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Who uses US steel?

neophyte

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KUMZ in Russia does make aluminum products that comply with aerospace specifications. That said, I've never seen plate/sheet from them in the wild.
i got some russian 6061 from a online metal store. first time ive encountered something like this.
The Russians supposedly came up with the Scandium aluminum alloys that have the strength of steel or close to it for use in aerospace applications(a bit of an oversimplification).
This is the type of alloy Smith & Wesson are now using for their ultra lite weight “Scandium” revolvers, which supposedly have the durability of a steel frame revolver, but the weight of aluminum. I have no clue whether Russian made aluminum alloys would be similar quality, but Russia still has an aerospace industry so possibly.
 
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Kscardsfan

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The Russians supposedly came up with the Scandium aluminum alloys that have the strength of steel or close to it for use in aerospace applications(a bit of an oversimplification).
This is the type of alloy Smith & Wesson are now using for their ultra lite weight “Scandium” revolvers, which supposedly have the durability of a steel frame revolver, but the weight of aluminum. I have no clue whether Russian made aluminum alloys would be similar quality, but Russia still has an aerospace industry so possibly.
I’ve got a scandium framed 1911 from smith and it’s been good to me. But it doesn’t have a ton of rounds out of it either. Nice carry gun though.
 

MWEric

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It’s more about looking out for our neighbors. A country that can’t make it’s own stuff is not a good thing. Offshoring production has not resulted in drastically lower prices. It’s just lined the pockets of the executives.

James
Unfortunately James I bet not half of us here on this forum care about the US manufacturing sector. The ones who don’t care that we are becoming mostly a service economy could care less that service jobs don’t pay and that manufacturing jobs pay very well. The United in USA is disappearing at an alarming pace.
 

MWEric

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As the smart folks say: "US Steel" isn't a thing. Steel is an alloy. You can make the same alloy in the US or China. China currently has one of the fastest growing infrastructures anywhere in the world. They're not doing that with Harbor Freight tools.

-Ryan
We are all super proud of China. And Harbor Freight.
 

qqzj

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From the root for the home team point of view I understand the question. From the scientific point of view anybody that has the technology to build a steel mill anywhere in the world knows how to make whatever grade of steel you're willing to pay for. It's not the secret formula for Cola-Cola. TOPTUL for example gets their steel from Kobe Steel in Japan. When I worked in the semiconductor industry we bought our 316L stainless steel piping for our UHP gases from Kobe Steel as they had the best electropolishing technology and surface finish. There is likely at least 1,000 miles of this tubing in Intel's factories in Chandler, AZ.

I guess just hearing Kobe gives you a warm fuzzy feeling even though it is not a USA company and has been cheating for five decades, gee, that is 50 years. The power of bias, speechless

Kobe Steel admits data fraud went on nearly five decades, CEO to quit​

 

gearhead1

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This is not in direct answer to the OP, but steel related. My last employer made engines and had flywheels sourced from India. One shipment was held at customs at the port because it tripped the radioactive sensors. The material in the flywheels had some radioactive material! They sent it back.

Friend of mine was involved in certifying suppliers. He had been overseas a few times and said he’d much rather work with suppliers from China than India. He said if you tell the Chinese what you want and show them how to do it, they will. If you tell an Indian supplier what you want, they say ok no problem and just do what they want anyway.

Where I work now, we make ASME compliant pressure vessels, and some of the steel fittings come from India. The material has the chemical composition sheets, which we verify the material composition meats the material spec.

Other countries can make good quality products. I am in the camp that I’d rather support an American company first so at least more of the money stays here. No offense to the individuals in other places or their culture whatsoever, but my friends, family, and I don’t live there.
 

dnschmidt

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I guess just hearing Kobe gives you a warm fuzzy feeling even though it is not a USA company and has been cheating for five decades, gee, that is 50 years. The power of bias, speechless

Kobe Steel admits data fraud went on nearly five decades, CEO to quit​

I'm an engineer, we don't have warm and fuzzy feelings. In fact we try to avoid feelings period. All major semiconductor players (in particular Intel) test the living **** out of whatever 316L products they are using for their UHP gas distribution systems. Nobody gives a **** what was on Kobe's or anybody else's spec sheet as the material was going to be sent to an independent testing laboratory for verification before acceptance. Every roll was tested as the semiconductor industry learned a lesson when Siemens had a silane leak and blew up a building in Germany. Perhaps because Kobe knew this upfront they never tried to send sub-standard product to the SEMATECH member companies. Other industries that were not so diligent who knows what they did? Believe me, if there was a USA supplier that was as good at making 316L stainless steel piping as Kobe, SEMATECH, being a US government funded organization, would have used it. Kobe won the competition fair and square. What do you want me to tell you?
 
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finn

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I'm an engineer, we don't have warm and fuzzy feelings. In fact we try to avoid feelings period. All major semiconductor players (in particular Intel) test the living **** out of whatever 316L products they are using for their UHP gas distribution systems. Nobody gives a **** what was on Kobe's or anybody else's spec sheet as the material was going to be sent to an independent testing laboratory for verification before acceptance. Every roll was tested as the semiconductor industry learned a lesson when Siemens had a silane leak and blew up a building in Germany. Perhaps because Kobe knew this upfront they never tried to send sub-standard product to the SEMATECH member companies. Other industries that were not so diligent who knows what they did? Believe me, if there was a USA supplier that was as good at making 316L stainless steel piping as Kobe, SEMATECH, being a US government funded organization, would have used it. Kobe won the competition fair and square. What do you want me to tell you?
Not sure how the semiconductor industry does it, but I haven’t seen a production facility that does “100% inspection of incoming materials “ in the last forty years.

At best, there would be an initial qualification during the development and pre production phases, then some relatively superficial spot checks thereafter.

The material vendor, in this case Kobe, would develop a quality program that includes in process controls and documentation.

Sounds like Kobe was cheating on this quality program and falsifying records as a matter of course. From what I recall, that cost them a lot of money in the end.

100% inspection is 50% effective. It’s the in process controls, and documentation that insure quality, not final inspection at the end user.

In this case, you are, in fact running on your feelings, and not on the facts, as determined in a courtroom.

I don’t have a dog in this fight. In fact, I vaguely remember Kobe being a crankshaft forging supplier of ours about twenty five years ago, and don’t remember any issues with them.
 

qqzj

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I'm an engineer, we don't have warm and fuzzy feelings. In fact we try to avoid feelings period. All major semiconductor players (in particular Intel) test the living **** out of whatever 316L products they are using for their UHP gas distribution systems. Nobody gives a **** what was on Kobe's or anybody else's spec sheet as the material was going to be sent to an independent testing laboratory for verification before acceptance. Every roll was tested as the semiconductor industry learned a lesson when Siemens had a silane leak and blew up a building in Germany. Perhaps because Kobe knew this upfront they never tried to send sub-standard product to the SEMATECH member companies. Other industries that were not so diligent who knows what they did? Believe me, if there was a USA supplier that was as good at making 316L stainless steel piping as Kobe, SEMATECH, being a US government funded organization, would have used it. Kobe won the competition fair and square. What do you want me to tell you?
You don't have to tell me anything else. Reuters reported Kobe Steel cheated 50 years and CEO quit vs an internet forum member willing to vouch for Kobe. I can pick the evidence I want to trust. Maybe Kobe should have invited a guy from Sematech to court and convince the jury or judge that Kobe's product quality is not impacted by the cheating.
 

zendriver

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We are all super proud of China. And Harbor Freight.
Contrary to popular belief, trade with China is not a zero sum game.

Imported materials and products improve a company's bottom line and puts more money in the pockets of consumers, who work for **** wages, these days.

Farmers don't want to admit it, but they have a pretty large export market to China.
 

neophyte

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I guess just hearing Kobe gives you a warm fuzzy feeling even though it is not a USA company and has been cheating for five decades, gee, that is 50 years. The power of bias, speechless

Kobe Steel admits data fraud went on nearly five decades, CEO to quit​

Yet Kobe according to other members here is a top notch steel producer.
Also, from what I recall from reading the news story a while ago, people in the US government knew that Kobe wasn’t using the proper specs for the steel, yet ignored it.
This makes me wonder how crappy the steel from a number of other not top notch steel producers actually is and was, if Kobe, a top quality steel producer, was Bulls1ting their specs.
 

dstblj52

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Yet Kobe according to other members here is a top notch steel producer.
Also, from what I recall from reading the news story a while ago, people in the US government knew that Kobe wasn’t using the proper specs for the steel, yet ignored it.
This makes me wonder how crappy the steel from a number of other not top notch steel producers actually is and was, if Kobe, a top quality steel producer, was Bulls1ting their specs.
highly variable there is a reason safety margins have been pushed from 1.4 to 2.2 over the last couple of decades
 

dnschmidt

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When a new semiconductor factory cost $5B dollars (which is a conservative estimate of what TSMC's new Phoenix factory is going to cost located about 10 miles from my home) you better believe that the critical components such as the gas distribution system will be tested to hell and back. Each extreme UV ASML stepper cost $175M and ASML can only produce 30 of these each year. If there were an HCl gas leak in the photo area of this factory it would destroy the optics of these steppers of which there will be 20 in this factory. No other industry tests as much as the semiconductor industry because nobody else has a much to lose. The factory I worked in, STMicroelectronics PF-1, was down for three weeks due to a leak in our exhaust system that caused a boron contamination issue that caused zero yield on five weeks of production. The total loss was $100 million dollars. At those stakes you don't take chances. We loved our suppliers but we had a plethora of outside testing facilities test our incoming materials on a routine basis. Not every shipment but at least four times a year.
 

finn

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When a new semiconductor factory cost $5B dollars (which is a conservative estimate of what TSMC's new Phoenix factory is going to cost located about 10 miles from my home) you better believe that the critical components such as the gas distribution system will be tested to hell and back. Each extreme UV ASML stepper cost $175M and ASML can only produce 30 of these each year. If there were an HCl gas leak in the photo area of this factory it would destroy the optics of these steppers of which there will be 20 in this factory. No other industry tests as much as the semiconductor industry because nobody else has a much to lose. The factory I worked in, STMicroelectronics PF-1, was down for three weeks due to a leak in our exhaust system that caused a boron contamination issue that caused zero yield on five weeks of production. The total loss was $100 million dollars. At those stakes you don't take chances. We loved our suppliers but we had a plethora of outside testing facilities test our incoming materials on a routine basis. Not every shipment but at least four times a year.
Nice, but not very relevant to the homeowner tool discussiothis thread is all about, nor is it relevant to 99.9% of commercial industrial processes.

It’s an outlier.

Again, process control is what yields quality, not feel good receiving inspection.
 
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dnschmidt

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Agreed, I have no stock in Kobe Steel. I neither love nor hate Kobe Steel. All I know is that when they wanted to they did have the technical capability of making the best 316L electropolished SS tubing in the world. Their business ethics and whether they screwed their other customers wasn't my issue.
 

zendriver

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As a follow-up to my OP, I have received no reply from Proto regarding their steel sourcing.
Most Companies these days are getting pretty good, at avoiding a trap, which will just get them nothing but bad publicity.

Even if they replied their steel is 100% certified American made, would anyone really care, at least enough to rush out and buy more of their products, which is why they are in business in the first place.?

Of course not.
 

dstblj52

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Most Companies these days are getting pretty good, at avoiding a trap, which will just get them nothing but bad publicity.

Even if they replied their steel is 100% certified American made, would anyone really care, at least enough to rush out and buy more of their products, which is why they are in business in the first place.?

Of course not.
besides if they say that today and next year they get either a shipment of recycled or foreign steel because thats whats available everyone will get mad at them
 
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