handle into a snap on truck, it costs me nothing to get a new shaft.

You got the shaft well before the driver needed replacement.

 

[sberry]

I traded a couple Sears in cause I was there and happened to grab a couple old ones for giggles but I aint going out of my way to warrant a tool I paid a dollar or 2 30 yrs ago and beat the snot out of. I know there are those, we seen it here, drive 50 miles and 2 hrs to try to replace a 3 dollar piece, stop and eat a burger cost 2x the thing they are going after.
I replaced a lot piece the other day, last sockets I replaced were losses, had to drive 10 minutes and 10$ which was not an economic decision but I had it and wanted it then.
But I aint insuring a screwdriver.

 

[walrus]

You got the shaft well before the driver needed replacement.

You can make that argument if you'd like, that's simply a matter of opinion. When you've had hard handles since the early 90s and have had many shafts replaced your argument will fall on deaf ears

 

[sberry]

I think its closer to fact than opinion. Sell a screwdriver that is 3$ to make and that's generous for 30, of course someone is willing to warrant it, on the chance it ever wears out, betting on the chance its lost before it ever needs to be changed. They don't offer it because you will end up on the winning side.

 

[Provincial]

When did screwdrivers become conme consumable?

When my grandfather started grinding chisel edges on the tips.

 

[bwringer]

Back in Ye Olden Dayes, pretty much every screw head was a simple slot. A screwdriver would still mostly work even if it was pretty banged up. And if it didn't, it's a simple enough shape to file or grind by hand until it works again.

You can't really do that with any other shape. (Although I'm sure some beady-eyed geezer will be along any second now to tell us how real men learned to sharpen Phillips screwdrivers with a dull file back in seventh grade shop class.)

So, screwdrivers became consumables the second the Phillips head screw entered production. About 1935-36, according to Wikipedia:
It's all this *******'s fault: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_F._Phillips

 

[Rossco]

Ah ... All tools can become consumable in the end. What ever it takes to get the job done and get paid.

Using a 2' snipe tube on a 1/2 ratchet. You bet the internals are an expendable consumable.

 

[sberry]

Due to the fact that tools have not only got so much better but so much cheaper it makes even more sense to view it as a consumable. Don't need to care for it in the same sense, don't need to insure it or finance. A tool may cost per use, same for a grinding wheel, so what if it cost a couple bucks to replace it. It may return so fast on initial investment maybe that's the attraction and the bonus is the cheap stuff has worked better than we thought it would. I got some from the dollar bin I still use, how good they all got to be.
Even some of the power tools are surprising, not the uber cheap ones but 1 step off the bottom.

 

[jn50308401]

I bought a milk crate full of tools.. yep, everything from wing Wang pliers to high quality Proto and SK sockets and ratchets. There's about 80 screwdrivers of a million different brands too.
The common denominator on them is the handles. They're disgusting! I'm soaking them in a bucket of Dawn to get the gunk off. The plastic handles are slick with the funk of years of swear, oil and degrading plastic. Most of the shanks are fine, the tips are ok but the handles smell like an old man's shoes.

My definition of consumable is when the handles stink too bad to keep in your tool box!

 

[53chevy5]

I just replaced my #2 Philips from Cornwell ( Whitte ) after it wore out over 10 yrs. I guess all tools are consumable, some quicker than others.

 

[T45]

p2's (etc) are designed to cam out, thus once they are used at the limit they start to wear. crappy hardware much moreso accelerates this, by camming out more often and by depositing metal/abrasive junk onto the tips. so junky hardware, sloppy or soft production tips (corner cutting by oems), and the rusty "special situation" problem that rolls in repeatedly a couple times a year...I don't think its all that unreasonable people find it necessary to replace the tips/shafts. etc...lets also not forget people dealing with JIS tips or other slotted screws that aren't true p2 (frearsons etcZ)...etc there's lots of imperfection in the world and lots of people making do with tools at hand that aren't always perfect/

 

[walrus]

I think its closer to fact than opinion. Sell a screwdriver that is 3$ to make and that's generous for 30, of course someone is willing to warrant it, on the chance it ever wears out, betting on the chance its lost before it ever needs to be changed. They don't offer it because you will end up on the winning side.

Your opinion is just that, yours. Its obvious that the screwdrivers I'm talking are not consumable unless you think that they are magically going to be no good after 30 yrs or something. These drivers get used every day in my business and I'll continue to use them and when a tip breaks I'll get another shaft put in. Whether or not Snap On made money on them is of little concern in this discussion

 

[Olafur]

Back in Ye Olden Dayes, pretty much every screw head was a simple slot. A screwdriver would still mostly work even if it was pretty banged up. And if it didn't, it's a simple enough shape to file or grind by hand until it works again.

You can't really do that with any other shape. (Although I'm sure some beady-eyed geezer will be along any second now to tell us how real men learned to sharpen Phillips screwdrivers with a dull file back in seventh grade shop class.)

So, screwdrivers became consumables the second the Phillips head screw entered production. About 1935-36, according to Wikipedia:
It's all this *******'s fault: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_F._Phillips

Are you telling us the world didn't figure out the pry bar/chisel/paint stirring properties of flat screwdrivers until (after) 1936?

 

[lbhsbz]

Screwdrivers are only consumable if they're used incorrectly, in the wrong fastener, or the wrong tool for the job. I still have screwdrivers that have seen daily use that I've had for 25 years.

I also have a bunch of broken ones I've used for jobs other than driving screws

 

[bwringer]

Are you telling us the world didn't figure out the pry bar/chisel/paint stirring properties of flat screwdrivers until (after) 1936?

Nah, just that when every screw was a slotted screw, you could (usually) still use a screwdriver with a boogered up tip. If it got too bad, you could easily bang and file the tip until you got a sort of straight tip and go at it again.

My Dad and Grandpa had several screwdrivers in their collections where they had cut off the tip and then ground and filed the stub to create a new tip. Can't do that with Phillips.

 

[finn]

Screwdrivers are only consumable if they're used incorrectly, in the wrong fastener, or the wrong tool for the job. I still have screwdrivers that have seen daily use that I've had for 25 years.

I also have a bunch of broken ones I've used for jobs other than driving screws

I haven't seen or used a paint can church key in thirty years.

One of the uses of a screwdriver is to open paint cans, almost by default.

I try to steer my wife towards old, inexpensive, worn out screwdrivers, but that doesn't always work.

I'd rather replace a five dollar screwdriver every few years than become the household painter.

If screwdrivers can't handle opening a few cans of paint, they become disposable and incidental to the task.

Fortunately a lot of new paints are packaged in plastic cans with screw on lids.

 

[dutchgray]

Our painter has a PB Swiss slot head for opening paint cans and stirring.
He didn't even know what it was until I pointed it out, it was just an old screwdriver he picked up somewhere.

 

[Superbec]

Our painter has a PB Swiss slot head for opening paint cans and stirring.
He didn't even know what it was until I pointed it out, it was just an old screwdriver he picked up somewhere.

that would be reason to fire him..

 

[bcradio]

Screwdrivers have always been consumable. They all wear out and normally quicker then everything else because screws are the most used form of fastener across the board. Quality last longer. Quality was higher years ago because it was expected to be.

Buy a set of Mayhew Cats Paw screwdrivers. FYI they are all the same color. They will last you a good long time as long as you use them as actual screwdrivers. As will Snap-On and MAC Tools. You get what you pay for...

Nope. Quality is better today.

 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Buy a high quality screwdriver if you don't want "consumable" screwdrivers. I'm extremely fond of Wera screwdrivers, to an extent my friends probably consider somewhat psychotic. Lots of quality brands of screwdrivers out there, many of them German.

 

[sberry]

Your opinion is just that, yours. Its obvious that the screwdrivers I'm talking are not consumable unless you think that they are magically going to be no good after 30 yrs or something. These drivers get used every day in my business and I'll continue to use them and when a tip breaks I'll get another shaft put in. Whether or not Snap On made money on them is of little concern in this discussion

My argument isn't that they are not good but that its perceived as free when it isn't. The shaft must be consumable or you wouldn't be replacing it? So, we paid lots to save a handle at some point in the future and are still replacing the business end?

 

[sberry]

It isn't that good screwdrivers are so much better its usually that by the time a guy is long enough in his career they are usually 2nd or 3rd sets and he takes better care of something he can remember he paid 100$ for vs the 14.95 from a flea where they were pretty good co0nsideing he beat the snot out of them for a good long time.
I could buy a couple new top shelf drivers and yes they would probably last the rest of my career, give them to a 20 yr old working on junk or some oilfield hands and see if the difference is worth it.

 

[ssdave]

Screwdrivers are only consumable if they're used incorrectly, in the wrong fastener, or the wrong tool for the job. I still have screwdrivers that have seen daily use that I've had for 25 years.

I also have a bunch of broken ones I've used for jobs other than driving screws

You must be one of the most careful users of tools there is, or only work on non-stuck fasteners. I've plain worn out many #2 phillips in the last 25 years, and I'm not counting cheap craftsman or stanley ones that only last one or a few uses. I break very few screwdrivers, although I have broken maybe 10 to 20 small flat screwdrivers; I work on guns a lot, that's just what happens sometimes. Same with small torx; I go through a lot of them.

Plain and simple, screwdrivers wear out and are consumables, even if they're just used for driving screws. Cheap ones are consumed much faster than better ones, in my experience. When I stopped using the cheap Craftsman ones about 15 years ago, they had gotten to the point that the #2 phillips often deformed and were useless on the first use. They would round out, but I could go to the box and get a Snap-on or SK or Proto or old VA and take out the same fastener without a problem. I have a few Craftsman pro with the black handles that I got on warranty, and they've held up better, although they are wearing out also. I have a huge Craftsman flat driver that has done exemplary service as a paint stirring stick. I've been using it for that for about 20 years, and it's still performing perfectly for that. I also use it for prying off the lid.

I turn in my Snap-on phillips periodically for warranty replacement of the shafts, to me it's worth it to own them for the warranty, but more importantly because they wear longer. I have one in my electricians tool belt that has been used steadily since 1989, it is finally getting worn enough it will have to be warranted soon. I regrind my flat snap-on and re-square them periodically so they perform better, eventually I have to turn them in on warranty when there's not enough meat left to keep re-tipping them.

I use the cheap ones for tent stakes; they're great for that, work a lot better than the bent wires that come with the tents. Easy to hammer in, and easier to remove.

I use flat screwdrivers all the time for opening paint cans and doing minor pry jobs. I can't recall ever breaking one doing that, it's the least demanding of the uses for them. But then again, I use a thick wide one, not a small delicate one. Where they break is when I have a rusted fastener, one that is loc-tited in, steel in aluminum, or a large fastener in hard wood. They start getting a little twisted, and after a few times of that, they crack and one side breaks off. Time to re-grind.

 

[Finky198]

"When did screwdrivers become consumable?"

When the idiot before you didn't replace the f'd up fastener that he messed up.

BTW, that's what hand impact drivers are for. I think this is the main reason my screwdrivers last as long as they do, I've used hand impacts on stuck or screwed up fasteners since I was taught to use tools many many years ago. This and the fact that I replace f'd up fasteners...

This a 1000% the only things I will add is if a screw is really corroded, I'll hit it with a wire brush to hopefully get a better grip.. or use some grip compound ( Comet/water works well )

I'm in the same crowd I haven't bought a screwdriver in 5 years... most of mine are Snap-on ratcheting, with a few older hard handles and the last few being Wiha and CM...

( I've wrecked a few bits on my drill tho)

its about USE not ABUSE

 

[walrus]

My argument isn't that they are not good but that its perceived as free when it isn't. The shaft must be consumable or you wouldn't be replacing it? So, we paid lots to save a handle at some point in the future and are still replacing the business end?

If my hard handles were consumable, I wouldn't have them after 25 years of constant use. I see sand paper as consumable, I see grinding wheels as consumable, I see impact bits as consumable but I don't see Snap On screw drivers as consumable. I get a new tip and away they go again. I also don't believe a blade is of much use without a handle. Is a ratcheting screw driver consumable?, I guess so in your shop, bit breaks or gets worn out, throw the ratcheting screwdriver in the trash.?

 

[bcradio]

If my hard handles were consumable, I wouldn't have them after 25 years of constant use. I see sand paper as consumable, I see grinding wheels as consumable, I see impact bits as consumable but I don't see Snap On screw drivers as consumable. I get a new tip and away they go again. I also don't believe a blade is of much use without a handle. Is a ratcheting screw driver consumable?, I guess so in your shop, bit breaks or gets worn out, throw the whole thing in the trash.

Thats what I do

 

[walrus]

Thats what I do

I reworded that, might not have been clear

 

[Gmonkee]

I have used just about every style and make of screwdriver offered in the Americas. The one I seek to use is an import 2 in one.

It shows wear but has lasted years without wearing out. It adjusts in length also making it well suited to my work.

But one day I will wear it out and unceremoniously scrap it. Then I'll put the spare already purchased into use.

Disposable, yes. But not before I make far more than the three bucks I paid for it by using it.

HF freebies litter my house as do half the US homes. For casual tool users they are more than fine. If you feel only ( your brand here ) will do and the rest are useless junk then use them.

 

[DenisG]

Most screwdrivers are indigestible.

 

[T45]

don't forget you can get some of the best ph2 tips available for ~$3 dollars each. The zephyr/apez/snap on ACR type tips are pretty modest in cost.

Likewise the PB Swiss JIS/DIN hybrid tip is very good, and provided you can find a way to deal with the shipping costs, the unit pricing is very reasonable.

It might not be a bad idea to keep one or two of those around even if you like to use and abuse $1-2 dollar scewdrivers like they are going out of style. In the event you need to actually have a more precise tip for something they can be invaluable.

Mainly for not messing up hardware that would be a PITA to replace or deal with.

As with many nice tools its usually the cost of damaging the workpiece that makes the cost of the tools itself come into a sharper relief.

throwaway hardware probably goes fine with throway drivers, tho.

 

[lbhsbz]

You must be one of the most careful users of tools there is, or only work on non-stuck fasteners. I've plain worn out many #2 phillips in the last 25 years, and I'm not counting cheap craftsman or stanley ones that only last one or a few uses. I break very few screwdrivers, although I have broken maybe 10 to 20 small flat screwdrivers; I work on guns a lot, that's just what happens sometimes. Same with small torx; I go through a lot of them.



Plain and simple, screwdrivers wear out and are consumables, even if they're just used for driving screws. Cheap ones are consumed much faster than better ones, in my experience. When I stopped using the cheap Craftsman ones about 15 years ago, they had gotten to the point that the #2 phillips often deformed and were useless on the first use. They would round out, but I could go to the box and get a Snap-on or SK or Proto or old VA and take out the same fastener without a problem. I have a few Craftsman pro with the black handles that I got on warranty, and they've held up better, although they are wearing out also. I have a huge Craftsman flat driver that has done exemplary service as a paint stirring stick. I've been using it for that for about 20 years, and it's still performing perfectly for that. I also use it for prying off the lid.



I turn in my Snap-on phillips periodically for warranty replacement of the shafts, to me it's worth it to own them for the warranty, but more importantly because they wear longer. I have one in my electricians tool belt that has been used steadily since 1989, it is finally getting worn enough it will have to be warranted soon. I regrind my flat snap-on and re-square them periodically so they perform better, eventually I have to turn them in on warranty when there's not enough meat left to keep re-tipping them.



I use the cheap ones for tent stakes; they're great for that, work a lot better than the bent wires that come with the tents. Easy to hammer in, and easier to remove.



I use flat screwdrivers all the time for opening paint cans and doing minor pry jobs. I can't recall ever breaking one doing that, it's the least demanding of the uses for them. But then again, I use a thick wide one, not a small delicate one. Where they break is when I have a rusted fastener, one that is loc-tited in, steel in aluminum, or a large fastener in hard wood. They start getting a little twisted, and after a few times of that, they crack and one side breaks off. Time to re-grind.

Far from it. I use an impact screwdriver (btw...I've used a lot of brands, and snap-on is best here) whenever possible to break things free....not because I care about saving my tools, but because I'm going for the most painless way to get the damn screw out.

 

[R.Anderson]

If my hard handles were consumable, I wouldn't have them after 25 years of constant use. I see sand paper as consumable, I see grinding wheels as consumable, I see impact bits as consumable but I don't see Snap On screw drivers as consumable. I get a new tip and away they go again. I also don't believe a blade is of much use without a handle. Is a ratcheting screw driver consumable?, I guess so in your shop, bit breaks or gets worn out, throw the ratcheting screwdriver in the trash.?

Replacing the shaft repeatedly over 25 years does that not mean the shaft is a consumable?

 

[Gmonkee]

This. You in fact have a new screwdriver with an old handle. The human half is old but the more important working end is new.

Replacing tips on a bit driver the tips are in fact a consumable.

I have a few old wood handled screwdrivers that are shop decor because fixing them would ruin the history of owners past. And I really do not need them.

 

[leg17]

Some have replied, and I agree, that screwdrivers are tools.
Tools are for working.
The more you use em', the sooner you will eventually use em' up.

If your tools are collectibles, or for occasional use, they will last a lot longer.

And, tools get used by all sorts of people for all sorts of things.
Remember, EVERY tool is a hammer eventually.

BTW, I both use and collect so I get both sides.

 

[Know Wosad]

If a screwdriver isn't a disposable item, then what do you do with it if you break off the tip?

Repeatedly inquire as to COO and direct blame accordingly

 

[walrus]

Replacing the shaft repeatedly over 25 years does that not mean the shaft is a consumable?

Yes, the shaft is, the handle isn't to me. I have an Ideal multibit driver in my bag. I broke a bit the other day, did I throw the multibit driver away? According to this thread I should have but I didn't. I bought a new bit.

 

[Olafur]

Most screwdrivers are indigestible.

 

[R.Anderson]

Yes, the shaft is, the handle isn't to me. I have an Ideal multibit driver in my bag. I broke a bit the other day, did I throw the multibit driver away? According to this thread I should have but I didn't. I bought a new bit.

I agree, replace the bit but that is not what the thread is really about. Down to the nitty gritty it's about the working end of the screw driver not no freakin plastic handle. Your snap-on screw drivers are in fact consumable then, well 50% of em anyway. Ignorance is bliss believing your screw drivers are not consumable.

 

[T45]

disposable v consumable