Why does everyone choose to add FLAKES?

[SUPERFORD]

Hello everyone,

I'm currently in the research phase of coating my garage floor.

In another thread ( http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19245 ) I asked at what point in the construction of a new garage should the floor be coated.

now I'm asking WHY everyone adds the "flakes" to their epoxy floor.

Is it:
-purely for aesthetic appeal (just like the way it looks)
-to hide surface imperfections? (cracks, chips, scrapes, pitting, uneven concrete finishing, etc)
-for traction?
-because everyone else adds them, you just thought you were supposed to?
-to help hide UV yellowing of lighter colors and clears?

The reason that I ask is that I'm a mechanic during the day. Our floors are coated at work with plain WHITE (or VERY light grey) solid color. This color choice is more than cosmetic alone.

1. When I drop a nut or bolt or washer or tool or whatever on the floor, the plain white makes it MUCH easier to quickly scan for a lost item. most anything dropped just stands out against the white background. adding flakes to me would seem almost like adding "camouflage" for lost small items.

2. Our current floor (in a 20 year old dealership service dept.) was once almost black from years of heavy use and spills in a completely bare and unprotected state. The day that we came back to work after they epoxied the floors, it was like working with a whole new updated lighting system! the white floors are GREAT for brightening the workplace as they reflect a remarkable amount of light back up from the floor. again, this makes everything easier to see when working. it would seem to me that adding colored flakes (or even using a colored floor other than white or light grey) would absorb light and thus make the shop at least a somewhat darker place. this MAY only be a concern if you are trying to work in the shop, but alot of us do at least hobby work at home too.

I ask because aside from the reason's mentioned above, I simply don't generally prefer the look of the flakes. Don't get me wrong, I've seen some examples here that were quite attractively done. they really gave the floor a more "expensive" or classy look in my opinion. However looking classy wasn't a good enough reason in my mind to override the "functionality" of going with solid white or light grey in a working garage.

Maybe it's just me though as I'm also not a fan of the checkerboard tile theme that appears to be EXTREMELY popular.

so why did/would YOU choose flakes?

-chris

 

[KnightFire]

I didn't use the provided chips the first time I epoxied a garage floor (Home Depot/Rustoleum Brand) in my old house/garage, nor did I use any aggregate (which isn't provided in the Rustoleum kits from HD).

Man, that was a HUGE mistake! The floor looked great! Once it got wet or I spilled some fluid on it...it turned into a ice rink! The first time it happened, I never even knew what hit me...I got up from under the car, apparently stepped into a bit of trans fluid, and I was on my *** again. I didn't even have time to brace myself.

Now would that have happened if I'd used aggregate, probably not...but I wasn't wise in the ways of epoxy floorings at that time and I thought the clean look would be better...this time (in my new house/garage) I used BOTH (chips and aggregate)!

 

[XR80David]

I'm not so turned on he flakes but my floors are flaked... Overall, you will be happy with the flakes because it hides MANY imperfections and it is harder to tell that there is dirt on it. It doesn't seem to add traction if you put a clear coat over the flakes (which is recommended), but has tons of traction without flakes.

 

[SUPERFORD]

RE: KnightFire

It's funny that you mention traction. I've been trying to use the "search" feature and read some older posts. I've just been reading a few about traction issues.

FWIW, on the floor that I work on every day. They coated one half of the shop one day, and the second half on another day. For some reason on the first half they added silicon or sand or metal shavings or something for traction, but they added nothing on the second half. (this was not a professional job). I work on the "non traction additive side" of the building. I don't have any issues with traction. in fact, the guys across the shop are always complaining when they try to mop their floors that the "sand" is shredding the mops and after mopping their floors always have a layer of fuzz or lint where the additive has grabbed the mop fibers.

I've never pulled a car into my bay and had it slide across the floor. I also can't remember the last time I fell down at work. Although I can't say it has never happened, but it must have been YEARS.

The previous dealership where I worked also had completely smooth epoxy flooring.

I HAVE seen people fall on the smooth floors AND on the "traction additive" floors. But pretty much every time there was standing fluid on the floor. Standing water, or even worse antifreeze/transmission fluid/brake fluid etc. can make for a slippery situation even if you are acustomed to walking on an epoxy floor.

 

[AlphaGarage]

If there's a really heavy coating of flakes it will add texture, but if you're concerned about slipping you'll still want to add a bit of grit. As noted different grits have different attributes. Some will shred mops, while other grip products have just as much traction but won't have you buying a new mop every few months.

I like flakes for aesthetic reasons, and they do hide imperfections and dirt between cleanings. It doesn't take a lot of flake to get those benefits, .05 lbs per sq ft will do the trick.

If you want the granite look you'll need heavier coverage, .1 lb per sq ft or more.

Light reflection is one of joys that really isn't appreciated until you work with a light coated floor, it makes a big difference!

 

[KnightFire]

RE: KnightFire

in fact, the guys across the shop are always complaining when they try to mop their floors that the "sand" is shredding the mops and after mopping their floors always have a layer of fuzz or lint where the additive has grabbed the mop fibers.

That was another reason why opted not to put the chips down on my 1st floor, I wanted to be able to squeegee it dry, without worrying about shredding the squeegee.

At the time of the infamous fall, it only happened once, I was wearing worn out soccer flats (zero traction). Not smart...I learned to wear boots when working in the garage on my vehicles, but even then every great once in a while, I'd slip a bit on something that found it's way to the floor and it's not like I kept a messy garage...since I put down the new floor in the new garage with aggregate and chips...I've never once had a misstep (knocking on wood).

That was my 1st epoxy floor, it does take some time to learn to wear GOOD shoes/boots with traction and watch where you step, even if you have to learn it the hard way.

As for my squeegee concerns, they were unfounded, I squeegee my new floor all time, the blade still looks great.


Take it FWIW

 

[hblock72]

superford,

I'm with you on opting not to put down the flakes when I get around to coating my floor. This does put us in the minority though. I think the floors done with the flakes are absoluty gorgeous, but i'm going with a solid light grey smooth finish for all the reasons you've mentioned. I've been to a lot of race shops/professional garages and they all have solid colored floors. The few shops I've seen with flaked floors regretted putting in the flakes, because as you said, if you drop a small screw it's tough to locate.

 

[Jaguar Fan]

I've done 2 residential garages. The first is without flakes. The second is with flakes.

I, too, was wondering about adding the flakes on the 2nd garage. I really liked the look of non-flaked. Even though the slab was only about 9 months old and in great shape, once I put the primer coat on, it was as if every slight imperfection in the slab was popping out in 3D like in a Saturday Morning cartoon show. So, I opted for the flakes. It REALLY hides the imperfections. they are just gone. By the way, some of the imperfections were just from me using spiked shoes (golf shoes, actually).

The kinds of imperfections in the slab were things like tiny pits or voids, not cracks. Maybe if I had purchased enough material for another coat or two they would have filled in.

So, its a trade-off.

For traction, by the way, I added "Shark Grit" to the clear top coat that goes on top of the flakes... this garage is not a working garage; it is a retirement home for my 80+ year old mom, so for obvious reasons I took traction over all else. I don't think the flakes, now covered by the clear top coat, really added much to traction. They add texture, but not traction in so far as I can tell. I dumped water on the floor as part of a test where I *tried* to slip, and I didn't.

But now I've come to really like the look of the flakes in a medium broadcast... so I'm planning on redoing the 1st garage (that is currently flakeless... it is a cheap big box implementation that has outlived its lifespan and is slippery when wet) and will do flakes. I'll also do flakes on a 3rd garage in a house under construction.

So... its sort of a tradeoff.

I *think* that it would be possible to do a super duper prep job, and use several coats of solid color to ensure you've filled in all the voids, and then put a clear coat on top of that with "Shark Grit" or some other additive, and you'd be fine. You'd have traction, you'd have the very light floor, and based on several coats & great prep, you would have eliminated most imperfections.

HTH.

 

[matrix243]

it would be nice if someone maybe had some example pics.

my plan was to go with a urethane, without aggregate or clearcoat, and throw some flakes down for traction. I might be losing durability and finish without the clearcoat, but aggregate is a must and that ruins the look.

 

[Kirby]

Super Ford: I am curious... how often does your dealership recoat the floor? My local GM/Pontiac dealer does it once a year over one three-day weekend. I found this out because I mentioned how good the floor looked(light gray). Kirby

 

[ron in sc]

-purely for aesthetic appeal (just like the way it looks)
-to hide surface imperfections? (cracks, chips, scrapes, pitting, uneven concrete finishing, etc)

I used flakes for the two above quoted reasons.

 

[SUPERFORD]

Super Ford: I am curious... how often does your dealership recoat the floor? My local GM/Pontiac dealer does it once a year over one three-day weekend. Kirby

Kirby,

The Lincoln dealership where I used to work re-epoxied the floor every year without fail. Doing the same type of three day weekend deal. It looked so good that they would then invite all of the customers (mostly blue haired old folks) to a "Tea Party" that is held in the shop every May with catering and musical entertainment.

they used a two part epoxy (not sure of the solid or solvent content) obtained from a local Bennett paint store. the product held up reasonably well and was affordable enough to do annually.

the Ford dealership where I currently work has only epoxied the floor twice in their 20+ years of operation. It needs to be done every year, but to put it politely, they are too cheap. they actually just did it about two years ago with a two part epoxy product from Benjamin Moore.

some people might not understand the need for constant recoats, but a service department is a very abusive environment. harsh chemicals, heavy objects, and employees that just don't give a damn about taking care of the floor.

I've never had an opportunity to work on an expensive high end epoxy, but I'd suspect that no matter high many Mils thick, or how high quality the product is, if you drop a 500lb transmission or engine on it and it's going to take a chunk out of the epoxy (and probably some concrete with it). Fine you say, "just be careful and don't drop heavy things like engines and transmissions on the floor." that's all well and good, but sometimes even smaller parts like alternators or steering racks and even tools like impact guns and prybars get dropped. they aren't as heavy, but when dropped from 5 or 6 feet in the air (the height of the bottom of a vehicle on a lift), then the damage can be similar

that is the delimma I'm facing. I'm considering a higher end product like wolverine coatings, or possibly having a professional installation done. the problem with either of these options is high cost, if I tear it up working on it then I'm afraid it's far too expensive for me to have done again. where as with a cheaper two part say 70% solid epoxy from sherwin williams or benjamin moore, I can afford to recoat as needed.

decisions...decisions...

 

[Vicegrip]

One of my dealer shops is a super thick pro material and it still looks good 4 years in. No flake, slight grit not slippery. it has lost some gloss in the work bays and drive lanes and has some dings here and there but is holding up well. It over 1/8 thick or better throughout.

 

[nissan_crawler]

Personally, I don't like the flakes. I did my floor without it, put a coat of rustoleum down, spread a LIGHT amount of sand (less than one pint for 240 sq ft), then put another coat on top of it to encapsulate it. It works great, and can still be swept/squeegeed/knelt on/creeper used. For the haters, the Rustoleum was put onto a 55 year old floor that was covered (literally) with inches of dirt and grease. It's held up to 5 years of torching/welding/grinding/plasma cutting.

The floor at work was done without any grit and at the slightest hint of water/oil/hydraulic fluid/etc., you'll split your sack if you aren't careful. I hate it.

We sealed our garage floor back home with Thompson's or the equivalent, with the same result. You had to barely shuffle your feet to get around if there was snow on the floor. It was awful.

 

[Fuller]

I rarely do a solid color floor without the chips. My full chip floors have enough texture to not need any additional grip and the partial chip floors usually get at least some "shark grip" in the final urethane coat.

If you're in the floor business, chips are your friend. It takes a lot more effort to make a solid color floor look good (regardless of what type of product you're using) than a chip floor.

If you insist on no chips, be sure to evaluate the condition of the concrete and pick a product that will fill any imperfections. You can't beat a good 100% solids epoxy for filling a nasty floor.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Aluminum Oxide is the "grit" of choice as it does not crush when heavy things like floor jacks are wheeled across it and used to lift a car. Sand will crush into powder under this kind of use.

Charles

 

[Sledgehammer]

Still one of my concerns is when something like a bolt, nut or small screw is dropped finding it on the floor.

 

[Ironcrow]

No flake or sand in mine. I wanted easy squeegee and mopping.

 

[PhantomEB]

I only want to add in glow in the dark flakes just so I dont have to use the lights when I dont need to.

 

[Timm129]

Just to hide imperfections in the floor and to add traction.. It is still easy to clean

 

[FL_Javelin]

Its been 2 years since I put down my professional Rustoleum flooring, love it, holding up great. Light gray with medium broadcast of blue-black-white flakes. No clear coat.

The Good
I love the traction they provide
Hides imperfections like my wife improperly grinding the floor
I really like the looks they add

The Bad
They shred mops and paper towels. You get about 3 wipes with a paper towel then toss. Red shop rags leave fibers.
They kill your knees. In Florida I mostly wear shorts. I kneel on a small piece of cardboard.

I just recently rolled a loaded engine hoist on it. I was worried it would crush the flakes in a manner you could see tracks but it was just fine.

If I drop a small part I kneel (with carboard) to eye level to find the small nut, washer ect. Usually though I dont need to do that.

If I did it again I would add in those glow-in-the-dark ones!

 

[Need4Speed]

I have 5 years of hard use on my Rustoleum painted floor and its holding up great. I live in sunny AZ so hot tires was a concern but I don't even think about it at all anymore. I decided to not use the flakes since I was concerned about finding things since I have a knack for dropping just about every small part that I lay my hands on. The added traction is not really necessary since we get so little rain but even when we do its not a problem, just about like any other unpainted garage floor when wet. Cleanup and squeegee is a breeze. I imagine the flakes would hide imperfections in the floor but I really have a decent enough slab so it was not a concern.

 

[RobSmith]

I don't anything about these floor coatings but assume that the flakes make the floor more "grippy" I don't feel that that is neccessary as you have a FLAT floor right ?
Anyway what I'm really writing about is finding dropped bits. I have what I call a "Black Hole" where things dissapear to. Just under my work bench directly infront of where I do my work. If I'm lucky the bits go in other directions so I use a torch to find them....The torch is an ever-ready dolfin and all I do is sit it on the floor and wash the light beam across the floor like a spot light. The little dropped bit stands out like an escaped con in the spotlight. Too easy.

 

[shopnut]

No flakes or grit in mine and I'm very happy with it. These pictures were taken about 4 years ago when the shop was just constructed. It is very easy to keep clean and it still looks new. Spilled fluids in my shop get cleaned up ASAP so they don't get tracked all over the place.

 

[Ray-CA]

I coated my floor and used grit in the second coat. That was back when I was pulling motorcycles in and out during all kinds of weather. Now that the bikes are gone, I wish that I had skipped the grit. It does grab the mop and hold some of the dirt when cleaning. Next time, no grit, light grey color and MORE LIGHTS.

Ray