Whole House Generator ?

[bcoke]

Looking for input or experience with brands of whole house generators , please tell me the good,the bad , the ugly............and is there a problem with the penny being @ 100 feet from the electrical service entering the house.....I figure it's just wire to the transfer switch am I correct? thanks bobbycoke

 

[kd3pc]

the brand is not nearly as important as how close the repair shop/parts/service location is to you and what your fuel will be.

Adequate wire size and proper installation should work at that distance.

bests

 

[soj]

I have a Kohler 14KW and am pleased with it. I have only had one problem, and it was corrected with a software update.

Mine is located right outside the service entrance area, but remote location just means use the proper wire size for the load/distance.

I installed it myself, details in this thread.

Sorry for the lack of pictures, you can thank Photobucket for that.
jp

 

[kelving884]

Not to be rude, (I know people who say that are usually rude! LOL) but if you don't know electricity or generators you'd be money ahead to pay someone to figure it out for you.

Will the generator run full time, part time, or just as an emergency generator?
How large is the load going to be? How much of that load is inductive vs. resistive, (motors starting, motors running, lights, heaters, etc.)
If it's an emergency generator, how much of your household load do you really need to power? Does it need to be auto connect vs. manual?

For example, I live remote and off the grid. I have a low rpm diesel high end generator. Auto start, auto connect. Expensive and will last for years.

I have friends who just want to have some heat if its winter and keep the food in their fridge, freezers safe. I've helped them wire their furnace so it plugs into the wall. Had them buy a good, (but relatively cheap) small high rpm gas generator. A little 2kW honda generator to be exact. Weighs about 50 lbs. Told them to keep it in the house where its warm. When the power goes out start it up, pack it outside and run a extension cord into the house. And plug in the furnace, freezers, etc. as needed. No big, expensive generator sets, transfer switches, or wiring job.

And I haven't even touched on electrical code issues. Or the trouble it could cause you if the install isn't code compliant and something happens.

And in my opinion brand is critically important. What good is a generator if it's hard to start? Doesn't like starting when its cold? Load regulation is **** so when a motor starts your electronics go ****?

Hire someone you trust and let them figure it out.

 

[ard]

Not to be rude, (I know people who say that are usually rude! LOL) but if you don't know electricity or generators you'd be money ahead to pay someone to figure it out for you.

Will the generator run full time, part time, or just as an emergency generator?
How large is the load going to be? How much of that load is inductive vs. resistive, (motors starting, motors running, lights, heaters, etc.)
If it's an emergency generator, how much of your household load do you really need to power? Does it need to be auto connect vs. manual?

For example, I live remote and off the grid. I have a low rpm diesel high end generator. Auto start, auto connect. Expensive and will last for years.

I have friends who just want to have some heat if its winter and keep the food in their fridge, freezers safe. I've helped them wire their furnace so it plugs into the wall. Had them buy a good, (but relatively cheap) small high rpm gas generator. A little 2kW honda generator to be exact. Weighs about 50 lbs. Told them to keep it in the house where its warm. When the power goes out start it up, pack it outside and run a extension cord into the house. And plug in the furnace, freezers, etc. as needed. No big, expensive generator sets, transfer switches, or wiring job.

And I haven't even touched on electrical code issues. Or the trouble it could cause you if the install isn't code compliant and something happens.

And in my opinion brand is critically important. What good is a generator if it's hard to start? Doesn't like starting when its cold? Load regulation is **** so when a motor starts your electronics go ****?

Hire someone you trust and let them figure it out.

Silly (bad) advice.

How is OP supposed to "hire someone" unless he educates himself on the scope of his project, pros/cons, possible issues, etc etc???

OP is doing PRECISELY what one should do prior to 'hiring someone'.

Give advise- don't seek to puff up your ego by putting him down with how much you know about this issue.

And you were precisely right about one thing: it was rude

 

[mike93lx]

How much power do you need? Does it need to be automatic?

I'll second the opinion that local service is most important. When another hurrican irene comes through, you want spare parts and repair as available as possible.

What fuel? Hopefully natural gas, but if not, make sure you can have enough fuel on site for an extended outage.

 

[6768rogues]

Not to be rude, (I know people who say that are usually rude! LOL) but if you don't know electricity or generators you'd be money ahead to pay someone to figure it out for you.

Will the generator run full time, part time, or just as an emergency generator?
How large is the load going to be? How much of that load is inductive vs. resistive, (motors starting, motors running, lights, heaters, etc.)
If it's an emergency generator, how much of your household load do you really need to power? Does it need to be auto connect vs. manual?

For example, I live remote and off the grid. I have a low rpm diesel high end generator. Auto start, auto connect. Expensive and will last for years.

I have friends who just want to have some heat if its winter and keep the food in their fridge, freezers safe. I've helped them wire their furnace so it plugs into the wall. Had them buy a good, (but relatively cheap) small high rpm gas generator. A little 2kW honda generator to be exact. Weighs about 50 lbs. Told them to keep it in the house where its warm. When the power goes out start it up, pack it outside and run a extension cord into the house. And plug in the furnace, freezers, etc. as needed. No big, expensive generator sets, transfer switches, or wiring job.

And I haven't even touched on electrical code issues. Or the trouble it could cause you if the install isn't code compliant and something happens.

And in my opinion brand is critically important. What good is a generator if it's hard to start? Doesn't like starting when its cold? Load regulation is **** so when a motor starts your electronics go ****?

Hire someone you trust and let them figure it out.

In our state the central heating system has to be hard wired and it is a violation of the code to have it plug in.
I do not keep gas powered equipment in my dwelling. I would rather heat an outbuilding than keep a gas powered generator in my house.

 

[kelving884]

In our state the central heating system has to be hard wired and it is a violation of the code to have it plug in.
I do not keep gas powered equipment in my dwelling. I would rather heat an outbuilding than keep a gas powered generator in my house.

My point exactly. In my state its ok. But if done in your state and something happened, oh boy! Insurance out the window, fines, maybe lawsuits.

I told them to keep it in their garage. If done to building code it's designed to hold "gas powered equipment". [emoji38]

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[kelving884]

Silly (bad) advice.

How is OP supposed to "hire someone" unless he educates himself on the scope of his project, pros/cons, possible issues, etc etc???

OP is doing PRECISELY what one should do prior to 'hiring someone'.

Give advise- don't seek to puff up your ego by putting him down with how much you know about this issue.

And you were precisely right about one thing: it was rude

How about talking to people IN HIS AREA that have hired electricians? Seems like a no brainer to me. As correctly pointed out, what is code compliant where I live isn't code compliant everywhere.

You know, I've been sitting debating with myself about pointing out what a dumb *** your are for berating me for doing exactly what you said should be done. Giving him highlights on the info that should be considered when finding someone to hire.

Anyway feel free to tell us how wrong I am and how great you are. I won't be responding or reading these posts anymore.

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[Hot Rod Grampa]

The big gorilla in the room is generac. There are better options but first you need to determine load and then go looking at units. Generators need to be run regularly to be effective when you need it. Since you are in Vermont it will get cold and keeping it in your house is not a good idea. They make battery heaters and oil pan heaters to help keep your unit ready to go even cold. Automatic transfer switches can be the best solution but only you can determine your budget and your skill level. A 6000 watt generator will run most homes assuming no electric heat, range or water heater. Also important if only you will be starting and connecting unit. Lots of information available from gen set makers. Just thinking out loud.

 

[Bretny]

The whole house generators are really not much more than a lawnmower motor in a fancy case with an auto start kit.
If you dont need it to auto start dont get a auto start.
I see your in VT. Do you heat with heating oil? Even if you dont i suggest a MEP802 or mep803 military diesel unit. They sell an autostart kit for these generators for $350.
The transfer switch and wireing is almost all the same for what ever gen in the same amp range.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Here are the details on my whole house generator (link) installed in Dec. 2011 complete with pricing. No complaints, no issues and I would do it again the exact same way today.

 

[malibu101]

In our state the central heating system has to be hard wired and it is a violation of the code to have it plug in.
I do not keep gas powered equipment in my dwelling. I would rather heat an outbuilding than keep a gas powered generator in my house.

True, but one of these makes it safe, simple, and easy to just run a cord in from a generator.


http://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...hEBF2L8h0K-u7C39Cx1FttUjsmZMr6OhoCVG4QAvD_BwE

 

[TractorJeff]

Sometimes you have to think about the Wife and your teenage daughter.
Can they start it? Plug it in? Turn off the correct breakers, substituting for the Generator?
In my house they can't or won't. We don't worry but if the power was going to be off for an extended period, then maybe I would get home or the neighbor would be able to come over.
Sometimes Auto-Start/Transfer is a GOOD Idea!

 

[bcoke]

Wow it took until post 10 to start answering the questions I had......I did not state that this would be a DIY job.......I will have a licensed electrician do the install......I will have a licensed plumber run the propane feed.......I live in the country 2nd house from the lines end so always last to receive power after an outage.......I have a genteck switch in one building I own 2 portable generators ......need the peace of mind that we will have power even if not home we lose power quite often but only for afew hours and have had 3-6-5 day outages in the last 6 years therefor the need of an automatic whole house generator thus the question as part of my research ..........of course I can and have hot wired things with portable genny making sure the grid connection was disconnected...I have run furnaces with 12 volt battery what i am asking is advice about BRANDS of whole house generators and any experiences...thank those who read and understood my question.......bobbycoke

 

[Texsun]

I have a 40kW Generac that runs off a 500gal propane tank, good for about 2 weeks if needed. It's sized to run everything, uses an automatic transfer switch - so will take over during the night, the middle of a shower or when we're gone. It was installed in '02 and has only needed an engine control module replaced as well as tune-ups/oil changes. Would buy one again.

 

[davidlee]

I have a 23kw Armstrong generator. It has a Lister Petter diesel engine. It will power my whole house. I do not have an ATS, I just shut off my main breaker and turn on the gen breaker once its up and running.
On full load it burns about one gal per hour. Mine is for mainly hurricane use so when something is brewing i will have 150 gals of fuel ready but most of the time I only keep about 25 gals in the belly tank for thunder storms and exercise.
I bought it in 1999 and have not had any problems at all.
As some have said, figure out you necessary load then pick a size and a fuel that will work for you. Good luck.
They are like insurance, they are a waste of money till you need it then they are worth every penny.

 

[yeldogt]

Just did a lot of research on this ...Cummins just came out with a new line of generators. Bought the 20kw propane unit for my new weekend place in the county. Cummins sells that model as a kit that comes with the transfer switch. Also, bought the remote control, concrete pad (it has mounting points for the unit) and the auto load shedding kit. It was around $5500 delivered.

The 20kw unit will start a 5 ton AC. I was originally going to go with a 14k unit with more load shedding -- but the new Cummings 20kw unit was about the same fuel use as the 14kw. I don't have natural gas -- so fuel use is important. When we get ice storms -- the propane trucks can't deliver .... we lost power for a few days last year and many people could not get deliveries and ran out. All the appliances in the new house will be propane .. my studio also.

The transfer switch goes between the meter and the load center -- be advised ... the transfer switches are big. The load shedding kits are two 50 amp relays that are spliced into a big amp user that you may not be able to run if everything is on ... say a dryer.

I'm going to shed the second AC unit .. and my studio AC unit. Mine is about 125' from the house -- it's close to the buried 1k propane tank. We ran three conduits -- one is 2.5 for the cables back to the house .. the other two are for the low volt wires and the 110 feed. I think they are both 1". I was confused at the time about how it was connected -- some areas only allow the main feed wires in a single cable others allow the 110v wires to share with the main .. still anthers allow everything in one. Generac makes a cable you can buy with all the wires in one jacket -- but many areas don't allow this type of hook up .. mine will not.

The cummins unit is quiet and has an innovative test cycle that uses the engines starter motor to test the unit vs starting the motor -- it can eliminate about 1/2 the hot test cycles where the engines actually starts ... this conserves propane. I also liked how it all connected up and communicated with the remote -- the load shedding kit is straight forward in hookup and operation. When the generator starts -- the unit drops the loads -- after running for a while it brings them on one at a time if within the units capacity. The unit will drop them one at a time should the load on the unit increase to 90%. I also found out that unlike many units .. the cummins does not require a heater until it get to 0 degrees .... not very often in my area.

 

[George in Rancho Cordova]

My folks put in a Briggs & Stratton 12KW unit. It has worked flawlessly.
Being a retired tech, I did the maintenance.
The air filter and spark plugs still look like new, but there are spares on hand.
Same with synthetic oil, but it gets changed about once a year anyway.

When I mention maintenance to the neighbors with units installed at the same time, the responses are "huh"?

With both parents disabled, it was important that it power their AC. It does so easily.
During a 4 day summer outage, I went there and shut it down for a couple hours to give it a rest, and check the oil.

One annoyance:
The service entrance is on the detached garage. They didn't identify the circuits on the new sub panel for the garage.

 

[My Old Tools]

I have a 40kW Generac that runs off a 500gal propane tank, good for about 2 weeks if needed. It's sized to run everything, uses an automatic transfer switch - so will take over during the night, the middle of a shower or when we're gone. It was installed in '02 and has only needed an engine control module replaced as well as tune-ups/oil changes. Would buy one again.

I have a 35 kw Genrac on a 750 gallon propane tank. It does an auto self test for 10 minutes every week. It is auto start and auto switch. I had it checked out when I had the house inspected at purchase.

 

[nick2010tundra]

I have a Generac whole home. Thing I haven't seen mention is quality of power. A whole home or a good invertor generator is safe to use with sensitive electronics. The cheaper generators will ruin computers and most compressors and motors over time ( Fridge and fans on gas furnace)
I live in Canada so I see cold weather, my generac has never failed me in 4 years now, It ran for 8 days straight on propane with zero issues.
Hope this helps, feel free to ask away.

Also remember the transfer switch depends on if the generator is grounded neutral or floating neutral, please consult your electrical inspector to gurantee correct installation

 

[Bretny]

If your going to consider propane i highy recomend you look ay there burn rate. They are quite high and a 500gal propane tank is not cheap..neither is 500gal of propane.
You will notice that one person said they have a diesel lister petter thats 23kw and burns 1gal hr at full load. Thats what a 7kw propane unit will burn at 50* load. Thats a huge difference for alot less power.
I have a 5kw lister petter military unit. It burns .5 gal hr max. How i run my house it uses .26gal hr, a 55gal drum of diesel will last about 9 days if i never shut it down. One thing to remember is if you dont have fuel you dont have a generator. Many people with out power could mean the propanr delivery guys are over loaded.

 

[bob15]

If your going to consider propane i highy recomend you look ay there burn rate. They are quite high and a 500gal propane tank is not cheap..neither is 500gal of propane.
You will notice that one person said they have a diesel lister petter thats 23kw and burns 1gal hr at full load. Thats what a 7kw propane unit will burn at 50* load. Thats a huge difference for alot less power.
I have a 5kw lister petter military unit. It burns .5 gal hr max. How i run my house it uses .26gal hr, a 55gal drum of diesel will last about 9 days if i never shut it down. One thing to remember is if you dont have fuel you dont have a generator. Many people with out power could mean the propanr delivery guys are over loaded.

One major problem with #2 fuel, it will go bad if untreated. It will also gel up in the wintertime if untreated. Propane doesn't go bad.

Your delivery points are no different for # 2 fuel. Not all gas stations have diesel and a delivery truck might not make it to your place when you need them either.

You also need to figure how long you really think you will be out of power. I have been out of power for over 11 days straight once, but that was the exception, not the norm. Usually we are out of power for a day max, but typically only a few hours.

 

[Bretny]

Your right #2 can go bad. But it takes many years. Treating diesel can do both keep it fresh and from geling. Im a former diesel tech.
My generator fuel is stored in the form of my 275gal heating oil tank. So getting it just means a walk to the basement.
Propane does have an advantage, shelf life really being the only one. Propane tanks need to be recertified every 12yrs. The generators burn as much propane as gas. the fuel can be expensive and its highly explosive. the tanks can freeze if you pull to many BTU/hr even in warm weather. Propane also dosnt like to leave the tank if its below freezing. So in a way o guess propane can gel up also.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Isn't lister petter essentially out of business? Plus it's really difficult to compare price of propane with diesel. I paid $1.50/gal. for propane last season and I'm pretty sure diesel was around $2.60/gal.

 

[Bretny]

Isn't lister petter essentially out of business? Plus it's really difficult to compare price of propane with diesel. I paid $1.50/gal. for propane last season and I'm pretty sure diesel was around $2.60/gal.

I think onan bought them if i remember. So its a cummins business. You really cant compair gal for gal. Needs to be gal/hr vs gal/hr.

 

[yeldogt]

Fuel use is a concern with anything other than NG -- my 20kw propane is rated just under 2lb per hour at 50% and a bit over 3lb at full output.

The concern is always a winter ice storm. That's when we get the longest outages .. coupled with delivery problems or even shortages of propane. While you may not be needing full output from the generator -- the propane is also being used for heat.

..... And ..... outages never occur when the tank is full.

 

[Platonic Solid]

I think onan bought them if i remember. So its a cummins business. You really cant compair gal for gal. Needs to be gal/hr vs gal/hr.

Actually: gal/hr * $/gal vs gal/hr * $/gal

Fuel use is a concern with anything other than NG -- my 20kw propane is rated just under 2lb per hour at 50% and a bit over 3lb at full output.

Mine is rated the same, but my actual usage is 30 Gal per day.

The concern is always a winter ice storm. That's when we get the longest outages .. coupled with delivery problems or even shortages of propane. While you may not be needing full output from the generator -- the propane is also being used for heat.

..... And ..... outages never occur when the tank is full.

In an ice storm, no one is going anywhere for anything. The only people who luck out are those who have NG piped to their house. The last "shortage" we had of propane was a manufactured shortage (which really pissed me off). It's not like there wasn't plenty of propane, they chose to sell their stock overseas.

Think I'll just plant a bigass windmill in my yard. That'll solve the problem.

 

[yeldogt]

Actually: gal/hr * $/gal vs gal/hr * $/gal



Mine is rated the same, but my actual usage is 30 Gal per day.

In an ice storm, no one is going anywhere for anything. The only people who luck out are those who have NG piped to their house. The last "shortage" we had of propane was a manufactured shortage (which really pissed me off). It's not like there wasn't plenty of propane, they chose to sell their stock overseas.

Think I'll just plant a bigass windmill in my yard. That'll solve the problem.

With the unit so new I don't have any actual usage -- good to know I may use a bit less. This is a weekend house that is rarely used in the summer -- My main concern is keeping the heat going in the winter ... it's a balancing act. One quickly goes from a 7k unit to keep the essentials on -- to a 30kw unit and a second 1kg tank.

 

[gungatim]

I have a friend whose husband works on generators (diesel mainly) for a living. he does a lot of service on home installs of whole house generators. FWIW, he says anything under $10k is junk. need to spend $15k for a good quality setup that will last. Generac is supposedly entry level and needs lots of work, and warranty work at that (which takes a lot of time to get the company to honor). Cummins is supposedly the best.

take it for what it's worth. personally, I don't need fancy auto start built in setups that put out 20kw...A HF portable 8750 watt for $529 on sale is what I use and it suits me just fine...(I can replace it many times over for what he says the high quality setups cost but that's my choice, lol) I do wish it ran on propane but I may convert it some day.

 

[My Old Tools]

Propane also dosnt like to leave the tank if its below freezing. So in a way o guess propane can gel up also.

Don't know where you get that. Propane is a heating fuel and is routinely used in sub-freezing weather. For many people it is the only heating, cooking, and hot water fuel they have. If it didn't work in freezing weather, it wouldn't be used.

 

[gungatim]

^ ayuh, only way we get heat in winter...

I think what he means is the latent heat of evaporation is much higher than gasoline at 0F. which it is. I'm not even going to try and explain it, but unless the OP plans the generator to start up at -44 degrees F, a properly sized tank will be able to supply the needed volume of vaporized propane...

 

[Bretny]

Don't know where you get that. Propane is a heating fuel and is routinely used in sub-freezing weather. For many people it is the only heating, cooking, and hot water fuel they have. If it didn't work in freezing weather, it wouldn't be used.

I get that from proper research. With a 100lb tank you have half the available btu output at 0* vs 60*. These cylinder vaporization rate charts can be hard to find online. I have one saved for 20lb to 100lb cylinders but dont know how to post it.
This is why your tank freezes up and or you get low output when cold. With a larger tank its less of a problem but the rate at propane vaporizes also depends on the liquid level in the tank. Less propane = less btu ouput available.

 

[bob15]

I get that from proper research. With a 100lb tank you have half the available btu output at 0* vs 60*. These cylinder vaporization rate charts can be hard to find online. I have one saved for 20lb to 100lb cylinders but dont know how to post it.
This is why your tank freezes up and or you get low output when cold. With a larger tank its less of a problem but the rate at propane vaporizes also depends on the liquid level in the tank. Less propane = less btu ouput available.

Propane won't freeze up on a 120, 500 or a 1000 gallon tanks. Gotten as cold as -28°F and had zero issues with my generator or my kitchen stove. Guess you've never cooked outside in the winter with a propane grill before......

You don't run a whole house generator on an RV size tank (100 pound).

 

[bob15]

Your right #2 can go bad. But it takes many years. Treating diesel can do both keep it fresh and from geling. Im a former diesel tech.
My generator fuel is stored in the form of my 275gal heating oil tank. So getting it just means a walk to the basement.
Propane does have an advantage, shelf life really being the only one. Propane tanks need to be recertified every 12yrs. The generators burn as much propane as gas. the fuel can be expensive and its highly explosive. the tanks can freeze if you pull to many BTU/hr even in warm weather. Propane also dosnt like to leave the tank if its below freezing. So in a way o guess propane can gel up also.

Diesel fuel can go bad in less than 30 days, but usually will last around 6 months before issues can start to appear. You will/can have for issues in diesel storage: water in the fuel from condensation or a hole in your tank or fill cap, algae will start forming, gum will start to form, rust and oxidation can occur from different metals reacting to #2 fuel and there is potential for fine sediment to form.

120 gallon and above ASME vessels (tanks) do not require re-certification. Think about it, how are you going to certify a 1000 gallon underground tank? FYI: my 500 gallon LP tank is over 60 years old.....

 

[My Old Tools]

And if you are going to the expense of a whole house generator, put in a dedicated propane tank. That way it will be full when the ice storm or hurricane hits.

 

[mcmlvif100]

Sometimes you have to think about the Wife and your teenage daughter.
Can they start it? Plug it in? Turn off the correct breakers, substituting for the Generator?
In my house they can't or won't. We don't worry but if the power was going to be off for an extended period, then maybe I would get home or the neighbor would be able to come over.
Sometimes Auto-Start/Transfer is a GOOD Idea!

For many of the above reasons, I had a Generac 20 kw whole house, natural gas fed generator and auto transfer switch installed. Am really happy with it. The first time that I was away and the power went out, and my wife texted , I knew that it was a good decision. She never could / would have been able to set up and connect our prior 5500 W portable gas generator. With a well, and a gas water heater, being without electricity for an extended period is no fun.

In a prior post, there was a suggestion to look for a brand with good, local service and support. In our area, Generac is well supported by a local dealer and this made my choice easier. They provided good advice, and were willing to work with me on who performed what parts of the installation. For example, I took delivery of the generator, installed the concrete base and set the generator myself. They did the electrical installation and actual commissioning of the generator. Hope that you can find an option that works for you as well as ours has for us.

 

[mike93lx]

take it for what it's worth. personally, I don't need fancy auto start built in setups that put out 20kw...A HF portable 8750 watt for $529 on sale is what I use and it suits me just fine...(I can replace it many times over for what he says the high quality setups cost but that's my choice, lol) I do wish it ran on propane but I may convert it some day.

I have a tri fuel kit from US Carburetion on my ridgid generator (Honda GX390 engine) and love it. Fires right up on propane and i can switch to gas by turning the fuel on. Installation was pretty easy, just needed to find a good spot for the regulator, which is fairly large

 

[matt151617]

I have a tri fuel kit from US Carburetion on my ridgid generator (Honda GX390 engine) and love it. Fires right up on propane and i can switch to gas by turning the fuel on. Installation was pretty easy, just needed to find a good spot for the regulator, which is fairly large

^This. For $500 I have a generator that will run off of gasoline, propane, or natural gas.

FWIW, I live in extreme northern NY, and have for the last 8 years. I've used my generator 3 times- Irene, once when the pole transformer to my house blew, and once for a bit after a thunderstorm. Up until last year, I did not have natural gas. Fuel is a concern, but I keep the tank on the generator full (4 gallons), a 5gl container that I use for the lawnmower/snowblower, and an extra 5gl container I rotate in my car every 6 months. Stabil in everything, and never had a problem even at extreme winter temps.

With that amount of fuel, I could run 49 hours straight (3.5 hours per gallon). Only running say every other hour, or 2 on/2 off, I could get just over 4 full days. If things really get bad, then I could drain the gas tanks of both cars.

I can't possibly justify spending 5 grand on something I may need once every 2-3 years.

 

[CHJake]

I'll second on the Generac. Have a 16kvw installed. About a month after install, power went due to a fallen tree in the township. Wife came home and did not even realize power was out. All about peace of mind. Don't have to worry about home when away for work or at the cabin. Starts up and runs all by itself.


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