Why do you think Craftsman ratchets fail so often?

[HanShotFirst]

I'm not a "power user" of mechanics tools, but I do my fair share of wrenching. The only tool I have consistently broken are Craftsman raised panel 1/4" & 3/8" ratchets (for some reason I've never broken a 1/2"). So it got me thinking, why is that? Clearly I'm not the only one to have this problem.

I think the internal dimensions of the pawls and gear are just overly generous and that leads to premature wear. I also think their springs aren't very good, because I've noticed that CM ratchets often fail to engage.

So what are your thoughts?

 

[Ponchoguy]

I've never broken one and I've returned maybe 2 in my 25+ years of wrenching. I do have a lot of them, so maybe the wear is "spread" across the collection.

Now I just rebuild them with a new kit to freshen them up now and then.

 

[Dog Garage]

Outside of two really el cheapos, I have never broken a name brand ratchet. If it's really tight, grab a breaker bar and a piece of pipe.

 

[AceofSpad3s]

I would have to go with the design itself and the plastic selector switch. I have a VS series rp with a chinese rebuild kit, the plastic switch moves so much it feels like it is going to switch directions without even touching it. I have a napa USA version of the raised panel, it has a rounded handle with light checkering on it. It has a metal selector and it feels significantly tighter tolerance wise and the selector does not move nearly as much. It did not have a quick release so I switched out the qr gear of the rp and stuck it in the napa, feels very solid and it is actually a pretty nice ratchet. I also have a flying V style selector rp and it is nothing great, it has a ton of backdrag. I did have a 1/4 kobalt rp and it was garbage even though it had a metal selector. I think it is a bit of the design and the bad switches.

 

[1990 Grand Wag]

I'm not a "power user" of mechanics tools, but I do my fair share of wrenching. The only tool I have consistently broken are Craftsman raised panel 1/4" & 3/8" ratchets (for some reason I've never broken a 1/2"). So it got me thinking, why is that? Clearly I'm not the only one to have this problem.

I think the internal dimensions of the pawls and gear are just overly generous and that leads to premature wear. I also think their springs aren't very good, because I've noticed that CM ratchets often fail to engage.

So what are your thoughts?

I was under the impression that the RP ratchets had the same Danaher/Apex "Torque Wrap" pear had design throughout the line (no matter who they are made for), but the other, similar 36T ratchets are better finished (overall) and have better pawls. Mind you, they are coarse, but I think Craftsman has fudged on the specs of the ratchets over the years to save a few pennies, so much so that the RP ratchets have a really bad rep now!

 

[thebeekeeper1]

I've never had one fail, so I'm guessing the only reason they fail is due to failure to use a breaker bar when appropriate. Anyone who puts a pipe on a ratchet needs said pipe upside his head.

 

[hangfirew8]

Myself and my family haven't broken a Craftsman RP ratchet (all there was, or all we knew of, anyway) ever, in, oh, 5 decades or more of use. This includes dealer professional mechanics, machinists, engineers with a serious DIY bent, etc. To say the word Craftsman was held in high regard is an understatement.

I have a 1/2" I thought might be messed up inside after 25 years of occasional but hard use, a quick clean and lube and it's good to go again. It was literally gummed up inside, that's all. I still use my Grandfather's 3/8.

I can only conclude it might be one of two things. One, people abuse their ratchets when they should be using a breaker bar or wrench, or Two, there have been a few bad batches, perhaps more so towards the present. I don't know so much about the newer Craftsman RP ratchets because I am still using ones from the 60's, 70's and 80's.

 

[Ponchoguy]

Also, keeping them clean and lubed so that they do not skip and chip the teeth is a biggie. I keep mine clean and lubed and that makes for a happy ratchet .

 

[Mechanical Noise]

I'll agree with the sloppy tolerances and I suspect they use soft steel. I think the biggest problem is with the ratchets which have the strongest tendency to self reverse. The teeth don't always fully engage. They wear fast and break off.

Maybe the pawls don't always line up well with the drives. I guess, if you're going to sell 'em cheap, you can't waste too much time on machine setup or reject alot of borderline parts.

I did handle a Craftsman Industrial RP ratchet a couple of years ago. It felt like the teeth were fully engaging all the time and didn't have the odd asymmetrical feeling the Craftsman RP ratchets sometimes have. That's a sample of one, so it really doesn't mean much.

 

[AceofSpad3s]

I just did some more digging in my rp and my napa one and I did notice some big differences. The pawl on the napa had significantly better finish compared to the craftsman, the craftsman was very course looking in comparison. The craftsman has 3 teeth that engage the pawl, the napa only has 2. The napa pawl was full engaged all the time when ratcheting. The craftsman did not engage completely until it was turned opposite of the way it was ratcheting, the pawl moved quite a bit more compared to the napa. The inside of the head on the napa was machined alot better. Not many differences in the gears, but I did notice that the teeth on the craftsman were cut more at a shallow angle compared to the napa one, which reduces the surface area that the pawl can contact.

 

[General Geoff]

Larger sample size = more failures. Everyone and their cousin has a Cman RP ratchet. The ones that get the job done without failure are rarely mentioned.

 

[Thumper68]

I have a ton of RP ratchets, not as many as some here but the only 2 that have broken are the 1/2 flex head and that was user error, I stood on it and bounced to break free a lug nut, and a new 3/8 non usa, all the others are good to go with just cleaning and re-greasing, some of them have been in the family for 50 years.

 

[Brownsfan]

I think it's because there are just so many out there. So naturally there will be a higher number of failures than most. Simply because there are more out there than any other ratchet.

 

[wayne55]

Over the years, the only real problem I have seen is the grease they used in them will harden up and keep the internals from working.

 

[ravenzfusion]

I broke two 1/4". Gears stripped and switch kept reversing on me. None of my other ratchets are like this junk. I don't even like them because they are very uncomfortable in my hand. I do have a non RP craftsman 1/4" that I got with my universal craftsman socket set. It is actually my favorite 1/4, has a black anodized finish, looks nice and feels nice. Made in Taiwan.

 

[mrjaw14]

I've only broken one ratchet in my life and it was a cheap harbor freight one that I was using to drive a lag bolt into some wood with too small of a pilot hole. Wasn't using a cheater pipe...actually my wife was using it most of the day and it broke loose on me after it got too hard for her to turn by hand.

I did have a 1/4 RP ratchet that felt like it was going to break when I was working on some fence bolts once, but I stopped before it broke and got a breaker bar out.

 

[HanShotFirst]

Larger sample size = more failures. Everyone and their cousin has a Cman RP ratchet. The ones that get the job done without failure are rarely mentioned.

I could by into that, but I personally have had several fail, and I consider myself a small sampling. Now early on I attribute that to me putting grease inside the ratchet before I knew better. But later on after I learned that lesson, I still encountered the problem. They just get really sloppy and then start to reverse or just not engage.

 

[HanShotFirst]

Over the years, the only real problem I have seen is the grease they used in them will harden up and keep the internals from working.

Now that's interesting and quite believable. I used to grease all my ratchets before I knew better and I attribute a few ratchet "kills" to that alone. If Craftsman was doing that from the factory, that could account for failures. All sorts of problems can be attributed to grease in a ratchet.

 

[M6erfan]

I have half a dozen or so C'man "pro" ratchets circa 2000. 15 years of wrenching, I've never had an issue. Clean & lube once a year or so and all is good...

 

[tdkkart]

I've had my own Craftsman RP ratchets since 1980 or so, and used my father's before that. I've used them at home and at work, some years they get used A LOT, others not so much. the oldest ones are at work and get used more than the ones at home.

I know that I've replaced/returned/rebuilt at least a couple of them.

I can tell you this, the ONLY ones I've ever broken were broken while being abused.

 

[Jim C.]

I've never had one fail, so I'm guessing the only reason they fail is due to failure to use a breaker bar when appropriate. Anyone who puts a pipe on a ratchet needs said pipe upside his head.

^^^^^I tend to agree with this......except the pipe to the head part. Violence won't fix ignorance.

The only ratchets I've used for the last 30+ years of serious DIYer projects, a few old car restorations, etc. have been the basic Craftsman RP ratchets. I broke one 1/2" drive one time torquing down a lag bolt on a deck I was building in my back yard. I should have used a breaker bar. I put new guts in it and it's still going strong. I'm still using my original 3/8" and 1/4" drives and have never had a problem with either one.

Finally, for the literally millions of Craftsman ratchets out there in the world that are still functioning just fine, I'd have to disagree that they "fail so often." I'd guess that a small percentage of them actually do fail under normal use. I'd also guess that more fail from abuse, misuse, and neglectful maintenance. Still, there's always a that "statistical anomaly" user who seems to break most or all of the Cman ratchets that he/she has the misfortune of using. I'm not sure how that happens, but there's always someone who seems to get one bad Craftsman ratchet after another.

Jim C.

 

[Moose97]

I've never had one break. For that matter the only ratchet I have ever had break on me was a cheap "no-name" ratchet. I think it was made in India?

 

[ravenzfusion]

I feel sorry for anyone who hasn't retired a RP ratchet , working or not. Horribly uncomfortable to use. Not much leverage, etc... Just about any ratchet from any big box store is light years better.

 

[HanShotFirst]

I have half a dozen or so C'man "pro" ratchets circa 2000. 15 years of wrenching, I've never had an issue. Clean & lube once a year or so and all is good...

I've never heard any complaint on the Pro ratchets. I have an old set of pro wrenches that are actually re-branded SK long patter superchromes; they're fantastic. I wonder who made the Craftsman Pro ratchets you have?

 

[HanShotFirst]

I feel sorry for anyone who hasn't retired a RP ratchet , working or not. Horribly uncomfortable to use. Not much leverage, etc... Just about any ratchet from any big box store is light years better.

I never thought they were uncomfortable, but after breaking the first one (and no I wasn't using a cheater bar) I've been very gun shy about seriously bearing down on them. They don't have much leverage, but I've never found them uncomfortable.

I think the internal specs are just very generous. When I trip the selector on mine it's very loosy-goosy in comparison to my other teardrop style ratchets. I'm a pretty big fan of my Stanley teardrop ratchet, it's pretty darned solid.

 

[kctyphoon]

i think craftsman ratchets are the most popular to fail - since they are probably the most popular ratchets almosts anyone that owes tools, has. also - if you have a cheap craftsman with a lifetime warranty that will be replaced or rebuilt at any location they are sold at, and a more expensive one that may or may not need to be mailed out - which one do you think people are gonna smash with a hammer or put a 3 foot pipe on..

 

[ganymede]

. ..... also - if you have a cheap craftsman with a lifetime warranty that will be replaced or rebuilt at any location they are sold at, and a more expensive one that may or may not need to be mailed out - which one do you think people are gonna smash with a hammer or put a 3 foot pipe on..

Yup. I bet that's also a factor in buying a 3/8 in situations when a 1/2 should be used . Penny wise and no more pound foolish because Sears will take up the slack.

 

[zakmartin]

I've only broken one RP Craftsman ratchet, and that was one of the newer Craftsman Industrial ones, and it was a POS from the get-go. I've been using the same 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 set since the late 1970s. I take them apart every couple years for a clean and lube. To be honest, since they're the ones I feel so used to and comfortable with, I usually go to them first. Other ratchets I own are Armstrong, Craftsman Pro, Snap-On, S-K, Husky and VIM. I will say this about the Snap-On ratchets: they are by FAR superior to the other brands I use (big surprise, huh?)

 

[thebeekeeper1]

^^^^^I tend to agree with this......except the pipe to the head part. Violence won't fix ignorance.

<snip>


Jim C.

It will if you do it right.

 

[Jim C.]

It will if you do it right.

Yeah, maybe so.....

 

[JDon99]

I have never broken any of mine in the 15yrs of owning them, and I don't remember my dad ever breaking one when I was a kid. I rarely put a pipe on them, I am sure I did in some junkyard situations where I didn't have an option. Did they auto-reverse on me quite often, yes. Did I cuss the damn things, yes. Did I buy better ratchets to replace them with, yes. With that said, I am sure more things in the world have been repaired with them than any other series of ratchet.

 

[Ponchoguy]

I've never heard any complaint on the Pro ratchets. I have an old set of pro wrenches that are actually re-branded SK long patter superchromes; they're fantastic. I wonder who made the Craftsman Pro ratchets you have?

Craftsman Pro ratchets should also have been Danaher/Apex, but more along the lines of Armstrong quality than Easco quality.

 

[Jim C.]

.........I am sure more things in the world have been repaired with them than any other series of ratchet.

Absolutely, 100% agree....

Jim C.

 

[M6erfan]

I've never heard any complaint on the Pro ratchets. I have an old set of pro wrenches that are actually re-branded SK long patter superchromes; they're fantastic. I wonder who made the Craftsman Pro ratchets you have?

Don't know, codes on my C'man ratchets are; VM, VL, VU if that helps...

 

[stihlntime]

For over 25 years our only ratchets were raised panel Craftsman, didn't know any better. My favorite was the long handled 3/8 swivel head. I twisted the shank off one working on a piece of farm equipment when I should have been using a 1/2 ratchet. No cheater involved. Just using a tool in excess of it's design limits. I just bought a set of 3/8 torx, Allen ,drag link, slot and Phillips sockets that came with a Chinese raised panel ratchet. What a pos. The selector just flops around like a broke pecker,the slop in it is unbelievable. I would never consider one, my old ones have severed me well,but I've come to realize there are just better options. I think it is lack of QC, not being mfg within spec.

 

[CJM8515]

Old ones, pre 1990 or so were okay. Not great, but they didnt bust nearly as easily. Im sure Ive said this story like 20x now: Friend went out and bought an entire 300pc set. We took apart a dirtbike, broke both the 1/4 and 3/8 in less than an hour. The teeth skip and break off it seems or the thing wants to reverse always.

It took extreme abuse for the 3/8 stanley ratchets I used to use all the time to self reverse and Ive never broken the teeth in any of them. All metal, no plastic either.

 

[Ponchoguy]

Old ones, pre 1990 or so were okay. Not great, but they didnt bust nearly as easily. Im sure Ive said this story like 20x now: Friend went out and bought an entire 300pc set. We took apart a dirtbike, broke both the 1/4 and 3/8 in less than an hour. The teeth skip and break off it seems or the thing wants to reverse always.

It took extreme abuse for the 3/8 stanley ratchets I used to use all the time to self reverse and Ive never broken the teeth in any of them. All metal, no plastic either.

The newer ones (44807, 44808 and 44809) are finer and are a little less stellar than their older counterparts (43175, 43784, 44975 if I remember right). Also, the older ones had snap rings for the "business" end and the selector lever, and the new ones don't, they are just fitted into the pawl.

However, I just rebuilt a 44809 on Monday and it works fine and I have several of them. I also have a 1990 "Tri-Wing" setup (my first tool set from Sears) and those have held up well. Those were Easco era Craftsmans.

 

[Cato]

Larger sample size = more failures. Everyone and their cousin has a Cman RP ratchet. The ones that get the job done without failure are rarely mentioned.

That's a good point. Guys who aren't tool snobs use the RP ratchet day in and day out. They are work horses, get abused, and aren't maintained. For every babied Snap On $150 ratchet there are probably 1000 RP Craftsman ratchets doing their duty.

They remind me of Russian WWII tanks - coarsely built, but very effective.

 

[Ponchoguy]

That's a good point. Guys who aren't tool snobs use the RP ratchet day in and day out. They are work horses, get abused, and aren't maintained. For every babied Snap On $150 ratchet there are probably 1000 RP Craftsman ratchets doing their duty.

They remind me of Russian WWII tanks - coarsely built, but very effective.

I'm sure almost 90% of us on this board probably own at least one! And like the Lays potato chip commercial, "You can't just have one!".

 

[Cato]

I'm sure almost 90% of us on this board probably own at least one! And like the Lays potato chip commercial, "You can't just have one!".

Yeah, they were good deals in those sets. I'm sure a lot of us got our first ratchets in those Craftsman sets.