Why no ICON line wrenches ?

[impactims]

No one said that about flare nut wrenches?

A high percentage of professional car mechanics go their entire careers without a set of 4 way wrenches.


And where is “Around here”

Pacific NW

Someone up there indicated that they are more prevalent in areas other than automotive applications and they at HF are going for the automotive crowd thus no need for them because automotive mechanics don’t use them. That was the gist of it anyways and that what I was commenting on.

 

[Firebrick43]

For me…around here is Oklahoma.

I actually polled four guys I know well, and who work on a lot of stuff, from hot rods to 4x4s to tractors and farm equipment. I sent them the two photos.

All four identified the “flare nut wrenches” as “line wrenches,” two of them didn’t know what the angle wrenches were, one called them “hydraulic wrenches” and the other responded “those sure would be handy for hydraulic lines.”

I get that, regional and vocational differences do affect the terminology.

Sort of like in places in California when i moved there all soda was called "coke". It baffled me when some said "what kind" after asking for a coke. Here in rural Indiana the generic term is "pop", and other places, and other places it "soda"

 

[liliysdad]

I get that, regional and vocational differences do affect the terminology.

Sort of like in places in California when i moved there all soda was called "coke". It baffled me when some said "what kind" after asking for a coke. Here in rural Indiana the generic term is "pop", and other places, and other places it "soda"

Here in hillbilly Oklahoma, its "coke" as well. I would imagine that the same reasons exist for that here and in California, given the cultural exchange in the 20s and 30s.


"You want me to grab you a coke?"

"Sure!"

"What kind?"

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Here in hillbilly Oklahoma, its "coke" as well. I would imagine that the same reasons exist for that here and in California, given the cultural exchange in the 20s and 30s.


"You want me to grab you a coke?"

"Sure!"

"What kind?"

"Get me a Pepsi"

 

[rust in the eye]

Around here, Chicago, a "four way" is one of those cross type lug wrenches.
It took me a minute to figure why "angle wrenches" would be called four way but now, looking at the angles on both ends I get it.

 

[rust in the eye]

Here in hillbilly Oklahoma, its "coke" as well. I would imagine that the same reasons exist for that here and in California, given the cultural exchange in the 20s and 30s.


"You want me to grab you a coke?"

"Sure!"

"What kind?"

No Coke, Pepsi

 

[liliysdad]

No Coke, Pepsi

'round here, Pepsi is a kind of coke. So is Coke, and Dr. Pepper, and Root Beer, and RC.....all coke.

 

[sparky 1971]

When someone asks me what kind of coke I want, it's Mountain Dew.

Anyway, sort of back to the topic; without fail, every single time someone has mentioned line wrench around me, they were referring to a flare nut. The other kind have always been angle wrenches or four way angle wrench because a four way is what is used for tires.

 

[DAWrench]

Most people I know would have no idea what a flare nut wrench is. Maybe a few would if I called it a line wrench. As far as angle head wrenches go I use them regularly on tractor hydraulic lines which are usually not all that tight but in really tight spots

 

[Basskiller]

Line wrench crowfoot
or
Flare nut crowfoot?

 

[DAWrench]

Yea it is funny how that works. For me it's a Flare nut crowsfoot foot and line wrench

 

[sk farmer]

i don't mean to pick on anyone but this group seems to be predominantly auto mechanics. there are a few construction, ag, heavy truck or over the road mechs, machinist etc. scattered in as well as fluid power, welders, locksmiths, plumbers, electricians and some other trades. take no offense if i missed any,

again, not picking on them but auto tech guys seem to think if it is sae, line wrenches, angle wrenches or other specialized tools that they may not see or need, they think that nobody needs them and there is no demand for them. while it may or may not be needed in their area or specialty, it is simply not true with everyone or everywhere. for some reason they just seem to get tunnel vision or blind to other occupations because that is all they see.

 

[dchawk81]

No Snappy truck anymore, so thought i would give ICON a try..but no luck.

They know it would be a waste of time, money, and effort because that's pretty much the one thing almost everyone agrees is worth buying from Snap on.

 

[impactims]

i don't mean to pick on anyone but this group seems to be predominantly auto mechanics. there are a few construction, ag, heavy truck or over the road mechs, machinist etc. scattered in as well as fluid power, welders, locksmiths, plumbers, electricians and some other trades. take no offense if i missed any,

again, not picking on them but auto tech guys seem to think if it is sae, line wrenches, angle wrenches or other specialized tools that they may not see or need, they think that nobody needs them and there is no demand for them. while it may or may not be needed in their area or specialty, it is simply not true with everyone or everywhere. for some reason they just seem to get tunnel vision or blind to other occupations because that is all they see.

Who in particular are you talking about?

 

[dchawk81]

i don't mean to pick on anyone but this group seems to be predominantly auto mechanics. there are a few construction, ag, heavy truck or over the road mechs, machinist etc. scattered in as well as fluid power, welders, locksmiths, plumbers, electricians and some other trades. take no offense if i missed any,

again, not picking on them but auto tech guys seem to think if it is sae, line wrenches, angle wrenches or other specialized tools that they may not see or need, they think that nobody needs them and there is no demand for them. while it may or may not be needed in their area or specialty, it is simply not true with everyone or everywhere. for some reason they just seem to get tunnel vision or blind to other occupations because that is all they see.

How's the sk crop this year?

 

[sk farmer]

Who in particular are you talking about?

i thought i was clear, auto mechanics and or auto techs that frequent this site.

 

[sk farmer]

How's the sk crop this year?

not sure what you mean "sk crop".

if you mean my grain crops, it is the first week of march and we generally do not plant anything until the last week of march, weather permitting. our snow is mostly gone so we could make that but being march mother nature has the last word. the cattle have survived the winter well.

i was in south texas last week traveling between san antonio and corpus christi. it appeared the tractors were just getting a good start around corpus christi. i was surprised how many fields there were right in town and close to the bay near north padre island. either way that is a whole different world and long way from se nd.

 

[Steve_P]

They know it would be a waste of time, money, and effort because that's pretty much the one thing almost everyone agrees is worth buying from Snap on.

That's the general consensus here on GJ. But GJ is a rounding error in the tool buying world- we're not "almost everyone". I'd bet HF sells many, many.... more flare nut wrench sets than SO does, regardless of how much better the SO are. Or many more of pretty much any item that's similar between the two- it's the reality of their markets. Since HF has Pittsburg and Quinn flare nut wrenches, there's no reason that Icon couldn't sell a copy of the SO flare nut wrenches that perform as well for 25% of what SO does; it's just better broaching and steel vs their other wrenches- not rocket science. Which, I think, is the point of this thread. Taiwan, or even China, can make anything as good as SO does if they're paid to.

But Icon's line is tiny, and I guess they figure that there's lots more stuff to introduce first- like a ratchet selection that rivals even Gearwrench, let alone SO. Icon doesn't even have a full line of pliers, sockets.... The reality is that a full line of Icon hand tools wouldn't fit in the current HF store size, so I assume they're going with the "top sellers" for now, which makes sense- not too many people need flare nut wrenches. If they had a full Icon line of hand tools, they'd need to have an Icon only store.

 

[liliysdad]

Since HF has Pittsburg and Quinn flare nut wrenches, there's no reason that Icon couldn't sell a copy of the SO flare nut wrenches that perform as well for 25% of what SO does; it's just better broaching and steel vs their other wrenches- not rocket science. Which, I think, is the point of this thread. Taiwan, or even China, can make anything as good as SO does if they're paid to.

If that were the case, someone would have made a "flare nut" wrench that's as good as SnapOn. So far, no one has...including the other big name truck and industrial makers.

ICON is decent, even good, corner tool store stuff. Its better than most of the other options out there.....but it's simply not "just as good as for 25% of the cost."

 

[nicks78camaro]

Line wrench = Flare nut wrench

4 way wrench = Angle wrench

Agree. Never heard of or thought of an angle wrench being referred to as a line wrench. But I just work on cars. And I can't remember the last time I needed or saw a fellow tech use an angle wrench.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Agree. Never heard of or thought of an angle wrench being referred to as a line wrench. But I just work on cars. And I can't remember the last time I needed or saw a fellow tech use an angle wrench.

I love mine, they're worth it. Holding control arm bolts, alignment access, buried tube nuts - they're surprisingly useful. Not a daily use tool, but they sure do shine. Sort of like torque adapters - when it's their time, nothing else works.

 

[nicks78camaro]

I love mine, they're worth it. Holding control arm bolts, alignment access, buried tube nuts - they're surprisingly useful. Not a daily use tool, but they sure do shine. Sort of like torque adapters - when it's their time, nothing else works.

Gives me a reason to get a set!

 

[Etchase]

The torque test channel tested line wrenches and MAC, Proto and Snap On were all pretty similar. I don’t think there are secrets in hand tool production.

 

[joel63]

The torque test channel tested line wrenches and MAC, Proto and Snap On were all pretty similar. I don’t think there are secrets in hand tool production.

The one thing I like about the 4 way angle wrenches is that the thickness of them falls between tappet wrenches and the open end of a combination wrench. I don't have any wrenches that I can grind down, so I find the 4 angle very useful in certain situations. One case was the inside jam nut on a brake caliper.

 

[WWheeler]

'Flare nut' wrenches have been synonymous with 'line' wrenches everywhere I've been.
Until this thread I've never heard of angle wrenches referred to as line wrenches.

Torque Test Channel: "Are There Any Line Wrenches That DON'T Kill Flarenuts?"

BUT, if someone was asking why there were no Icon Line wrenches, and they were actually meaning angle wrenches, I bought metric and SAE sets of Icon angle wrenches back when everything Icon was 40% off.

 

[M635_Guy]

No Snappy truck anymore, so thought i would give ICON a try..but no luck.

From what I've seen (testing/etc.) and heard (mainly here), I don't think anyone is close to SnapOn these days. The MiUSA SK stuff might be in the same zip code, but everything lese seems to be a full step below.

NAPA's Carlyle stuff tends to be the same ODM/factory as the Icon stuff. I have their (metric) flare wrench set and while I haven't used them a ton, they've always been just fine.

If there was any all they'd be is an attempt to copy Snap-on.

That would be plenty good enough for most of us

 

[M635_Guy]

BUT, if someone was asking why there were no Icon Line wrenches, and they were actually meaning angle wrenches, I bought metric and SAE sets of Icon angle wrenches back when everything Icon was 40% off.

I bought the metric set of that too, and wondered if it would be handy, but it has come in really handy in weird spots e.g. the cold start injector on my old BMW is in a really tight spot - even a stubby would foul on the throttle rail and other stuff crowding around the two 10mm nuts. I'd used a crow's foot before, but the angle wrenches were a much easier solution - happy to have them around.

 

[DAWrench]

I agree that Snap On is the strongest and best fitting but I also think that if Icon did make them they would be fine in most circumstances. My experience with flare nut fittings that are badly rusted is not just a better wrench but going heat and penetrating oil and some patience. Unless you have a total **** wrench the flare nut itself is the weak link

 

[M635_Guy]

They know it would be a waste of time, money, and effort because that's pretty much the one thing almost everyone agrees is worth buying from Snap on.

I 100% believe the SO is the very best in this particular case but I would never be able to justify their price unless I was a pro, and even then I'd have to really think about it unless I was in a specialty where I was dealing with those fitting a lot. As I mention above, I got a Carlyle set that his been fine in the rare instances I've needed one. Carlyle and Icon are usually from the same Taiwanese ODM, so if HF ever did add it to their line, I'd be willing to be it would be identical to my set.

It currently sells for $133 - NAPA often runs sales, but

I wish TTC had tested the Carlyle set...

 

[dchawk81]

I 100% believe the SO is the very best in this particular case but I would never be able to justify their price unless I was a pro, and even then I'd have to really think about it unless I was in a specialty where I was dealing with those fitting a lot. As I mention above, I got a Carlyle set that his been fine in the rare instances I've needed one. Carlyle and Icon are usually from the same Taiwanese ODM, so if HF ever did add it to their line, I'd be willing to be it would be identical to my set.

It currently sells for $133 - NAPA often runs sales, but

I wish TTC had tested the Carlyle set...

I have an old pickup so they're 100% worth it for those brake lines.

Until I'm ready to redo the whole truck, they save me from having to redo the whole truck.

 

[liliysdad]

I 100% believe the SO is the very best in this particular case but I would never be able to justify their price unless I was a pro, and even then I'd have to really think about it unless I was in a specialty where I was dealing with those fitting a lot. As I mention above, I got a Carlyle set that his been fine in the rare instances I've needed one. Carlyle and Icon are usually from the same Taiwanese ODM, so if HF ever did add it to their line, I'd be willing to be it would be identical to my set.

It currently sells for $133 - NAPA often runs sales, but

I wish TTC had tested the Carlyle set...

You realize that new isn’t the only way to buy things? I’ve got a pretty complete set of SO line wrenches and I don’t think I paid more than $10 a piece for them.

I have SnapOns, Protos, and Bonneys in the drawer. The SnapOns are absolutely better, but the Bonneys are close. The open end of a WrightGrips 2.0 is better than the Craftsman’s I use to have.

 

[M635_Guy]

I have an old pickup so they're 100% worth it for those brake lines.

Until I'm ready to redo the whole truck, they save me from having to redo the whole truck.

The metric set is $376 from SO. It looks like you can find sets on eBay for as low as $150 used (owner marks) to $250 or so, and new from $250 or so on up (though there is one new set @ $199)

Knowing that, if I was doing a lot of work where 'regular' wrenches were a risk, I could probably talk myself into a used set or that $199 set. As a DIY-doofus in my garage, I'm happy enough with my pre-owned set of Carlyle, which I think are designed to be similar to the SO. If their performance is as close to SO as the Icon wrenches are to their Snap On brothers that's pretty great for me.

If I were a pro dealing with a lot of flare fittings, I can actually kinda see it given how much better they appear to be and the vastly-worse impact of the tool working well (i.e. you damage the nut and you have a very-bad day in a lot of cases, and likely in more way than just one).

 

[M635_Guy]

You realize that new isn’t the only way to buy things? I’ve got a pretty complete set of SO line wrenches and I don’t think I paid more than $10 a piece for them.

I don't have the time or patience to piece together a set of wrenches from eBay, flea markets and pawn shops, and pretty sure I'm not alone in that. It's great that you were able to do that.

I have SnapOns, Protos, and Bonneys in the drawer. The SnapOns are absolutely better, but the Bonneys are close. The open end of a WrightGrips 2.0 is better than the Craftsman’s I use to have.

It sounds like you're talking about combination wrenches here, which is not the topic.

 

[neophyte]

So why does no manufacturer make spline or “Metrinch”/“Surface Drive” style flare wrenches?
All three designs are known for being hood with rounded over fasteners, and soft fasteners, since the designs grip towards the centers of the flats, away from the corners.
The dimensions can be made for a tighter fit if it’s felt necessary.

 

[dchawk81]

The metric set is $376. It looks like you can find sets on eBay for as low as $150 used (owner marks) to $250 or so, and new from $250 or so on up (though there is one new set @ $199)

If I was doing a lot of work where 'regular' wrenches were a risk, I could probably talk myself into a used set or that $199 set. As a DIY-doofus in my garage, I'm happy enough with my pre-owned set of Carlyle, which I think are designed to be similar to the SO. If their performance is as close to SO as the Icon wrenches are to their Snap On brothers that's pretty great for me.

If I were a pro dealing with a lot of flare fittings, I can actually kinda see it given how much better they appear to be and the vastly-worse impact of the tool working well (i.e. you damage the nut and you have a very-bad day in a lot of cases, and likely in more way than just one).

I had Tekton and they were such garbage I had zero confidence. After that I decided to go full hog and not compromise.

Can't say for sure I wouldn't be just as satisfied with those other better brands.

 

[M635_Guy]

I had Tekton and they were such garbage I had zero confidence. After that I decided to go full hog and not compromise.

Can't say for sure I wouldn't be just as satisfied with those other better brands.

Tekton flare nut wrenches?

My Tekton combo wrenches were a touch sloppy. Not a nightmare by any stretch, but the Icon set that replaced it is noticeably less sloppy (my Hazet set is better than either).

I guess my point is I'd be surprised if the Carlyle set I have wasn't better than the Tekton since they tend to use the same ODM HF does for Icon. I doubt any of them would make the Snap On flare nut wrenches sweat their seat at the top though. The world of regular combo wrenches is a lot closer.

I get your point though - If you have a touchy scenario you're dealing with and you can get a used set of the SO flare wrenches for $200, any bad day with a flare fitting is worth that money.

 

[dchawk81]

Tekton flare nut wrenches?

My Tekton combo wrenches were a touch sloppy. Not a nightmare by any stretch, but the Icon set that replaced it is noticeably less sloppy (my Hazet set is better than either).

I guess my point is I'd be surprised if the Carlyle set I have wasn't better than the Tekton since they tend to use the same ODM HF does for Icon. I doubt any of them would make the Snap On flare nut wrenches sweat their seat at the top though. The world of regular combo wrenches is a lot closer.

I get your point though - If you have a touchy scenario you're dealing with and you can get a used set of the SO flare wrenches for $200, any bad day with a flare fitting is worth that money.

Yeah Tekton flare nut. The metric fit SAE better than SAE did, and not those "also" sizes the way some are.

My pickup is almost 40 years old. It's not rust pus but I'm okay spending on the best tools I know about to avoid... complications.

 

[liliysdad]

I don't have the time or patience to piece together a set of wrenches from eBay, flea markets and pawn shops, and pretty sure I'm not alone in that. It's great that you were able to do that.


It sounds like you're talking about combination wrenches here, which is not the topic.

If you’ve got time to post you don’t have time, you have time.

And no, I’m not discussing combination wrenches.

 

[M635_Guy]

Yeah Tekton flare nut. The metric fit SAE better than SAE did, and not those "also" sizes the way some are.

oof.

My pickup is almost 40 years old. It's not rust pus but I'm okay spending on the best tools I know about to avoid... complications.

Fair.

If you’ve got time to post you don’t have time, you have time.

And no, I’m not discussing combination wrenches.

 

[liliysdad]

SnapOn Metric Set

Pretty quick and easy to save a ton over new. Easily worth every dime.