Why does Snap-On continuously make people rage?

[zendriver]

Over the years, HF has built a pretty extensive poor boy/cheap boy fanboy following, I'm admittedly one, as well.

We have a very nice, clean well stocked local store, nice workers. Just shop and buy on line or head there to pick up pretty nice stuff - at a good price, that gets the job done every time. It's a decent experience.

Not surprising to develop a bit of "in your face" attitude to the expensive stuff.

 

[dchawk81]

Over the years, HF has built a pretty extensive poor boy/cheap boy fanboy following, I'm admittedly one, as well.

We have a very nice, clean well stocked local store, nice workers. Just shop and buy on line or head there to pick up pretty nice stuff - at a good price, that gets the job done every time. It's a decent experience.

Not surprising to develop a bit of "in your face" attitude to the expensive stuff.

All this talk about Icon and everything...I wonder if they finally started putting adhesive on their electrical tape.

 

[AEAdam]

Over the years, HF has built a pretty extensive poor boy/cheap boy fanboy following, I'm admittedly one, as well.

We have a very nice, clean well stocked local store, nice workers. Just shop and buy on line or head there to pick up pretty nice stuff - at a good price, that gets the job done every time. It's a decent experience.

Not surprising to develop a bit of "in your face" attitude to the expensive stuff.

I think “fanboy” is rude and derogatory. You and I don’t agree on much, but let’s agree on this: your tools are working for you and/or you are making them work. Respect.

I think a fanboy is someone who favors a brand because of its image alone. People who rave about basketball shoes who don’t play basketball (or hiking boots and don’t hike etc). That’s not the @zendriver I've come to respect.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Over the years, HF has built a pretty extensive poor boy/cheap boy fanboy following, I'm admittedly one, as well.

We have a very nice, clean well stocked local store, nice workers. Just shop and buy on line or head there to pick up pretty nice stuff - at a good price, that gets the job done every time. It's a decent experience.

Not surprising to develop a bit of "in your face" attitude to the expensive stuff.

What's wild about HF in the tool world, is the sheer variety in a retail setting.

I can speak mostly to automotive as it's my specialty, but there is nobody who is even competitive with them. Maybe a bigger parts store might have some options? Between ball joint presses, scan tools of varying power, impact extensions, fuel line disconnects, it's a lot.

 

[CGarage]

HF quality has improved over time as well.
But if I want a disposable tool for a single use job, I don’t mind buying for that purpose in mind.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I think “fanboy” is rude and derogatory. You and I don’t agree on much, but let’s agree on this: your tools are working for you and/or you are making them work. Respect.

I think a fanboy is someone who favors a brand because of its image alone. People who rave about basketball shoes who don’t play basketball (or hiking boots and don’t hike etc). That’s not the @zendriver I've come to respect.

"Noun
a male fan, especially one who is obsessive about comics, music, movies, or science fiction."

I'm going to be honest, I'm a tool fanboy. It can certainly have a negative connotation implying a lack of reason/logic and blind support. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't LOVE those wright grips. The snap on ratcheting wrench combos? Divine. Don't even get me started on what a fresh set of test leads feel like..... I'm a bit obsessive. Certainly better than drinking. Not sure it's any cheaper.

 

[GE45]

I buy SO because of Val

 

[dchawk81]

I buy SO because of Val

Me and half the boys in our senior high school class bought cars from the same tiny dealership because of a woman like Val.

 

[Boogerman]

Some of us have dealt with significant debt in business before and find the idea of borrowing money for something that (if we got past the branding) we could own instead, well, that's just hard to watch.

Experienced, successful adults paying cash for Snap-On - sure, nothing but admiration there. They appear to be awesome tools and would be proud to have them!

But a brand new tech, borrowing money they shouldn't because they were "influenced" by others - that's just frustrating to watch...

"Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." Older folks try to help with hard earned wisdom and advice, but what can you do?

Not picking on anyone in particular, but this quote embodies what I think is one of the first reasons these people rage against SO. They're "missionaries" trying to convert us to their righteous way of thinking, instead of our own sinful ways.

Yeah and? Tasting better and being worth the money aren't really the same thing.

Again, not picking on anyone, just the most applicable quote. This is the second reason; people that have invested in lower cost tools know they're not truly equal to top of the line, but they're "better (for the price)". But, to somehow not feel inferior for having made the economy choice, some of the economy buyers feel the need to tear down the better brand.

Finally, the youtube videos are simply professional entertainers specifically creating drama and dissent just to up their ratings.

The loyalty of those that chosen factions is fueled a huge amount by confirmation bias; those buyers are trying to support their own choices, because for both extremes, there's tradeoffs that they had to make. The high quality buyers had to pay much more money for their choice. The economizing on costs buyers had to use tools with some degree of inferiority compared to the premium ones. Both factions want to defend why they made what could be construed as poor decisions based on the particular observers biases.

 

[dchawk81]

Not picking on anyone in particular, but this quote embodies what I think is one of the first reasons these people rage against SO. They're "missionaries" trying to convert us to their righteous way of thinking, instead of our own sinful ways.

Again, not picking on anyone, just the most applicable quote. This is the second reason; people that have invested in lower cost tools know they're not truly equal to top of the line, but they're "better (for the price)". But, to somehow not feel inferior for having made the economy choice, some of the economy buyers feel the need to tear down the better brand.

Finally, the youtube videos are simply professional entertainers specifically creating drama and dissent just to up their ratings.

The loyalty of those that chosen factions is fueled a huge amount by confirmation bias; those buyers are trying to support their own choices, because for both extremes, there's tradeoffs that they had to make. The high quality buyers had to pay much more money for their choice. The economizing on costs buyers had to use tools with some degree of inferiority compared to the premium ones. Both factions want to defend why they made what could be construed as poor decisions based on the particular observers biases.

Yeah I mean I have snap on so I'm not tearing down anything and pay little mind to those that do.

 

[joel63]

Yeah I mean I have snap on so I'm not tearing down anything and pay little mind to those that do.

That works for me and has for a long time.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Not picking on anyone in particular, but this quote embodies what I think is one of the first reasons these people rage against SO. They're "missionaries" trying to convert us to their righteous way of thinking, instead of our own sinful ways.

Again, not picking on anyone, just the most applicable quote. This is the second reason; people that have invested in lower cost tools know they're not truly equal to top of the line, but they're "better (for the price)". But, to somehow not feel inferior for having made the economy choice, some of the economy buyers feel the need to tear down the better brand.

Finally, the youtube videos are simply professional entertainers specifically creating drama and dissent just to up their ratings.

The loyalty of those that chosen factions is fueled a huge amount by confirmation bias; those buyers are trying to support their own choices, because for both extremes, there's tradeoffs that they had to make. The high quality buyers had to pay much more money for their choice. The economizing on costs buyers had to use tools with some degree of inferiority compared to the premium ones. Both factions want to defend why they made what could be construed as poor decisions based on the particular observers biases.

Ooof, so my choice of tools DONT make me better than other people?

 

[CGarage]

Ooof, so my choice of tools DONT make me better than other people?

Some of the most skilled craftsman I have hired make do with absolute junk, which amazes me.

 

[dchawk81]

Ooof, so my choice of tools DONT make me better than other people?

Yes it does. Ignore him. He's a poor.

 

[dchawk81]

Some of the most skilled craftsman I have hired make do with absolute junk, which amazes me.

A classmate of mine from high school lives in England and makes furniture for the royal family.

I can't say friend since I don't remember being in the same classroom after 8th grade but still. I don't think he has any snap on.

 

[GE45]

Some of the most skilled craftsman I have hired make do with absolute junk, which amazes me.

The best mechanic I know uses mainly Cornwell, but it’s only bc he needs truck service. He looks at a problem, throws what he needs on a cart, and gets it done efficiently, rarely having to go back to his box.

He actually advised me to buy Gearwrench.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

The best mechanic I know uses mainly Cornwell, but it’s only bc he needs truck service. He looks at a problem, throws what he needs on a cart, and gets it done efficiently, rarely having to go back to his box.

He actually advised me to buy Gearwrench.

I tell people generally to buy blow molded case sets. Typically works better for occasional users.

I tell most people I've worked with to stay off the tool truck, as I climb the stairs into the belly of the beast.

 

[dchawk81]

I tell people generally to buy blow molded case sets. Typically works better for occasional users.

I tell most people I've worked with to stay off the tool truck, as I climb the stairs into the belly of the beast.

I live and die by my blow molded cases.

 

[dchawk81]

The best mechanic I know uses mainly Cornwell, but it’s only bc he needs truck service. He looks at a problem, throws what he needs on a cart, and gets it done efficiently, rarely having to go back to his box.

He actually advised me to buy Gearwrench.

Yeah well he's a spy.

 

[CGarage]

A classmate of mine from high school lives in England and makes furniture for the royal family.

I can't say friend since I don't remember being in the same classroom after 8th grade but still. I don't think he has any snap on.

That said, there are guild suppliers of fine wood-crafting tools in the U.K., so Snap-On likely isn’t his cup of tea for his needs, but I imagine he is “fully sorted and kitted”.

 

[CGarage]

The best mechanic I know uses mainly Cornwell, but it’s only bc he needs truck service. He looks at a problem, throws what he needs on a cart, and gets it done efficiently, rarely having to go back to his box.

He actually advised me to buy Gearwrench.

I have GW. My most used ratchet is probably the locking GW 90T flexheads. Matco is not as available here and GW was an easy Amazon order for me. No complaints.

I think most of the GW animosity is having to do with company policy and dismantling once favored U.S. tool companies, and GW takes the blame for Apex management decisions.

 

[micromind]

I have GW. My most used ratchet is probably the locking GW 90T flexheads. Matco is not as available here and GW was an easy Amazon order for me. No complaints.

I think most of the GW animosity is having to do with company policy and dismantling once favored U.S. tool companies, and GW takes the blame for Apex management decisions.

I have nothing against Gearwrench, I consider them to be fine tools but I'll never buy them only because their parent company, Apex, bought Armstrong and eventually closed the factory.

In my mind, that is not a forgivable offense.

 

[CGarage]

I have nothing against Gearwrench, I consider them to be fine tools but I'll never buy them only because their parent company, Apex, bought Armstrong and eventually closed the factory.

In my mind, that is not a forgivable offense.

Thank you for proving my point.

 

[Boogerman]

I live and die by my blow molded cases.

I detest blow molded cases, the pieces are hard to remove (or fall out and get mixed up) and they're horribly bulky. Just for sockets, how would I store enough blow molded sets to cover the 500+ in my top drawer, or the 4 full drawers of wrenches on racks? It'd take a whole toolbox to store blow molded boxes for the screwdrivers, and pliers would be impossible. But, I bring the work to the tools generally, instead of the tools to the work. When I do remote work, I make up job specific tool sets and use ammo boxes and crates for transport. And/or road chest.

Just goes to show how much different people work and what their varied needs are.

I have maybe a dozen blow molded cases. A few insert driver sets. tap and die in both metric and standard. Thread chasers. Damaged nut sets. fast spiral plug extractor sockets. Torque wrenches. Few other specialty tool sets.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I detest blow molded cases, the pieces are hard to remove (or fall out and get mixed up) and they're horribly bulky. Just for sockets, how would I store enough blow molded sets to cover the 500+ in my top drawer, or the 4 full drawers of wrenches on racks? It'd take a whole toolbox to store blow molded boxes for the screwdrivers, and pliers would be impossible. But, I bring the work to the tools generally, instead of the tools to the work. When I do remote work, I make up job specific tool sets and use ammo boxes and crates for transport. And/or road chest.

Just goes to show how much different people work and what their varied needs are.

I have maybe a dozen blow molded cases. A few insert driver sets. tap and die in both metric and standard. Thread chasers. Damaged nut sets. fast spiral plug extractor sockets. Torque wrenches. Few other specialty tool sets.

Blow molded cases are for the lower class without triple bank sized tool boxes. That's the majority of people and it works good for their limited needs.

Toolbox Widget is my current organizer in the cart, but I would probably need another $1500+ to do the box which isn't worth it to me. For sets/specialty I too prefer to just save the cases.

 

[MOS3522]

Blow molded cases are for the lower class without triple bank sized tool boxes. That's the majority of people and it works good for their limited needs.

Toolbox Widget is my current organizer in the cart, but I would probably need another $1500+ to do the box which isn't worth it to me. For sets/specialty I too prefer to just save the cases.

I have a 3 bank and I love molded cases. I leave them open or cut them in half and lay them out in the drawer. It's a beautiful way to organize tools.

 

[dchawk81]

Blow molded cases are for the lower class without triple bank sized tool boxes. That's the majority of people and it works good for their limited needs.

Toolbox Widget is my current organizer in the cart, but I would probably need another $1500+ to do the box which isn't worth it to me. For sets/specialty I too prefer to just save the cases.

Yep peasants like me love them.

I wish I could whammy zammy blow molded cases around the specific tools I need for a specific task at a specific moment.

I also like tool rollers. For like wrenches and ratchets and extensions.

Because we have to work in the yard but the garage if you can even call it that is 100 yards away and every time we enter the garage we get excited and have to poo so one trip is way better.

 

[Mb4]

Nice. All, I can give you is this: I was there, raising a family, good engineering job, but had a side hustle and was fixing cars and doing home improvements. I did probably exactly what you are doing. I tried to get the biggest bang for my buck tool wise (but everything wise).

Looking back, I made some jobs harder on myself than I should have. There was more drama than there needed to be. If I had only spent, what in hindsight was an insignificant amount more on tools, those jobs would have gone smoother.

The money I’ve saved my family was longer term, and now I wish I’d spent some of that because I don’t need it now. I don’t know everybodies situation, and can’t possibily give advice that will help everyone. I will say this though: in general, we seem to approach tool buying like wrist watches or golf clubs or other hobby items. That’s not really fair. Our tools generally SAVE us money or facilitate other purchases (like older vehicles). You don’t necessary see the savings in your checking account, but if you did even a cursory comparison of what normal people spend on vehicles, you’d find that what you save is quite dramatic.

A lot of good points in this post. I think a lot of it has to do with the amount of hobbyists here. When you’re depending upon a tool to make you money, help you do your job as efficiently, accurately, and fast as possible, you’re typically not bargain hunting for tools or buying lower end stuff justifying the purchase based on how people in the third world repair equipment. The tools are not jewelry, they’re there for a purpose. It’s understandable that weekend warriors get confused over this.

 

[Kaervak]

In my opinion, the hate comes from the attitude of "if you don't use Snap-On tools, you aren't a serious mechanic" mentality. Like the only way your skills, knowledge and work ethic mean anything is if you have $50k in Snap-On, otherwise you're a worthless hack.

I work as a paramedic and fleet mechanic for the same employer. The current lead mechanic who I'm replacing is all in on Snap-On and will **** talk Harbor Freight, the other mechanic is of the mindset of whatever tool works is the best tool and has a bunch of different brands of tools in his box, Snap-On included. I have mostly HF stuff in my service cart at work, a few USA made tools that I brought from my home tools that I had as spares, but everything else was bought from HF specifically for this role. Myself and the other mechanic get the job done just the same as the lead mechanic, with significantly less cost of investment in tools. I have nothing against Snap-On tools, I own a decent amount of their sockets and extensions and they're quite nice. There are a few tools that when you need the best, Snap-On is the only way to go (Torx/Hex bits, speciality) But with that said, a lot of their stuff to me is just too expensive to justify the purchase. I can get the job done with a "lesser" brand and have the monetary difference in my pocket to save or spend on other things and at the end of the day the job is done just the same.

 

[Mb4]

Some people (here) aren’t broke like I was. They are just militantly cheap. There’s a difference. (Think Ive heard that before somewhere)

I love looking at those militantly cheap weekend warrior home editions…

 

[engineer2]

Years ago my former employer made a part for Snap On. Probably cost $100 in parts. They sold it to them for around $200. Snap On's retail price was $1000.

 

[dchawk81]

In my opinion, the hate comes from the attitude of "if you don't use Snap-On tools, you aren't a serious mechanic" mentality. Like the only way your skills, knowledge and work ethic mean anything is if you have $50k in Snap-On, otherwise you're a worthless hack.

I work as a paramedic and fleet mechanic for the same employer. The current lead mechanic who I'm replacing is all in on Snap-On and will **** talk Harbor Freight, the other mechanic is of the mindset of whatever tool works is the best tool and has a bunch of different brands of tools in his box, Snap-On included. I have mostly HF stuff in my service cart at work, a few USA made tools that I brought from my home tools that I had as spares, but everything else was bought from HF specifically for this role. Myself and the other mechanic get the job done just the same as the lead mechanic, with significantly less cost of investment in tools. I have nothing against Snap-On tools, I own a decent amount of their sockets and extensions and they're quite nice. There are a few tools that when you need the best, Snap-On is the only way to go (Torx/Hex bits, speciality) But with that said, a lot of their stuff to me is just too expensive to justify the purchase. I can get the job done with a "lesser" brand and have the monetary difference in my pocket to save or spend on other things and at the end of the day the job is done just the same.

I agree. It's not hate it's just the realization that a nut doesn't care what brand wrench is on it.

(Overly simplified but still)

 

[Hiball]

I think a lot of it has to do with how people shop nowadays, the majority of people whether you are buying a Washer and Dryer or a set of tires will put some google time in reading reviews in a attempt to convince themselves that Brand X is correct choice.

In other words, I watched 27 YouTube videos and 15 TicToks, No way in Hell your Ratchet is better than mine. Please stop trying to make me feel like I’m a cheapskate or a Brand *****.

 

[AEAdam]

I have mostly HF stuff in my service cart at work, a few USA made tools that I brought from my home tools that I had as spares, but everything else was bought from HF specifically for this role.

Myself and the other mechanic get the job done just the same as the lead mechanic, with significantly less cost of investment in tools.

Snap On tools are significantly harder and tighter fitting than anything HF sells. That’s a fact. You may never need that additional capability because of what you are working on, where you live etc.

But there may well come a day when your tools let you down and you CAN’T do what your lead mechanic can. I’d be surprised if that hasn’t already happened.

I’ve had that experience. Your lead mechanic may have had that experience. So what you may hear as hate for HF, could just be his way of sharing his experience.

I can get the job done with a "lesser" brand and have the monetary difference in my pocket to save or spend on other things and at the end of the day the job is done just the same.

Please keep in mind, the statements above have this air of superiority. How smart were you and your colleague to save your money. The stupid old fashioned lead wasted his money, brain washed by the snap on truck’s siren song. You are one of those folks I mentioned earlier who discovered the magical tool store.

When your Pittsburgh open end wrench spreads, and you need to borrow the lead’s FD+, how will that be? Will he “I told ya so” and be an elitist ***?

You can’t fight and win against physics, and the nut ABSOLUTELY cares what brand wrench turns it. If you guys haven’t learned that here, I’m not sure what you’ve been reading on GJ.

My kids are in their 20s. I tell them things, give them advice as Dads do. They NEVER take my advice. They are committed to learning everything the hard way. It’s tough to watch. And like all Dads, I’m always right. But that brings me no joy, and they seem ever more indignant as whatever I predict comes to pass. HF wrench sets (for example) feel that way to me. You will regret that purchase sooner or later. You can’t win against physics. Just like the mechanic named John did.

 

[yjWrangler]

This thread will be locked I'm sure. Prime display of the arguments a tool brand somehow causes. I like the Snap-On stuff I have, I like other brands I have. Just don't care enough to argue about them anymore, I guess. This same stuff happens with watches, guns, whatever. Must be some sort of primal man tribal instinct. Kinda tired of it honestly, it's all you find online anymore

 

[zendriver]

A lot of good points in this post. I think a lot of it has to do with the amount of hobbyists here. When you’re depending upon a tool to make you money, help you do your job as efficiently, accurately, and fast as possible, you’re typically not bargain hunting for tools or buying lower end stuff justifying the purchase based on how people in the third world repair equipment. The tools are not jewelry, they’re there for a purpose. It’s understandable that weekend warriors get confused over this.

If I'm repairing my own **** (and seemingly half of everybody else's I know), does that make me a "hobbyist"?

I want tools that work and hold up - just like the pro's, to get whatever **** job I'm destined to complete, done as quick and accurately as possible. Everybody does and today's inexpensive stuff hangs in there just fine.

I'm not alone in this view and I've been doing this **** for 55 years, so I thinks we know the difference between tools get the job done and those that won't. Could we effectively use the HF, Cman, Carlysle and yes even old beat the hell Snap On tools, all day long, day after day?

Of course and those that don't believe that's possible almost seem in a bit of denial.

Ironically, I am Admitently a "militant cheapskate" but those I know who "only use the best" have been hitting us up for money lately in a big way. Weird.

FWIW If I was a pro mechanic, I'd probably go with Snap On for the optics alone,evne though the are great tools. Kind of like seeing your ortho surgeon driving and old rusted out hooptie.

What are they doing with all that money I am forking over?

 

[dnschmidt]

Snap-On is why I started to sell TOPTUL. My friends and I wanted great tools at one tenth the Snap-On price. Having said that I'm one to always cover my bets so I bought a sizeable amount of SNA stock for those that just have to have Snap-On. I've actually made more money from SNA stock than I did from my TOPTUL business. A wise businessman friend of mine made the comment to only sell high-end **** because the people with money love paying more - it's a status thing. BMW SUV's **** compared to Toyota's but in Scottsdale you've got to have the BMW or Porsche or your neighbors think you've a commoner and shun you.

 

[dchawk81]

If I'm repairing my own **** (and seemingly half of everybody else's I know), does that make me a "hobbyist"?

I want tools that work and hold up - just like the pro's, to get whatever **** job I'm destined to complete, done as quick and accurately as possible. Everybody does and today's inexpensive stuff hangs in there just fine.

I'm not alone in this view and I've been doing this **** for 55 years, so I thinks we know the difference between tools get the job done and those that won't. Could we effectively use the HF, Cman, Carlysle and yes even old beat the hell Snap On tools, all day long, day after day?

Of course and those that don't believe that's possible almost seem in a bit of denial.

Ironically, I am Admitently a "militant cheapskate" but those I know who "only use the best" have been hitting us up for money lately in a big way. Weird.

FWIW If I was a pro mechanic, I'd probably go with Snap On for the optics alone,evne though the are great tools. Kind of like seeing your ortho surgeon driving and old rusted out hooptie.

What are they doing with all that money I am forking over?

My dentist drove the same Dodge Dakota with Mossy Oak full rear window decal as he drove in college. I thought it was pretty badass.

His wife got a new Lexus though.

 

[JeepYJ]

In my opinion, the hate comes from the attitude of "if you don't use Snap-On tools, you aren't a serious mechanic" mentality. Like the only way your skills, knowledge and work ethic mean anything is if you have $50k in Snap-On, otherwise you're a worthless hack.

There is a commenter on another forum I frequent that always posts about how they only use S-O tools because they “want the best or will go without.” That person seems to be a hobbyist, not a mechanic by trade. They go into rants if someone mentions that there are better options for some tools or, even worse, S-O doesn’t make all the tools they sell. That kind of attitude makes the person unlikeable and emphasizes the fanboy stereotype.

 

[zendriver]

My dentist drove the same Dodge Dakota with Mossy Oak full rear window decal as he drove in college. I thought it was pretty badass

His wife got a new Lexus though.

My Dentist put all 5 of his kids through some of the priciest colleges out there.

Even with insurance, I have written his practice, some very nice checks.

His work is good. It's worth it, just like a good mechanic.